Ok let me do it before someone else does : )
Posted on 11/07/2008 10:40:35 AM PST by Traviswf
Hi there. I voted for Obama, but have been reading a lot of Freerepublic lately to see how the other side is reacting. I'm not trying to troll here - honestly - but if you feel I am, that's understandable. I just wanted to offer a perspective on this that I think may be interesting to some of you. Oh, and this is much longer than I intended. And I'm fairly certain I'm not posting this the right way...for which I apologize.
When Bush was elected in 2000, I was upset. And yes, I whined about him "stealing" the election. I don't really think that's true anymore - it was just a painful way to lose. Sure, we can whine about the popular vote vs. the electoral vote, but you can't change the rules in the middle of the game. Then I watched the movie Recount and realized just how awful the democrats were at trying to win the damn thing. Gore seemed like he didn't really want it.
When Bush won in 2004, I was absolutely devastated. I thought the world was going to end. I didn't think we should be in Iraq, I agreed with Kerry that we had to finish the fight in Afganistan. I was worried about the courts. And frankly - I just didn't like Bush. I didn't like the way he governed, the way he spoke, and the way he talked as if we on the left were less American.
On 9/11 I happened to be in Toronto on business. When the towers fell, I knew I had to get home. A colleague and I wanted to go to New York, to help in some way. But we were told nobody was getting anywhere close. Our next instinct was to get home - to California. We didn't just want to be with our families, we desperately wanted to be in our country. That day was rough because my colleague thought his wife might have been on one of the planes - her travel plans were very similar. It took hours of agony before we, thank God, found out she was safe.
So we rented a car in Toronto and drove across the country. It took a couple hours to get across the border in the middle of the night. We stopped in Omaha, and then Colorado. I can't even tell you how much I loved my country driving across its beauty in those days after the attacks. And there were no jokes about "we're in enemy territory" because we were in "red states." We were in America. Everywhere we went people said "How are you? Is everyone safe?"
I know everyone has similar stories of those days. And certainly many, many people have stories of real loss - not just "we thought we lost someone, but it was a happy ending." Then, fairly quickly, I felt my patriotism coming under attack because I had a difference of opinion about how to fight back. I didn't think Iraq was the right choice - it made no sense to me, and I certainly wasn't alone. But people questioned my love of my country. And that was very, very hard to forgive.
When 2008 came up, more than anything, I wanted to win the White House back. I wanted to punish the Bush administration for what I felt was not just a failure to be competent, but a failure to keep the country united. I inititally supported Hilary, but I had this feeling in my gut that she was just going to be Bush - but for our side. She'd be a partisan warrior, a polarizing figure (which Bush wasn't when he started, but Hilary already was...). It made me sick to my stomach.
I wanted to go back to feeling like an American in those days after the attack - where our disagreements were things we laughed about over a beer and the real threat was far, far more serious.
I'd written Obama's candidacy off as a dry run for 2016 or later. Or maybe he was running for VP. I thought - hey, dude, at least finish a term in the Senate. Then when he said "we're not a collection of red states and blue states, we're the United States of America" it hit me like lightning. It had nothing to do with him - it had to do with the country, and my love for it and this feeling deep down in my gut that we were fighting over the placement of the deck chairs while the ship was sinking.
Wow, this got really rambly. Sorry about that. Here's why I posted initially. I saw this thing on here about Obama's "national defense force" and some posters commenting about the coming civil war or some such. I'm pretty sure Obama was just talking about funding for police. I mean - are you guys really worried he's going to do this? There was a rumor on the left that Bush was bringing a military brigade trained in "riot control" home from Iraq before the elections. People were convinced Bush was going to take over the country in a military coup. I'm sure you think that's laughable - as do I. Obama is not going to raise a civilian force of brown coats. First of all there's no money for it, nobody would go for it, and he'd be laughed out of the White House.
He's also not a socialist. And he's not coming for your guns. If he did either of this things, he can basically just go home now. Those are not realistic positions for any president to have. He will likely appoint liberals - at least too liberal for you guys - to the courts.
But here's the thing. He's going to try and be a good president. I think they all do. And Obama ran on uniting the country, on being bipartisan. That's sort of ALL he ran on. It's how he won 60% of independent and brought home so many of the Clinton voters. So if he doesn't deliver on this - I imagine he'll be fairly easy to beat in 2012.
So that's my two cents. Obama was always going to get my vote as the nominee because I'm a lifelong democrat and a liberal. But I'm not a socialist or a pacifist. I believe in the 2nd amendment and favor the idea of most issues being decided by the states. I'm not a religious man, but I respect those who are and I think the Dems over reach in pushing religion out of the public square. I believe global warming is a serious problem, but I also think Al Gore enjoys it WAY too much.
And here's another caveat. I know it's easier to be bipartisan and talk about "togetherness" when my guy won. I was where you guys are now in 2000 and 2004. I mean, my party ALMOST ran Howard Dean and then said "No wait! John Kerry is a much better idea!" Or in this election to have a friend say "You've GOT to read Alec Baldwin's latest piece on HuffPo." I mean...really? He doesn't count as an "Obamacon" you know, he only plays a republican on TV...(you guys ever notice that our most annoying Hollywood liberals end up playing republicans? what's with that?)
So yeah - we've all spent some time in the woods. I just hope we can all agree that we're just as American as the other, and we're passionate about what we believe to be the right path to take. There are real problems with the economy, and Islamic Terrorists aren't going to take a vacation for four years.
That's about it I guess. Sorry you guys lost.
Truer words could never be spoken. While I might very enthusiastically support a candidate, I would never, ever, ever come to love them. I can very deeply admire and have affection for leaders (not candidates) such as Lincoln, Reagan and the great John Paul II. This frenzy over BHO is just plain silly. I don't expect any candidate to every change my life -- that's my responsibility.
Maybe not a zot...I stand down. A taste of the Fairness Doctrine here at FR.
You have bought the lie.
Ok let me do it before someone else does : )
Regardless of the zot posts etc., thanks for taking the time to share your perspective, and we are all Americans indeed.
As for the civilian corps, yes, some are a bit loopy taking that to Nazi-like terms.
I am sure all it is talking about it mandatory service, what he is describing on his website.
But, that is wrong.....it is flat wrong to force people to do something they do not want to do.
His economic policy is wrong. Bottom-up policies taxing the heck out of the businesses that employee Americans is not the way to keep the economy running.
Yes, perhaps some flexibility is due in terms of only having a top-down approach. It could be true that those on the bottom need a bit more help. The problem is, those in the middle are the ones screwed since Democrat polices pass them over.
But, something needs done. I am sure it won’t turn out to be as bad as we all think right now. But we are scared just like you were.
You guys have set the perfect example for US to follow. I have lived through 8 years of the ugliest raging hate of Bush by insane liberals. You alinsky followers do not even have a clue what you have signed onto, and if you have the mind and spine to stick around here long enough your blindness might get peeled away. Serve your self and do a bit of research as to who Alinsky was and how could it be that a political party would affix themselves to admirers of the devil himself.
Unlike liberals, we will not crucify Obama liek you guys did Bush. We put our country first.I certainly hope this is going to be true, because I have seen the exact opposite opinion expressed here quite a bit in the past couple of days.
If Americans are better off in four years than they are now, Obama has a shot at being reelected. How strong his chances are will be dependent on how strong the recovery is. I see a lot of people here who would rather see our country go further downhill the next four years than "risk" a second term for Obama. It disgusts me.
I would like to say to Traviswf, "We want to see Obama turn this country around. We don't believe he has the best approaches, but we hope for the best." I'm not sure, however, that this describes what "we" (as a whole) actually believe. It's what I believe.
I don’t recall McCain saying anything about Palin.
It is his staffers.
You do not deserve to be ZOTted. Your comments are meant earnestly, and you are not trying to troll or deceive anyone.
I’m willing to consider the possibility that Obama might do some good things, or at least some not-bad things.
What I think worries people here (besides the left-wing policies) is
1) the messianic style of leadership. Imagine if a Republican had people composing songs about him, people fainting at his rallies, chanting political liturgies, and crafting quasi-religious imagery in support of him. The left would be terrified!
2) the Chicago-style political tactics. Sending the campaign-supporter swarm out against Obama critics like Stanley Kurtz. The (mis)use of the media. A relentless, ruthless attack posture against his opponents.
Go away. There is no kumbaya sentiments that are welcome at this time.
LQ
You are a supporter of a commie. Get lost.
You are actually execptional. Exceptionally stupid. Do you realy think turning or government over to a snake oil salesman for four years is going to help things? Astounding. How I would love to spend 4 or 5 hours going off on you. I truly hope you have invested heavily in a future that depends entirely on Zero actually turning our economy around. I doubt it, I iamgine that if you have any money you are busily trying to figure out how to protect it from the Democrats yourself. Here is a challenge for you. If you really belive in this guy, turn all your resources into stocks right now. Take everything you actually aren’t using every day to a pawn shop and buy GM. I dare you. See you don’t even believe Zero is good for the country. You won’t do it. I DARE you.
Travis - I respect your freedom to state your argument here on FR, but I’ve got a big question about your knowledge of what has happened since Tuesday. The very first thing Obama did was make Rahm Emanuel chief of staff. Now, you say “And Obama ran on uniting the country, on being bipartisan.”
How in the heck does any conservative (fiscal, social or both) trust him when his FIRST act is to put uber-partisan/”F-Republicans”/dead fish sender Rahm Emanuel in charge of WH staff?
He's also not a socialist. And he's not coming for your guns. If he did either of this things, he can basically just go home now
Clearly you don't know him, or, his voting record.
The clear measure of a man is not what he says, it's what he does (i.e. voting record) that counts.
Liberalism truly is a mental disorder - logic and facts are clearly optional in making a decision.
If it feels good, do it.
Hope you still feel good in 2012...your pocketbook won't, your gun cabinet won't, but his brownshirts will be more than happy to "motivate" you...
Riiiiight. Say that crap in a couple of years.The question I have is this: if, in a couple of years, our capitalist economy is recovering and we still have our guns, are you or any of the people who said things like this going to feel at all stupid about having said them?
When Bush won in 2004, I was absolutely devastated....frankly - I just didn't like Bush.
When 2008 came up, more than anything, I wanted to win the White House back. I wanted to punish the Bush administration for what I felt was not just a failure to be competent, but a failure to keep the country united.
So you hated Bush from Day One and did everything you could to make his presidency seem illegimate.
And you expect us to unite in support of Obama?
You helped make America an uglier place to live in with your slanders and libels against the president of the United States during the last eight years. Reap the coming whirlwind, chum.
Now, I argued that vigorously, and ultimately, unsuccessfully with her. I've long since learned that there comes a point where if you don't agree to disagree, your relationship will suffer.
Fast forward five years to this election. I've had many questions about Obama - not about whether or not he had an Indonesian passport, but why was there no scrutiny of his record? No college records, no records or client list from his law firm, scant medical records, no publications from the Harvard Law Review, etc. I put these questions to my wife in the framework of "If Bush was subjected to this level of scrutiny (and he was), why does Obama get a pass with "This is another example of the politics of division!"?" He's never answered our questions either. Where am I going with this? Basically, that it's interesting to how see the circle of opinion revolves. Beyond that, I don't believe that Obama is the Anti-Christ, but I do believe he has questions to answer, and neither he nor the media seem interested in answering them. Witness the recent Charlie Rose-Tom Brokaw interview in which they lamented not knowing much about Obama. Well, who better to find out? I guess that's a topic for another day.
It wasn’t an election it was a coup. Mr Obama will not unite the country he will divide it even further. I plan on treating him and the liberal party with the same respect they showed President George Bush. We will never support Mr Obama, the abortion loving, commie.
Your man won, and America doesn’t know who he is. Most of us here at FR know who Barack Hussien Obama really is. He’s a Marxist, and a racist. He will try his best to govern, in a Sal Alinsky kind of way.
Your post seems sincere, but you have no idea what you liberals have done. You will soon learn.
Wow this thread is hopping! I love to study the social phenomenon or the libs. Please dont zot this, this is gold.
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