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Where’s the Science? The Sorry State of Psychotherapy
Association for Psychological Science ^ | 10/02/09 | Timothy Baker, Richard McFall, Varda Shoham

Posted on 10/04/2009 9:35:34 AM PDT by TennesseeGirl

The prevalence of mental health disorders in this country has nearly doubled in the past 20 years. Who is treating all of these patients? Clinical psychologists and therapists are charged with the task, but many are falling short by using methods that are out of date and lack scientific rigor. This is in part because many of the training programs—especially some Doctorate of Psychology (PsyD) programs and for-profit training centers—are not grounded in science.

A new report in Psychological Science in the Public Interest, a journal of the Association for Psychological Science, by a panel of distinguished clinical scientists—Timothy Baker (University of Wisconsin-Madison), Richard McFall (Indiana University), and Varda Shoham (University of Arizona)—calls for the reform of clinical psychology training programs and appeals for a new accreditation system to ensure that mental health clinicians are trained to use the most effective and current research to treat their patients.

There are multiple practices in clinical psychology that are grounded in science and proven to work, but in the absence of standardized science-based training, those treatments go unused.

For example, cognitive-behavioral therapy (CBT) has been shown to be the most effective treatment for PTSD and has the fewest side-effects, yet many psychologists do not use this method. Baker and colleagues cite one study in which only 30 percent of psychologists were trained to perform CBT for PTSD and only half of those psychologists elected to use it. That means that six of every seven sufferers were not getting the best care available from their clinicians. Furthermore, CBT shows both long-term and immediate benefits as a treatment for PTSD; whereas medications such as Paxil have shown 25 to 50 percent relapse rates.

The report suggests that the escalating cost of mental health care treatment has reduced the use of psychological treatments and shifted care to general health care facilities. The authors also stress the importance of coupling psychosocial interventions with medicine because many behavioral therapies have been shown to reduce costs and provide longer term benefits for the client.

Baker and colleagues conclude that a new accreditation system is the key to reforming training in clinical psychology. This new system is already under development: the Psychological Clinical Science Accreditation System (PCSAS www.pcsas.org).


TOPICS: Chit/Chat; Health/Medicine; Miscellaneous; Science
KEYWORDS: apa; disorders; libertarians; medicalmarijuana; mentalhealth; psychology
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1 posted on 10/04/2009 9:35:34 AM PDT by TennesseeGirl
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To: TennesseeGirl

‘’Psychologist’’ - just another word for ‘’witchdoctor’’


2 posted on 10/04/2009 9:43:08 AM PDT by Lexington Green (Racist? When you call me that... smile.)
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To: TennesseeGirl
The Association for Psychological Science (APS) was founded some years ago to push back against the drift away from empirical research and applications which have characterized the field since probably the 1970's.

Not many clinicians belong, compared to research psychologists. Which is too bad, but the dismal fact is, in the 1970s and following, two trends converged: the New Age, anti-intellectual, anti-scientific bias grew strong, and at the same time Psychology became dominated numerically and soon "intellectually" by women and others of a leftwing feminist persuasion.

The American Psychological Association (APA) fell to the pseudoscientists, became derelict in holding to its mission statement, and abandoned any pretense of being a scientific organization. In short, the last thirty years the field of psychology has forgotten most of what it ever knew. The APS is trying to hold on to some light in this darkening age.

3 posted on 10/04/2009 9:46:03 AM PDT by hinckley buzzard (Truth--The liberal's Kryptonite)
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To: TennesseeGirl

...Paxil killed Freud.


4 posted on 10/04/2009 9:48:07 AM PDT by STONEWALLS
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To: TennesseeGirl

I was an Office Manager for Psychs in my previous life.
There is a thread of truth to this but it’s not absolute.

In our office, drugs were the last resort. Some were used only temporarily to give the patient confidence in behavior modification. My main Doctor was well known to wean patients off meds that others had prescribed.

However, some Psych problems are diagnosed with blood tests. They are absolute and are treated chemically. That being said, we called the Serotonin reuptake inhibitors (Paxil, Prozac, Zoloft) “Candy Meds” because every doctor felt that if someone was “depressed” that would help. Honestly, they don’t help those people who don’t need them and a doctor could give a bottle of Smarties and do just as much. Yet they have side effects that cannot be dismissed.

I agree with much of this article. I really believe that the diagnosis of “Autism Spectrum” and ADHD are overused, over medicated and should be treated with Behavior Modification for the child and for the parent.


5 posted on 10/04/2009 9:52:11 AM PDT by netmilsmom (Psalm 109:8 - Let his days be few; and let another take his office)
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To: Quix

“Pray you are feeling better” ping.


6 posted on 10/04/2009 9:52:41 AM PDT by oprahstheantichrist (The MSM is a demonic stronghold, PLEASE pray accordingly - 2 Corinthians 10:3-5)
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To: TennesseeGirl
A far more effective therapy for PTSD is shown to be EMDR, even provided for by the government for the military. Anyone interested should look into it, along with studies that compare results of different therapies.
I agree medications are a poor choice.
7 posted on 10/04/2009 9:53:56 AM PDT by nakutny
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To: oprahstheantichrist

Seems like progress, PTL, . . . slower than would prefer. Not sure if I’m going to be up to teaching Monday, or not.

Sure appreciate the prayers and your thoughtful caring.


8 posted on 10/04/2009 9:55:08 AM PDT by Quix (POL Ldrs quotes fm1900 2 presnt: http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/religion/2130557/posts?page=81#81)
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To: TennesseeGirl

Dreadful.

Thankfully, my program insisted on staying up with the latest science and delivering the most effective, least problematic service to the client.

Cognitive Behavioral Therapy has also been shown to be the most effective with the least side effects and least relapse rate for

CLINICAL DEPRESSION.

However, clients are also polluted with cultural propaganda and tend to want quick fixes from a bottle or some such.

CBT tends to take more mental work and discipline to change one’s brain-wiring from the typical habitual thought patterns than a lot of folks are willing to bother with.


9 posted on 10/04/2009 10:03:11 AM PDT by Quix (POL Ldrs quotes fm1900 2 presnt: http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/religion/2130557/posts?page=81#81)
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To: Lexington Green

Not necessarily.

Certainly true with some new agers, however.


10 posted on 10/04/2009 10:04:15 AM PDT by Quix (POL Ldrs quotes fm1900 2 presnt: http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/religion/2130557/posts?page=81#81)
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To: hinckley buzzard

Plenty of truth in that post.


11 posted on 10/04/2009 10:04:51 AM PDT by Quix (POL Ldrs quotes fm1900 2 presnt: http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/religion/2130557/posts?page=81#81)
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To: TennesseeGirl

Going back several steps... One problem is that psychology, when taught at the high-school level, is taught by the Social Studies department, not by the Science department. It attracts social worker do-gooder types, not scientists.

The College Board offers an Advanced Placement psychology course and exam for high schools, but there are no requirements for the teacher of this AP course to have any science background. In addition, the College Board states: “It is essential for AP Psychology teachers to join [the American Psychological Association] as High School Teacher Affiliates, which also includes membership in TOPSS (Teachers of Psychology in Secondary Schools).” And as a FReeper has already pointed out, the APA is part of the problem.


12 posted on 10/04/2009 10:05:50 AM PDT by LibFreeOrDie (Obama promised a gold mine, but will give us the shaft.)
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To: netmilsmom

Excellent points.

Though I don’t believe that all the blood test stuff is that absolute.

Blood tests don’t demonstrate which came first, the chicken or the egg. Too many assume that blood tests mean the chemical imbalance caused the malady first when there’s plenty of

EMPIRICAL EVIDENCE

that behaviors, thought processes, habits

cause chemical imbalances which are then worsened by same.

Pastor Henry Wright in conjunction with a host of MD’s and psychologists has demonstrated this in a number of maladies very empirically.

He’s now successful in getting folks healed of a host of mental illness related maladies which have long been assumed by many to be incurably caused by chemical imbalances alone.

His revised book

A MORE EXCELLENT WAY is an important contribution to cancer and a lot of other ‘incurable’ medical problems being healed.

He’s recently asserted that they have now learned enough to get most schizophrenia patients cured—lastiingly permanently cured—within 3 days of residential treatment at his center.

I don’t think there’s a cancer that can stand up to his methods either.

There’s a lot of low population rare incurable diseases that are unprofitable for medicine to bother with that he’s been led to lasting cures/healing for.

Of course, he also deals with the demonic aspect in some cases of many illnesses and syndromes.

His success rate is so high that 100’s of MD’s refer their patients to him and many are taking training from him.

His basic tool is THE WORD OF GOD. The Lord began to show him that folks have problems because they refuse to live by The Manual. When they work earnestly at getting right with God and living by The Manual, God will heal them—many times instantly or overnight and many times walking it out step by step.

IIRC, he even has great success with bi-polar disorder.


13 posted on 10/04/2009 10:13:04 AM PDT by Quix (POL Ldrs quotes fm1900 2 presnt: http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/religion/2130557/posts?page=81#81)
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To: nakutny

INDEED.

Effective administrations of traditional talk therapy where the individual gets in touch with the emotional content related to the PTSD have also proven to be effective. The client must get in touch with the emotional content and be able to cognitively sort through it until the poisonous energy, impact, potential has been drained off.

The Eye Movement desentization is also effective for similar reasons and may take a shorter time to be effective, IIRC.


14 posted on 10/04/2009 10:15:27 AM PDT by Quix (POL Ldrs quotes fm1900 2 presnt: http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/religion/2130557/posts?page=81#81)
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To: STONEWALLS

Freud was a complete Fraud, who faked his records and never cured anyone of anything. He was a cocaine addict who killed his friend Marxow with the stuff. Carl Jung publicly praised both Hitler and Mussolini.

The Chemical Imbalance thing is a Myth. Read the actual drug Ads. “Scientists think. It is Believed.” They can’t go any farther than belief, because the proof isn’t there.

The American Psychological Assc was recently taken to task for claiming that abortions weren’t damaging to women.


15 posted on 10/04/2009 10:16:07 AM PDT by To-Whose-Benefit? (It is Error alone which needs the support of Government. The Truth can stand by itself.)
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To: TennesseeGirl

PTSD? Oh, I get it, I’m a total idiot for not knowing, let me reach for my Paxil.


16 posted on 10/04/2009 10:16:51 AM PDT by Revolting cat! (Let us prey!)
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To: LibFreeOrDie

Plenty true.

HOWEVER,

the RELIGION OF SCIENCE is also full of plenty of problems.

The RELIGION OF SCIENCE

ASSUMES, BELIEVES AND TEACHES

THAT

IF

one cannot touch it, measure it, manipulate it tangibly and run stats on it,

IT MUST NOT BE REAL.

It’s the old GREEK VS HEBREW manner of KNOWING, DISCOVERING.

NOT ALL TRUTH, NOT ALL FACTS, NOT ALL REALITY is ammenable to GREEK dissection in discovering solid TRUTH.

A new hubby wanting to dissect his new wife to better be able to love her is not likely to find a willing partner.


17 posted on 10/04/2009 10:19:25 AM PDT by Quix (POL Ldrs quotes fm1900 2 presnt: http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/religion/2130557/posts?page=81#81)
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To: To-Whose-Benefit?

Agreed.

I wish I had a copy of my FREUDIAN section term paper.

FRODO AND DR FRUD

It was a biting stinging satire on Freud. Hilarious as well. Prof didn’t appreciate it at first but on re-read admitted I deserved an A—I think an A+ because I had thoroughly understood Freud and documented it.

I think one of Freud’s observations was too correct for comfort:

That even a RELIGION based on Love would be unloving to those not members of it. Too often too many “Christians” have spent too much time proving he was right on that IN-GROUP/OUT-GROUP issue.


18 posted on 10/04/2009 10:22:47 AM PDT by Quix (POL Ldrs quotes fm1900 2 presnt: http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/religion/2130557/posts?page=81#81)
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To: Lexington Green
‘’Psychologist’’ - just another word for ‘’witchdoctor’’

Ironically, I somewhat agree with you, but perhaps not in the way that you intend.

Personally, I would probably not be alive today were it not for the help that I received through the mental health profession a few decades ago. Psychotherapy and medication were both aspects of my treatment. Gradually, I went from being a selfish, self-absorbed and suicidal menace to, today, a happy productive family man with a wonderful wife and two terrific teen-age kids. In the process I discovered a profound sense of gratitude and an appreciation for "amazing grace".

I went through three therapists, some were good, some not. Ironically, those that helped me the most were the more intuitive "witch doctors" rather than the heavily science and research-oriented ones.

Certainly, mental health practitioners are open to a lot of criticism and it is certainly fashionable to bash them as "shrinks", but whenever I see others walking around with "tombstones in their eyes", I want to tell them from the bottom of my heart that there is help and they should seek it.

19 posted on 10/04/2009 10:25:28 AM PDT by cerberus
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To: TennesseeGirl

They could start the reform by re-classifying homosexuality as a disorder as it should be.

This would also go a long way to re-establishing their creditability.


20 posted on 10/04/2009 10:31:09 AM PDT by SoConPubbie
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To: Quix
That even a RELIGION based on Love would be unloving to those not members of it. Too often too many “Christians” have spent too much time proving he was right on that IN-GROUP/OUT-GROUP issue.

To be fair, when it comes to Christianity, that is not the fault of the religion and always the fault of the so-called adherent.
21 posted on 10/04/2009 10:33:20 AM PDT by SoConPubbie
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To: Quix

http://www.psychquotes.com/

Psychiatry’s Views on Conservatives

“In August 2003, the National Institute of Mental Health (NIMH) and the National Science Foundation (NSF) announced the results of their $1.2 million taxpayer-funded study. It stated, essentially, that traditionalists are mentally disturbed. Scholars from the Universities of Maryland, California at Berkeley, and Stanford had determined that social conservatives, in particular, suffer from ‘mental rigidity,’ ‘dogmatism,’ and ‘uncertainty avoidance,’ together with associated indicators for mental illness.”

Source: B.K. Eakman, Chronicles, October 2004, pp. 28-29.
“Political conservatism as motivated social cognition” By Jost, John T.; Glaser, Jack; Kruglanski, Arie W.; Sulloway, Frank J. APA Psychological Bulletin, May 2003, Vol 129(3), p 339-375

Any questions on who they want to drug into being silent and obedient?


22 posted on 10/04/2009 10:33:44 AM PDT by To-Whose-Benefit? (It is Error alone which needs the support of Government. The Truth can stand by itself.)
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To: SoConPubbie

Quite so. Quite so.


23 posted on 10/04/2009 10:41:04 AM PDT by Quix (POL Ldrs quotes fm1900 2 presnt: http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/religion/2130557/posts?page=81#81)
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To: To-Whose-Benefit?

My professional opinion of that is . . .

IDIOT RESEARCH DONE BY IDIOTS FOR IDIOT REASONS.

My Dissertation was . . . how to put it without making it searchable . . . enough in the ball park of . . . such issues . . . my assertion above is somewhat founded on certainly a review of the literature.

Rigid bias and permeability of belief systems is an issue for the jerks who did such a study as much as it is for those they studied.


24 posted on 10/04/2009 10:43:41 AM PDT by Quix (POL Ldrs quotes fm1900 2 presnt: http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/religion/2130557/posts?page=81#81)
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To: To-Whose-Benefit?

They don’t plan to drug us into silence.

They plan to exterminate us totally.


25 posted on 10/04/2009 10:44:08 AM PDT by Quix (POL Ldrs quotes fm1900 2 presnt: http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/religion/2130557/posts?page=81#81)
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To: Quix

“They don’t plan to drug us into silence.

They plan to exterminate us totally.”

If you look into the actual damage caused by their drugs, and the unbelievable excuses used to sell them, you’re right on target.

Either Smoking cigarettes, or trying to Quit Smoking them, are Both, Official psychiatric incurable mental illnesses.

The slightest evidence of teenage rebellion gets kids diagnosed as incurable, for life.


26 posted on 10/04/2009 10:50:07 AM PDT by To-Whose-Benefit? (It is Error alone which needs the support of Government. The Truth can stand by itself.)
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To: To-Whose-Benefit?

INDEED.

imho,

Their own rebellions against God

plus

the deceptions and lies of the critters . . . literally from hell

have all convinced the elites of the ruling oligarchy

that DARWINIAN survival of the fittest must guide their reducing the world’s population to 200 million.

Sooooooooooooooooooooo

. . . encourage all the drug abuse, alcohol abuse etc. etc. they can . . . find out all the idiots who succumb . . .

ditto homosexuality etc. though they are quite schizophrenic about that . . . exterminate the serfs and slaves who practice such but not the elites . . .

categorize all the misfits . . . law breakers . . . except, of course, for the elite such . . .

schedule all their extermination . . . after, that is, their usefulness as useful idiots is well past.


27 posted on 10/04/2009 11:05:13 AM PDT by Quix (POL Ldrs quotes fm1900 2 presnt: http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/religion/2130557/posts?page=81#81)
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To: Quix

Ask Your Doctor if Abilify is Right for You.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mmsjBdxDxcM


28 posted on 10/04/2009 11:24:47 AM PDT by To-Whose-Benefit? (It is Error alone which needs the support of Government. The Truth can stand by itself.)
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To: To-Whose-Benefit?

YUCK!

Slick, aren’t they.


29 posted on 10/04/2009 11:27:57 AM PDT by Quix (POL Ldrs quotes fm1900 2 presnt: http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/religion/2130557/posts?page=81#81)
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To: Quix

I got called a Naderite on another post here for noting that the NIH blew $28 Billion with no oversight on the idiot research which got Abilify and more FDA certified.

I was called out as being an Anti-Capitalist because the other poster thought I was overly concerned with the Profits the Drug Companies make, because it was somehow Their money, when it came from the NIH.


30 posted on 10/04/2009 11:30:21 AM PDT by To-Whose-Benefit? (It is Error alone which needs the support of Government. The Truth can stand by itself.)
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To: To-Whose-Benefit?

Yeah . . . there’s folks hereon who think Capitalism is

GOD ALMIGHTY.

I don’t think God like socialism per se . . . at least not forced socialism.

He seems to be quite an advocate of reasonably free choice. Otherwise, no capacity to Love.

However, He’s not in favor of unbounded greed and corruption by any means either.

And then when one gets into the deadly greed of the oligarchily controlled drug conglomerates . . .

super YUCK.

Glad you sound the alarm.

Some may listen.


31 posted on 10/04/2009 11:32:43 AM PDT by Quix (POL Ldrs quotes fm1900 2 presnt: http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/religion/2130557/posts?page=81#81)
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To: Quix
CBT tends to take more mental work and discipline to change one’s brain-wiring from the typical habitual thought patterns than a lot of folks are willing to bother with.

It really is harder than heck!

I've seen a couple of therapists and neither even asked about the "speeding freight train of doom" which are the thoughts in my head. I came across the idea in a book, the title of which I can't remember (it was very thick, and the cover was yellow, if that helps? LOL).

The book irritated me with all it's "happy thought" stuff and I didn't accept the validity of it for years. But it does work. It's just very, very hard.

32 posted on 10/04/2009 11:43:07 AM PDT by Dianna
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To: Quix

Hitler and Mussolini both instituted despotisms which ran on MONEY.

Just because MONEY is in play, doesn’t make the system FREE, or Free Market Capitalism.

Real Free Markets with manufacturers competing against each other, rather than Drug Companies being Monopolies which Own their Regulators, and squeezing their bottom lines out of the public through Govt Redistribution - Obamacare - would bankrupt products like Abilify right off the shelf.

Anytime Govt has to pay for it, underwrite it, research it, the people have Already voted NO on the product, or service.


33 posted on 10/04/2009 11:47:36 AM PDT by To-Whose-Benefit? (It is Error alone which needs the support of Government. The Truth can stand by itself.)
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To: TennesseeGirl

Interesting article. The Psy.D. programs are extremely dubious, especially with their push to prescribe medications with essentially no scientific background or training.


34 posted on 10/04/2009 11:50:44 AM PDT by FormerACLUmember (When the past no longer illuminates the future, the spirit walks in darkness.)
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To: To-Whose-Benefit?

MMMMM ... MMMMM ... MMMMM

You reference psychiatry but then cite work done by psychologists and then claim the latter wish to drug people into silence.

Perhaps you are off your medications or have missed your therapy appointments of late to be so confused and confusing.


35 posted on 10/04/2009 12:19:31 PM PDT by dodger
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To: Dianna

I don’t recall the book.

THE TRUTH OF IT IS IN SCRIPTURE.

TAKE EACH THOUGHT CAPTIVE, THE BIBLE SAYS. That’s the kernal of truth on which COGNITIVE BEHAVIOR THERAPY is based whether they believe it or not.

Give it’s rooted in God’s Word, of course it works.

Does NOT mean it’s easy.

Took me decades to get there, too.

My profs and bosses articulated it this way . . .

imagine a chain of thoughts . . . The first

link = the first hint of a thought in the destructive, negative direction—the FIRST HINT—may not even seem in the ball park but is still a repeatedly used first step on the route to destruction.

then the next link and the next and the next.

By the time one has reached the last dozen or half dozen or so links, IT IS LIKE A RUNAWAY TRAIN TO DESTRUCTION. Very hard to stop.

ALSO, THOUGHT STOPPING—YELLING STOP OUT LOUD OR SILENTLY TO ONE’S SELF to stop the chain of thoughts . . . can be helpful. BUT ONE THEN HAS TO FORCEFULLY TURN ONE’S THOUGHTS TO A CONSTRUCTIVE ALTERNATIVE.

ONE MUST.

IT’s far from automatic—especially the first 30-90 days.

After 60-90 days, it’s tons easier. Actually, it’s significantly easier after the first 4 days; and easier still after the first 7-10 days.


36 posted on 10/04/2009 12:22:03 PM PDT by Quix (POL Ldrs quotes fm1900 2 presnt: http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/religion/2130557/posts?page=81#81)
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To: To-Whose-Benefit?

EXCELLENT POINTS.

THANKS.


37 posted on 10/04/2009 12:22:44 PM PDT by Quix (POL Ldrs quotes fm1900 2 presnt: http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/religion/2130557/posts?page=81#81)
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To: FormerACLUmember

Depends on the program.

My program offered either a PhD or Psy D. I chose the PhD.

We had more training by the UCSD MD who taught psychiatrists their psychoactive drug courses—we had 10 times the hours of instruction BY HIM than he was allowed TO GIVE THE PSYCHIATRISTS! Crazy.

I have no trouble with properly trained psychologists prescribing a limited range of psychoactive drugs in a proper context.

This closed shop/guild turf stuff to rank up the fees is not exactly the greatest benefit to the patients, clients either.


38 posted on 10/04/2009 12:25:42 PM PDT by Quix (POL Ldrs quotes fm1900 2 presnt: http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/religion/2130557/posts?page=81#81)
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To: Quix

Sorry, psychologists and social workers have no business prescribing.

It is de facto medical malpractice.


39 posted on 10/04/2009 12:34:12 PM PDT by FormerACLUmember (When the past no longer illuminates the future, the spirit walks in darkness.)
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To: TennesseeGirl; All
FYI, Health Realization or also known as Psychology of Mind. It takes a while to “figure it out” but once you do, your life changes. Not everyone buys into the theory. I have read that most traditional psychologist do not or have never heard of it. It challenges the conventional thinking on how to treat mental disorders.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Health_realization

40 posted on 10/04/2009 12:52:27 PM PDT by LuvFreeRepublic (Hey whiners, SEE BRETT THROW!!!)
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To: FormerACLUmember

NONSENSE.

As I noted . . . I and my classmates had more training in psychoactive drugs TEN TIMES MORE than UCSD’s PSYCHIATRISTS HAD by the time they graduated.

The legal definitions of kosher medical etc. practice are changed all the time.

Physicians Assistants didn’t even used to be a category.

Parochial turf wars AT SOME POINT are a gross disservice to the client/patient/customer.

One of my classmates prescribed psychoactive meds at Bethesda Naval Hospital all the time. WITHOUT ANYTHING BUT BENEFIT TO THE PATIENTS.

Besides, MD psychiatrists who see patients for 10 minutes, charge megabucks without really knowing or understanding anything more about the patient than a label someone else gave the pateint . . . are not exactly beacons of responsible safe MEDICAL TREATMENT BEHAVIOR!

I suggest that you

Clean up your own house first, before crying about folks encroaching on your turf.


41 posted on 10/04/2009 12:54:04 PM PDT by Quix (POL Ldrs quotes fm1900 2 presnt: http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/religion/2130557/posts?page=81#81)
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To: dodger

Dear Dodger, the entire system is rigged to one end and one end only, to sell the product.

Psychologists and psychiatrists work out of the same knowledge base, and refer their marks back and forth. The essential difference being that psychologists do not yet possess the prescription pad, and psychiatry, as pharmaceutical companies sales force, are working on Getting psychologists the pad.

There are currently 374 different psychiatric/psychological excuses to turn people into life long drug addicts, with drugs which cure, nothing.

Every psych course in America has already targeted 60 Million Americans as needing their drugs: Exactly the same percentage it started out with from the Psychs in Hitler’s Germany: 1 in 5, 20%.

You can make all the jokes you like about it but it isn’t a laughing matter when those drugs have little kids slashing their wrists and hanging themselves.


42 posted on 10/04/2009 1:02:55 PM PDT by To-Whose-Benefit? (It is Error alone which needs the support of Government. The Truth can stand by itself.)
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To: Quix

Blah, blah, blah...

I have no “turf,” but someone sure does.


43 posted on 10/04/2009 1:04:05 PM PDT by FormerACLUmember (When the past no longer illuminates the future, the spirit walks in darkness.)
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To: FormerACLUmember
Interesting. No logical response to my true points.

Actually, I don't play that turf either. I hated those aspect of the PROFESSION. The snobbishness; the holier-than-thou junk; the elitism etc. were all nauseating smells to me.

I ended up doing more teaching than counseling and now do only a small amount of informal counseling for free. I counsel more folks on FR by far than I do face to face in any context.

44 posted on 10/04/2009 1:10:04 PM PDT by Quix (POL Ldrs quotes fm1900 2 presnt: http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/religion/2130557/posts?page=81#81)
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To: To-Whose-Benefit?

I agree with you wholesale.


45 posted on 10/04/2009 1:10:38 PM PDT by Quix (POL Ldrs quotes fm1900 2 presnt: http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/religion/2130557/posts?page=81#81)
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To: TennesseeGirl

The diagnoses have doubled because insurance requires a diagnosis for payment. And everyone wants to use insurance instead of paying out of pocket expenses.


46 posted on 10/04/2009 1:17:37 PM PDT by Chickensoup (Angry about where our country is going with the current regime at the helm.)
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To: Quix

Thanks Quix.

If anybody wants to make any More crackpot jokes about what a Clear and Present Menace the whole psych con actually is:

http://www.cchrint.org/psychdrugdangers/

http://www.ssristories.com/

They need to understand just What, those drugs actually Are, First.


47 posted on 10/04/2009 1:22:39 PM PDT by To-Whose-Benefit? (It is Error alone which needs the support of Government. The Truth can stand by itself.)
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To: To-Whose-Benefit?

I mostly agree with you.

I used to be more in favor of some drugs.

And, I can still see some use for seretonin reuptake inhibitors for some small percentage of extreme cases for a limited time.

And, I can see some need for Ritilin for a very very small minority of TRUELY ADHD cases.

But mostly, it’s a racket very destructive to living things like humans.

Besides, PASTOR HENRY WRIGHT and his book

A MORE EXCELLENT WAY now show us how to do things right and get rid of such horrific maladies healthier ways.


48 posted on 10/04/2009 1:25:27 PM PDT by Quix (POL Ldrs quotes fm1900 2 presnt: http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/religion/2130557/posts?page=81#81)
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To: To-Whose-Benefit?

www.cchrint.org/psychdrugdangers/

Scientology alert


49 posted on 10/04/2009 1:30:01 PM PDT by Petronski (In Germany they came first for the Communists, And I didn't speak up because I wasn't a Communist...)
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To: Petronski

Dismiss the site, due to the source, if you wish.

You haven’t had time to SCAN the DATA without KNEEJERKING it as scientology first.

The DATA ITSELF, is from the FDA. It was BURIED by the FDA, and Regardless of Who put up the site:

That FDA DATA required FOIA REQUESTS TO MAKE IT PUBLIC.

FDA’s 2008 budget was $2.2 Billion. Half a Billion of that FDA BUDGET came directly from the Drug Companies, as “User Fees.”

Scientologist or Not, the DATA, is the DATA.

Slagging the ACTUAL SCIENCE, no matter Who retrieved it, is NOT a VALID ARGUMENT.


50 posted on 10/04/2009 1:44:45 PM PDT by To-Whose-Benefit? (It is Error alone which needs the support of Government. The Truth can stand by itself.)
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