TSA bag inspections / search AFTER travel (passengers leaving TRAIN searched)

Flyer Talk ^ | February 21, 2011 | Cartoon Peril

[CedarDave]

This has been mentioned in other threads, but deserves its own. Here is a video from 2/13/11 showing a mother and two young children being searched AFTER they got off the train at the Savannah train depot. From the YouTube poster's account:

Quote: The only bad thing on our trip was TSA was at the Savannah train station. There were about 14 agents pulling people inside the building and coralling everyone in a roped area AFTER you got OFF THE TRAIN! This made no sense!!! Poor family in front of us! 9 year old getting patted down and wanded. They groped our people too and were very unprofessional. I am all about security, but when have you ever been harassed and felt up getting OFF a plane? Shouldnt they be doing that getting ON??? And they wonder why so many people are mad at them.

They have no bag X-ray, so while the mother is getting wanded down, and her bra strap felt, and the 9 year-old terrorist and the 11 year year-old terrorist are getting wanded down, and having their arms and legs patted down, two more TSOGOONS are pawing manually through their bags on the table.

I'd sure be curious to hear what the possible justification can be for searching people who are GETTING OFF of a train.

[tutstar]

bttt

[devattel]

Thank you for this information.

Americans feel violated by these searches because they know it is an invasion of privacy. Although it may not be apparent to many Americans, searches without a warrant require voluntary consent. This includes any checkpoint where it is considered to be in a public place, including an airport, station, or public road. Privacy does not mean others may see your personal belongings. Privacy means that the government or any other agency employed by the government may not see your personal belongings without probable cause or a warrant.

To avoid these searches, simply reject them. When they tell you to open your bags, you tell them kindly, "No I will not. Please ask me for consent." If they do ask you for consent, refuse. Then when they don't and detain you, you sue the TSA for illegal search.

We must follow this process, or the courts will never deem this invasion unconstitutional. The TSA is clearly violating the 4th and 14th Amendments. Why no attorney general has filed suit on this is a mystery unless one sees that the implications of being called a "terrorist lover" not boding well for them.

The safety of the nation never overshadows our inalienable rights. Nothing else does either. The founding fathers made this perfectly clear in the Declaration of Independence.

[Sarajevo]

It is like the US does not trust the other parts of the world’s security (smart move!).

I totally disagree. If inspections are to be made, they need to be made pre-flight, not after the flight is completed.

[CedarDave]

To avoid these searches, simply reject them. When they tell you to open your bags, you tell them kindly, "No I will not. Please ask me for consent." If they do ask you for consent, refuse. Then when they don't and detain you, you sue the TSA for illegal search.

If traveling on a plane, at best they will deny you boarding. At worst they will deny you boarding and fine your $10,000.

What are they going to do when you get off a train AFTER you arrive at your destination?? I see this as a totally different set of circumstances.

[piytar]

If I had ANY faith in the TSA, checking people getting off a train would make some sense. Why? Because a nasty terrorist scenario is to ride a train to your target and then detonate. Of course, packing people in a room for screening makes that scenario MORE deadly, not less.

Thus, this is just security theater and thugcopism. Nothing more.

[Surrounded_too]

It’s about time the Republicans an TEA Party started making a lot of noise about the nazification of America.

[silverleaf]

and what happens if you opt out? They make yon get back on the train?

poor old Charlie!

[brityank]

What are they going to do when you get off a train AFTER you arrive at your destination??

Put you on the list so you can't get back on the train (or flight) to return? Scumbags!

[Travis McGee]

It’s not just theater. They are beta testing police-state controls to see what happens. Will people comply? Be outraged? Curse them out for gestapo?

The answers to those questions shall determine if freedom is soon to be extinguished in this nation.

[sheana]

I would have refused them.....period. The trip is over I am off and done....screw off.
I just flew out of a small regional airport, no scanners just a walk thru metal detector. The gal asked me to remove my sweatshirt and I refused. She motioned me to go through the detector so I did. After I was through she tried to pull me aside for a pat down. I told her nothing beeped and no she was not going to pat me down. She kept insisting and I kept refusing. Lol. After a minute of this she said...well can I just pat down your back and arms and I said yes. I was adamant that they were not going to do a full pat down on me just because I refused to strip for them.

[piytar]

That”s what I meant by “thugcopism,” and you explained it well. Agreed 100%.

[devattel]

CedarDave said:

If traveling on a plane, at best they will deny you boarding. At worst they will deny you boarding and fine your $10,000.

What are they going to do when you get off a train AFTER you arrive at your destination?? I see this as a totally different set of circumstances.

The two circumstances are no different from each other from a legal perspective. The Supreme Court is very clear on the matter of preventing free travel. Two recent cases clearly defined this violation. Here is a citation from one:

It is a right broadly assertable against private interference as well as governmental action. Like the right of association, ... it is a virtually unconditional personal right, guaranteed by the Constitution to us all.

- Shapiro v Thompson, 394 U.S. 618 (1969)

Although the right to travel is in the Articles of Confederation, it is mysteriously absent from the Constitution. Nonetheless, this would be a clear violation of various segments of the Constitution, as it restricts free passage between states. Obviously the scenario changes with regards to international flights, but the majority of flights at various ports are domestic.

[devattel]

brityank said:

Put you on the list so you can't get back on the train (or flight) to return? Scumbags!

There is nothing finer than the TSA making people violate one inalienable right to enjoy another, then punishing people by eliminating both.

This works very well in countries that have no Bill of Rights nor Constitution. When I first watched Firefox back in the early 1980's the first thing I said to myself was "thank God all those checkpoints Eastwood had to pass through in the USSR don't exist here in America." How quickly we forget.

[Chode]

where...

Where will we draw the line?

When will we say enough??

What will finally provoke spontaneous direction action???

[Vor Lady]

Scary ping. I was thinking of taking an Amtrak ride to Denver for fun with the kids, silly me. I guess we’ll just drive.

[fightinJAG]

Um, how do these people know for sure that these searches made “no sense”?

Is it not at least possible that TSA had some specific information that led them to search at a time and place that they don’t normally search?

[fightinJAG]

Please, let’s not overreact at every turn.

Yes, I can think of plenty of scenarios in which LE/HS agents would be required to check passengers upon deboarding a train or an airplane, for that matter. Do people really think that the security is only concerned about what happens when the conveyance is underway?

If HS got information that someone may have brought a dirty bomb on a train, would it be okay for them to check for it or would that be “an amazing abuse of police power”?

If HS had information that a geiger counter held by an onboard air/train marshall went off, would it be okay to check passengers as they deboarded?

Let’s get a little real here.

Just sayin.

[spodefly]

The TSA — Building a compliant, docile, conditioned society of tax cows, and employing the best and brightest of the AA gene pool, since 2002.

[43north]

If we were able to trust our government you might have a point. But we can’t so you don’t.

Just sayin’

[ArmyTeach]

Umm, how can we be sure that these people in fact areTSA? Where are their bona fides? They wear a blue uniform - available at any uniform store. Military members display their names prominently displayed on their shirt - I don't see TSA names. TSA should be required to carry a TSA photo ID and present it upon request. RotsaRuck