Posted on 12/01/2016 5:57:49 PM PST by Steely Tom
Did anyone here at Free Republic ever attend Erhard Seminars Training, back in the 1970s? Did anyone know another person who did?
If so, do you have any observations to share about the experience? Did it have any lasting influence over you?
Was it just an exercise in groupthink? Erhard certainly seemed to think he was on to something.
My family was literally dysfunctional...not just in a Psych 101-way where it is claimed that 95% of families are “dysfunctional”. My family literally could not meet basic requirements. I lived with my grandmother across the street from my parents’ house because my mother could not get up in the morning in time to get a couple of kids off to school. She would stay up half the night watching old movies, get to bed, and wake up at noon, just like a teen-ager on summer vacation. To escape I went to a college 1500 miles away but really didn’t have the skills to successfully handle academic responsibility. I graduated and stayed there but had a low-paying job, lousy boyfriends, and decent female friends. Est made me realize that I had to take charge of my life. I also realized that my mother had never taken responsibility for even taking care of herself (my father did the laundry, cooking, etc.). Through this insight I was able separate do-era from users.
I’ve found Stoic philosophy—in particular the writings of Epictetus (Enchiridion and Discourses)—to be very useful, as well as very easy to read.
It amazes me the number of people who have to essentially raise themselves because their experience of family life is so grossly distorted and dysfunctional.
I have a high-school friend — female — who I liked and admired when I saw her every day, but for some reason couldn't talk to. She just didn't present a contact surface, so to speak, back then.
At a reunion some years back, I spent hours talking to her, and found out she was physically abused by her father, who also abused his wife (who left him) and then a live-in girlfriend.
The abuse wasn't sexual (at least I don't think it was) but included everything else, including being thrown out of the house at night and having to fend for herself. She had a twin sister, and between the two of them a remarkable bond of survival developed.
Her first marriage was basically a repeat of her childhood experience with a husband playing the role that her father once played.
But her second marriage was with a great man, who gave her a great life, took care of her, was kind and loving to her.
The point is, I had absolutely not the slightest idea that this was going on back in high school. I saw the two of them — the two twin sisters, who were not identical — every day, and they seemed quite normal to me, if somewhat withdrawn and quiet. I assumed they went home to a family, two parents, a warm and cozy house, a safe bed to sleep in every night, just like I did. Nothing could have been further from the truth.
Multiply that sort of pain by millions, and you have the real world.
I'm glad you survived, MHT. I'm glad to have met you here tonight.
The earliest iterations of this movement were laid at BU School of Social Research in the early 60s. A PhD grad of that program, Dr. B., ran a group for 3 years in the mid 60s at Crane graduate school in Tufts where I matriculated. The program was a break down build up group process that trained for group leadership. I learned to effectively control groups of people by encouraging them to pit themselves against each other. A typical session focused on one member with everyone in attack mode. I came out of this abhorring the skills I had developed and refused to ever put them to use.
I was thinking the exact same thing. Book of John and Proverbs. I am actually studying John right now. Proverbs 3 is perfect for a young man.
You’re welcome. Definitely cult-like. If you’re real smart, you’ll see in the first few hours what’s going on there, and how easily manipulated most of the people there are. It freaked me out I must say. Had a few nuggets of truths but mostly is cultish and not recommended.
My younger brother and his wife did and about all I can say is that they (brother and his wife) were intolerable to be around after that. They became very condescending and fooled themselves into believing that they knew things that they didn’t know.
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Two of my draftsmen attended EST, and it destroyed their lives through divorce and subsequent strife.
Didn’t do anything good for their work habits either. One of them began stuttering severly, and had to carry a note pad and pencil to communicate.
“Erhard” was just another self-hating american Jew, like the Democrat party is chock full of.
Most people that have their name changed are mentally ill, and Erhard was no exception.
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The smart people just pissed on the floor.
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>> “Sort of how to be a sociopathic used car salesman like its founder.” <<
That’s it in a nutshell.
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The "Dr. B" thing at Tufts sounds like the application of something thought up by the Cheka in the old USSR.
I agree about people who change their names. It's almost always a bad sign. There are legitimate reasons, such as if a father or other family member is involved in a crime that brings great infamy through the media, or if one happens to share a name with a notorious criminal (I think I recall hearing about some Ted Bundys changing their name), but usually its a sign of serious internal problems.
Thanks all of you for your observations and insights.
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>> “ They became very condescending and fooled themselves into believing that they knew things that they didn’t know.” <<
They became “climate scientists?” :o)
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So did I! I also got involved in Actualizations at the same time -- but in Los Angeles. I won't mock it; it actually helped me in a number of ways -- socially, as well as psychologically, as back then I had just left college, at 21, and was extremely insecure and damaged by a crappy childhood. It taught me to accept responsibility and the power to change. I was exposed also to a diversity of people. Although most of them were white, they were of different backgrounds.
However, in retrospect, Actualizations was a starting point for more intensive therapy (where, ironically, many of those people headed). I can see its potential damage when there is no moral system integrated. I say this in hindsight, since I became involved in a religious community. Nowadays, I would not recommend Actualizations, EST (Landmark), or any secular movement, since it ultimately encourages narcissism.
OMG! They became liberals!
I remember John Denver was an est disciple. He never had a Top 10 hit again.
Unfortunately a lot of these types ruined the country. (I'm Jewish; grew up around them. I am so glad I moved to Orthodoxy.)
It sucks and it’s for suckers.
I was there, but don’t remember the bathroom thing.
I agree and my experience was similar. I guess what the “course” did was enable me to see there is an inner life to a person, or CAN be. At that point in my life I was focused on the world outside me and attempting to force it to behave MY WAY! As I reflect on it, this experience enabled me to open my mind long enough for God to get in. Then the REAL changes began.
Your point about narcissism is apt. Secular teachings always end up at self. Since self is unwilling to sacrifice self, it’s an endless cycle of frustration. Without God, it’s emptiness.
EST is an example of delusional self helpers trying desperately to find something other than God to fill the void
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