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TARP Was Even Worse Than You Think: “An Abysmal Failure,” Barofsky Says
The Daily Ticker-Yahoo Finance ^ | 7/27/12 | Aaron Task

Posted on 07/27/2012 11:45:40 AM PDT by Kartographer

Much has been made about Barofsky's criticism of Treasury Secretary Tim Geithner, who told CBS News he is "deeply offended" by how he's portrayed in Barofsky's book Bailout: An Inside Account of How Washington Abandoned Main Street While Rescuing Wall Street.

Barofsky pulled no punches in our earlier segment about the ongoing rate-rigging scandal. (See: "I Hope We See People In Handcuffs": Neil Barofsky Weighs in on LIBOR Scandal)

In the accompanying video, we focused more on TARP's failings to live up to its promise to help individual Americans, not just the big banks.

(Excerpt) Read more at finance.yahoo.com ...


TOPICS: Business/Economy; Government
KEYWORDS: banksters; obama4tarp; rinos4tarp; romney4tarp; tarp
I liked this:"Officials in both the Bush and Obama administrations took the attitude "bankers know best," Barofsky recalls. "It was somewhat shocking how much control big banks had over their own bailout [and] the overwhelming deference show by Treasury officials to the banks."

A very common sentiment among the 'Bankster' defenders.
1 posted on 07/27/2012 11:45:46 AM PDT by Kartographer
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To: blam

PING!


2 posted on 07/27/2012 11:46:32 AM PDT by Kartographer ("We mutually pledge to each other our lives, our fortunes and our sacred honor.")
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To: Kartographer

TARP an abysmal failure?
I’m shocked. Just shocked!


3 posted on 07/27/2012 11:48:33 AM PDT by dfwgator (FUJR (not you, Jim))
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To: Kartographer

I am “deeply offended” that Geithner and the rest of his incompetent, criminal cretins are not in federal prison.

Shove it up your smelly Obama, Geithner. The only place for stellar incompetance such as yours is in government.


4 posted on 07/27/2012 11:51:01 AM PDT by Da Coyote
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To: Kartographer
BS.

It was a rousing Cloward-Piven success.

5 posted on 07/27/2012 11:52:45 AM PDT by E. Pluribus Unum (Government is the religion of the sociopath.)
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To: Jet Jaguar; NorwegianViking; ExTexasRedhead; HollyB; FromLori; EricTheRed_VocalMinority; ...

The list, Ping

Let me know if you would like to be on or off the ping list


6 posted on 07/27/2012 11:54:26 AM PDT by Nachum (The complete Obama list at www.nachumlist.com)
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To: Kartographer

I was not in favor of TARP, but the banks did pay TARP back.

However, what we will NEVER see back is the billions and billions and billions of dollars poured down the rat-hole of the government-sponsored enterprises Fannie and Freddie.

The left wants to demonize large banks in the minds of the sheeple in order to politically prepare for nationalizing the banks.

But they don’t want people to look at Fannie and Freddie and what the government was doing, because these are basically giant liberal slush funds who helped the Left destroy our traditional mortgage lending standards in the name of affirmative action.


7 posted on 07/27/2012 11:54:47 AM PDT by Meet the New Boss
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To: Meet the New Boss

They say they paid it back, but will we every really know that they did? And despite the fact that most of the government people in control of the Treasury, the Fed and other entities that controled, lent and and otherwise ran these programs were mostly exemployees, cronies, friends, investors and pals of those that ran the big banks the banks themselves are completely devoid of blame in these matters.


8 posted on 07/27/2012 12:07:40 PM PDT by Kartographer ("We mutually pledge to each other our lives, our fortunes and our sacred honor.")
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To: Kartographer

Stimulus through Government spending: It’s like taking water out of the deep end of the pool, pouring it in the shallow end, hoping to make the shallow end deeper.


9 posted on 07/27/2012 12:13:46 PM PDT by wayoverontheright
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To: Kartographer

Hmmm, banks get 800 Billion Dollars in exchange for worthless assets at super low percentage rates in TARP, they then go gamble on commodities and the stock market index because they also get more 0% FED money in QE I and II for more worthless assets which pushes them into the trillions category, they then “pay” us back on the original 800 Billion while making profit on bets funded by 0% to low percent FED money and dump their toxic assets on our backs. Then when the economy collapses, they scream for more funny money because their bets on commodities and stocks are going down without the constant infusion of FED 0% pumping.

That is like handing a criminal 1000 bucks, then handing the criminal 10000 bucks, and he peels off 1000 bucks and gives it back to you while gambling with the leftovers. His PR guy says “look, I paid you back the 1000 bucks” what is the big deal. TARP was the tip of the iceberg to this scam where fraudulent bankers were rewarded and allowed to dump their losses on our backs for guaranteed free money. This can only end badly.


10 posted on 07/27/2012 12:20:06 PM PDT by Gen-X-Dad
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To: Kartographer

They DO audit TARP. Maybe one day they’ll audit the Fed.

I would rather see government regulators be people with experience in the banking industry.

Because as a practical matter, if you exclude people with banking experience, what you’re left with as a pool of people from which to choose your regulators are left-wing professors.

This demonization of the big banks by the Left is similar to the demonization of the big health insurance companies by the Left.

Both industries are among the most regulated activities on earth, and yet the Left points to both as illustrating the “failure of unfettered capitalism” to argue for nationalization (or effective nationalization through complete government control, like ObamaCare).

Any resemblance between these industries and unfettered capitalism is purely coincidental.


11 posted on 07/27/2012 12:23:43 PM PDT by Meet the New Boss
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To: Kartographer
TARP Was Even Worse Than You Think: “An Abysmal Failure,” Barofsky Says

The bank recapitalization portion worked great. Cascading bank failures didn't occur. The banks paid the money back, at a profit to the Treasury.

The auto portion will end up costing tens of billions. And we'll never get back the $100 billion plus that TARP gave to Fannie and Freddie. The mortgage giveaway portion was also a waste of money.

12 posted on 07/27/2012 12:32:05 PM PDT by Toddsterpatriot (Math is hard. Harder if you're stupid.)
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To: Kartographer
They say they paid it back, but will we every really know that they did?

They lied? About hundreds of billions?

13 posted on 07/27/2012 12:33:50 PM PDT by Toddsterpatriot (Math is hard. Harder if you're stupid.)
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To: Kartographer
TARP was a failure of such EPIC proportions ($5Trillion and counting) that it should be used to lock all democraps in jail and outlaw their party

TARP locked in $1.4T deficits and is not stopping, and that is why they have not made a budget in 4 years. They would have to go BACK TO the last baseline budget figures of 2008 (+ 6% baseline)

14 posted on 07/27/2012 12:36:39 PM PDT by Mr. K ("The spread of evil is the symptom of a vacuum [of good]")
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To: Meet the New Boss
I was not in favor of TARP, but the banks did pay TARP back.

The problem is the banks did not use the TARP money for which it was intended. Paulson, Kashkeri, and the Goldman Sachs cabal that ran it in the last days of the Bush Presidency allowed that to happen. Geithner merely followed what Government Sachs had done.

I just started reading Barofsky's book. It's an excellent read so far, and I will admit to more than a passing interest, as my current position has mostly to do with single family mortgage loans.

Had TARP been executed as planned, we wouldn't be in the mess we are today: those "toxic assets" are still on the books, and millions are enslaved to their seriously underwater mortgages. From where I sit, there's much more pain to be endured.

15 posted on 07/27/2012 12:38:59 PM PDT by Night Hides Not (My dream ticket for 2012 is John Galt & Dagny Taggart!)
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To: Meet the New Boss

looks like the demonization of the banks is starting to come from inside:

Former Citi CEO: Break up big banks

http://www.bankrate.com/financing/banking/former-citi-ceo-break-up-big-banks/


16 posted on 07/27/2012 12:40:30 PM PDT by Kartographer ("We mutually pledge to each other our lives, our fortunes and our sacred honor.")
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To: Kartographer
Admiral Akbar tried to warn us.


17 posted on 07/27/2012 12:41:26 PM PDT by dfwgator (FUJR (not you, Jim))
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To: Gen-X-Dad
Hmmm, banks get 800 Billion Dollars in exchange for worthless assets at super low percentage rates in TARP

No, banks got less than $250 billion in exchange for preferred stock and warrants.

they then go gamble on commodities and the stock market index

Banks used TARP money to increase their capital base, not to gamble.

they also get more 0% FED money in QE I and II

QE isn't loans to banks. And the Fed doesn't loan to banks at 0%. The current Discount Rate is 0.75%.

for more worthless assets which pushes them into the trillions category

The Fed only bought guaranteed debt. Debt which is trading well above par and which the Fed has huge unrealized capital gains on.

fraudulent bankers were rewarded and allowed to dump their losses on our backs for guaranteed free money.

That's funny. Banks were borrowing $2 million dollars at the Fed discount window as of Wednesday, July 25, 2012. I guess they don't need money at 0.75%.

Fed balance sheet

18 posted on 07/27/2012 12:46:51 PM PDT by Toddsterpatriot (Math is hard. Harder if you're stupid.)
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To: Mr. K
TARP was a failure of such EPIC proportions ($5Trillion and counting)

Your math is an epic fail.

19 posted on 07/27/2012 12:48:36 PM PDT by Toddsterpatriot (Math is hard. Harder if you're stupid.)
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To: Kartographer

What Weill has learned the hard way is that you can’t really have a diversified financial entity that includes a deposit-taking bank and only have government tell you how to run that bank.

Government regulation will creep up to the holding company and eventually the government will be telling you how to run the entire business because it includes a deposit-taking bank.

I too think it is not healthy for there to be just a few big banks in the country controlling the market, and I am by no means demonizing the banks when I say that.

With just a few big institutions controlling things, it is too easy for the big institutions and government to de facto merge into one big mess where the fingers of the politicians like Dodd and Frank and Clinton and Obama are able to reach down into everything.

This is what we will see with the development of the health care insurance industry under ObamaCare - the consolidation of the industry into a handful of big players that are de facto instrumentalities of the government and ruled by politicians.

I would rather see a field of more smaller competitors that compete in the field of the market rather than in the field of government regulation and political favors.


20 posted on 07/27/2012 12:59:42 PM PDT by Meet the New Boss
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To: Meet the New Boss

Audit the Fed passed overwhelmingly in the house today, complete by-partisan support, suddenly Harry Ried a champion of auditing the Fed thinks maybe it’s a bad idea now. Personaly I think the powers that be are afraid of what they may find, that the Fed has been bailing out foriegn banks and governments and that the Fed itself is broke and has been printing money to stay solvent. If that information was made public the dollar would indeed colapse.


21 posted on 07/27/2012 1:02:00 PM PDT by qman (The communist usurper must go!)
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To: Kartographer

TARP failure is so NOT Bush’s fault

hell half the money ($350Billion) didn’t even get requested until Bush’s’ last 8 days of office

No sir, obama (”office of the president elect”) and Geithner had control of the TARP slush fund, OBAMA called the bankers into his office in early 2009 and doled out the money to them, obama and pelosi doled out TARP money to GM and the UAW (totally NOT what it was requested for in the TARP act) and OBAMA is responsible for how it was wasted


22 posted on 07/27/2012 1:26:10 PM PDT by silverleaf (Every human spent about half an hour as a single cell)
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To: Gen-X-Dad

Bungling Ben and his Merry Men at the Fed will start to inflate dollars as soon as the economy begins to breathe again. The only way to try to make a dent in our horrendous mountain of debt is to devalue the dollars we owe. Everyone will suffer, because inflation is the most devastating tax of all.


23 posted on 07/27/2012 1:43:27 PM PDT by txrefugee
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To: qman
and that the Fed itself is broke and has been printing money to stay solvent.

How could the Fed be broke? You must have a unique definition of the word. Why don't you share?

24 posted on 07/27/2012 2:21:09 PM PDT by Toddsterpatriot (Math is hard. Harder if you're stupid.)
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To: silverleaf
OBAMA called the bankers into his office in early 2009 and doled out the money to them

The bank TARP was doled out while Bush was President. Before the election for the biggest banks.

25 posted on 07/27/2012 2:25:24 PM PDT by Toddsterpatriot (Math is hard. Harder if you're stupid.)
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To: Toddsterpatriot

Go back and read your history
TARP wasn’t even voted on until 4 October 2008
The first “allocations” for “stock purchase” in the banks were made on 28 October

Paulson summons bankers to DC and warns them to take the TARP money..... or else

By November Pelosi et al were hammering on Bush to use TARP money to save GM. Bush caved. By December TARP money was flowing into GM and the UAW

The democrats were also hammering Bush to ask for and release the entire $700 Billion in TARP before obama took office so he could have all the money to use. Bush caved. 8 days before the inauguration Bush asked that all TARP be released. It was.

obama and Larry Summers vowed to institute controls over TARP
http://moneymorning.com/2009/01/13/obama-tarp/

By Feb 2009 about $300 Billion of the $700 Billion was spent
In March obama summons the bankers to DC and tells them they cannot simply repay TARP Paulson forced on them, and they better spread the wealth because he is all that stands between them and “the pitchforks”
http://dealbook.nytimes.com/2009/03/24/obama-is-expected-to-meet-with-top-bankers/

By June 2009 the top 10 banks that Paulson forced to take TARP, repay TARP (with interest) despite Geithner obstacles to them doing so, to get govt out of their executive boardroom decisions.
http://dealbook.nytimes.com/2009/06/17/jpmorgan-repays-treasury-as-tarp-exits-continue/


26 posted on 07/27/2012 3:27:13 PM PDT by silverleaf (Every human spent about half an hour as a single cell)
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To: Toddsterpatriot

Go back and read your history
TARP wasn’t even voted on until 4 October 2008
The first “allocations” for “stock purchase” in the banks were made on 28 October

Paulson summons bankers to DC and warns them to take the TARP money..... or else

By November Pelosi et al were hammering on Bush to use TARP money to save GM. Bush caved. By December TARP money was flowing into GM and the UAW

The democrats were also hammering Bush to ask for and release the entire $700 Billion in TARP before obama took office so he could have all the money to use. Bush caved. 8 days before the inauguration Bush asked that all TARP be released. It was.

obama and Larry Summers vowed to institute controls over TARP
http://moneymorning.com/2009/01/13/obama-tarp/

By Feb 2009 about $300 Billion of the $700 Billion was spent
In March obama summons the bankers to DC and tells them they cannot simply repay TARP Paulson forced on them, and they better spread the wealth because he is all that stands between them and “the pitchforks”
http://dealbook.nytimes.com/2009/03/24/obama-is-expected-to-meet-with-top-bankers/

By June 2009 the top 10 banks that Paulson forced to take TARP, repay TARP (with interest) despite Geithner obstacles to them doing so, to get govt out of their executive boardroom decisions.
http://dealbook.nytimes.com/2009/06/17/jpmorgan-repays-treasury-as-tarp-exits-continue/


27 posted on 07/27/2012 3:27:26 PM PDT by silverleaf (Every human spent about half an hour as a single cell)
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To: silverleaf
The bank TARP was doled out while Bush was President. Before the election for the biggest banks.

Go back and read your history
TARP wasn’t even voted on until 4 October 2008
The first “allocations” for “stock purchase” in the banks were made on 28 October

I've read my history. That's how I knew that October 28th was before the election.

WSJ

28 posted on 07/27/2012 3:38:32 PM PDT by Toddsterpatriot (Math is hard. Harder if you're stupid.)
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To: Toddsterpatriot

Not if you count the fact most of TARP is folded into the baseline budgeting process.


29 posted on 07/27/2012 3:50:22 PM PDT by Fledermaus (Democrats are dangerous and evil. Republicans are useless and useful idiots.)
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To: Toddsterpatriot

TARP was the most blatant case of bait and switch ever perpetrated on taxpayers. Tarp was sold as an idea that the govt would purchase the toxic mortgage assets from the banks at steeply discounted rates. This would allow the govt to place all toxic assets in a traunch and sell them off after the markets quieted down and a reasonable idea of the relative pperformance of the underlying mortgages could be ascertained. The bank in turn would have had smaller balance sheets but they would be rock solid grade a assets. once they got the money they found out the banks had no intention of selling these mortgage assets to the govt so they just gave them the money instead in exchange for equity and preferred stock. Anyone involved in tarp is guilty of fraud against the american people and as far as i’m concerned the sooner we see perp walks the better.


30 posted on 07/27/2012 5:01:10 PM PDT by cdpap
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To: cdpap
Tarp was sold as an idea that the govt would purchase the toxic mortgage assets from the banks at steeply discounted rates.

Wouldn't have been enough. And imagine the losses the Treasury would have suffered. The bank TARP made money. We'd be down hundreds of billions on the toxic crap they would have bought.

Anyone involved in tarp is guilty of fraud against the american people and as far as i’m concerned the sooner we see perp walks the better.

The American people don't have a clue one way or the other about TARP. But you should hold your breath waiting for a perp walk.

31 posted on 07/27/2012 5:17:27 PM PDT by Toddsterpatriot (Math is hard. Harder if you're stupid.)
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To: Toddsterpatriot

Did TARP become part of the annual Federal Government baseline? If so, what is happening each year to the money - I assume it isn’t going to the banks still?


32 posted on 07/27/2012 5:21:16 PM PDT by utford
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To: Kartographer

TARP was sold to Congress as a financial aid to the foreclosure crisis. Barofsky’s point it that Tarp would never have been approved if it hadn’t had the promises that the banks would help homeowners.

They didn’t. For the most part, the homeowners under water got zero help from all those banks and mortgage companies.

Instead, The money was used by the big banks and institutions for purposes outside of the original idea. It is just wrong.


33 posted on 07/27/2012 5:37:48 PM PDT by wildbill (You're just jealous because the Voices talk only to me.)
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To: Meet the New Boss

GAO: Banks Paying Back TARP with Federal Money

Read more: http://www.foxbusiness.com/industries/2012/03/09/gao-banks-paying-back-tarp-with-federal-money/#ixzz23SSa4GjZ


34 posted on 08/13/2012 1:01:19 PM PDT by Lorianne (fedgov, taxporkmoney)
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To: Lorianne
Your article says:

The GAO adds that this issue of round-tripping federal bailout money arises with small banks, as the government essentially replaced their TARP funding with the new federal Small Business Lending Fund enacted in 2010, which GOP Congressmen have dubbed “TARP 2.0.”

Yes, there were a lot of small banks involved with this, but the aggregate amount was tiny compared to the TARP program as a whole:

But when the [Small Business Lending Fund] ended a few weeks ago, many were disappointed at its lack of actual lending. Only $4 billion of the fund was lent out to banks—of that $4 billion, only half went to small business loans, the rest went to pay off banks’ debts from the Troubled Asset Relief Program, according to the Wall Street Journal.

From this calculation, we can see that the amount in the program identified by the GAO that was round-tripped was approximately $2 billion.

(There was a second program identified by GAO as involving round-tripping of funds to TARP, which was the Community Development Capital Initiative. However, the aggregate amount funded under CDCI was only $570 million, and only 28 of the 84 recipients round-tripped, so the amount used to repay TARP from this program was immaterial.)

According to that GAO report, as of January 31, 2012, Treasury received back $211.5 billion from the banks, exceeding its disbursements of $204.9 billion.

So even if we subtract the $2 billion that was round-tripped under that program, the Treasury STILL received more than it disbursed, with the possibility of more coming.

And don't get me wrong - I am completely against the government taking ownership interests in any of the banks, whether under TARP or any other program.

In my view, this focus on TARP is being peddled by the Left as a part of their larger effort to demonize the banks in the public perception to set up the eventual nationalization of the banks.

And, this is to distract attention from the role of the Left in destroying the sound mortgage credit standards that were used by banks for generation after generation. This was accomplished by falsely claiming the banks were racist for adhering to sound mortgage-lending standards.

This "affirmative-action" housing collapse has destroyed literally trillions of dollars of national wealth by a tremendous misallocation of resources in the economy, and control by Democrat politicians of Fannie/Freddie has resulted in vast sums of taxpayer money lost which will never be seen again, unlike the disbursements to the banks under TARP.

35 posted on 08/13/2012 5:37:07 PM PDT by Meet the New Boss
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To: Meet the New Boss

Thanks for the reply.

I don’t agree that the left is focussing on TARP to demonize the banks.

No. 1 a marority of Democrats in a democrat majority Congress voted for TARP. As soon as you mention that, they defend TARP.

No. 2. the left uses the fact of TARP to justify MORE government giveaway programs. So TARP is very handy for them politically.


36 posted on 08/13/2012 6:48:54 PM PDT by Lorianne (fedgov, taxporkmoney)
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To: Kartographer

TARP “did help prevent financial Armageddon,” he concedes.

That’s all TARP as originally proposed by Paulson was meant to do. Pelosi and the Democrats loaded it up with all the crap that failed.


37 posted on 08/13/2012 6:54:52 PM PDT by Wyatt's Torch (I can explain it to you. I can't understand it for you.)
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To: Kartographer

Ryan on TARP (he voted for it). Pretty accurate as the Dems bastardized it far away from its original purpose.

In his 2013 budget, the House Budget chairman accuses the Treasury Department of having diverted TARP from its original purpose of “providing targeted assistance to unlock credit markets” and turning the program “into an ad hoc, opaque bailout and a slush fund for large private institutions.” Although Ryan’s budget acknowledges that TARP “succeeded in halting a systemic panic,” the budget also concludes that TARP has “morphed into crony capitalism at its worst.”


38 posted on 08/13/2012 6:57:54 PM PDT by Wyatt's Torch (I can explain it to you. I can't understand it for you.)
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To: Toddsterpatriot

Good post. Spot on.


39 posted on 08/13/2012 6:58:49 PM PDT by Wyatt's Torch (I can explain it to you. I can't understand it for you.)
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To: Kartographer

Government should not save companies from the consequences of their bad decisions.


40 posted on 08/13/2012 7:00:18 PM PDT by dfwgator
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To: wildbill

“TARP was sold to Congress as a financial aid to the foreclosure crisis.”

Absolutely incorrect. It was sold as being a backstop to bank losses on the toxic mortgage assets and associated derivatives. The democrats and Pelosi tossed in all the foreclosure and other program stuff.


41 posted on 08/13/2012 7:05:40 PM PDT by Wyatt's Torch (I can explain it to you. I can't understand it for you.)
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To: Lorianne; Meet the New Boss

Banks don’t need any help demonizing themselves they are doing just fine. Another day another scandal.


42 posted on 08/13/2012 9:06:05 PM PDT by Kartographer ("We mutually pledge to each other our lives, our fortunes and our sacred honor.")
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To: Toddsterpatriot

Is the FED not in essence a bank, if that is so, it is the only bank that can print money, why is it printing money? because is does not have any. It dilutes each dollars value with every dollar it prints, stealing from your savings to prop up it’s bottom line!


43 posted on 08/26/2012 1:46:35 PM PDT by qman (The communist usurper must go!)
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To: Toddsterpatriot

Where exactly in the US Constitution is Congress authorized to bail out any business? Article and Section if you please.


44 posted on 08/26/2012 1:48:45 PM PDT by Lurker (Violence is rarely the answer. But when it is it is the only answer.)
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To: qman
It dilutes each dollars value with every dollar it prints, stealing from your savings to prop up it’s bottom line!

Why do you feel the Fed needs to prop up it's bottom line?

45 posted on 08/26/2012 3:58:24 PM PDT by Toddsterpatriot (Math is hard. Harder if you're stupid.)
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To: Lurker
Where exactly in the US Constitution is Congress authorized to bail out any business?

Who said they were?

46 posted on 08/26/2012 4:01:39 PM PDT by Toddsterpatriot (Math is hard. Harder if you're stupid.)
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To: Toddsterpatriot

You did, just before the owner of this fine forum gave you a richly deserved vacation.


47 posted on 08/26/2012 4:33:10 PM PDT by Lurker (Violence is rarely the answer. But when it is it is the only answer.)
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To: Lurker

I did? Link?


48 posted on 08/26/2012 4:55:25 PM PDT by Toddsterpatriot (Math is hard. Harder if you're stupid.)
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To: Lurker

Still no proof?
That’s a shock.


49 posted on 08/29/2012 3:42:42 PM PDT by Toddsterpatriot (Math is hard. Harder if you're stupid.)
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