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ANGRY REICH PRESS THREATENS POLAND WITH MAILED FIST (8/9/39)
Microfiche-New York Times archives, McHenry Library, U.C. Santa Cruz | 8/9/39 | Otto D. Tolischus

Posted on 08/09/2009 5:18:11 AM PDT by Homer_J_Simpson

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TOPICS: History
KEYWORDS: agenda; catholic; fascism; liberalfascism; milhist; realtime
If you would like to be added to or deleted from the Real Time +/- 70 Years ping list, send me a freepmail. You can also search for these articles by the keyword realtime, going back to the first one on January 27, 2008. These articles are posted on the 70th anniversary of their original publication date. See my profile for additional information.
1 posted on 08/09/2009 5:18:12 AM PDT by Homer_J_Simpson
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To: Homer_J_Simpson
Ciano’s diary:

August 9. – Ribbentrop has approved the idea of our meeting. I decided to leave tomorrow night in order to meet him at Salzburg. The Duce is anxious that I prove to the Germans, by documentary evidence, that the outbreak of war at this time would be folly.

William L. Shirer, The Rise and Fall of the Third Reich

2 posted on 08/09/2009 5:19:43 AM PDT by Homer_J_Simpson ("Every nation has the government that it deserves." - Joseph de Maistre (1753-1821))
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To: r9etb; PzLdr; dfwgator; Paisan; From many - one.; rockinqsranch; GRRRRR; 2banana; henkster; ...
“The first shot from a Polish gun will in our eyes be sufficient cause to give Poland an answer the letters of which will represent the concluding sentence of present Polish history.”

Also on this thread:

Reich Orders All From 5 to 70 Registered To Supply Basis for Wartime Assignments – 3*
British Defenses Repel Air ‘Enemy’ Raiding in Waves – 4**
Imperial Airways Booked Up for This Year; Lacks Planes and Pilots to Expand Service – 5
Pope’s Peace Key is Renunciation – 6***

* Most children at 10 are enrolled in the Hitler Youth Movement, which in time of emergency might have special duties assigned to it.

Like taking on the Red Army.

** An imaginary enemy out in the North Sea tonight sent wave after wave of bombing planes, raiding Eastern England in the most ambitious test yet made of Britain’s air defenses.

*** The keynote to peace lies in sacrifice, without which the tenets of Fascism or even of legality will fail, says Pope Pius XII in a letter that Luigi Cardinal Maglione has written to Canada and that is being hailed in some quarters here as the Pontiff’s most important doctrinal pronouncement to date.

Ciano’s diary update at reply #2.

3 posted on 08/09/2009 5:22:33 AM PDT by Homer_J_Simpson ("Every nation has the government that it deserves." - Joseph de Maistre (1753-1821))
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To: Homer_J_Simpson

And that was in the days before email.


4 posted on 08/09/2009 5:23:18 AM PDT by Hillarys Gate Cult (The man who said "there's no such thing as a stupid question" has never talked to Helen Thomas.)
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To: Homer_J_Simpson

I knew I shouldn’t have stepped through that worm hole. Shouldn’t this be in breaking news? :^)


5 posted on 08/09/2009 5:33:49 AM PDT by mkmensinger
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To: Homer_J_Simpson

This is very interesting to me. My father, his brother and his mother were visiting relatives in Poland 70 years ago today. When the Germans invaded they didn’t get out till 1947. He would tell some stories about it but not many. It was a very difficult time for them.


6 posted on 08/09/2009 5:38:55 AM PDT by raybbr (It's going to get a lot worse now that the anchor babies are voting!)
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To: raybbr

He was fortunate to have survived.


7 posted on 08/09/2009 5:41:09 AM PDT by abb ("What ISN'T in the news is often more important than what IS." Ed Biersmith, 1942 -)
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To: Homer_J_Simpson

This is what National Socialism looks like.

As for the articles themselves, the complete objectivity and lack of bias is striking.


8 posted on 08/09/2009 5:47:54 AM PDT by Walrus (My congressman is toast in 2010 --- how about yours?)
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To: abb
He was fortunate to have survived.

They lived in the outlying area of Wroclawek, which is northwest of Warsaw. They were shoved in a farmhouse with two other families. He often told of having to sneak out to find wild fowl and firewood. They weren't Jewish and I am not sure the whether American passports had anything to do with the Germans pretty much leaving them be but it must have helped in some way. He was only five when it happened so his memory wasn't all that good about what happened. Also, I get the feeling he simply didn't like to talk about it.

9 posted on 08/09/2009 5:49:44 AM PDT by raybbr (It's going to get a lot worse now that the anchor babies are voting!)
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To: raybbr
They weren't Jewish and I am not sure the whether American passports had anything to do with the Germans pretty much leaving them be but it must have helped in some way.

Did they choose to stay in Poland rather than go back to the U.S.? Wouldn't the Germans would have allowed them passage because of their U.S. passports? Germany and the U.S. weren't at war until Dec. 41.

10 posted on 08/09/2009 5:58:11 AM PDT by Homer_J_Simpson ("Every nation has the government that it deserves." - Joseph de Maistre (1753-1821))
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To: Homer_J_Simpson
Did they choose to stay in Poland rather than go back to the U.S.? Wouldn't the Germans would have allowed them passage because of their U.S. passports? Germany and the U.S. weren't at war until Dec. 41.

According to my dad they were simply herded into a farmhouse. It was like that all over Poland. I am not a hundred percent sure but I think they were basically imprisoned in their own homes. The Germans shut down the borders. Or, maybe my grandmother didn't have her U.S. citizenship yet. My dad and his brother were born in the U.S. but my grandmother was from Poland. I never did get the whole story. My dad passed this past May so I guess we'll never know.

11 posted on 08/09/2009 6:18:37 AM PDT by raybbr (It's going to get a lot worse now that the anchor babies are voting!)
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To: raybbr
My dad and his brother were born in the U.S. but my grandmother was from Poland.

That probably explains it.

Not my area, but it's my recollection that they would have been considered to have dual citizenship since they were born of Polish parents. The mother probably did have a window in which she could have appealed to American diplomats to help get the children out, but she probably would have had to travel to Berlin (or at least a city with counsulor offices) to make the appeal, and probably couldn't do so.

12 posted on 08/09/2009 7:00:36 AM PDT by PAR35
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To: raybbr

They were fortunate they weren’t stuck on the Soviet zone of occupation in 1939, the fate for Poles there was even worse than under Nazi occupation.


13 posted on 08/09/2009 7:32:02 AM PDT by dfwgator
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To: dfwgator; raybbr; PAR35
They were fortunate they weren’t stuck on the Soviet zone of occupation in 1939, the fate for Poles there was even worse than under Nazi occupation.

If they were still there in 1947 then they must have experienced both forms of governance. Talk about a vacation gone bad!

14 posted on 08/09/2009 7:41:41 AM PDT by Homer_J_Simpson ("Every nation has the government that it deserves." - Joseph de Maistre (1753-1821))
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To: Homer_J_Simpson

William L. Shirer: This is Berlin. Excellent reading. I didn’t realize he wrote The Rise And Fall of the Third Reich.


15 posted on 08/09/2009 8:36:34 AM PDT by wgflyer (Liberalism is to society what HIV is to the immune system.)
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To: PAR35
The mother probably did have a window in which she could have appealed to American diplomats to help get the children out, but she probably would have had to travel to Berlin (or at least a city with counsulor offices) to make the appeal, and probably couldn't do so.

My grandmother had to save money to get my dad's younger brother out. How she got the money I have no idea. They sailed home on the Ernie Pyle.

What a time it must have been.

16 posted on 08/09/2009 8:41:56 AM PDT by raybbr (It's going to get a lot worse now that the anchor babies are voting!)
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To: Homer_J_Simpson

On the first pass, I missed the little blurb about the American woman not in Dachau - or at least she wasn’t after her husband escaped.


17 posted on 08/09/2009 10:20:33 AM PDT by PAR35
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To: Homer_J_Simpson

On the first pass, I missed the little blurb about the American woman not in Dachau - or at least she wasn’t after her husband escaped.


18 posted on 08/09/2009 10:20:38 AM PDT by PAR35
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To: Homer_J_Simpson

That short article about the pro-Nazi Austrian Bishop being forced to retire is interesting, in that the Church was still able to resist within the Reich even this late in the game. I am a little confused by referring to him as Monsignor, but giving him the title ‘Prince Bishop’, which I don’t think I have heard before, unless the Prince part referred to a secular noble title.

The feeling I get reading this stuff is pity for the millions being rushed into unutterable horror.


19 posted on 08/09/2009 4:09:47 PM PDT by Lucius Cornelius Sulla ("men of intemperate minds cannot be free. Their passions forge their fetters." -- Edmund Burke)
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To: Lucius Cornelius Sulla

Before the unification of Germany, certain areas were controlled by the Bishop as secular as well as religious leader. Thus the Prince Bishop. And the religious office was not enough to provide protection against neighboring Dukes. The Bishop of Koeln was captured and held by a neighboring ruler, for example.

For an overview of how it worked, here’s an article from Wikipedia http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Electorate_of_Cologne

I’d assume it worked the same in Austria.

Of course, by the 1930s, the civil titles were largely empty.


20 posted on 08/09/2009 9:51:59 PM PDT by PAR35
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To: Homer_J_Simpson

Pelosi threatens dissenters with iron fist!

Threatens to wipe them out if conditions are not met


21 posted on 08/09/2009 11:06:29 PM PDT by GeronL (http://unitedcitizen.blogspot -Guilty of deviationism- http://tyrannysentinel.blogspot.com)
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To: Walrus

Well, Herbert L Mathews did have a couple of moments when he was praising the efficiency of Mussolini a couple of weeks back


22 posted on 08/09/2009 11:13:00 PM PDT by GeronL (http://unitedcitizen.blogspot -Guilty of deviationism- http://tyrannysentinel.blogspot.com)
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To: Homer_J_Simpson
Ciano’s diary:

August 10. – The Duce is more than ever convinced of the necessity of delaying the conflict. He himself has worked out the outline of a report concerning the meeting at Salzburg which ends with an allusion to international negotiations to settle the problems that so dangerously disturb European life.

Before letting me go he recommends that I shall frankly inform the Germans that we must avoid a conflict with Poland since it will be impossible to localize it, and a general war would be disastrous for everybody.

Armed with such commendable but, in the circumstances, naive thoughts and recommendations, the youthful Fascist Foreign Minister set out for Germany, where during the next three days – August 11, 12 and 13 – he received from Ribbentrop and especially from Hitler the shock of his life.

* * *

[From Shirer's diary]

“How completely isolated a world the German people live in,” I noted in my diary on August 10, 1939. “A glance at the newspapers yesterday and today reminds you of it.” I had returned to Germany from a brief leave in Washington, New York and Paris, and coming up in the train from my home in Switzerland two days before I had bought a batch of Berlin and Rhineland newspapers. They quickly propelled one back to the cockeyed world of Nazism, which was as unlike the world I had just left as if it had been on another planet. I noted further on August 10, after I had arrived in Berlin:

Whereas all the rest of the world considers that the peace is about to be broken by Germany, that it is Germany that is threatening to attack Poland . . . here in Germany, in the world the local newspapers create, the very reverse is maintained .. . What the Nazi papers are proclaiming is this: that it is Poland which is disturbing the peace of Europe; Poland which is threatening Germany with armed invasion . . .

“POLAND, LOOK OUT!” warns the B.Z. headline, adding: “ANSWER TO POLAND, THE RUNNER-AMOK [AMOKLAUFFER] AGAINST PEACE AND RIGHT IN EUROPE!”

Or the headline in Der Fuehrer, daily paper of Karlsruhe, which I bought on the train: “WARSAW THREATENS BOMBARDMENT OF DANZIG – UNBELIEVABLE AGITATION OF THE POLISH ARCHMADNESS [POLNISCHEN GROESSENWAHSN]!”

You ask: But the German people can’t possibly believe these lies? Then you talk to them. So many do.

William L. Shirer, The Rise and Fall of the Third Reich

23 posted on 08/10/2009 6:14:13 AM PDT by Homer_J_Simpson ("Every nation has the government that it deserves." - Joseph de Maistre (1753-1821))
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To: Homer_J_Simpson
Churchill’s final paper for the Air Defence Research Committee:

August 10, 1939

The main defence of England against air raids is the toll which can be extracted from the raiders. One-fifth knocked out each go will soon bring the raids to an end. . . . We must imagine the opening attack as a large affair crossing the sea in relays for many hours. But it is not the first results of the air attack which will govern the future of the air war. It is not child’s-play to come and attack England. A heavy proportion of casualties will lead the enemy to make severe calculations of profit and loss. As daylight raiding will soon become too expensive, we have chiefly to deal with random night-bombing of the built-up areas.

* * *

The British Government . . . dispatched Admiral Drax with a mission to Moscow on August 10. These officers possessed no written authority to negotiate. The French Mission was headed by General Doumenc. On the Russian side Marshal Voroshilov officiated. We now know that at this same time the Soviet Government agreed to the journey of a German negotiator to Moscow. The military conference soon foundered upon the refusal of Poland and Roumania to allow the transit of Russian troops. The Polish attitude was, “With the Germans we risk losing our liberty; with the Russians our soul.”

Winston S. Churchill, The Gathering Storm

24 posted on 08/10/2009 6:19:27 AM PDT by Homer_J_Simpson ("Every nation has the government that it deserves." - Joseph de Maistre (1753-1821))
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To: r9etb; PzLdr; dfwgator; Paisan; From many - one.; rockinqsranch; GRRRRR; 2banana; henkster; ...
Update from Ciano’s and Shirer’s diaries at reply #23.
Churchill’s update on air defense and the negotiations in Moscow at reply #24.
25 posted on 08/10/2009 6:23:19 AM PDT by Homer_J_Simpson ("Every nation has the government that it deserves." - Joseph de Maistre (1753-1821))
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To: Homer_J_Simpson

kneel before KIng Zog of albania


26 posted on 08/10/2009 6:57:05 AM PDT by beebuster2000
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To: Homer_J_Simpson
You ask: But the German people can’t possibly believe these lies? Then you talk to them. So many do.

Just like in this country with the lies the MSM puts out.

27 posted on 08/10/2009 6:59:43 AM PDT by dfwgator
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To: Homer_J_Simpson

Reading the excerpts from the Nazi press is chilling. The bombastic rhetoric is really over the top, but it’s chilling for two reasons.

1: It was really just a preview of coming attractions. The German leadership really did want a war, and their propaganda machine was trying to whip up fervor for one. It presaged the most destructive global war of all time.

2: This crap is being printed yet today in places like Tehran and Pyongyang.


28 posted on 08/10/2009 7:03:28 AM PDT by henkster (The frog has noticed the increase in water temperature)
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To: henkster

agree that the similarity to today is striking. todays poland/danzig is Israel and palestine. like danzig, a somewhat artificial creation of boundries, with conflicting claims unresolved. like germany then Iran today threatening to “wipe off map”, today, like then, many dismissing it as just rhetoric, not taking it seriously.

how wrong they were.


29 posted on 08/10/2009 7:50:19 AM PDT by beebuster2000
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To: beebuster2000
agree that the similarity to today is striking. todays poland/danzig is Israel and palestine

Actually the parallel will be the Crimea, between Russia and Ukraine.

30 posted on 08/10/2009 7:51:38 AM PDT by dfwgator
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To: dfwgator

nah, the level of rhetoric and appeasement is way higher around Israel,palestine. plus Iran more closely fits Germany imho.


31 posted on 08/10/2009 8:18:58 AM PDT by beebuster2000
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