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Harry Potter and the Order of the Phoenix (Spoiler Alert!!)
07/11/07 | Dianna

Posted on 07/11/2007 12:44:49 AM PDT by Dianna

Please DO NOT read this thread if you have not seen the movie. Even if you have read this book, topics under discussion can affect what you will expect in the last book.

Several pet theories for the Deathy Hallows have, perhaps, been laid to rest by the release of this movie. A number of plot points I had thought were important to the end of the series were completely left out of Order of the Phoenix.

1. There is absolutely NO reference to the cleaning of Grimmauld Place. Thus, any speculation about the locket horcrux being hoarded by Kreacher must be false.

2. The prophecy was never heard in full. The portion of the prophecy which could have referred to Neville instead of Harry was omitted.

3. There was no mention of Percy's estrangement from his family. Percy was shown at Fudge's side at important points, but unless his face was remembered from previous movies, people not reading the book may not have caught that.

There were two plot changes which puzzled me. Cho was the one who gave Dumbledore's Army away, not the unimportant character of Marietta. Also, Sirius, before he falls through the veil calls Harry, "James". I assume these changes have a point, but I don't know what.

There was also no reference to Hermione and Ron being Prefects. There was no Quidditch at all, so Ron would not be on the team.


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KEYWORDS: harrypotter; orderofthephoenix
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To: A knight without armor
Does Snape die?

I'd like to see Snape die by saving Harry and then everyone finds out he's really been a good guy all along.

It's not that I like Snape so much (although he's a great character!), but I'd HATE for Dumbledore to have made such a mistake.

351 posted on 07/15/2007 9:36:17 PM PDT by Dianna
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To: null and void
Trelawney wasn't trying to disturb Malfoy.

Good point!

352 posted on 07/15/2007 9:38:00 PM PDT by Dianna
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To: Dianna

IIRC, (and the kids have the books, I’ve got the tapes) it was when they were captured in her office, shortly before the was trying to work herself up to applying the Cruciatus curse on Harry.

Maybe I can find it on the tape...


353 posted on 07/15/2007 9:38:11 PM PDT by null and void (We are a Nation of Laws... IGNORED Laws...)
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To: null and void
IIRC, (and the kids have the books, I’ve got the tapes) it was when they were captured in her office, shortly before the was trying to work herself up to applying the Cruciatus curse on Harry.

I've got the book handy, I'll check it out. Thanks!

354 posted on 07/15/2007 9:38:58 PM PDT by Dianna
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To: null and void
Maybe I can find it on the tape...

On second thought, it can wait.

355 posted on 07/15/2007 9:39:59 PM PDT by null and void (We are a Nation of Laws... IGNORED Laws...)
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To: null and void
On second thought, it can wait.

LOL! If anyone else missed it, it's at the top of page 747. I can't believe I missed that!

356 posted on 07/15/2007 9:53:15 PM PDT by Dianna
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To: Dianna
It certainly illuminates her character, doesn’t it?
357 posted on 07/15/2007 9:55:51 PM PDT by null and void (We are a Nation of Laws... IGNORED Laws...)
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To: Dianna

Malfoy asked for a room where he wouldn’t be disturbed.
But Trelawney got in.


Actually Malfoy asked for a room to hide something in and so did Trelawney. That’s how she got in. Harry also asked to have a room to hide something in(his potions book). I think he was given the exact same room and didn’t realize it.I’m basing this on the description of the items in the room.


358 posted on 07/16/2007 4:31:11 AM PDT by EmilyGeiger
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To: Dianna

She said it when she captured Harry and his friends using her fireplace the second time. Right before she tries to use the unforgiveable curse on him.


359 posted on 07/16/2007 4:32:47 AM PDT by EmilyGeiger
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To: EmilyGeiger

It was the same room, on page 526 it talks about him passing the vanishing cabinet when he is trying to hide his book. I think when he goes back for the book he’ll see it and realize what happened.


360 posted on 07/16/2007 4:49:04 AM PDT by EmilyGeiger
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To: schwing_wifey
I have a radical new idea...what if Lily was the Potions wiz and helping Severus? I noticed that Slughorn has been raving about Lily’s talents but hasn’t said anything about Snape’s. (Re-reading HBP at the moment....)

I don't consider Slughorn to be that perceptive a judge of talent. Snape was a prodigy at spells from his first year, long before any association with Lily

Also there's the matter of the Levicorpus levitating spell that Snape invented. In HBP, Snape's book says it's a non-verbal spell. So how would James have found out enough about Snape's non-verbal spell to be able to use it against Snape?

This is my scenario: Snape was infatuated with Lily, and helped her with her coursework. In the course of this help, Lily learned all the spells that Snape developed. Lily falls for James. Lily tells James about all Snape's spells, and James uses them against Snape

If someone you loved left you for your worst enemy, and betrayed all your confidences to your worst enemy, how would you feel about that person? Especially if you then decided that person was only using you all the while?

361 posted on 07/16/2007 5:59:48 AM PDT by PapaBear3625
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To: retrokitten

Correct and Umbridge uses a spell that Hermione used in Prisoner of Azkaban to break Sirus free. “Bombarda!”


362 posted on 07/16/2007 6:13:25 AM PDT by CholeraJoe ("Who are you and what have you done with Hermione Granger?")
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To: null and void
Trelawney wasn't trying to disturb Malfoy.

Right! Wasn't she either looking for a place to hide or hide her sherry bottles?

363 posted on 07/16/2007 6:22:12 AM PDT by retrokitten (I love caffeine)
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To: Dianna
“With the exception of Harry being so godawfully angry and emotional”

My Husband and I saw the movie last night at 5pm and it was packed! Some couple remarked about how “angry” Harry was...some one else remarked, “of course he is angry, he’s 16” Well not technically age correct, it drew a very large laugh from the mostly adult audience...

Counting down till Saturday night....I CAN’T WAIT...it’s like Christmas and my birthday all rolled into one!...

364 posted on 07/16/2007 6:52:54 AM PDT by SuzanneWeeks (I still <3 Karl Rove)
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To: Dianna; retrokitten
And I just thought of one other really funny “mistake” in the movie...

In the beginning when Harry is walking through the field, before the dementor attack, there is a voice over talking about the weather, in Fahrenheit, not Celsius. Yet when Petunia is watching TV, they show Celsius readings...

Haven’t finished the whole thread so I don’t know if it has been mentioned or not...

Suz

365 posted on 07/16/2007 6:56:40 AM PDT by SuzanneWeeks (I still <3 Karl Rove)
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To: SuzanneWeeks
Forget about the temp- what about that goofy outfit Aunt Petunia was wearing! Slap on some white makeup, stick a red foam nose on her face and teach her to make balloon animals and she could have joined Barnum and Bailey's.

My inner Mr. Blackwell was kvetching.

I'm not Jewish, but sometimes Yiddish is the only thing that will get your point across. :-)

366 posted on 07/16/2007 7:09:42 AM PDT by retrokitten (I love caffeine)
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To: SuzanneWeeks
Counting down till Saturday night....I CAN’T WAIT...it’s like Christmas and my birthday all rolled into one!...

The book goes on sale on the stroke of midnight FRIDAY night

367 posted on 07/16/2007 7:41:19 AM PDT by PapaBear3625
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To: Dianna
Malfoy asked for a room where he wouldn’t be disturbed.

But Trelawney got in.

Malfoy asked for a room where he could hide something. When Harry is hiding his potions book from Snape he puts it in the room of requirement and sees the vanishing cabinet. Trelawney is looking to hide her empty sherry bottles. Apparently, the room responds in a similar way to similar requests.

368 posted on 07/16/2007 7:53:50 AM PDT by Tijeras_Slim
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To: Dianna

RE KREACHER’S IMPORTANCE:

This for anyone who has forgotten or not
read the books thoroughly:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kreacher

PROBABLY the reason JKR said Kreacher is
to be important in the final book, too.


369 posted on 07/16/2007 8:26:30 AM PDT by Grendel9
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To: CholeraJoe

In the book, Hermione used “Alohamora” to open the window to get Sirius.


370 posted on 07/16/2007 8:30:06 AM PDT by Politicalmom (Nearly 1% of illegals are in prison for felonies. Less than 1/10 of 1% of the legal population is.)
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To: Politicalmom

In the movie she uses “Bombarda.”


371 posted on 07/16/2007 8:42:16 AM PDT by CholeraJoe (Ratzaz! There. I do give one about something.)
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To: CholeraJoe

I know.

Sorry, I am reading two Potter threads and getting quite confused on the points being made. :p

*Goes back to reading about interracial dating, lying, stealing, and so forth.....*


372 posted on 07/16/2007 8:49:33 AM PDT by Politicalmom (Nearly 1% of illegals are in prison for felonies. Less than 1/10 of 1% of the legal population is.)
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To: Politicalmom

Don’t forget underage drinking and animal cruelty.


373 posted on 07/16/2007 8:52:22 AM PDT by CholeraJoe (Ratzaz! There. I do give one about something.)
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To: EmilyGeiger

Any bets that there’s a Horcrux hidden there?


374 posted on 07/16/2007 9:12:43 AM PDT by null and void (We are a Nation of Laws... IGNORED Laws...)
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To: SuzanneWeeks
Counting down till Saturday night....I CAN’T WAIT...it’s like Christmas and my birthday all rolled into one!...

Saturday night?

375 posted on 07/16/2007 9:15:15 AM PDT by null and void (We are a Nation of Laws... IGNORED Laws...)
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To: null and void

I didn’t think about that!!


376 posted on 07/16/2007 9:33:29 AM PDT by EmilyGeiger
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To: Dianna
It's not that I like Snape so much (although he's a great character!), but I'd HATE for Dumbledore to have made such a mistake.

I know what you mean. I'm not sure which I'd think was worse: that Snape was evil all along or that Dumbledore could be so wrong about something so important.

I'm also trying to figure out if I'd care nearly as much for Snape if he wasn't being played by Alan Rickman, one of my favorite actors.

I don't think I would.

377 posted on 07/16/2007 10:52:11 AM PDT by ksen ("For an omniscient and omnipotent God, there are no Plan B's" - Frumanchu)
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To: null and void; EmilyGeiger

Shouldn’t take Harry long to find it if there’s a horcrux in the RoR. Go in to check his potions book and “Accio Voldemort’s horcrux.” Notice I was specific to Voldemort’s horcrux. He could be crushed by a dozen others, if not careful.


378 posted on 07/16/2007 11:08:41 AM PDT by CholeraJoe (Ratzaz! There. I do give one about something.)
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To: ksen

He is marvelous in that role.


379 posted on 07/16/2007 11:13:53 AM PDT by null and void (We are a Nation of Laws... IGNORED Laws...)
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To: null and void

I’ve never seen him in anything in which he wasn’t wonderful, but I am partial to his good guy roles.


380 posted on 07/16/2007 3:32:22 PM PDT by Politicalmom (Nearly 1% of illegals are in prison for felonies. Less than 1/10 of 1% of the legal population is.)
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To: All
Another question to all. In the HBP, while Harry is trying to get into the Room of Requirement, all of a sudden, he meets Tonks in the hallway. She seems to be thin, ashen, and asks him if he has heard anything from the Order members. Harry tells her no, and she leaves. She was apparently there trying to meet with Dumbledor.

This meeting always seemed strange to me. Perhaps it is Crab or Goyle using Polyjuice potion brewed to look like Tonks. If Draco's henchmen can make themselves appear to be Order members, it would be easy for them to infiltrate the Order.

Any thoughts on that? Thanks!

381 posted on 07/16/2007 5:54:34 PM PDT by Blue Eyes (Praying for a miracle.)
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To: Blue Eyes

Later on in the book it explains this encounter. There had just been news that someone had been attacked by Fenrir Greyback. Since Lupin was undercover noone knew his whereabouts. Dumbledore’s office I believe is somewhere near the room of requirement because Harry was on his way there when he ran into Trelawney(when she was trying to hide her sherry bottles). It was told that Tonks was really trying to find Dumbledore to make certain that Lupin was alright because she was in love with him.

On a side note, I don’t think Crabbe and Goyle would know about Harry’s involvement with Lupin. Tonks asked if he had gotten any letters from anyone in the order in that exchange and I don’t think one of them would know about the order. Just MHO. :)


382 posted on 07/16/2007 6:10:33 PM PDT by EmilyGeiger
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To: EmilyGeiger

My prediction is that Hermoine creates a potion to cure werewolf bites in DH.

I even know the critical ingredient...


383 posted on 07/16/2007 6:39:10 PM PDT by null and void (We are a Nation of Laws... IGNORED Laws...)
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To: retrokitten
Forget about the temp- what about that goofy outfit Aunt Petunia was wearing! Slap on some white makeup, stick a red foam nose on her face and teach her to make balloon animals and she could have joined Barnum and Bailey's.

For as prim and proper as she's always seemed, she was showing a awful lot of skin.

Was that a new Dudley? I didn't like him.

384 posted on 07/16/2007 11:09:31 PM PDT by Dianna
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To: EmilyGeiger

Thanks for the explanation! For some reason, that scene was sticking in my memory as being unresolved. Now I remember the rest. (It’s that middle aged, hot flash, memory shot, kind of thing. LOL!)


385 posted on 07/17/2007 3:55:42 AM PDT by Blue Eyes (Praying for a miracle.)
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To: null and void

Would you freepmail me the critical ingredient, I really want to see where you’re going with this. :)


386 posted on 07/17/2007 4:03:45 AM PDT by EmilyGeiger
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To: Blue Eyes; EmilyGeiger
This meeting always seemed strange to me. Perhaps it is Crab or Goyle using Polyjuice potion brewed to look like Tonks. If Draco's henchmen can make themselves appear to be Order members, it would be easy for them to infiltrate the Order.

I agree with you! This encounter always seemed out of place or "off". The Greyback explanation is a good one, though. I had never looked at it in that context (some romantic I am!).

387 posted on 07/17/2007 6:23:27 AM PDT by retrokitten (I love caffeine)
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To: Dianna
Was that a new Dudley? I didn't like him.

Oh he was horrible!

Do you (or anyone really) watch "Little Britian"? He reminded me of the ghetto teenage girl who talks really fast and is always in trouble.

388 posted on 07/17/2007 6:28:10 AM PDT by retrokitten (I love caffeine)
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To: EmilyGeiger
OK, you have FReepmail.

Caution - It’s a real groaner...

389 posted on 07/17/2007 7:05:15 AM PDT by null and void (We are a Nation of Laws... IGNORED Laws...)
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To: PapaBear3625
If someone you loved left you for your worst enemy, and betrayed all your confidences to your worst enemy, how would you feel about that person? Especially if you then decided that person was only using you all the while?

I would be so incredibly angry, I wouldn't be able to see straight. But that still leaves the question...why was Dumbledore so positive that Snape is on their side while playing a double agent? What is the hook??? (Oh please deliver the book...)

;D
390 posted on 07/17/2007 7:46:54 AM PDT by schwing_wifey (Lily was mistaken..The Borg are Swedish..Resistance is Futile.....)
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To: retrokitten; Dianna
Was that a new Dudley? I didn't like him.

Oh he was horrible!

According to the Internet Movie Database, (IDMb.com) that was the same actor that portrayed Dudley in SS, CoS and PoA.
The actor's name is Harry Melling. And yes, I didn't like him grown up either.

391 posted on 07/17/2007 8:05:03 AM PDT by cuz_it_aint_their_money (Fred Thompson & Duncan Hunter in '08)
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To: Xenalyte

I thought it was the best of all the movies so far, and I agree with the earlier comment that it was the smoothest transition of book to movie. In places, I thought it was actually preferable to the book, (in cutting the dreadfully extended “angry” scenes, teenaged tantrums, and the repetitive detentions) and I agreed with most of the cuts and changes in the interests of time.

This was the best character development of all the movies, and I give the director credit for that. Luna, Umbridge, Snape, Harry, Sirius, Neville, and the Weasley twins all shone. Ron and Hermione took somewhat of a back seat, but were portrayed much more sympathetically than the book, and gave solid performances. And my best honors go to the improvement of Michael Gambon as Dumbledore. He has almost completely redeemed himself after the last two movies. This was the best movie for seeing the scale and beauty of Hogwarts as well.

As you can see, I loved the movie and felt the old Harry Potter magic working for me again.


392 posted on 07/17/2007 9:50:28 AM PDT by alwaysconservative (Algore wants us to reduce our carbon footprint: he wants all Republicans to stop breathing.)
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To: Dianna

I agree with your comments and would add that the improvement of Dumbledore was most certainly welcome!


393 posted on 07/17/2007 10:09:26 AM PDT by alwaysconservative (Algore wants us to reduce our carbon footprint: he wants all Republicans to stop breathing.)
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To: alwaysconservative

DANG! Now that is what I call a ringing endorsement.

Am almost done re-reading “Goblet of Fire” . . . am in a push to finish the other two before the final installment arrives Friday!


394 posted on 07/17/2007 10:46:39 AM PDT by Xenalyte (Lord, I apologize . . . and be with the starving pygmies in New Guinea amen.)
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To: Dianna; retrokitten

Same Dudley, Harry Melling. Just growed up and with a Yorkshire accent not his native London one.


395 posted on 07/18/2007 4:51:57 AM PDT by CholeraJoe (Ratzaz! There. I do give one about something.)
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To: CholeraJoe
Same Dudley, Harry Melling. Just growed up and with a Yorkshire accent not his native London one.

His new look is what I was referring, too. The wannabe hip-hop kid is not a good look for any kid. My 12 year old nephew is trying to adopt it, too. Tragic.

396 posted on 07/18/2007 6:36:53 AM PDT by retrokitten (is NOT enviromentally friendly)
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To: Dianna; schwing_wifey; TightyRighty; null and void; EmilyGeiger; retrokitten

Did anyone read ( spoiler/hacker ) Gabriel’s message about the ending? I won’t say what happen but it was interesting if it’s true.


397 posted on 07/18/2007 8:31:04 AM PDT by dragonblustar (Never hold discussions with the monkey when the organ grinder is in the room. - Churchill)
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To: retrokitten
The wannabe hip-hop kid is not a good look for any kid.

OTOH, we always knew he'd turn out badly.

398 posted on 07/18/2007 8:35:52 AM PDT by null and void (We are a Nation of Laws... IGNORED Laws...)
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To: dragonblustar
I didn't bother. By Saturday (Sunday, tops!) I'll know the real ending.

And I'll be busy trying to figure out what the sequels will look like...

399 posted on 07/18/2007 8:38:44 AM PDT by null and void (We are a Nation of Laws... IGNORED Laws...)
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To: retrokitten; donna; EmilyGeiger; grellis
I saw OOTP for the second time last night, this time in IMAX 3D. I could have sworn I was riding the thestral with Luna.

I noticed a few things I hadn't before: Tonks' hair color changes from purple to red to blue when Moody introduces her as "Nymphadora." Kreacher was hiding something when Harry sees him in the hallway at Grimmauld place the first time.

Harry teaches the DA "Levicorpus" and Luna uses it on a Death Eater at the Ministry. In the books, Harry doesn't learn that spell until Half Blood Prince.

Devon Murray (Seamus) is really short. Bonnie Wright was standing beside him at the end and seemed much taller.

400 posted on 07/18/2007 8:39:52 AM PDT by CholeraJoe (Ratzaz! There. I do give one about something.)
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