But the Russian government is incompetent and criminal in their task of protecting the people. They play a game of terror and anti-terror, but this is not working.
I can't compare the events in the US with those in Moscow for the simple reason: there it was "bang" and all over, while with us two years ago it was 57 hours of waiting and possibilities to avert tragedy.
What bothers me are lies and liars.
The world exhaled in relief on the morning of October 26th, 2002, when the Russian government officially stated that it was ALL OVER WITHOUT CASUALTIES, that all the hostages were saved. A LIE. Everyone sent congratulatory telegrams to Moscow about the outstanding operation they carried out, but after a few hours interior minister Vasilev said there were some 67 casualties. AGAIN A LIE, that there were no children or foreigners among these. ANOTHER LIE. Finally this figure rose to 128 with sixty missing who were thought to be of the hostages those days.
Now when governments, including Mr. Bush, ask for clarification, or when the parliament demands to know what went on, Moscow showing how their actions were correct by bringing out these same telegrams which they got FOR LYING ABOUT NO CASUALTIES.
A simple question: Why did they use the gas? According to a witness to the storming of the building by fighters from "A" and "V" special forces, the terrorists weren't asleep but fired back. According to witnesses among the hostages, the woman-terrorists understood that it was a gas attack, and fell asleep slowly - for ten minutes. That means that there was time to shoot the hostages and set off the bombs, the gas didn't prevent anything.
Yes, however strong the gas was, it would only take a fraction of a second to press the button to set off a bomb. So why the secret here? Maybe the Chechyans really weren't going to kill almost a thousand innocent people?
Another question: why did they blast through a wall if there was so many explosives there? Any schoolkid knows that a detonation is the surest way to blow up all the explosives nearby (since the wall was glass, they could have just dismounted it). In addition, if there really were explosives there, there was never a statement for TV or the newspapers about how much TNT there was. And so, how much was there, and was there even any? And why, despite the danger of explosion, was the HQ located in the building at a distance of 10-15 meters from the theater? HQ officers weren't afraid of an explosion?
Let's say that the sleeping Chechnyan women were shot because everyone was afraid of an explosion. But why shoot those who weren't wearing explosive belts? Evidentally it was very important to shoot them. And why were they shot after the attack, already unarmed, and in handcuffs?
It was stated that the attack began because the 'terrorists began to execute hostages' or 'were getting ready to execute' them. Now its known that there were no executions, IT WAS A LIE to explain the use of force.
They maintain that there was no other way. But there really was, and everyone knew it - through negotiations. Anna Politkovskaya offered a way, but a political decision was made not to negotiate Because no one was going to talk about removing troops from Chechnya to end this 'short anti-terror operation' which has been going on for almost ten years.
All the Chechnyan attacks since Nord-Ost have been more effective and better planned, the bombs have been bigger, and the victims even greater. According to a London institute, in 2003 four thousand Russians have been killed in Chechnyna. Can anyone in Russia not consider this a serious loss of life?
Many accuse me of 'Stockholm syndrome' with regards to the Chechnyans. Judging from how you judge the actions of the Russian government, you have 'Moscow syndrome'. I could not save my family. Everything I am doing know is an attempt to save you and your families.
You are the liar. I personally translated and posted here a statement from Putin that was on lenta.ru, after I stayed up all night reading the Russian news sites and translating for many here. I never saw the things you claim were said on Lenta or any other news site. Nor did any of my Russian friends hear such things, according to what they told us.
Putin we could not rescue them all, forgive us
Btw be sure to read my post #44, which says "The Russians accepted help, in person, from the representatives of 29 countries. All of whom were in Moscow on the eve before the rescue operation. Included were USA, Great Britain, Germany, Italy, France, China, Japan and the republic of South Africa."
You've got a lot more blaming to do! Better get going!!!
Also see post #99 about my near-constant posting from Russian news sites during the hostage crisis.
You must think we are really stupid here. That you can come here as if we all know nothing and make all these claims. You make yourself into a huge fool. Go somewhere else and try to get away with all these lies.
From my link, "Posted on 10/26/2002 11:35:05 AM PDT by MarMema"
I think you need some serious help.
You have a tremendous amount of guts to come here and defend a Michael Moore supporter. You are not long for this forum. Nice knowing you - well, never mind about that actually.
You say you don't defend terrorists and then you say this. For your information many here find this to be quite admirable. You might want to get out and read some of the threads here instead of just trying to use this forum for your own personal agenda.
Good hunting, Putin. Get them in their outhouses and in their beds if you must. They are evil vermin and must be eradicated. The large majority here are with you.
God Bless President Bush and President Putin, as they fight such evil and have to put up with the likes of you and your Michael Moore communist friends in the process.
If you feel so strongly about this, why not let us collect a ticket for you and you can move to Ikcheria and live more closely with those who hate the good and light in the world? I will be happy to contribute.
SVNI,
I know you were invited here by Peter. I have great respect for him.
But please, I've NOT seen any report to support this statement:
>>>The world exhaled in relief on the morning of October 26th, 2002, when the Russian government officially stated that it was ALL OVER WITHOUT CASUALTIES, that all the hostages were saved.<<<
Do you have a link to show for this?
And for your comment about not shooting a terrorist that doesn't have an explosive belt...that is standard training procedure. That isn't indigenous to Russia. Any swat team/anti terror team would shoot on sight once an incident gets to a hostage situation.
I'm lost here. What is your point?
I can't compare the events in the US with those in Moscow for the simple reason: there it was "bang" and all over, while with us two years ago it was 57 hours of waiting and possibilities to avert tragedy.
Even through I feel sorry for her, I ca'nt let this go without a reply! "BANG AND ALL OVER??!!" WHAT??!! I guess she does'nt think about all the people trapped on the floors who could'nt get down because of the fire and calling their family frantically on the cell phone just to say goodby, or maybe jumping out the window to escape the fire! I guess she does'nt think about the people who tried to ran down the stairs and got trapped and burned alive and the firemen who tried to rescue them and were killed themself. I guess she does'nt think about the relatives who called hospitals for days and weeks and put up photos that said, have you seen this person? Hoping and praying they had survived? It was defanitely NOT "BANG AND ALL OVER!