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Did Obama Fire General Ham Of Africom For Attempting To Buck His Order And Rescue Stevens?
Pat Dollard ^ | 10/28/12 | Pat Dollard

Posted on 10/28/2012 10:53:40 AM PDT by Nachum

The latest hot rumor flying around the internet is that General Ham of Africon, whose departure was announced last week, was actually fired for attempting to buck Obama’s order not to rescue Ambassador Stevens. He’s not exactly leaving early for his type of command, plus, he’s still in command, I have to assume, since his replacement still has to be confirmed by the Senate. Even if it’s an urban legend, it’s such a cool one that it’s kind of a duty to pass it on. Here’s the text most-often seen in emails, message boards and blog posts:

I heard a story today from someone inside the military that I trust entirely. The story was in reference to General Ham that Panetta referenced in the quote below.

quote: “(The) basic principle is that you don’t deploy forces into harm’s way without knowing what’s going on; without having some real-time information about what’s taking place,” Panetta told Pentagon reporters. “And as a result of not having that kind of information, the commander who was on the ground in that area, Gen. Ham, Gen. Dempsey and I felt very strongly that we could not put forces at risk in that situation.”

The information I heard today was that General Ham as head of Africom received the same e-mails the White House received requesting help/support as the attack was taking place. General Ham immediately had a rapid response unit ready and communicated to the Pentagon that he had a unit ready.

General Ham then received the order to stand down. His response was to screw it, he was going to help anyhow. Within 30 seconds to a minute after making the move to respond, his second in command apprehended General Ham and told him that he was now relieved of his command.

(Excerpt) Read more at readability.com ...


TOPICS:
KEYWORDS: africom; benghazi; benghazigate; bhoafrica; christopherstevens; cicobama; coverup; fired; general; generalham; ham; libya; rescue; stevens
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Sounds about right.
1 posted on 10/28/2012 10:53:48 AM PDT by Nachum
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To: Nachum

This is what I posted on Twitter oner an hour ago::

Jennifer Griffin @JenGriffinFNC6h (ON TWITTER): “Rumors Gen Carter Ham relieved of command over Benghazi NOT true, according to multiple well placed sources. Long planned change of command.”


2 posted on 10/28/2012 10:55:49 AM PDT by Matchett-PI (Obama's Shuck and Jive Ends With Benghazi Lies ~ Sarah Palin)
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To: Nachum

THAT IS PRECISELY WHY GENERAL HAM WAS RELIEVED BECAUSE HE WAS GOING TO RESCUE THE AMERICANS IN LIBYA AND obama HAD SAID LET THEM DIE. obama COULDN’T TOLERATE GETTING IGNORED AND HAD THE XO RELIEVE HIM. obama HAS COMMITTED TREASON. HE CAN ONLY GIVE LEGAL ORDERS. LETTING AMERICANS DIE TO PROTECT obama’s CAMPAIGN FOR OFFICE IS NOT A LEGAL ORDER.


3 posted on 10/28/2012 10:56:29 AM PDT by yldstrk (My heroes have always been cowboys)
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To: Matchett-PI

IT CERTAINLY WAS NOT NOT NOT A LONG PLANNED CHANGE OF COMMAND. IT WAS GENERAL HAM DOING THE RIGHT THING IN THE FACE OF AN EVIL DICTATOR AND GETTING RELIEVED FROM DUTY BEFORE HE COULD GET IT DONE.


4 posted on 10/28/2012 10:57:59 AM PDT by yldstrk (My heroes have always been cowboys)
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To: Nachum

In other news, Obama has fired the rear admiral commanding a carrier battle group off the shores of Libya. Yeah, right; coincidence.


5 posted on 10/28/2012 10:58:37 AM PDT by pabianice (washington, dc ..)
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To: Jet Jaguar; NorwegianViking; ExTexasRedhead; HollyB; FromLori; EricTheRed_VocalMinority; ...

The list, Ping

Let me know if you would like to be on or off the ping list

http://www.nachumlist.com/


6 posted on 10/28/2012 11:00:04 AM PDT by Nachum (The List was hacked- www.nachumlist.com)
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To: Nachum

7 posted on 10/28/2012 11:01:09 AM PDT by Travis McGee (www.EnemiesForeignAndDomestic.com)
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To: Nachum

If you want to get more military isight into Benghazi and other military issues, I recommend the radio show on KFI LA AM 640 8-10 Sat and Sunday nights, Brian Suits, A Dark Secret Place.


8 posted on 10/28/2012 11:02:46 AM PDT by morphing libertarian
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To: Nachum

The part about the second in command walking in thirty to sixty seconds later...I think is bogus. Maybe fifteen to twenty minutes is possible...but he’d have to have a armed escort to make that possible.

I will add this...having spent over twenty years in the Air Force. There are some officers who would have duked it out, and done physical damage to anyone who tried to arrest or apprehend them.

Finally, if this all plays out and is basically true...there’s going to be some suspicions about who works for who within the top twenty-five generals of DOD. I can’t even imagine General Ham being pushed out of the DoD, without a Senate hearing over the mess.


9 posted on 10/28/2012 11:03:32 AM PDT by pepsionice
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To: Nachum

1930’s Stalinist purges have come to Obamaland..


10 posted on 10/28/2012 11:04:51 AM PDT by cardinal4 (Barack Hussein Obama, what American would elect a guy with that name less than 10 years after 9-11?)
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To: pepsionice

Maybe Obama found out about ECOMCON.


11 posted on 10/28/2012 11:05:16 AM PDT by Jim Noble (Diseases desperate grown are by desperate appliance relieved or not at all.)
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To: Matchett-PI

If Gen Ham were relieved of duty as has been rumored (even apparently in intel circles—at least that’s the rumor;-), the Obama administration would deny it and take steps to make sure such information never saw the light of day.


12 posted on 10/28/2012 11:06:21 AM PDT by RoosterRedux (Obama: "If you've got a business -- you didn't build that. Somebody else made that happen.")
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To: Nachum
Actually, a couple of flag officers relieved of duty.
Looks a lot like Nixon's Saturday Night Massacre...
13 posted on 10/28/2012 11:07:05 AM PDT by gov_bean_ counter (Hope and Change has become Attack and Obfuscate.)
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To: Nachum
Obama utterly HATES Americans, would leave anyone "behind,
and probably planned/directed/implied/ordered the Ambassador
taken out to clear up "loose ends" in his transfer of
20,000 MANPADS to al Qaeda.


14 posted on 10/28/2012 11:07:15 AM PDT by Diogenesis (Vi veri veniversum vivus vici)
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To: Nachum

Ham needs to testify, under oath, in front of the House.


15 posted on 10/28/2012 11:08:30 AM PDT by Signalman
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To: Matchett-PI

So what came first- the chicken or the egg?


16 posted on 10/28/2012 11:08:47 AM PDT by Nachum (The List was hacked- www.nachumlist.com)
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To: Matchett-PI

Long-planned? That’s the ticket—replace Ham with Rodriguez a week before the election. Long-range, short-range, it’s still polisticky.


17 posted on 10/28/2012 11:09:26 AM PDT by Mach9
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To: cardinal4

And to think that during this Purgapalooza, that snake Colin Powell backs up Obama.


18 posted on 10/28/2012 11:11:11 AM PDT by ImJustAnotherOkie (zerogottago)
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To: SoFloFreeper

Ping...


19 posted on 10/28/2012 11:11:40 AM PDT by EBH (0bama is guilty of willful neglect of duty.)
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To: yldstrk
"IT CERTAINLY WAS NOT NOT NOT A LONG PLANNED CHANGE OF COMMAND. IT WAS GENERAL HAM DOING THE RIGHT THING IN THE FACE OF AN EVIL DICTATOR AND GETTING RELIEVED FROM DUTY BEFORE HE COULD GET IT DONE."

MOST IF NOT ALL THESE CHANGES IN COMMAND WERE PLANNED LONG BEFORE BENGHAZI INCIDENT BECAUSE THEY WERE REPORTED IN THE MILITARY TIMES AND OTHER PUBLICATIONS.

Google it.

20 posted on 10/28/2012 11:11:56 AM PDT by Matchett-PI (Obama's Shuck and Jive Ends With Benghazi Lies ~ Sarah Palin)
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To: pepsionice

Well, it is rather odd that not only in the military, but in positions of authority all over the United States, that LOYAL AMERICANS are being shoved out, and replaced with ‘helpful idiots’.


21 posted on 10/28/2012 11:11:56 AM PDT by UCANSEE2 ( If you think I'm crazy, just wait until you talk to my invisible friend.)
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To: pepsionice
The part about the second in command walking in thirty to sixty seconds later...I think is bogus.

Unless it had been anticipated.

22 posted on 10/28/2012 11:13:19 AM PDT by RoosterRedux (Obama: "If you've got a business -- you didn't build that. Somebody else made that happen.")
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To: RoosterRedux

See my post #20.


23 posted on 10/28/2012 11:13:42 AM PDT by Matchett-PI (Obama's Shuck and Jive Ends With Benghazi Lies ~ Sarah Palin)
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To: Jim Noble

And Ham is Houseman? Frankly I’d rather have a Gen. Scott around for a change.


24 posted on 10/28/2012 11:14:16 AM PDT by Mach9
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To: gov_bean_ counter

Perhaps Ham and the other high-ranking officers were relieved if command when, hearing how Obama ordered them to stand-down and not save the ambassador and the others, they could no longer contain themselves and overtly started criticizing Obama, maybe to his face, calling him a lying treasonous traitor.

Had I had been in that position, I would have had to exercise severe restraint in keeping my opinion to myself.


25 posted on 10/28/2012 11:15:51 AM PDT by Signalman
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To: Matchett-PI

google this genius, there are military change of command ceremonies for “long planned” changed of command with parties and ARCOMS or MSMs pinned on etc.

Not having your XO put you under arrest 30 seconds after you have given an order to go rescue the guys under attack in Libya.

You must be an obamambot


26 posted on 10/28/2012 11:16:25 AM PDT by yldstrk (My heroes have always been cowboys)
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To: Signalman

“relieved OF command”.


27 posted on 10/28/2012 11:16:49 AM PDT by Signalman
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To: Nachum

If you want to get more military insight into Benghazi and other military issues, I recommend the radio show on KFI LA AM 640 8-10 Sat and Sunday nights, Brian Suits, A Dark Secret Place.


28 posted on 10/28/2012 11:17:36 AM PDT by morphing libertarian
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To: Matchett-PI

Yep.


29 posted on 10/28/2012 11:17:46 AM PDT by RoosterRedux (Obama: "If you've got a business -- you didn't build that. Somebody else made that happen.")
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To: Nachum

ping


30 posted on 10/28/2012 11:18:01 AM PDT by Jack Black ( Whatever is left of American patriotism is now identical with counter-revolution.)
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To: Nachum

If Team Obama would have shot straigt from the start.. Even if it was from the hip. Then all this wouldn’t lead to all kinds of speculation.
Just like 0bama’s college records. The only one who could have set the story right is 0bama.


31 posted on 10/28/2012 11:19:49 AM PDT by Leep (Are you smarter than a 7th grade math student and or Barack 0bama?)
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To: yldstrk

Gen Ham was leaving anyway. Hubby read it in the Army Times last week. He was NOT relieved for this incident.

There’s enough reality to be upset about without adding rumor and introspection to the fire.


32 posted on 10/28/2012 11:20:47 AM PDT by Marie ("The last time Democrats gloated this hard after a health care victory, they lost 60 House seats.")
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To: Mach9

I think Obama is playing with fire here.

He’s sacrificed 2 SEALs and untold CIA assets, and interfered with longstanding ROEs for diplomatic defense/rescue.

I don’t think that any James Mattoon Scott types would have gotten a third or fourth star in the past 20 years, but I am almost certain that there are more than a few O5s and O6s, as well as some civilian intel badasses and PMCs, who both know the back story and who love the country.

Right now, if I were in their shoes, I’d be leaking and waiting ten days to see if the People have figured it out.

However, if worst comes to worst, it could get interesting.


33 posted on 10/28/2012 11:22:48 AM PDT by Jim Noble (Diseases desperate grown are by desperate appliance relieved or not at all.)
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To: Marie

well miss marie, that is not what I read. they both could be true, but you know as well as I if you are having a change of command, there is a ceremony, you get an award, there is a party. NONE OF THIS HAPPENED. HE WAS RELIEVED IN ADVANCE OF HIS DATE DUE TO CHALLENGING OUR SICKO cinc.


34 posted on 10/28/2012 11:25:52 AM PDT by yldstrk (My heroes have always been cowboys)
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To: All
Please, folks, read the entire thread before wildly going off on all the creative military-command sacking stories.

We have enough to deal with both mentally and physically these last few days before election without having to expend our time, energy and Jim's bandwith on a bunch of damn conspiracy theories proliferating like dandelions pushing up in vacant lots in springtime.

Leni

35 posted on 10/28/2012 11:25:56 AM PDT by MinuteGal
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To: Nachum
Only the POTUS had the authority to act!
36 posted on 10/28/2012 11:26:48 AM PDT by TigersEye (dishonorabledisclosure.com - OPSEC (give them support))
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To: Nachum

That’s exactly what 25 men tried to do in Afghanistan in 2005 when Michael Murphy called.


37 posted on 10/28/2012 11:28:21 AM PDT by wastedyears (The First Law of Heavy Metal: Not all metal is satanic.)
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To: Matchett-PI

Long planned change of command my ass. The timing is WAY TOO COINCIDENTAL to be planned.


38 posted on 10/28/2012 11:28:27 AM PDT by usconservative (When The Ballot Box No Longer Counts, The Ammunition Box Does. (What's In Your Ammo Box?))
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To: Nachum

Gen Ham is one of the few general officers left with honor and integrity.


39 posted on 10/28/2012 11:29:13 AM PDT by The Sons of Liberty ( For AMERICA's sake: Vote for the Mormon, NOT the muslim; The Capitalist, NOT the Communist! FUBO!)
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To: Marie

General Ham has only been the Commander of Africom since March/2011. For Panetta to say in the DOD report that Ham is being replaced, in part, because he’s 64 years old sounds pretty weak. Why put someone in that position who is 62-63 if 64 is too old?


40 posted on 10/28/2012 11:30:25 AM PDT by sanjuanbob
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To: pepsionice

Does anyone else wonder what effect this will have on the troops?

Crap runs downhill, I would bet there are some unhappy troops.


41 posted on 10/28/2012 11:31:17 AM PDT by Venturer
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To: MinuteGal
OK.

Panetta told Pentagon reporters. “And as a result of not having that kind of information, the commander who was on the ground in that area, Gen. Ham, Gen. Dempsey and I felt very strongly that we could not put forces at risk in that situation.”

They had live feed from security cams on the compound, live audio from two sources on the compound and live feed from two surveillance drones above. Were they waiting for the jihadis to give them a call and give them live feed from their side of the fight with their cell phones?

If Panetta's words there are true then he and both of those generals should be sacked for cowardice under fire.

42 posted on 10/28/2012 11:32:29 AM PDT by TigersEye (dishonorabledisclosure.com - OPSEC (give them support))
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To: yldstrk; Matchett-PI
Not having your XO put you under arrest 30 seconds after you have given an order to go rescue the guys under attack in Libya.

General Carter Ham had to clean up behind
Gen. William E. Ward of formerly of AfricaCom being
Court-martialed for mis-aprepriation of funds.

Kip Ward is one of Holder's people.

Leon the Nancy-boy is trying to save Kip's retirement.


43 posted on 10/28/2012 11:35:54 AM PDT by Uri’el-2012 (Psalm 119:174 I long for Your salvation, YHvH, Your teaching is my delight.)
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To: Matchett-PI

If this was “long planned”, it would not have been a secret, so you should have no trouble citing and naming sources.

Change of command ceremonies at this level are very public and published months in advance. An article in a e-zine 3 1/2 weeks after the fact is not proof of “long planned”.


44 posted on 10/28/2012 11:37:57 AM PDT by wrench
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To: sanjuanbob
Why put someone in that position who is 62-63 if 64 is too old?

Unfortunately the answer to that is something very ordinary and all too common. You put him there as a favor and a reward for service so he can put one more command under his belt and retire with a higher pension. It's the one-hand-washes-the-other politics of the top brass.

45 posted on 10/28/2012 11:39:00 AM PDT by TigersEye (dishonorabledisclosure.com - OPSEC (give them support))
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To: Matchett-PI
I googled...cant find it.....Can you please show me where Hamm was to be replaced on 11 sept 2012?...was there the usual change of Command ceremony?
46 posted on 10/28/2012 11:39:49 AM PDT by M-cubed
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To: wrench

Obama and his cabal are scaring the sh— out of me!


47 posted on 10/28/2012 11:40:16 AM PDT by Republic (Keep uhbama desperate - seems to force slips of honesty from his angry interior)
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To: Signalman; All

Two stories are being told:

1. Panetta said that Ham was consulted and in on the decision to not intervene.

2. Ham himself (according to former ambassador Bolten on Greta) told congressional investigators he was not asked to intervene.

Which story is true?


48 posted on 10/28/2012 11:40:41 AM PDT by TigerClaws
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To: TigersEye
see 43 above

49 posted on 10/28/2012 11:40:41 AM PDT by Uri’el-2012 (Psalm 119:174 I long for Your salvation, YHvH, Your teaching is my delight.)
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To: UriÂ’el-2012

I read it. What’s your point about it?


50 posted on 10/28/2012 11:41:38 AM PDT by TigersEye (dishonorabledisclosure.com - OPSEC (give them support))
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