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Nokia opens new front in Apple patent battle
yahoo tech news ^ | Dec 29, 2009 | Brett Young

Posted on 12/29/2009 12:39:15 PM PST by driftdiver

HELSINKI (Reuters) -

The world's top mobile phone maker Nokia launched a new patent broadside against Apple, escalating a battle for control of the smartphone market that has already led to a flurry of lawsuits.

Nokia filed a complaint with the U.S. International Trade Commission (ITC) on Tuesday alleging that Apple infringes Nokia patents in "virtually all of its mobile phones, portable music players, and computers" sold.

The seven patents at issue relate to Nokia technology being used by Apple to create features in user interface, camera, antenna and power management technologies, it said in a statement.

A Nokia spokesman said the firm expected the ITC to decide whether to pursue the case in around 30 days. Any possible injunction against the sale of Apple products with regard to the alleged patent infringement would not happen until early 2011.

Apple was not immediately available for comment.

(Excerpt) Read more at tech.yahoo.com ...


TOPICS: Society
KEYWORDS: apple; mac; nokia; patent

1 posted on 12/29/2009 12:39:16 PM PST by driftdiver
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To: driftdiver

Nokia sees that Apple is beating them with things like the iPod, the Macbook, and the iPhone and they are doing what any good weasel would do. If Nokia REALLY thought that these were infringements then why didn’t they file when the first laptops from Apple went wirelss? Or when the iPod first came out 9 or any of the multiple generations since)?

Sounds like sour grapes to me


2 posted on 12/29/2009 12:42:35 PM PST by the long march
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To: the long march

“Sounds like sour grapes to me”

Apple has filed around 14 lawsuits against Nokia.


3 posted on 12/29/2009 12:45:45 PM PST by driftdiver (I could eat it raw, but why do that when I have a fire.)
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To: driftdiver

And did so in a timely manner.


4 posted on 12/29/2009 12:47:00 PM PST by the long march
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To: the long march

Excuse me, not 14 lawsuits. A lawsuit alleging infringement of 13-14 patents.


5 posted on 12/29/2009 12:47:21 PM PST by driftdiver (I could eat it raw, but why do that when I have a fire.)
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To: the long march

Interesting and little known fact. The great user interface isn’t Apples, its built on Nokia technology.


6 posted on 12/29/2009 12:48:32 PM PST by driftdiver (I could eat it raw, but why do that when I have a fire.)
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To: the long march

Nokia’s mobile internet devices were on the market long before Apple’s iPhones. I expect there is some merit to this. Especially given the level of arrogance within Apple’s management.


7 posted on 12/29/2009 12:49:41 PM PST by MrEdd (Heck? Geewhiz Cripes, thats the place where people who don't believe in Gosh think they aint going.)
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To: MrEdd

I agree...sue-happy Apple can enjoy a little “sauce for the goose.”


8 posted on 12/29/2009 1:05:31 PM PST by ez ("Abashed the Devil stood and felt how awful goodness is..." - Milton)
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To: driftdiver
Unless I have the timeline wrong, this would be the standard MAD approach to patents among corporations -- you sue me, I counter-sue, we settle and cross-license. This is true because with the number of patents these days, and the overly-broad nature of many, almost no tech company can produce any products without infringing on another company's patent. Apple has over 200 patents associated with the iPhone, so any company making an iPhone copy (like Nokia, which publicly admitted it was copying the iPhone) is likely to be infringing.

Personally, I think Nokia didn't sue way back when because nobody thought the iPhone would succeed so much. Now Nokia is scared and resorting to lawsuits.

BTW, the MAD doctrine is also why patent trolls are so dangerous. They undermine the game since they have no products over which the defendant can counter-sue.

9 posted on 12/29/2009 1:30:22 PM PST by antiRepublicrat
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To: antiRepublicrat

The way a lot of company’s handle these is to try and work out a licensing arrangement when they discover infringement.

If the other party refuses to accept a licensing agreement then a lawsuit is used to force them to the table.

Although Apple is doing well in Nokia’s market, nokia still has market share. using the courts is one way to maintain or get your market share. Apple did the same thing to stop that mac clone company.


10 posted on 12/29/2009 1:46:25 PM PST by driftdiver (I could eat it raw, but why do that when I have a fire.)
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To: driftdiver
The only thing that keeps Europe afloat,financially,is their courts fining successful US companies (Intel,Microsoft,etc) for billions and billions and billions.
11 posted on 12/29/2009 4:26:57 PM PST by Gay State Conservative (Host The Beer Summit-->Win The Nobel Peace Prize!)
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To: ~Kim4VRWC's~; 1234; 50mm; Abundy; Action-America; acoulterfan; Airwinger; Aliska; altair; ...
Nokia pleads to ITC that Apple is infringing their patents... PING!


Nokia v. Apple Ping!

If you want on or off the Mac Ping List, Freepmail me.

12 posted on 12/29/2009 10:03:49 PM PST by Swordmaker (Remember, the proper pronunciation of IE isAAAAIIIIIEEEEEEE!)
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To: driftdiver
Interesting and little known fact. The great user interface isn’t Apples, its built on Nokia technology.

No, it isn't. Nokia's 10 patents that they are suing Apple over are not related to user interfacing. They are related to GSM and UMTS standards as well as 802.11 WiFi technologies... and they have been pooled with Apple contributions to the standards as which all participating companies, including Nokia and Apple, are permitted to license equally for "fair and reasonable" licensing fees. When Nokia saw the success of the iPhone they tried to hold Apple to discriminatory licensing fees for their 10 patents that were far higher than the fees other members of the pool were paying...

13 posted on 12/29/2009 10:15:08 PM PST by Swordmaker (Remember, the proper pronunciation of IE isAAAAIIIIIEEEEEEE!)
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To: driftdiver

I like the looks of the N900. Don’t care much for the iPhone. On-screen keyboards are awful.


14 posted on 12/29/2009 10:23:07 PM PST by B Knotts (Calvin Coolidge Republican)
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To: B Knotts

Has anyone with no ties to either company done a comparison between the N900 and the HTC HD2?


15 posted on 12/29/2009 10:40:20 PM PST by Abundy
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To: driftdiver; the long march; B Knotts; Gay State Conservative; antiRepublicrat; ez; MrEdd; Abundy

Why Nokia is suing Apple over iPhone GSM/UMTS patents

October 22nd, 2009

by Daniel Eran Dilger

Nokia has filed suit over patent infringement on Apple’ iPhone, claiming that “by refusing to agree appropriate terms for Nokia’s intellectual property, Apple is attempting to get a free ride on the back of Nokia’s innovation.” Actually the reverse is true.

As the world’s leader in handset sales by a wide margin, Nokia most certainly does have one of the “strongest and broadest patent portfolios in the industry,” as the company says. And having licensed its technology to nearly every mobile maker in the industry, it’s not surprising that Apple will have to pay Nokia to play in the phone market.

However, Nokia is painting a picture that doesn’t doesn’t really mesh with reality, suggesting that Apple is a rogue manufacturer intent on breaking patent laws. In reality, Apple maintains one of the most experienced legal teams in the field of intellectual property, knows how the industry works, and either pays for IP or proves that it doesn’t need to.

Nokia sues Apple over iPhone’s use of patented wireless standards

Apple, tamer of trolls

After all, this is the company that in 2005 outmatched Microsoft in slaying the Burst.com multimedia patent trolls. After Redmond paid out $60 million to Burst, Apple stepped in and invalidated most of the company’s patents and then settled for just a sixth as much, despite the giggles of pundits who hoped Apple would be forced to pay out far more than Microsoft.

Apple also expertly navigated the perilous waters surrounding the iPod, buying out trolls or in some cases partnering with them for mutually beneficial results. That’s what it did when Creative creatively threatened to get an injunction against iPod sales; Apple pulled out its own patents over a Beer Summit and ended up talking Creative into making iPod accessories and liking it.

This is a company that has played both sides of the IP game, contributing its patents to pools and licensing others’ back. An easy example is the MPEG Licensing Authority, which Apple repeatedly had to dicker with to pull licensing down to reasonable levels. In 2002, Apple staunchly refused to ship Quicktime 6 until the MPEG LA agreed to reasonable streaming fees for MEPG-4.

Apple is now gearing up again to battle MPEG LA over H.264 streaming fees set to explode in 2011, while the powerless open source community just curses under its breath, cowers in the shadows, and suggests using Ogg instead.

When the going gets tough, Nokia gets litigious

Analysts say Apple has similarly been working with Nokia to hash out an acceptable patent agreement for at least a year. So why is Nokia grandstanding about its patent suit to the press for sympathy? Because that’s about all Nokia has left going for it.

The company now sits on at least four operating system strategies: its Nokia OS “no frills” Series 30 and “basic” Series 40 embedded systems for simple phones; Symbian OS, its flagship smartphone system that just converted itself from a commercial enterprise in free fall to an open source giveaway bin; various flavors of Linux that power the company’s not-quite-a-phone devices; Windows 7 on its netback experiment; and rumors about following Sony Ericsson into the fetid swamps of Windows Mobile just to cover all the bases.

Nokia is a lot like the Microsoft of mobile phones: on top of the market for reasons nobody can still remember and yet convinced that things won’t ever change despite clear evidence to the contrary, not the least of which is the company’s frequently absurdist management decisions. Such as partnering with each other to be led out of the pit.

Readers Write About Symbian, OS X and the iPhone

iPhone panic spurs Nokia to dump Symbian on high end

Follow the lack of money

A look at Nokia’s finances is also revealing. While the company sold 108,500,000 phones in the last quarter (an 8% drop from the previous year), a figure that dwarfs Apple’s sales of 7,367,000 iPhones over the same period, Nokia’s average selling price was around $90 compared to Apple’s $612. Nokia sells a lot of crap; Apple only sells the iPhone.

That’s why despite selling a tiny fraction of the volume that Nokia pushed into the channel, Apple’s iPhone brought in revenues of $4.5 billion compared to Nokia Devices and Services’ $9.8 billion, and actually earned gross margins of $2.7 billion compared to Nokia’s $3 billion, and Apple’s EBIT (earnings before interest and taxes; operating profit) was $2 billion to Nokia’s $1 billion.

Apple is just now entering its third year as a smartphone vendor and it has already beaten Nokia at its own game. And while Apple’s business is growing dramatically, Nokia’s sales slipped behind in every market it did business in: down 1.1% in Europe, down 6.6% in China, down 8.8% in the Middle East and Africa, down 11.8% in Latin America, and in Apple’s home territory of North America, Nokia was down 31.1%.

Nokia is trying to demand something like $12 per iPhone in royalties, which analysts describe as ridiculous posturing. But that goal indicates that Nokia sees no future in its own ability to innovate, and that it would rather latch onto Apple like a barnacle and live the easy life of a parasite, earning more from each sale of Apple’s iPhone than it makes from selling its own devices.

That’s why claiming that “Apple is attempting to get a free ride on the back of Nokia’s innovation” is about as shamelessly bottom feeding as Nokia could be expected to get.


The real patent story behind Apple vs Nokia

December 11th, 2009

Daniel Eran Dilger

Nokia sued Apple, now Apple is suing Nokia; both companies claim the other is trying to appropriate their own technology unfairly. But that’s not really the case at all. The real story isn’t even being reported.

Apple’s own press release only says that the company is countersuing Nokia over “stealing” 13 of Apple’s patents; Nokia originally claimed Apple had similarly infringed on 10 of its patents rather than doing its own innovative research. Digging deeper into Apple’s legal filings however, it becomes clear that all patents are not equal.

AAPL-NOKCountersuit

Pooling patents

It’s not a just case of Apple’s patents being better or more novel. Nokia says its patents are related to GSM and UMTS standards as well as 802.11 WiFi technologies. The problem for Nokia is that the company has already committed itself to license its standards-related patents using “fair, reasonable and non-discriminatory terms.”

When companies pool their patents into open standards as Nokia did, it can benefit the entire industry. It also benefits the contributing companies, who earn royalties on those patents as the portfolio of technology related to a given standard is licensed by other companies.

Without patent pooling within international standards bodies, each company would have to develop its own complete set of technologies without any of the benefits of sharing. There would also be less interoperability between products.

Pooling patents together from multiple companies also allows third-party companies to adapt and deploy technologies originally created by others. This creates competition through cooperation and benefits consumers. Companies like Nokia with expertise in wireless mobile technologies, and companies like Apple with expertise in multimedia and network computing, can combine their talents to create interoperable standards which third parties can license as a package.

Licensed broadly vs private innovation

Nokia, Apple, and many other companies have all contributed to pooled standards such as MPEG video, WiFi wireless networking, web standards, and mobile standards such as GSM and UMTS. Once they pool their technologies into a standard, their intellectual property is now understood to be available at fair and reasonable licensing terms to any company that wishes to use it and pay the established licensing fees, or in some cases, completely free and open.

After Nokia committed its ten patents to various mobile and WiFi standards, it attempted to discriminate its licensing terms against Apple. Due to the success of the iPhone, Nokia wanted more money from Apple then it gets from other licensees, and also wanted open access to Apple’s private portfolio of technology used in the iPhone.

While Apple has contributed a variety of its patented technologies to open standards which are licensed under “fair, reasonable and non-discriminatory terms,” it also has a variety of technologies that are not related to any open standards. These differentiate the iPod and iPhone, and are sold directly to consumers rather than being broadly licensed to other technology companies to use.

Patent discrimination

Nokia hoped to leverage its pooled patents to gain access to Apple’s private patents, patents Nokia had already began using in its own phones, a grossly hypocritical move after alleging that Apple had stolen its technologies because it wasn’t innovative enough to develop its own.

So this is not a case of tit-for-tat as virtually every report so far has suggested. It’s a case of Nokia, finding itself well behind the curve in mobile phones, attempting to extort unfair, unreasonable, and discriminatory licensing terms against Apple for patents which Nokia has already committed to license under fair reasonable and nondiscriminatory terms.

Why Nokia is suing Apple over iPhone GSM/UMTS patents

Another interesting take away here is that Nokia isn’t the only company stealing Apple’s technology. Pundits cheered when when Palm did it, and they’re giddy at the prospect of Android stealing more and more of Apple’s intellectual property.

And while the industry rags all complained that Apple was going to stifle competition in the industry by going after Palm, Apple didn’t. And earlier, when it was claimed that Apple had a “killer patent” it would use to destroy every competitor to the iPod… that didn’t happen either. and when pundits fretted that Apple would use its multitouch patents to kill innovation and smart phones… that didn’t happen either.

Why Apple’s Tim Cook Did Not Threaten Palm Pre

Apple’s Billion Dollar Patent Bluster

The iPhone Multitouch Patent Myth

Instead, Apple only responded to Nokia after that company launched a highly publicized assault on the iPhone, one which was celebrated and cheered on by Nokia’s fanboys and much of the technology press in general. Clearly, Apple prefers to win in the marketplace and is only using its patents defensively. So pundits, chew on that before scribbling up your next missive about how Apple may destroy the world via its patent holdings.

16 posted on 12/29/2009 10:54:03 PM PST by Swordmaker (Remember, the proper pronunciation of IE isAAAAIIIIIEEEEEEE!)
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To: MrEdd; ez

All of Nokia’s mobile internet devices are, surprise, LATER than the original Apple Newton MessagePad, which could have a cellular internet connection and had a browser. In fact, it predates just about everyone else’s mobile internet devices.


17 posted on 12/30/2009 1:38:08 AM PST by Spktyr (Overwhelmingly superior firepower and the willingness to use it is the only proven peace solution.)
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To: driftdiver

I have had two Nokia phones and will never own another. In fact, after getting my iPhone, I have decided it is a total game changer and have no intention of ever switching again.

The thing just cannot be any easier to use. Nokia was always a pain and never delivered what it promised.


18 posted on 12/30/2009 2:18:48 AM PST by Ronin
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To: Abundy

This one is more favorable to the N900, but makes points for both phones:

http://www.starryhope.com/nokia-n900/2009/15-ways-nokias-n900-is-better-than-apples-iphone-and-5-ways-its-not/


19 posted on 12/30/2009 6:11:58 AM PST by B Knotts (Calvin Coolidge Republican)
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To: driftdiver

Can’t win in the marketplace, so file a lawsuit... The “American Way”... File the case in the “right” (as in leftist) venue, and this case has a chance even if it really is a pile of dung (which it most likely is).

The iPod has been around how long? The iPhone as well? So the lawsuit is just now getting filed?

If I “owned” a certain technology that was being infringed upon, I would jump all over it immediately to stop the abuse of my intellectual property, and to prevent being hurt economically by said infringement.

I use to think Nokia was a decent company. Mark them off the list...


20 posted on 12/30/2009 9:49:45 AM PST by TheBattman (They exchanged the truth about God for a lie and worshiped and served the creature...)
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To: driftdiver

It isn’t Apple’s? Hmmm... and all this time, I thought the interface was an ultra-simplified take on OS X... Even the interface on the original iPod was a loose version of the menu system in Apple’s OS.


21 posted on 12/30/2009 9:52:49 AM PST by TheBattman (They exchanged the truth about God for a lie and worshiped and served the creature...)
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To: driftdiver
Apple did the same thing to stop that mac clone company.

Apples to oranges. Apple sued Psystar because Psystar blatantly violated the licensing agreement in every copy of OS X they distributed.

The only way your statement would hold water is if Apple purchased software from Nokia, then copied it freely, and used it on their own hardware in direct violation of copyright and patent.

22 posted on 12/30/2009 9:55:57 AM PST by TheBattman (They exchanged the truth about God for a lie and worshiped and served the creature...)
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To: TheBattman

Apple filed their lawsuit a while back. you gonna write them off as well?


23 posted on 12/30/2009 12:36:34 PM PST by driftdiver (I could eat it raw, but why do that when I have a fire.)
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To: TheBattman
The iPod has been around how long? The iPhone as well? So the lawsuit is just now getting filed?

Given that Nokia knew about the Apple products from the beginning, there are only two possible motives. One, Nokia didn't think the iPod was any good or would be successful, so why sue when their market position isn't threatened?

Two is an old-time practice. If you sue early then the target company might stop infringing, leaving you to only collect a small amount of damages. But if you wait until the product is very popular and has sold millions, then you reap much bigger rewards. This is a dangerous one to do though, because any good and fair judge will recognize the tactic and limit damages. Unfortunately, such judges aren't to be found in the Eastern District of Texas.

24 posted on 12/30/2009 1:32:24 PM PST by antiRepublicrat
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To: Swordmaker
So pundits, chew on that before scribbling up your next missive about how Apple may destroy the world via its patent holdings.

I heard Apple was going to patent gravity and unless everyone pays royalties all our stuff will float off into the ether. Some say they stole the idea from MicroSoft.

25 posted on 12/30/2009 1:41:41 PM PST by Mind-numbed Robot (Not all that needs to be done needs to be done by the government)
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To: driftdiver
Apple filed their lawsuit a while back. you gonna write them off as well?

Apple's lawsuit is a counter lawsuit. Read it. It is part of their answer to Nokia's suit against Apple. As such it is being heard by the same judge in the same court in Delaware as the original Nokia suit. They are not separate cases.

26 posted on 12/30/2009 2:59:06 PM PST by Swordmaker (Remember, the proper pronunciation of IE isAAAAIIIIIEEEEEEE!)
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To: Swordmaker

yeah cause apple is the model in business ethics.

/puke


27 posted on 12/30/2009 3:52:50 PM PST by driftdiver (I could eat it raw, but why do that when I have a fire.)
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To: driftdiver

Non sequitur.


28 posted on 12/30/2009 4:01:10 PM PST by Swordmaker (Remember, the proper pronunciation of IE isAAAAIIIIIEEEEEEE!)
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To: Swordmaker

How does apple pay these days?


29 posted on 12/30/2009 4:44:04 PM PST by driftdiver (I could eat it raw, but why do that when I have a fire.)
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To: B Knotts

thanks...that was a good read...I was looking for comparison between the HTC HD2 and the Nokia N900....

I’m working overseas in a war zone and want something that has integrated gps/mapping ability (if the fecal matter hits the fan) and there is no service for the Iphone here...plus I want a phone that I can switch out simm cards if needed


30 posted on 12/30/2009 7:27:02 PM PST by Abundy
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To: driftdiver
How does apple pay these days?

I imagine with checks or automatic deposits, just like most employers.

However, I wouldn't know for sure, I'm not an employee of Apple, as I've told you before. . . several times, I think.

How does Microsoft pay?

31 posted on 12/30/2009 7:34:14 PM PST by Swordmaker (Remember, the proper pronunciation of IE isAAAAIIIIIEEEEEEE!)
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To: Abundy

Sorry. I missed that when I posted...have you seen this one?

http://www.ibtimes.co.uk/articles/20091105/smartphone-wars-nokia-n900-versus-htc-hd2-versus-motorola-droid-four.htm


32 posted on 12/30/2009 7:42:42 PM PST by B Knotts (Calvin Coolidge Republican)
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