Slavery Reparations

Spartanburg Herald-Journal ^ | March 31,2002

[stand watie]

certainly does!

for a FREE dixie REPUBLIC,sw

[WhiskeyPapa]

I did see a statistic that in the south ONLY 2% of white families ever owned a slave. The rest were too poor to afford a slave.

The 1850 census showed that there were about 2.25 million southerners in slave owning families -- out of 6 million. That of course is about 1/3. In SC and MS slave ownership devolved on 50% of whites. The taker of the 1850 census, J.E.B. DeBow proudly pointed out that there were more slave holders by percentage in the south than there were owners of real property in the north.

Walt

[WhiskeyPapa]

The Republican Congress at the time voted 40 acres and a mule for all freed slaves. The Democrat Andrew Johnson vetoed it.

Have you got a source for this?

I saw earlier this very day that this promise came from General Sherman to blacks following his army. Of course any such promise by Sherman was hardly binding on the guvment.

Walt

[billbears]

Here's an answer to your question

Black Slaveowners

While others will sit and argue till the cows come home, these are documented facts. You'll notice that one of the largest slaveowners in SC was black, and that there were not many large plantations holding all the slaves. Also consider that Indians held slaves as well. Within New Orleans 28 percent of blacks held slaves an interesting fact considering that nationwide less than 2 percent of whites held slaves

[WhiskeyPapa]

My ancestors were Yankee abolitionist ministers, humane and devout, who preached against the evil slave-holding culture of the Old South. They were right and you were wrong. Anyone who defended the Old South deserved to be killed, and many were, and the South was smashed and will never rise again. Good riddance.

Gee, where to start.

The Old South was definitely wrong not to embrace more modern ways of thinking and they clung to slavery to the degree they were willing to rend the Union to protect it.

But I think the society is a lot more homogenized now than you would credit. The south -has- largely risen. There is a good deal of heavy industry in the south. In my home town of Chattanooga, they used to make nuclear power plant containment vessels. They'd barge 'em out on the river. There are BMW plants in South Carolina and Nissan plants in Tennessee. There is even a new plant building in LINCOLN, Alabama!

There is a lot of tolerance in the south. A 12 year old vietnamese girl from Chattanooga won the national spelling bee a few years ago.

There are some old fashioned things about the south I like quite a bit. If a perp comes in your house and you shoot him, you don't have to much worry about being prosecuted in the south, because they can't empanel a jury to convict you, even if the DA wanted to charge you, which they don't.

There is a great stereotype that I think has a lot of currency here. If you slide off the road in one of the very infrequent snow storms we have down here, don't worry. Before too long, a 4-wheel drive vehicle with four good ol' boys will appear with a chain and pull/push you out of the ditch. They will even offer you a beer before they go off looking for someone else to help. It's that kind of spirit that made southern soldiers so feared in the late unpleasantness.

The south is a great place to live, and there are only fringe element vestiges of its benighted past.

Plus, we have Southeastern Conference Football!

Walt

[WhiskeyPapa]

There is no justification for these actions - Sherman himself said if the Union lost, he would be tried for war crimes.

Actually, I just read yesterday that Sherman later even denied ever being told there were any rapes by his army in the march to the sea, although it was clear he was informed of at least two.

So he seemed pretty much in denial.

--See "Sherman's march" by Burke Davis.

What is your source for Sherman saying he was a war criminal?

Walt

[Razz Barry]

We should send these people a hearty THANK YOU. Thanks to the reparations fools, many of us have had our hearts freed from guilt that was forced upon us. The more they push, for reparations, the more we investigate slavery, and the more we investigate, the less sympathy we have.

[ccmay]

When I say the South will never rise again, I mean of course the Old South of slavery and Jim Crow. The New South is quite a nice place. I lived in Texas for five years and liked it just fine.

I just have a problem with the Old South ancestor-worshippers who assert that the war was fought for any reasons other than freeing the slaves from the bondage in which the forebears of today's Southern apologists held them. They prattle on about 'economic' causes for the war, not realizing or caring that economic strain was caused by the stagnant, unsustainable system of chattel slavery itself. Hard-working, well-paid Yankee freemen will outwork sullen, resentful, whipped slaves every time.

Furthermore, I object to reparations for slavery on the grounds that the blood and toil of my non-slave-owning Northern forebears has paid them in full. You guys who idolize the Old South just play into the hands of the Ogletrees and Jacksons and Sharptons, and make reparations more likely. Maybe we should stick sons of the Confederacy for the reparations bill.

So- if your great-grandfather had his plantation burned and was horsewhipped by Sherman's men, I say GOOD! because he was an evil slave-owner and deserved no better, in fact all slave-owners and overseers should have been rooted out and shot dead after the war.

Apologists for the Old South have NOTHING of which they can be proud, except for mint juleps and some old Stephen Foster songs.

-ccm

[stainlessbanner]

CCM-
If you have a problem with Southrons paying respect to their ancestors, then leave. We have a problem with carpetbaggers like you who move South and disrepect our heritage and culture.

Your comments are laughable and devoid of reason. Perhaps you should put down your goverment school, liberal history books, and find some other history sources. Yanks imported slaves by the thousands, ran slave ships, and established successful businesses in the slave trade. Don't blame the South for your own ancestor's shortfalls - she's not a scapegoat for your lies.

[WhiskeyPapa]

Apologists for the Old South have NOTHING of which they can be proud, except for mint juleps and some old Stephen Foster songs.

I strongly disagree. We also have the Allman Brothers.

Walt

[WhiskeyPapa]

Just remember, it was your imperial governments ensconced in the South that gave us the Jim Crow laws fashioned on those in force throught the North.

Is that right? Did you know that individual voters in South Carolina didn't vote either for governor or presidential electors until 1868?

That's not true any way as blacks could vote in at least 5 states prior to 1860.

Walt

[Delbert]

Slavery was wrong and has been eradicated. I say if they can find someone alive that has benefitted directly and someone alive that was affected by it then go for it. Otherwise shut the hell up, quit pissin and moaning and go get a job and stop trying to get money for nothing.

[HoustonCurmudgeon]

You really need to get a grip and check your blood pressure.

I wrote three more paragraphs before it occurred to me that you really don't want to talk, just rant, so I deleted them. Have a nice day, and know that I do not worship the old South, I worship none save God.

[ccmay]

You may live in Texas but you will never in your life be a Texan.

No, I lived there a while ago, in the shadow of the Alamo no less, where men became 'heroes' fighting for their 'right' to keep slaves despite Mexican law to the contrary. I lived on Johnny Reb Drive, in fact. Too good for this damn Yankee, eh? But my son is a native Texan.

I think this guy showed more courage than the Alamo defenders...

You, obviously, have never read the first Former Slave Narrative,

Should I have? I am a well read person but I never heard of any such thing.

can't explain how Slaves bought their freedom or resold themselves back into bondage,

Oh? I guess that means you think slavery is OK if men can buy themselves out of it by the sweat of their brows.

can't explain the Confederate Pension Rolls containing many Blacks that claimed Soldier status but had that status changed by Yankee administrators to body servant, teamster or cook in an attempt to belittle the Blackman's valued contribution to the South.

Hmm, you sure there were no ex-Confederates who had any motive to belittle the black man's contribution to the war, such as cheating them out of pensions they had earned? It would be in keeping with the way blacks were treated by the noble sons of the South before and after the war...

You can also not explain the many pictures of Black men attending Confederate Veteran reunions and being photographed with their comrades in arms.

I don't doubt that many black men served in the Confederate military. But I bet most of them were press-ganged, or sent in place of their cowardly white masters, or simply figured three meals and pay and no whippings beat life on the plantation. I doubt many of them were fighting to preserve the institution of slavery. And it doesn't change the fact that chattel slavery was a great evil and that the Old South deserved to be destroyed by force of arms in order to end it.

If this proves anything it is that it's hard to feel racism for someone who took enemy fire with you, much less presume that you could own him. Maybe this is why slavery was peacefully abolished in the North after the Revolution. Too bad the Southerners didn't learn the same lesson sooner.

Just remember, it was your imperial governments ensconced in the South that gave us the Jim Crow laws fashioned on those in force throught the North.

This is the biggest load of horse apples. While Union occupation and Reconstruction lasted, Southern blacks had civil rights for the first time ever. Some were even elected to Congress. As soon as the carpetbaggers and Union Army left, the noble sons of the South instituted Jim Crow and drove the black man back into oppression.

-ccm

[Political Junkie Too]

Maybe you can sue too ,if your ancestors were mistreated.

Last night during the annual running of The Ten Commandments, I decided that I want reparations for the Egyptian enslavement of Jews thousands of years ago.

By the current definition, my claim is valid. Egypt "conspired with slave traders, with each other and other entities and institutions ... to commit and/or knowingly facilitate crimes against humanity, and to further illicitly profit from slave labor." Jews today are still suffering from their enslavement by the Arab world. Egypt is still profiting from the slavery of ages ago -- their tourist industry is based on people coming to see the ancient monuments to the Pharoahs that were built by generation after generation of Hebrew slaves -- therefore the statute of limitations hasn't expired yet as the profiteering is still ongoing.

It's time for Egypt to apologize. All Arabs should have to pay all Jews a reparation for the damage that Jewish slavery has wreaked on society.

-PJ

[Non-Sequitur]

Why would non-slave owners go to war over rich slave-owners?

Well, to be blunt, because they didn't want millions of free blacks voting, competing for jobs, living where they wanted, things like that. They were fighting to keep blacks as slaves and to maintain their own place in society.

[ccmay]

He seems to forget he got here going south. If he is intelligent enough to use a compass, I'm sure he can find a highway headed North. We don't need any more Northern socialist down here telling us how they did it in NY City. I don't give a damn how they did anything up north.

You didn't read my reply very well. I lived in Texas years ago, I don't live there now, and I feel no great liking or dislike for the place. It's pleasant enough, but certainly not the paradise some Texans seem to think it is.

BTW you are quite wrong to label me a socialist, unless you have socialism confused with abolitionism. I am very much in favor of capitalism and limited government and liberty. I disagree that you can trace all our current problems with overbearing Federal government to the Civil War. It goes back at least as far as the Whiskey Rebellion.

-ccm