Ruger P345PR: Should I buy this?

March 21, 2006 | JewishRighter

[JewishRighter]

I am considering buying a pistol for personal, home protection. I don't expect to have any concealed carry needs/opportunities/license. I am pretty well settled on 45ACP as a benchmark for stopping power. I am also limiting my preferences to American manufacturers. I don't expect to do a lot of shooting, except for regular practice to maintain proficiency.

I've seen a lot of discussion of various weapons and I'm really asking for views on reliability, durability, user-friendliness, safety and degree of kickback for the Ruger P345PR. If anyone suggests another American made 45, please tell me why it would be preferred over the Ruger.

Thanks to anyone who can weigh in.

[Mikey_1962]

Well, if you really MUST know, yes I am fucking nutz.

The first hand gun I ever had was a 0.357 Magnum, and my next two were 0.44 Mags: Dan Wesson and Ruger with a Magna Port.

With a minimum amount of range time anyone can become very good at handling a large caliber handgun.

[ExSoldier]

With a minimum amount of range time anyone can become very good at handling a large caliber handgun...

You remind me of the classic boyfriend or Dad who takes his girlfriend or daughter out to the south pasture and hands them either a 44 magnum or a 12 ga with 000 Buck and say here try this. The resultant blast and exclamations of FEAR cause that big old MANLY arm to circle those small helpless shoulders and whisper soothingly: Don't you worry, Darlin' I'll protect you! That makes me sick. Tell me, did you START on a magnum the very first time you ever fired a handgun? The 44 is a great gun. I took a Bull Elk at about 40 meters with one in the early 1980's. Got about a thousand pounds of meat off him. I wouldn't EVER carry a 44 on the street. Nor would I ever recommend such to a novice as the "best" gun for self defense. It kicks like Tennessee white lightnin', sounds like the crack of DOOM and is almost guaranteed to induce permanent flinch in even an experienced shooter who doesn't shoot them daily...which I might add is a good definition for masochism. I really hope you haven't been dispensing this garbage as advice to your friends....who'll probably just accept it as truth because you carry the mighty 44 just like Dirty Harry....but I suspect you do and that means I'll have to add them to my prayer list and ask that God protect them from you and your advice.

[randyclark]

Can't go wrong with a Glock or HK USP. Someone had commented that the handgun is to get you to a safe place where your long gun is, which I agree. My long gun is not my shotgun though-its a flat top Bushy with an Aimpoint CompM, and Surefire P6, full of 50 grain frangibles. (My house has old, heavy plaster walls)
Get a decent set of electronic ear protection and wear them. I don't know if you ever have fired a gun inside in the dark, but after that first round, you can be pretty deaf and blind.

[kerryusama04]

I'm not an NRA instructor, just a lowly Life Member and CCW holder. I can remember buying my first gun 5 years ago and still feel like the guys behind the counter know waaayyy more than me.

Note to JR - Gun shop owners/trainers tend to be a-holes. I got ripped off by the two first stores I bought from. If you have a problem with a gun the day after you buy it, expect to deal with the manufacturer. I think it is because they tend to deal with some stupid people.

This board is a perfect example of the gun-guy attitude. JR asked about a DAO polymer gun in 45, and what was the first reply? Buy a shotgun, 1911, or wheel gun. Imagine if you walked on the Chevy lot wanting an Impala SS and the guy says, "no, what you need is an LT Suburban". You would leave, wouldn't you?

Here's a link to a review of the 345The only beef I have with this gun is the magazine disconnect. This means that even if you have a round in the chamber, if you take out the magazine (to reload), the gun is useless until you put another magazine in. Other than that, good for you for finding a US made non-1911 in 45.

[Uri’el-2012]

ExSoldier; JewishRighter

I'm not an NRA instructor,....... Note to JR - Gun shop owners/trainers tend to be a-holes. I got ripped off by the two first stores I bought from. If you have a problem with a gun the day after you buy it, expect to deal with the manufacturer. I think it is because they tend to deal with some stupid people.

This board is a perfect example of the gun-guy attitude. JR asked about a DAO polymer gun in 45, and what was the first reply? Buy a shotgun, 1911, or wheel gun. Imagine if you walked on the Chevy lot wanting an Impala SS and the guy says, "no, what you need is an LT Suburban". You would leave, wouldn't you?

Here's a link to a review of the 345The only beef I have with this gun is the magazine disconnect. This means that even if you have a round in the chamber, if you take out the magazine (to reload), the gun is useless until you put another magazine in. Other than that, good for you for finding a US made non-1911 in 45.

44 posted on 03/22/2006 7:08:55 AM MST by kerryusama04

I am considering buying a pistol for personal, home protection. I don't expect to have any concealed carry needs/opportunities/license

A short barreled shotgun in 12Ga is a better choice for home protection than a handgun, any hand gun.

I'm not saying don't buy a hand gun. But consider a shotgun for personal protection in the home.

I would not recommend a pistol grip for a shotgun, as it is way too easy to break your wrist.

Once a year I train NRA Certified Pistol Instructors up to be NRA Certified Personal Protection in the Home Instructors.

In selecting a gun for home defense buy a "functionally reliable" gun that fires every time the trigger is pulled.

I would not recommend any pistol with a magazine safety, as all safety is with the operator of the gun.

If you follow the rules for gun handling as taught by the NRA.

Always keep the gun pointed in a safe direction.

Always keep your finger off the trigger until ready to shoot.

Always keep the gun unloaded until ready to use.

You and all around you will be safe.

A safety is a mechanical device which can and will fail.

First consider a Basic Pistol and a Personal Protection the Home course taught by an NRA Certified Instructor.

During the course you will be trained in the criteria for selecting a gun.

In addition, in the PPitH course you will spend a hour or two with a LEO or an attorney reviewing your local laws governing firearms.

b'shem Y'shua

[ExSoldier]

This board is a perfect example of the gun-guy attitude. JR asked about a DAO polymer gun in 45, and what was the first reply? Buy a shotgun, 1911, or wheel gun.

Read his initial post again...carefully. He specifically stated the gun was for home defense as he did not intend to carry it on the street. What the others and I said was correct: A shotgun trumps a handgun in the self defense role. A handgun gives you survival time to reach your shotgun and remove the threat(s). Had he specifically asked about street carry then I would have responded as such...actually I gave my feedback on Ruger semiautos. The 345 is a standard sized service pistol like the H&K USP45. If I were looking for a gun made in America, compact 45 I'd go with the Glock Model 30. Not American owned but made by American workers. OTOH, An American company, Springfield Armory imports a foreign made and designed in Bosnia. The XD-45. Would that work for you? S&W makes a 45 DA, but I personally won't recommend them for personal and political reasons.

BTW, those guys behind the counter, unless they're certified instructors are all SALESMEN. They get commissions based on the number of guns they sell. They can be very savvy sounding and glib. It does NOT mean they're right. In fact I wouldn't be a bit surprised if Mikey_1962 was a gun salesman.

That's the classic mindset: You don't want that little 38sp. It's a toy! What you need is this $900 monster with the two or eight inch barrel.....Yeah the 2" is easier (??) to conceal, but you can knock 'em over two blocks away with the longer barrel....

[ExSoldier]

A short barreled shotgun in 12Ga is a better choice for home protection than a handgun, any hand gun. I'm not saying don't buy a hand gun. But consider a shotgun for personal protection in the home. I would not recommend a pistol grip for a shotgun, as it is way too easy to break your wrist. Once a year I train NRA Certified Pistol Instructors up to be NRA Certified Personal Protection in the Home Instructors. In selecting a gun for home defense buy a "functionally reliable" gun that fires every time the trigger is pulled. I would not recommend any pistol with a magazine safety, as all safety is with the operator of the gun. If you follow the rules for gun handling as taught by the NRA. Always keep the gun pointed in a safe direction. Always keep your finger off the trigger until ready to shoot. Always keep the gun unloaded until ready to use. You and all around you will be safe. A safety is a mechanical device which can and will fail. First consider a Basic Pistol and a Personal Protection the Home course taught by an NRA Certified Instructor. During the course you will be trained in the criteria for selecting a gun. In addition, in the PPitH course you will spend a hour or two with a LEO or an attorney reviewing your local laws governing firearms.

I agree 1000%!!!! Well said!

[ExSoldier]

This means that even if you have a round in the chamber, if you take out the magazine (to reload), the gun is useless until you put another magazine in.

Here's the upside to that argument: S'pose you have a very close encounter with the BG (bad guy) and you wind up in a battle for the retention of your gun...force on force. If you think you might lose, all you have to do is use your thumb to drop the mag or move it a little bit out of the mag well (many guns don't forcibly eject the mag, it sticks in the well and you have to lightly tug it out) and thus render the gun incapable of being used against you, even with a hot chamber. It's a safety device. Never EVER disable a mechanical safety!

Here's another view. If you have kids in the home, you can leave the chamber hot in the nightstand (at night or when you're home...but secure it at other times) and put the loaded mag elsewhere so that it's a simple matter to put the two together to be ready to ROCK.

[kerryusama04]

Perhaps one of you more enlightened and educated gentlemen could take a break from selling shotguns to people who want handguns to address the poster's question? Seriously, with all those certs, one of you has to have an opinion on the Ruger P345PR?

I am considering buying a pistol for personal, home protection. I don't expect to have any concealed carry needs/opportunities/license. I am pretty well settled on 45ACP as a benchmark for stopping power. I am also limiting my preferences to American manufacturers. I don't expect to do a lot of shooting, except for regular practice to maintain proficiency. I've seen a lot of discussion of various weapons and I'm really asking for views on reliability, durability, user-friendliness, safety and degree of kickback for the Ruger P345PR. If anyone suggests another American made 45, please tell me why it would be preferred over the Ruger.

My Glock 36 was made in Europe. I was incredibly surprised to find my XD's were really HS2000's. As far as I know, the only decent S&W DA 45 is the SW99, which is also imported.

My first defensive gun was a 590 and I love it. It cost $300 bucks and ammo is really cheap. It broke after thousands of shells and Mossberg fixed it and overnighted it back with no questions asked. There is no doubt that a shotgun will stop someone better than a handgun, but there are other considerations. Do you really want to blow huge holes in your walls? Do you have kids? Is your hallway big enough for a long gun to be applicable? Are you physically able and willing to put 1000's of shells through it training? Can you safely store it without making it useless for defense? Do you want to be discrete when you take your gun out of your house? Will your local range let you train (train, not stand there like a statue) with a shotgun? Will you feel like a retard shooting at targets with a shotgun?

[kerryusama04]

Here's another view. If you have kids in the home, you can leave the chamber hot in the nightstand (at night or when you're home...but secure it at other times) and put the loaded mag elsewhere so that it's a simple matter to put the two together to be ready to ROCK.

I was taught by both my dad and the military not to rely on safeties, but I'm not a certified instructor, so you better take that with a grain of salt :)

Follow the link to the review of the gun in question. The author addresses the mag safety and makes both points. It is my opinion not to buy guns for defense that need the planets aligned before they fire. If you want to keep a gun safe, the only thing you can do is unload it and lock it up.

[ExSoldier]

I am pretty well settled on 45ACP as a benchmark for stopping power.

By and large it's shot placement that wins gunfights, not power of the cartridge. That's one reason professional (read government) assassins use the 22LR with a hushpuppy (suppressor), because they can make the cranio-ocular shot. Or the medulla connection.

Your Glock 36 was most likely manufactered in Georgia (Smyrna?). Still, Glock is foreign owned. So what? Toyota and Mercedes and others have American plants that employ American labor at very good wages.

One reason I like the Glock is for the extremely "low to the hand" bore axis. This reduces felt recoil (what was referred to as "kickback" in the question). IIRC, the Ruger 345 has a higher bore axis. It is also (to me) a gun that is ergonomically unconfortable. But picking a handgun is like picking a girlfriend... ya gotta touch 'em a lot to see if you're a good match and everybody has different standards.

IMHO, head to head the Ruger 345 is not as reliable, durable, accurate, or user friendly as either the Glock or the H&K USP (compact or full size).

You are far more likely to have an over penetration of interior walls with a fast moving handgun round than with a load of shot. It is an urban myth that a shotgun load will just open up and splatter the BG all over your walls. In fact, it is possible to MISS with the shottie as the amount of spread capable of being achieved at the typical ranges inside the average American home will only allow for about a 4 inch expansion with a modified choke. Less on a full choke and slightly more with the improved cylinder choke. So yes a fair amount of practice will be necessary to use a shottie inside the home and use it well. But not thousands of rounds! The answer to training with a shottie is IDPA. This combat competitive organization often runs shotgun matches or three gun matches. There are lots of folks there who are certified instructors to help you along. Also, there will be several who've BTDT for real, either as a LEO or in military combat. My club is full of leo's and military.

But you make a good point on safe storage vs readiness. Valid concern. Also a handgun will tend to be more quickly brought to bear.

You refer to the S&W 99 which is the joint effort by Walther and S&W. It's a great gun, but Smith also makes other DA 45's. I personally don't like them, but my reasons are those associated with ergonomics.

[ExSoldier]

If you want to keep a gun safe, the only thing you can do is unload it and lock it up.

I think I would respond to that by saying: Safety is nice but it's not first. LIFE is first and Life is not safe.

Also, I would not tend to view the magazine disconnect as a direct safety in the operational sense. It's passive, not active if you get my meaning. But you're absolutely correct not to rely on them or any mechanical device. YOU are in fact the only "safety" that matters and if you follow those three little rules, you'll always be safe. The answer to children is to gun proof them not childproof the home.

[Uri’el-2012]

Perhaps one of you more enlightened and educated gentlemen could take a break
from selling shotguns to people who want handguns to address the poster's question?
Seriously, with all those certs, one of you has to have an opinion on the Ruger P345PR?

I would prefer that JewishRighter take an NRA course from a
Certified Instructor than to listen to a blog and make such an
intense decision about life threatening situations from people
without the aid of NRA training.

Other resources would be JPFO

I'm not a salesman for Ruger.
I'm providing JewishRighter with all that I've
learned as an NRA Certified Pistol Instructor and as an
NRA Certified Instructor in Personal Protection in the Home
In addition all that I've learned by attending a Training Counselor
Workshop and years as an NRA Certified Training Counselor
training NRA certified Pistol Instructors and
NRA Certified Personal Protection in the Home Instructors
and insights from every Instructor I've had the pleasure to train.

I'm currently a member of a team of NRA T/C s conducting
a NRA Training Counselor Workshop training
NRA Certified Instructors to become NRA Certified Training Counselors.

Gun Porn follows:


For shotguns for Home Protection, I personally prefer a Remington 870
or a Mossberg 590 "nine rounder" with a just legal barrel.

for handguns I choose a "functionally reliable" gun
that fires every time I pull the trigger. They include
a Glock 23(.40) & for carry a Glock 27(.40)
or a Glock 30(.45ACP) depending on the weather and clothing.

The only Ruger that I still own is a Stainless GP100 with a four inch barrel.

b'shem Y'shua

[ExSoldier]

You know, I've had many opportunities to become a training counselor and passed them by. Being a professional educator, my personal standards to certify a teacher for firearms is so high there wouldn't be much of a point. Knowing the guns and the rules is fine that's the starting point. But....ya gotta be able to teach. I haven't the patience to teach educational pedagogy.

[kerryusama04]

My Glock 36 reads "Made in Austria" on the slide and "Made in Austria, Glock Inc. Smyrna, GA". The so-what is because the poster wants a gun made in America. I tend to buy what works and hope it is made in America. I prefer the ergonomics and feel of the XD over the Glock. The Glock's trigger feels like gravel compared to the XD. I carry the G36 because it is the only reliable tiny 45 available, IMO. Sure, para and springfield make 3" 1911 variants, but they difference in weight and concealability are not equivalent.

I don't mean to dog your individual quals. I plan on attending Chapman Academy this year to attain an NRA cert. My point in being a butt head is that nobody seems to want to answer the post but just post their resume's and recommend weapons other than the one the poster wants. Somebody out there must have a Ruger semi-auto?

[Uri’el-2012]

You know, I've had many opportunities to become a training counselor and passed them by. Being a professional educator, my personal standards to certify a teacher for firearms is so high there wouldn't be much of a point. Knowing the guns and the rules is fine that's the starting point. But....ya gotta be able to teach. I haven't the patience to teach educational pedagogy.

Mostly we teach attitude and discernment.

b'shem Y'shua

[ExSoldier]

Actually if you have the bucks, check the Cylinder & Slide website and look for their "Adventurer." They guarantee 100% reliability. No small claim and Bill Laughridge can back it up.

Interesting on the Glock. I'll bet that the HQ for Glock America is in Smyrna GA. I wonder if the gun is made there from imported parts or what?

Can't fault you at all for the preferences of XD over Glock. Everything is preferences. IMHO you are very wise to shy away from any 1911 (except the Cylinder & Slide) variant that has a sub 4" barrel. I've owned both a ParaOrd and a Springfield Armory example and they were both a total POS. IMHO, the 1911 design becomes inherently and intrinsically flawed when the barrel shrinks smaller than 4 inches.

Lack of responses to the question about Ruger semiauto ownership ought to tell you something in itself. Look, IMHO, Ruger is a meat and potaotes gun. Nothing wrong with it, just nothing fancy. Nothing to write home about either. Good value for the money, but mostly as a duty gun, rather than for concealed carry. Low cost alternative.

[ExSoldier]

Mostly we teach attitude and discernment.

How very ZEN. Ahhhh grasshoppah.....

[Uri’el-2012]

Lack of responses to the question about Ruger semiauto ownership ought to tell you something in itself. Look, IMHO, Ruger is a meat and potaotes gun. Nothing wrong with it, just nothing fancy. Nothing to write home about either. Good value for the money, but mostly as a duty gun, rather than for concealed carry. Low cost alternative.

57 posted on 03/22/2006 11:56:01 AM MST by ExSoldier

I've owned Ruger pistols in the past, but I prefer Glocks,
as I teach and train Personal Protection.
1911s are only OK after you spend about $3000 on them.
A Glock works right out of the box.
Some people like fully supported chambers in aftermarket barrels.

I second everything ExSoldier stated about Ruger pistols.

I do like their wheelguns however.

b'shem Y'shua

[ExSoldier]

1911s are only OK after you spend about $3000 on them. A Glock works right out of the box.

I concur. I have the same opinion on my H&K USP.

I also agree on the 1911 observation except that my wife's Commander 45 has never been altered other than for night sights and it runs like a Ferrari. OTOH, none of my 1911's could finish an average IDPA match without relubing at some point. My USP went over 2000 rds without a lube or a cleaning, until I got bored and sick of a dirty gun, but she was running strong and hard. Seemed to enjoy the abuse. Accurate right from the box. If I could choose but one gun to take straight from the box and into combat, it'd be a USP 45. Hands down.