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1 posted on 12/11/2002 6:28:09 AM PST by A2J
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To: A2J
More creationist BS. In another 20 years we'll be able to create life from scratch using amino acids. Where will the cretionist arguments go then?
2 posted on 12/11/2002 7:09:20 AM PST by Soliton
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To: balrog666; Condorman; *crevo_list; general_re; Gumlegs; jennyp; longshadow; PatrickHenry; ...
Ping
3 posted on 12/11/2002 7:12:05 AM PST by Junior
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To: A2J
YEC bump for later
6 posted on 12/11/2002 7:47:31 AM PST by LiteKeeper
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To: A2J
...still leaves many unanswered questions about the origin of life.

One cannot argue against this statement if it is taten out of context, nor can anyone deny that textbooks are riddled with errors. My son's advanced biology teacher gave up trying to find a decent textbook and wrote his own. Everyone in the class passed the AP exam, so he couldn't have been a complete fraud.

The biggest threat to teaching is not creationists, but the socialized, centralized textbook purchasing systems of the public schools.

8 posted on 12/11/2002 8:22:15 AM PST by js1138
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To: A2J
The South is so progressive.
15 posted on 12/11/2002 9:15:14 AM PST by stanz
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To: A2J
High school biology textbooks would include a disclaimer that evolution is only a theory ...

If they do that, they should have a "disclaimer" for the Theory of Covalent Bonds, the Theory of General Relativity, and the Theory of Stellar Evolution.

In fact, everything in science should be labeled a theory, since it is always open to review and alteration because of new evidence.
21 posted on 12/11/2002 9:46:30 AM PST by BikerNYC
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To: A2J
Oh, a disclaimer again!
How about a page that explains what "theory", "hypothesis", "law", "model", etc. really mean in the scientific context?
26 posted on 12/11/2002 10:04:02 AM PST by BMCDA
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To: A2J
from the article: "John Oller Jr., a professor at the University of Louisiana-Lafayette..."

Once again, a creationist uses his lofty title to get the good people of Louisiana in a tizzy. I wonder if he mentions to them that "John Oller is Professor and Head of Communicative Disorders" at UL-Lafayette. And that his body of work includes how to get people to come to understand the words of Jesus were all true:
http://www.trinitysem.edu/journal/oller_collinspap.html

it never ends with these people.
27 posted on 12/11/2002 10:09:00 AM PST by whattajoke
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To: A2J
It boggles the mind how this should even NOT be in a textbook on evolution. It's a theory. Why the fear to call it such?
This intellectual dishonesty foisted on our kids needs to end.
While they're at it, comb the books themselves and delete all the subtle references that deceive the readers into believing that evolution is something resembling fact.
29 posted on 12/11/2002 10:15:15 AM PST by ALS
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To: A2J
Once again, it's not enough for the fundamentalists to teach their own children.
30 posted on 12/11/2002 10:17:21 AM PST by Trailerpark Badass
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To: A2J
Bump to watch the creationists get stupid again.
72 posted on 12/11/2002 1:24:30 PM PST by Aric2000
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To: A2J
Even a stopped clock department

"I don't believe I evolved from some primate," said Jim Stafford, a board member from Monroe.

In his ignorance Jimbo got it right. He didn't evolve from some primate.

What he doesn't realize is that he is a primate

Primate: from L. primas: "of the first rank": the highest order of the Mammalia including man, monkeys, lemurs, and the Archbishops of York and Canterbury.

93 posted on 12/11/2002 4:07:53 PM PST by Oztrich Boy
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To: A2J
"Paul Pastorek of New Orleans, president of the board, said he will oppose the addition. "I am not prepared to go back to the Dark Ages," Pastorek said. "

I think this has to be a misquote...It was probably supposed to be, "I am not going to let anyone keep me from living in the Dark Ages. Truth be damned!"

101 posted on 12/11/2002 7:50:55 PM PST by intolerancewillNOTbetolerated
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To: A2J
High school biology textbooks would include a disclaimer that evolution is only a theory under a change approved Tuesday by a committee of the state's top school board.

Actually this does not go far enough. For a start they need to get rid of all books which continue to repeat the lies about the Haeckel's embryos, the moths, the horses, the fruit flies, the finches, and the Miller-Urey experiment - all of them long disproven and still being repeated as scientific fact by evolutionists in textbooks. It's time that all schools stopped subsidizing the publishers of lies.

108 posted on 12/11/2002 8:25:37 PM PST by gore3000
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To: A2J
High school biology textbooks would include a disclaimer that evolution is only a theory under a change approved Tuesday by a committee of the state's top school board.

What's ironic about this is, a theory is an explanation for the facts. So, the stickers are warning the students that "evolution is not a fact; it's an explanation for the facts." Oh-kaaaaaaayyyyy. And knowing this distinction will save the students' souls because...?

157 posted on 12/11/2002 11:26:33 PM PST by jennyp
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To: A2J
"Backers bristled at suggestions that they favor the teaching of creationism, which says that life began about 6,000 years ago in a process described in the Bible's Book of Genesis."

They SHOULD bristle at that because the Bible doesn't teach that. In fact, it alludes to man being present (and going extinct) long before Adam.

189 posted on 12/12/2002 11:36:33 AM PST by nightdriver
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To: A2J
Evolution: What is it?

Wells Vindicated on Multiple Counts


For Textbooks and Evaluation Criterion, See Following Pages

TEXTBOOK
#1
#2
#3
#4
#5
#6
#7
#8
#9
#10
ICON
Miller-Urey
D
D
F
F
D
F
D
F
F
F
Darwin's tree of life
F
D
D
F
F
F
F
F
F
F
Vertebrate limb homology
D
D
D
D
F
F
D
F
D
D
Haeckel's embryos
F
D
F
F
F
D
F
F
F
F
Archaeopteryx
C
B
D
D
D
F
D
F
F
F
Peppered moths
X
N/A
D
F
F
F
F
D
F
F
Darwin's finches
F
D
D
X
D
F
F
D
F
F
OVERALL GRADE
D-
D+
D-
F
F
F
F
F
F
F

List of Textbooks Evaluated
(All have copyright dates of 1998 or later. Books are listed alphabetically by first author's last name.)
1. Alton Biggs, Chris Kapicka & Linda Lundgren, Biology: The Dynamics of Life (Westerville, OH: Glencoe/McGraw-Hill, 1998). ISBN 0-02-825431-7
2. Neil A. Campbell, Jane B. Reece & Lawrence G. Mitchell, Biology, Fifth Edition (Menlo Park, CA: The Benjamin/Cummings Publishing Company, 1999). ISBN 0-8053-6573-7
3. Douglas J. Futuyma, Evolutionary Biology, Third Edition (Sunderland, MA: Sinauer Associates, 1998). ISBN 0-87893-189-9
4. Burton S. Guttman, Biology, (Boston: WCB/McGraw-Hill, 1999). ISBN 0-697-22366-3
5. George B. Johnson, Biology: Visualizing Life, Annotated Teacher's Edition (Orlando, FL: Holt, Rinehart & Winston, 1998). ISBN 0-03-016724-8
6. Sylvia Mader, Biology, Sixth Edition (Boston: WCB/McGraw-Hill, 1998). ISBN 0-697-34080- 5
7. Kenneth R. Miller & Joseph Levine, Biology, Fifth Edition (Upper Saddle River, NJ: Prentice-Hall, 2000). ISBN 0-13-436265-9
8. Peter H. Raven & George B. Johnson, Biology, Fifth Edition (Boston: WCB/McGraw-Hill, 1999). ISBN 0-697-35353-2
9. William D. Schraer & Herbert J. Stoltze, Biology: The Study of Life , Seventh Edition (Upper Saddle River, NJ: Prentice Hall, 1999). ISBN 0-13-435086-3
10. Cecie Starr & Ralph Taggart, Biology: The Unity and Diversity of Life, Eighth Edition (Belmont, CA: Wadsworth Publishing Company, 1998). ISBN 0-534-53001-X.

Specific Evaluation Criterion
In general, an "A" requires full disclosure of the truth, discussion of relevant scientific controversies, and a recognition that Darwin's theory -- like all scientific theories -- might have to be revised or discarded if it doesn't fit the facts. An "F" indicates that the textbook uncritically relies on logical fallacy, dogmatically treats a theory as an unquestionable fact, or blatantly misrepresents published scientific evidence.

The Miller-Urey Experiment
Many modern scientists believe that living cells arose from chemical building-blocks that formed on the early Earth. In 1953, Stanley Miller used an electric spark to simulate lightning in a mixture of gasses thought to resemble the Earth's primitive atmosphere, and produced some of the chemical building-blocks of life. The experiment is pictured in many biology textbooks to show that scientists now understand an important early step in the origin of life. But scientists determined over a decade ago that the Earth's primitive atmosphere was probably nothing like the mixture of gasses Miller used, and now acknowledge that the origin of life's building-blocks remains unexplained.

D= includes a picture or drawing of the Miller-Urey apparatus with a misleading caption claiming or implying that the experiment simulated conditions on the early Earth; but the accompanying text explicitly points out that this was probably not the case (merely listing other gasses, and leaving it to the student to spot the discrepancy, is not sufficient); may leave the student with the impression that the experiment (or some variant of it) demonstrated how life's building-blocks formed on the early earth.
F = includes a picture or drawing of the Miller-Urey apparatus with a misleading caption claiming or implying that the experiment simulated conditions on the early Earth; the text contains no mention of the experiment's flaws, and leaves the student with the impression that it demonstrated how life's building-blocks formed on the early earth.

Darwin's Tree of Life
Darwin believed that all living things are modified descendants of one or a few original forms. Most biology textbooks show the branching-tree pattern that would result from such "descent with modification," and tell students that it is so thoroughly confirmed by the fossil and molecular evidence that it may be called a "scientific fact." But the fossil record of the "Cambrian explosion" shows that the major groups of animals appeared at about the same time -- a "lawn" rather than a tree; and recent molecular evidence suggests a "tangled thicket" instead of the branching pattern of Darwin's tree of life.

D = assumes the truth of universal common ancestry without questioning it (and may call it a "fact"); mentions the Cambrian explosion in the body of the text (briefly mentioning it in a note at the end of the chapter, without explaining what it is, is not sufficient), but does not discuss the problem it poses for Darwinian evolution.
F = assumes the truth of universal common ancestry without questioning it (and may call it a "fact"); does not even mention the Cambrian explosion.

Homology in Vertebrate Limbs
A bat's wing, a porpoise's flipper, a horse's leg, and a human hand all contain bones that are structurally similar. Before Darwin, biologists called this "homology," and considered it evidence for a common design, but Darwin attributed it to a common ancestor. Modern Darwinists have re-defined homology as similarity due to common ancestry, but now homology cannot serve as evidence for common ancestry without arguing in a circle. Many biology textbooks use circular reasoning anyway: We know that two features are homologous because they come from a common ancestor, and we know they come from a common ancestor because they're homologous.

D = defines homology as similarity of structure and position, and cites it as evidence for common ancestry; may attribute homology to similar genes or similar developmental pathways, but fails to mention that the evidence does not fit the claim.
F = defines homology as similarity due to common ancestry, then engages in circular reasoning by citing homology as evidence for common ancestry.

Haeckel's Embryos
Darwin believed that all animals with backbones (including humans) evolved from fish-like ancestors, and he thought the best evidence for this was that the early embryos of amphibians, reptiles, birds and mammals are similar to fish embryos. Many biology textbooks carry drawings (originally by Ernst Haeckel) to illustrate this, and claim that human embryos possess "gill slits." But embryologists have known for over a century that such drawings are false, and that early embryos of amphibians, reptiles, birds and mammals do NOT resemble fish. Human embryos pass through a stage when they have wrinkles in their necks, but they never have "gill slits."

D = uses actual photos rather than Haeckel's drawings, but chooses those which best fit the theory; fails to mention that earlier stages are dissimilar, and claims that early similarities in vertebrate embryos are evidence for common ancestry and Darwinian evolution; may call pharyngeal pouches "gill slits."
F = uses Haeckel's drawings (or a re-drawn version of them) without mentioning the dissimilarity of earlier stages; claims that early similarities in vertebrate embryos are evidence for common ancestry and Darwinian evolution; may call pharyngeal pouches "gill slits."

Archaeopteryx - The Missing Link
Darwin believed that modern species were linked in the past by innumerable transitional forms, but when he published his theory in 1859 those transitional links were missing. The discovery of Archaeopteryx, a fossil bird with reptile-like teeth, helped to persuade many people that Darwin's theory was true, and many biology textbooks still feature Archaeopteryx as the "missing link" between reptiles and birds. Yet paleontologists no longer believe that Archaeopteryx was the ancestor of modern birds, and its own ancestors are the subject of heated controversy. The "missing link" between reptiles and birds, it seems, is still missing.

D = presents Archaeopteryx as the transitional link between reptiles (or dinosaurs) and modern birds; does not point out that modern birds are probably not descended from it, but at least hints at the fact that there is a controversy over its ancestry or its transitional status.
F = presents Archaeopteryx as the transitional link between reptiles (or dinosaurs) and modern birds; does not point out that modern birds are probably not descended from it, and does not even hint at the fact that there is a controversy over its ancestry or its transitional status.

Peppered Moths
Darwin had no direct evidence for natural selection, the principal mechanism in his theory of evolution. Experiments in the 1950s seemed to provide the missing evidence by showing that light-colored peppered moths were more easily seen and eaten by predatory birds on pollution-darkened tree trunks, leaving mostly dark-colored moths to survive and reproduce. Many biology textbooks carry photographs of light and dark peppered moths on tree trunks to illustrate this famous story. Yet biologists have known for over a decade that the story has problems. Among other things, peppered moths don't normally rest on tree trunks, and the textbook photographs have been staged.

D = uses staged photos without mentioning that they misrepresent the natural situation; but the accompanying text at least hints at the fact that there are problems with Kettlewell's experiments or the classical story.
F = uses staged photos without mentioning that they misrepresent the natural situation; describes Kettlewell's experiments as a demonstration of natural selection, without mentioning their flaws or problems with the classical story.

Darwin's Finches
Many biology textbooks claim that finches on the Galapagos Islands, whose beak sizes are correlated with the foods they eat, helped to convince Darwin of evolution by natural selection in 1835. But the legend of "Darwin's finches" was actually contrived a century later. Some textbooks also tell students that a slight increase in the average size of finch beaks, observed after a severe drought in the 1970s, shows how natural selection could produce a new species in only two hundred years. But the textbooks fail to mention that the change was reversed when the rains returned, and no net evolution occurred.

D = describes the Galapagos finches as a good example of adaptive radiation (the origin of species by natural selection); but points out either that selection on finch beaks oscillates between wet and dry years or that the finches did not play an important role in the formulation of Darwin's theory.
F = describes the Galapagos finches as a good example of adaptive radiation (the origin of species by natural selection); but fails to mention that selection on finch beaks oscillates between wet and dry years, and implies that the finches played an important role in the formulation of Darwin's theory.

and…
“Douglas Futuyma's text (Evolutionary Biology, 3rd edition) he writes: "By coupling the undirected, purposeless variations to the blind, uncaring process of natural selection, Darwin made the theological or spiritual explanations of the life processes superfluous."

" Purvis, Orians and Heller, (in Life: The Science of Biology, 4th edition) tell students that, "the living world is constantly evolving without any goals.. . .evolutionary change is not directed."

Fairly new articles:
From the bone of a horse, a new idea for aircraft structures

'Junk DNA' Contains Essential Information

Intelligent Design Could Offer Fresh Ideas on Evolution

538 posted on 12/16/2002 7:41:27 AM PST by Heartlander
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To: A2J
Hooray!
738 posted on 12/17/2002 8:22:53 PM PST by rwfromkansas
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To: A2J; All
The argument is moot: Creation is self-evident.

I have a strong hunch that the most current theories in evolution are a somewhat accurate picture of natural history, but I don't know for sure.

Meanwhile, I am completely convinced that the Creator is the God of Israel, and Jesus Christ is His Son.

I have no problem believing both things. I only have a problem with my brothers in Christ sometimes rejecting me because I don't believe that Genesis was written as God's "Materials and Methods" section. This is grievous to me sometimes, because I otherwise see the world as my "creationist" brethren do. The way I see it, the godless have even less excuse if the theory of evolution is true.

I recommend Romans 1 in the Bible, and the writings of John C. Polkinghorne to everybody.

The political argument is moot, too, because no level of government should be involved in the education (which ALWAYS involves indoctrination) of our children.

779 posted on 12/18/2002 12:01:51 PM PST by agrandis
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To: A2J

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908 posted on 12/19/2002 6:09:28 PM PST by Bob J
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