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**RIFLE VANITY** Long-Distance Shooting and Hunting
12/17/2011 | Moi

Posted on 12/17/2011 9:34:30 AM PST by rabidralph

I am looking to buy a rifle that would serve two purposes: primarily a long-distance shooter and secondarily a larger game taker downer :-)

I like to shoot beyond 600 yards and I want a rifle to suit that purpose. From info I've gathered, I should get a larger-calibered rifle, with at least a 24" barrel. I would like to keep the rifle below 10lbs because I also want to hunt with it some day. I am interested in hunting elk and moose, eventually. So I am thinking of a .308.


TOPICS: Chit/Chat; Outdoors; Sports
KEYWORDS: banglist; firearms; hunting; reloading; rifle; shooting
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To: 41Thunder

Those Fins sure think a lot of their rifles :-)


51 posted on 12/17/2011 10:17:38 AM PST by rabidralph
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To: buffaloguy

Thank you for responding and for relating your personal experiences with that model.


52 posted on 12/17/2011 10:20:05 AM PST by rabidralph
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To: macquire

Vacationed at Priest Lake, Idaho once.
Guy there hunted Grizzley Bears with a bow and arrow.
I said, “ No problem, just have a Desert Eagle strapped to your thigh”.
He said Oh no, you can have a knife but NO firearm during bow hunt season.
I thought, Whoa.
I kinda like that 300 yard shot with a cannon.


53 posted on 12/17/2011 10:22:26 AM PST by Joe Boucher ((FUBO))
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To: Melinator

Thanks for the reply. I appreciate your reasoning about the .300WM. My friend’s rifle is a 7mm and it was comfortable for me to handle. I will not be shooting game beyond 200 yards. I just want to target practice at long distances.


54 posted on 12/17/2011 10:23:08 AM PST by rabidralph
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To: rabidralph
Just bought a nice rifle, with hunting as a secondary object. It was a Springfield M1A. Not exactly what your looking for. But I did ask a lot of hunters up here in Alaska about the .308 and the general consensus was that the .308 was adequate for moose and black bear at the lower end of things. More than one hunter uses that round. It however is all in the shot placement.

I was thinking more like 50 yards for zombies, 150 for moose and target fun beyond that. So I added the semi-auto function to service the 50 yard range. By the way, a charging Griz is a zombie in my book.

Rifle is 9.3 rounds unloaded with a medium weight match barrel and synthetic stock. Love it by the way.


55 posted on 12/17/2011 10:24:05 AM PST by American in Israel (A wise man's heart directs him to the right, but the foolish mans heart directs him toward the left.)
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To: rabidralph

Nobody has mentioned Vasily Grigoryevich Zaytsev.


56 posted on 12/17/2011 10:25:24 AM PST by seton89 (Starve the Beast)
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To: MCF

Thanks for the recommendation. I will not be shooting at game I don’t intend to eat, unless my friends invite me over for varmint hunting. I do plan on shooting at game at 250 yards and fewer. I appreciate your advice.


57 posted on 12/17/2011 10:26:07 AM PST by rabidralph
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To: IMR 4350

Thanks! I didn’t know that. I would have to go out of state to hunt moose and elk anyway.


58 posted on 12/17/2011 10:27:29 AM PST by rabidralph
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To: rabidralph

Also check out the 7.62 before you buy, They are cheap and will do the job you are asking for!


59 posted on 12/17/2011 10:30:13 AM PST by satan69 (garden)
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To: rabidralph

I recently picked up a .25-06 Ruger Model 77 with a bull barrel at auction. It had never been fired and I bought it on impulse (fellow gun owners know what I mean, I’m sure). I want to put better optics on it but what a shooter! It will do most everything you want. I guess it weighs about 9 lbs with the heavy barrel.


60 posted on 12/17/2011 10:31:57 AM PST by Lando Lincoln (But that's just me.)
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To: Designer

Well, this is all a learning experience for me which is why I ask for advice from you all. I don’t handle any of my firearms in a casual manner. I am unsure whether I will be swapping out the stock but I know I may have to upgrade some parts to get what I want. I am working on doing my part.


61 posted on 12/17/2011 10:32:37 AM PST by rabidralph
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To: rabidralph

I had an attorney that got fined big time for that.

They also took his gun and his game.

He got his money back by suing the crap out of his guide.


62 posted on 12/17/2011 10:35:59 AM PST by IMR 4350
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To: rabidralph

Dude, no, you misunderstand. After the first half-dozen posts, you are out of the discussion and your needs are no longer being discussed. It becomes all about the other posters and what they like and what their experiences have been. Soon it will deteriorate into a pissing contest about who has done the most hunting and has the biggest hardest gun. Then there will be insults, then some posters will sanctimoniously offer to pray for each other, then there will be accusations that the other guys are not real conservatives, probably liberal trolls, because they don’t like the same thing. Some lady or limp-wristed man will post that they don’t see why it’s necessary to kill the pretty animals because they have feelings too, and there will be a 100-post tangent on that. It’s great fun if it goes the right way.

And then some people wonder why we can’t agree on a decent presidential candidate!


63 posted on 12/17/2011 10:39:02 AM PST by ottbmare (off-the-track Thoroughbred mare)
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To: rabidralph
Reloading doubles your fun and cuts the cost by 2/3 thirds or more. You will enjoy being able to make rounds to fit your specific needs rather than having to accept what's available at Walmart.

You'll be surprised at how much commercial ammo (except for expensive match ammo) varies in bullet weight and powder charge. You'll also be surprised at how much you save by reloading, if you shoot a lot.

If you're going to become an above average long distance shooter, you'll need a rifle and ammo that is consistent.

Look for an American made rifle in the $500 - $600 dollar range new and a new scope beginning at least in the $350 range and up. Don't forget the used markets. Plenty of great deals there, especially from individuals.

64 posted on 12/17/2011 10:39:24 AM PST by Errant
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To: SampleMan

I’ve come across a few animals dead from their wounds over the years. Once I even found one still alive but gut shot and unable to stand.

I agree that the object is to kill them and not to have sport. However, minute of angle at 600yards is a 12” diameter. At 200yds with an appropriate caliber, a decent hunter can shoot a standing animal dead with one shot (though many still miss or gut them). At 600 you are as likely to wound or miss entirely. Chasing wounded game (especially large dangerous game such as moose and bears) is not fun.

15 years ago I guided for black bear. I saw alot of hunters with very expensive equipment miss and wound stationary animals. Our hunters were not allowed to use less than a 300 magnum nor shoot from more than 300 yards. Still ended up having to finish off lots of wounded bears.

No matter how accurate they are at the range, I don’t know anyone who hunts at 600 yards, and I don’t recommend it for a variety of reasons, especially in less than perfect conditions. Your mileage may differ.


65 posted on 12/17/2011 10:40:23 AM PST by Melinator (my 2 cents)
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To: Nailbiter

bfl


66 posted on 12/17/2011 10:42:02 AM PST by Nailbiter
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To: rabidralph

Check with the ranges you want to do 600 yard target shooting at and see what is the largest caliber they allow. I sometimes shoot a .308 at the Sacramento Valley Shooting Center in Ione and the biggest they allow is .338 Lapua. The restriction is from the FAA since Rancho Murrieta airport is within 5 miles of the range, so no .50BMG or similar are allowed.

Your range(s) may have even more restrictive limits.


67 posted on 12/17/2011 10:43:12 AM PST by CarmichaelPatriot
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To: rabidralph
The most versatile sized cartridge yet developed is the caliber 30.06. The weights of the bullet range from 120gr to 220gr.
The weapon itself is light enough to carry for fairly long periods of time and if set up properly by a good gunsmith is capable of 1000yd shots.
As written by another poster, shots at that range pose too many variables.
There is really no one caliber or weapon that can fulfill your fantasy.
68 posted on 12/17/2011 10:43:54 AM PST by Doc91678 (Doc91678)
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To: rabidralph
The most versatile sized cartridge yet developed is the caliber 30.06. The weights of the bullet range from 120gr to 220gr.
The weapon itself is light enough to carry for fairly long periods of time and if set up properly by a good gunsmith is capable of 1000yd shots.
As written by another poster, shots at that range pose too many variables.
There is really no one caliber or weapon that can fulfill your fantasy.
69 posted on 12/17/2011 10:44:13 AM PST by Doc91678 (Doc91678)
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To: rabidralph
The most versatile sized cartridge yet developed is the caliber 30.06. The weights of the bullet range from 120gr to 220gr.
The weapon itself is light enough to carry for fairly long periods of time and if set up properly by a good gunsmith is capable of 1000yd shots.
As written by another poster, shots at that range pose too many variables.
There is really no one caliber or weapon that can fulfill your fantasy.
70 posted on 12/17/2011 10:44:45 AM PST by Doc91678 (Doc91678)
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To: rabidralph
The most versatile sized cartridge yet developed is the caliber 30.06. The weights of the bullet range from 120gr to 220gr.
The weapon itself is light enough to carry for fairly long periods of time and if set up properly by a good gunsmith is capable of 1000yd shots.
As written by another poster, shots at that range pose too many variables.
There is really no one caliber or weapon that can fulfill your fantasy.
71 posted on 12/17/2011 10:44:45 AM PST by Doc91678 (Doc91678)
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To: ottbmare

>>>Dude, no, you misunderstand...<<<

LOL!


72 posted on 12/17/2011 10:47:09 AM PST by Fightin Whitey
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To: rabidralph
I am a retired Military Sniper. There is an awful lot of misinformation that has been given to you on this thread so far.

My advice is coming from over 2 decades of bench rest and freehand silhouette competition, as well as combat sniper/special forces service.

The best choice you could make in regards to the needs you express, would be for you to buy a reasonably good used Remington 700 BDL with a long action. (30-06 or belted magnum)

Take it to a good gunsmith and have the bolt and locking lugs trued and accurized. Have that same gunsmith rebarrel it in either a high grade #5 or #6 Hart or Douglas. Have it chambered to either an 8mm-06, 300 Win Mag, 338 Win Mag, or simply make it a 30-06.

Then have it bedded in a good composite stock and do not cut the barrel any longer than 20 inches and more importantly, have it crowned. It would also be wise to read up on accuracy and shooting technique. Then, take it to the range and practice, practice, practice. Not to mention, learn to custom hand load your ammunition. Do this, and you will have a far better rifle than you could ever buy off of the shelf, and for a third of the cost.

From what you describe, anything larger than a 30-06 is overkill for game in this continent. The 30-06 has more than ample power, and will easily handle any of the largest game on this continent. It is also a stellar long range round and is effective out to 1,000 meters.

For the largest and most dangerous game, like Brown Bear or Yukon Moose, I recommend at least a 338 Win Mag or larger. My personal and favorite choice for these animals is the 375 H&H.

73 posted on 12/17/2011 10:58:18 AM PST by PSYCHO-FREEP (If you come to a fork in the road, take it........)
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To: American in Israel
"I was thinking more like 50 yards for zombies"

Now see, Ralph didn't mention zombies.

That's a different proposition altogether.

rabidralph; in case you are shooting zombies, then you need a high-capacity semi-auto, caliber doesn't need to be any bigger than .223 Rem. You should strive for dependability above accuracy, because you'll be shooting at ranges of less than 100 yards, but if you experience a failure to fire, you will become zombie food.

Have extra magazines and a backup firearm, such as a semi-auto .45ACP.

Good Luck!

74 posted on 12/17/2011 11:01:22 AM PST by Designer (Nit-pickin' and chagrinin')
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To: rabidralph

7.62 x 54R. Mosin-Nagant M91-30. Set ya back about $100.

Ammo is cheap.

Iron sights only cause scopes are cheatin’.

:)


75 posted on 12/17/2011 11:01:27 AM PST by 2111USMC (Not a hard man to track. Leaves dead men wherever he goes.)
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To: Glennb51

I like the 165 Nosler Partition for deer and elk.


76 posted on 12/17/2011 11:04:53 AM PST by MileHi ( "It's coming down to patriots vs the politicians." - ovrtaxt)
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To: 2111USMC

“Iron sights only cause scopes are cheatin’”

Yep. I agree with you in all particulars.


77 posted on 12/17/2011 11:06:06 AM PST by buffaloguy
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To: rabidralph

Don’t let these people fool you. I also guided in Alaska for all species. There will be times when you will take a 600 meter shot. You will either wound one, and won’t have a clear shot until they get that far away, or the conditions won’t allow a closer stalk.

If you are skilled enough and have your equipment tuned correctly, 600 meter shots are not difficult. Especially with the new range finders available. This new technology has saved many animals from being crippled, as well as, satisfied many a hunter. They are an absolute requirement and the best money you will ever spend on equipment.

If you are not skilled or well trained in shooting, then you should not be in the field anyway. Even a 100 meter shot coming from an inexperienced, poorly prepared hunter, is unethical.


78 posted on 12/17/2011 11:06:50 AM PST by PSYCHO-FREEP (If you come to a fork in the road, take it........)
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To: Lurker

Ruger or Savage .300 Win Mag or .338 La Pua.


79 posted on 12/17/2011 11:07:19 AM PST by Georgia Girl 2 (The only purpose of a pistol is to fight your way back to the rifle you should never have dropped.)
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To: ottbmare
Politics?

POLITICS? You post politics on a shooting thread?

MODS!!!!!

FReeper etiquette misfire!!!

80 posted on 12/17/2011 11:08:36 AM PST by Designer (Nit-pickin' and chagrinin')
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To: rabidralph
Blaser 93 Safari
81 posted on 12/17/2011 11:08:57 AM PST by smokingfrog ( sleep with one eye open ( <o> ---)
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To: JRandomFreeper

>>>I am with coyote and feral pigs.<<<

Great point.


82 posted on 12/17/2011 11:11:28 AM PST by Fightin Whitey
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To: rabidralph; SampleMan

Sounds like 30:06 as Sampleman stated.

Personally, I have found RugerM77 rifles to shoot well and are reasonably priced. I hunt with a M77 Ultralight “Mountain Rifle” because I carry it more than shoot it, but at the distance you say stick with a longer barrel.


83 posted on 12/17/2011 11:12:08 AM PST by X-spurt
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To: rabidralph

With very good reason.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Simo_Häyhä;


84 posted on 12/17/2011 11:15:16 AM PST by Lurker (The avalanche has begun. The pebbles no longer have a vote.)
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To: American in Israel

I have one of those rifles. I acquired a National Match model from a guy getting divorced about 15 years ago. I paid him $500 cash for it. Some of the best money I ever spent.


85 posted on 12/17/2011 11:19:59 AM PST by Lurker (The avalanche has begun. The pebbles no longer have a vote.)
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To: ottbmare

I’ll pray for you Otty :)

Too funny, thanks for the laugh !


86 posted on 12/17/2011 11:20:32 AM PST by onona (FR is continuing education)
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To: Lurker

A-ha! See! That guy used a Mosin with open sights!

I rest my case!

:)


87 posted on 12/17/2011 11:21:33 AM PST by 2111USMC (Not a hard man to track. Leaves dead men wherever he goes.)
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To: X-spurt

Any ultralight rifle should be limited to 250 meter shots. The thin, light barrels are prone to gross loss of accuracy due to harmonics and vibration, temperature stress and bedding mechanics.

The longer barrel theory is also incorrect. Anyone who has shot in competition, knows that the longer the bullet spends in the barrel, the more accuracy is lost due to jacket deformation.

The minute gains of velocity that a longer barrel may provide, only amounts to a few feet per second, but the effects of friction, vibration and bed mechanics, effect bullet flight to a far greater degree.


88 posted on 12/17/2011 11:22:48 AM PST by PSYCHO-FREEP (If you come to a fork in the road, take it........)
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To: rabidralph

“... I like to target practice at long distances....”

Google “.260 Remington”. Find the article: “The case for the .260 Remington”. Then read it. Personally, one of my favorite combinations for long distance work is a the old bolt-action Remington 700 rifle originally in .243 cal, that I replaced the barrel with to a varmint 6.5mm (.260 Remington) purchased from Lilja Barrel, MacMillan stock, Nightforce scope, Jewel trigger, everything precision-machined, squared, etc. along with a few other goodies such as a Benner Cooley muzzle brake. I shoot a 123gr. HPBT Lapua Scenar bullet in a necked-down .308 military case...precisely custom-loaded specifically for my barrel. I easily and consistantly drop coyotes at over 500 yards with one shot with this combination but basically bench-rested when I do and sighted in for it. I do not take shots unless I know for sure I got a good clean kill. Some will argue that’s not a “hunting bullet” and it’s inhumane. Tell that to the pile of sun-bleached bones in the back corner of my property. I’ve only had one that I had to dispatch with a 2nd shot. I hate what they do to deer and livestock.
LMAO at some of the responses on here, but hey, to each his own. I just know the combos that what work for me.


89 posted on 12/17/2011 11:39:30 AM PST by lgjhn23
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To: rabidralph
If you're looking to shoot beyond 600 yards, you might find .308 a bit lacking. IMHO, you might want to look into at least a 300 WinMag. It will also allow you a heavier bullet.

Mark

90 posted on 12/17/2011 11:48:06 AM PST by MarkL (Do I really look like a guy with a plan?)
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To: American in Israel
Just bought a nice rifle, with hunting as a secondary object. It was a Springfield M1A. [[snip]] I was thinking more like 50 yards for zombies

Then I suggest stocking up on these...

Mark

91 posted on 12/17/2011 11:56:55 AM PST by MarkL (Do I really look like a guy with a plan?)
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To: CGalen
I had one years ago... bought it in Texas back in 1973. The recoil from that rifle is not the problem... it is the 15 minutes that the recoil takes to die off that I found objectionable. I do not think that a mule could kick any harder. I find the .50 Barrett to be far more comfortable to shoot.

LLS

92 posted on 12/17/2011 12:03:57 PM PST by LibLieSlayer ("Americans are hungry to feel once again a sense of mission and greatness." Ronaldo Magnus)
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To: SVTCobra03

Nice axe.

LLS


93 posted on 12/17/2011 12:04:52 PM PST by LibLieSlayer ("Americans are hungry to feel once again a sense of mission and greatness." Ronaldo Magnus)
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To: rabidralph
Those Fins sure think a lot of their rifles :-)

Yes they do! I've got it on a very reliable source that Santa is packing a mod 85 in .30-06 just for me! :))

94 posted on 12/17/2011 12:15:00 PM PST by 41Thunder (The SUPPLY of Government is GREATER than the DEMAND of the people)
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To: macquire

“Long distance shooting is NOT hunting.”

The site www.longrangehunting.com may be a refutation to your argument.


95 posted on 12/17/2011 12:15:20 PM PST by GladesGuru (In a society predicated upon freedom, it is necessary to examine principles."...the public interest)
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To: macquire

How right you are, it’s not hunting, it’s SPORT!


96 posted on 12/17/2011 12:18:19 PM PST by tupac
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To: calex59
“I think reading comprehension classes would help many of our FReepers.”

That's the understatement of the day.

I'm always amazed how some people read things.

97 posted on 12/17/2011 12:36:50 PM PST by IMR 4350
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To: IMR 4350

Great powder BTW, I used to use it for my 06, back in the day.


98 posted on 12/17/2011 12:41:54 PM PST by calex59
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To: American in Israel

The M1A is a wonderful rifle and is my choice for long-distance target shooting and capable of any hunting requirements...plus, fun for long distance varmits.

Ques...9.3 rounds?


99 posted on 12/17/2011 12:45:19 PM PST by Cuttnhorse
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To: ottbmare

LOL...you are right on the money in your description of typical FReep threads.


100 posted on 12/17/2011 12:47:14 PM PST by Cuttnhorse
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