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FORGIVING ENEMIES SETS YOU FREE
ZenithMax ^ | Jan 2 | J. Grant Swank, Jr.

Posted on 01/02/2010 5:26:21 AM PST by freedomyes

Have we remembered that one of the ways of leveling the whole situation is forgiving the enemy? Jesus admonished His children: “Pray for those who persecute you, despitefully use you.” Jesus followed through with His own counsel: “Father, forgive them for they do not know what they are doing.”

(Excerpt) Read more at zenithmax.wordpress.com ...


TOPICS: Chit/Chat; Miscellaneous; Religion; Society
KEYWORDS: bible; christ; faith; forgiveness; prayer; stopshouting
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1 posted on 01/02/2010 5:26:21 AM PST by freedomyes
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To: freedomyes

Seem’s it is God That Forgives ,Ultimately, Only GOD Can....


2 posted on 01/02/2010 5:40:01 AM PST by bravotu (Have a Nice Day !)
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To: freedomyes

I will pray for their souls. How’s that?


3 posted on 01/02/2010 5:41:09 AM PST by steve8714 (To paraphrase St. Paul; Ain't no harm in havin' a little nip, but don't fall down, bust your lip.)
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To: bravotu
Seem’s it is God That Forgives ,Ultimately, Only GOD Can....

Not at all...you are spreading false Gospel!

Each individual must forgive those "who have trespassed against him" if he wants God's forgiveness.

4 posted on 01/02/2010 5:51:41 AM PST by SonOfDarkSkies (Al Qaeda only hijacked commercial aircraft...Obama hijacked the White House!)
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To: bravotu

A word on forgiveness, and if I may, an outline of praying for the enemy.

There is a very important ingredient concerning those you forgive..the transgressor must first ask for forgiveness.
Repentance must be sought first.

If you just want to forgive for the sake of your own well being, fine, but the person who wronged you must ask for it...then you are bound to forgive them. They’re only human.
Also, for those of you who tend to be hard on yourselves...you must forgive yourselves as well, or Christ won’t forgive you. You’re only human, and when you repent to God He forgives you and blots out the offense...you should too, and realize that honest repentance brings a kind of resurrection, and you may start anew.

God instructed us through Christ Jesus to love your enemy and pray for them.
Understand that your enemy is a child of God too, and He does not wish to kill their souls in hellfire, but He will, and you should pray, for God’s precious sake, That your enemies get some wits about them and begin to follow the right path.

We are warriors for God and he has many enemies.
Don’t go soft on us...loving your enemy sometimes requires correcting your enemy..that takes real love.

God Bless You All.


5 posted on 01/02/2010 6:04:27 AM PST by SentForth5 (Just sayin' is all...)
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To: SentForth5

yes. agreed.

please click:

FORGIVE AND FORGET—NOT

http://truthinconviction.us/weblog.php?id=P3380


6 posted on 01/02/2010 6:27:53 AM PST by freedomyes
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To: freedomyes

In conjunction with this post, please read:

FORGIVE AND FORGET—NOT

http://truthinconviction.us/weblog.php?id=P3380


7 posted on 01/02/2010 6:28:31 AM PST by freedomyes
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To: SentForth5
There is a very important ingredient concerning those you forgive..the transgressor must first ask for forgiveness.

Anger and unforgiveness devours ones heart and soul. Therefore you forgive others/love your enemies for you own sake...so that your soul is not blemished.

I can't recall any place in scripture that forgiveness of others requires their request for it. If you can, please let me know.

On the other hand, reconciling with another person (i.e. putting aside differences for the sake of a relationship) certainly requires contrition...but this isn't a matter of scripture, just good sense.

8 posted on 01/02/2010 6:31:24 AM PST by SonOfDarkSkies (Al Qaeda only hijacked commercial aircraft...Obama hijacked the White House!)
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To: freedomyes
When the foes repent to God and you, then you are to forgive. And I am sure you will when they sincerely repent to God and you. Then, and only then, God bless you for it.

Pure baloney!

If you don't take it on yourself to forgive your enemies, that hatred (that's what it is) will dominate your life.

Is forgiveness the same as forgetting? Of course not.

Is forgiveness something that is easy or quick? Of course not!

If someone murders your family, you can either smolder with anger and have your life ruined by the anger OR you can start the process of purging that anger from your heart.

People are gonna hurt you in life...that's the nature of living. Parents are going to hurt you, friends are going to hurt and your enemies are definitely going to hurt you.

But it is up to you to deal with it and get over living a life wherein all your thoughts are dominated by blame (and that's what unforgiveness is).

God is telling us to "get over it and move on"!!!

God is telling us to focus on Him...not spend our lives nursing our wounds.

9 posted on 01/02/2010 6:39:49 AM PST by SonOfDarkSkies (Al Qaeda only hijacked commercial aircraft...Obama hijacked the White House!)
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To: freedomyes

This can be looked at from a very different perspective than reward and punishment, both Earthly and Heavenly.

To do this, look at the idea of tyrants, victims and suffering. A tyrant is a person who oppresses others, and gains by that oppression. But tyranny is dependent on victims. An important axiom is that a tyrant *cannot* make another person a victim—only they can do that, by seeing themselves as a victim.

A tyrant can injure, be cruel to, oppress, even kill someone, but if they reject victimization, if they shrug it off, if they are indifferent to it, even in being killed, they deny *gain* to the tyrant. And this is where the miraculous happens. Oppressing others who refuse to be victims is exhausting. Resistance radically increases the amount of work and energy the tyrant must use, to the point where they can no longer continue.

This is more so, because tyrants are weak in the first place. They use tyranny to make things easier for them. With resistance, they fold and are undone.

And this brings up the concept of suffering. For most people, suffering in an indulgent art form. If they get a paper cut, instead of just putting on a band-aid, they agonize about the unfairness of paper and the world in general. They focus on why “they are being punished”. They pay far more attention to it than it deserves. Were they instead to just ignore it, it would lose all importance.

Someone once said, if there was just one thing Heaven would wish for people to do, it would be to stop suffering. It is their choice, and it shows a very poor picture of humanity.

And this, in turn, brings up the subjects of sin, reward and punishment. Most people think of sin as just that. If you don’t sin, you will be rewarded. If you do, you will be punished. If not by men, then by Heaven. As such, it just seems to be another form of “luck”, which is also rewarded or withheld by Heaven.

But this is not the only way of looking at it. What we call sin may create its own punishment. For example, if a mother tells her child to not touch a hot stove, it may be a good analogy for sin. If the child obeys, they do not burn their finger. If they disobey, they get burned.

In either case, it was not the mother who rewarded or punished her child. Nor was the hot stove at fault, it just *was*. It was the act of disobedience by the child that resulted in the injury.

So how does all of this relate to an enemy? It means that for your enemy to be a tyrant to you, you must cooperate with them, by being a victim. Unless you do so by just suffering, instead of resisting, all your enemy accomplishes is to exhaust themself.

Their punishment for their “sin” of tyranny is to use themselves up. So by refusing to play along, you do not stand in the way of their punishment. If you suffer and play a victim, you stand in the way of their getting their just desserts.

I do not suggest that this accounts for *all* sins, for indeed, Heaven may, at its discretion, actively punish as well those sins that it finds most repugnant. But this does clear the air of the petty sins of man, the mostly trivial complaints, the paper cuts, that most people focus on to indulgently suffer over.


10 posted on 01/02/2010 6:54:33 AM PST by yefragetuwrabrumuy
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To: SentForth5
This is one of the hardest of Jesus' teachings. We have all sinned and suffered the consequences. That is one thing. But this is another. This is when we are maliciously attacked and harmed, sometimes irreparably, because of doing good. This is enormously difficult to deal with.
Jesus was crucified for the good he did.Yet he prayed for his tormentors asking God to forgive them, “for they know not what they do.” There were those, however, who knew precisely what they were doing, or so it seems. This is the most difficult sin to pray for.

When we are attacked and injured out of malicious intent and not for some injury we have caused, how do we respond? This is the sin that lingers for years. It is the cause of lawsuits, of hatred, of bitterness and of broken dreams. It causes the injured party to live with failure they can not overcome.

How, indeed, do we respond to malicious, undeserved injury? Add to this the additional pain that the injury is caused by a person who is trusted, even loved, and the effects of the sin drive a stake deep into the heart of the aggrieved. This is the sin Jesus spoke about. it is not the injury that is deserved but that which is undeserved He wishes us to pray about.

The hardest part of dealing with undeserved, deliberate injury, for a Christian, is recognizing and accepting one’s personal innocence. We each know that we do not stand before God in innocence, except for Christ allowing us to hide in Him. Yet this is different. This is undeserved, unremitting harmful assault done to us out of sheer malevolence. This is the nature of terrorism. How do we respond to this kind of evil?

It is one thing to forgive those who have sought forgiveness. That is a simple matter. But what about those who revel in the terror they instill? Howe do we respond to them? Jesus is very specific about this. He asks us to pray for them, He admonishes us not to return evil for evil. He ask His Father to forgive them knowing that they can only be forgiven by God if they seek His forgiveness.

We respond as Christians to those who injure us by “eating the sin.” We pray not only for God to touch the aggravator, we also pray that He will lift us above the torment of our attacker and not allow us to torment in return. This means allowing the world to win in order for Christ to have the final victory. Martyrdom is made of this kind of stuff.

11 posted on 01/02/2010 7:07:43 AM PST by Louis Foxwell (He is the son of soulless slavers, not the son of soulful slaves.)
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To: Amos the Prophet; yefragetuwrabrumuy

To both of you...BEAUTIFULLY PUT!!! (and healing, too)!


12 posted on 01/02/2010 7:21:22 AM PST by SonOfDarkSkies (Al Qaeda only hijacked commercial aircraft...Obama hijacked the White House!)
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To: freedomyes

“Father, forgive them for they do not know what they are doing.”

This is a tough one. I will not participate in any attempt by a government to take freedoms away from my family.

I’ll pass.


13 posted on 01/02/2010 7:27:03 AM PST by gathersnomoss (General George Patton had it right.)
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To: gathersnomoss

Did the people who put Jesus on the Cross really know who he was?. That might be why he asked for them to be forgiven.


14 posted on 01/02/2010 8:05:50 AM PST by seemoAR (If you can't dazzle them with brilliance, dazzle them with bull.)
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To: gathersnomoss

this demonic obama shadow govt knows exactly what it is doing. it is demonizing america.

they need to be disciplined, not forgiven.

God will see to it that the judgment of condemnation comes upon every one of them.

may God intervene for the sake of his righteous remnant.

thanks by the way for your response.


15 posted on 01/02/2010 9:23:09 AM PST by freedomyes
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To: seemoAR

makes sense


16 posted on 01/02/2010 9:23:27 AM PST by freedomyes
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To: Amos the Prophet
This is so childish. Don't you understand that evil depends on you turning the other cheek a thousand or a million times? God does not bless people who have unending tolerance for the intolerable. There was only one perfect martyr and he is not you. Allowing yourself and your family to be destroyed is not a plan..it's insane.

It is impossible to forgive an assault that continues over and over without end. You can pray for the person...but the forgiveness has to come from the almighty. Jesus didn't say he forgave his enemies who put him on the Cross...he asked God to do it. No one ever said if he did or not.

17 posted on 01/02/2010 9:37:01 AM PST by Earthdweller (Harvard won the election again...so what's the problem.......?)
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To: Earthdweller

You not only did not read my post with any understanding, you insulted me. Apologize or get reported.


18 posted on 01/02/2010 11:52:54 AM PST by Louis Foxwell (He is the son of soulless slavers, not the son of soulful slaves.)
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To: Amos the Prophet
I don't see where you are insulted, it's the ideas that are the sin. Asking people to allow terrorism to thrive while innocent people are killed and families are destroyed is not a solution, it's surrender to your attackers.

You have two hands and a brain that that God gave you to survive, use them or be devoured. The enemy does not play nice. People have every right to defend themselves and attack evil.

19 posted on 01/02/2010 2:32:42 PM PST by Earthdweller (Harvard won the election again...so what's the problem.......?)
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To: Earthdweller

G.Campbell Morgan has a statement Like:

‘God formed Trees and metal and created Man with hands and a Brain.Man formed a cross and nails and hung God from It.’

Can any of Us Comprehend the Goodness of God or the Depravity of Man?


20 posted on 01/03/2010 6:46:51 AM PST by bravotu (Have a Nice Day !)
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To: SonOfDarkSkies

False
Gospel???

I am Just a Man,

G.Campbell Morgan has a statement Like:

‘God formed Trees and metal and created Man with hands and a Brain.Man formed a cross and nails and hung God from It.’

Can any of Us Comprehend the Goodness of God or the Depravity of Man?


21 posted on 01/03/2010 6:50:47 AM PST by bravotu (Have a Nice Day !)
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To: SonOfDarkSkies

This Guy Is OK!

DON’T TRY TO FIGURE GOD OUT
January 3, 2010 by zenithmax
J. Grant Swank, Jr.

When you do try to figure God out, you play God. Don’t.

All God asks of you is to trust and obey. Remember that old-time hymn? “Trust and obey for there’s no other way to be happy in Jesus but to trust and obey.”

That’s it—start to finish.

The Bible tells us that God’s ways and thoughts are far above ours. Therefore, stay out of deciphering God’s ways and thoughts and let God be God.

Just trust and obey God in the moment.


22 posted on 01/03/2010 6:58:12 AM PST by bravotu (Have a Nice Day !)
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To: bravotu
Trust and obey...but who are you to say that I’m not doing just that? I’m God’s sheep...not yours. I say God does not want us to be slaughtered like a piece of meat...he already did that for us.
23 posted on 01/03/2010 7:12:42 AM PST by Earthdweller (Harvard won the election again...so what's the problem.......?)
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To: bravotu
If I understand you correctly, you were saying that it is not a man's place to forgive his enemies.

That is against the teachings of God.

Yes, only God can forgive a man's sins, but only you and I can erase the enmity we hold in our hearts against another of God's children.

And to approach God to ask forgiveness of our sins as we do all day long, we must first forgive our fellow man. We can only ask for God's forgiveness once we have repented of our sins (and that includes forgiving those who have "sinned" against us).

Mat 6:14
For if ye forgive men their trespasses [against you], your heavenly Father will also forgive you:
Mat 6:15
But if ye forgive not men their trespasses, neither will your Father forgive your trespasses.

If you are spreading a Gospel that teaches that a person does not have to forgive his enemies, then yes, you are spreading a false Gospel.

24 posted on 01/03/2010 7:19:27 AM PST by SonOfDarkSkies (Al Qaeda only hijacked commercial aircraft...Obama hijacked the White House!)
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To: Earthdweller

Between You and Sonofdarkskies...
I ain’t Sayin’ nuttin bout Nobody cept Me !
I do not Know Where Yall comeing From But I Can’t Take this Wimpy Christian, Turn the Other Cheek Junk.
Jesus Rebuked The Religeous Rulers To Thier Face !
He Ran The Money Changers From the Temple,
He Live As A Lamb BUT He Is Returning as King of Kings!
The Lion Of Judah !
Our Founding Fathers Stood Up For this Nation and I Blame Our Current PulPits For Wimpying Out and Not Preaching ‘The Gospel’.
Maybe Your Right,I Say Plenty !!
Judge Not as The Hypocrite,But Judge Rightly with Righteous Judgement!


25 posted on 01/03/2010 6:13:03 PM PST by bravotu (Have a Nice Day !)
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To: SonOfDarkSkies

Between You and Sonofdarkskies...
I ain’t Sayin’ nuttin bout Nobody cept Me !
I do not Know Where Yall comeing From But I Can’t Take this Wimpy Christian, Turn the Other Cheek Junk.
Jesus Rebuked The Religeous Rulers To Thier Face !
He Ran The Money Changers From the Temple,
He Live As A Lamb BUT He Is Returning as King of Kings!
The Lion Of Judah !
Our Founding Fathers Stood Up For this Nation and I Blame Our Current PulPits For Wimpying Out and Not Preaching ‘The Gospel’.
Maybe Your Right,I Say Plenty !!
Judge Not as The Hypocrite,But Judge Rightly with Righteous Judgement!


26 posted on 01/03/2010 6:13:36 PM PST by bravotu (Have a Nice Day !)
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To: SonOfDarkSkies

Heap Burning Coals On Your Enimies Head , Fred!


27 posted on 01/03/2010 6:19:48 PM PST by bravotu (Have a Nice Day !)
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To: Earthdweller
You are right, and I never thought of it that way, Jesus did not forgive them, he ask the Father too...Thank you for that bit of insight...

I have said that we do not have the power to forgive the pain that is inflicted on another...Only the pain inflicted on oneself...in other words, if my child is deliberately injured, only my child has the power to forgive that injury. As their parent I do not have that power..I do not have to forgive as the damage was not done to me...I can only forgive the damage done to me, I can hold against the one that injured my child no forgiveness to the pain of the child. Only to the pain of myself...I will give no forgiveness to the one that injured. I do not have that power....

Don't know if I am making myself clear or not...Forgiveness does not belong to everyone..God can forgive those he chooses to and not forgive those he chooses not to.....His choice.

28 posted on 01/03/2010 6:49:55 PM PST by goat granny
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To: bravotu
You are missing the point of the Gospel. And it sounds like you are mixing religion with alcohol (not exactly uncommon for any of us).

As has been said upthread, Faith in Jesus/Yeshuah is not for the faint of heart or the cowardly.

You are called to live in Jesus/Yeshuah's example, to let His Spirit come into you and live in you...and he was never wimpy. But his method of warfare does not involve hatred of his enemies.

A person can fight without a heart filled with hatred. If your fight is energized by hatred, you won't go far.

On the other hand, if your fight is energized by His Spirit, while it won't be necessarily be fun, you will be victorious (and there is great satisfaction in fighting as He commands)

If you think those of us who try to live as he commands are choosing a wimpy way of life...you haven't tried it yet.

Martyrdom (that's what he calls us to) is not for cowards. He calls you and all of us to lay down our lives for Him. He calls us to give up our rights to ourselves and that involves our emotions (such as hatred and blame).

Dying to Him is probably the most frightening thing in life (except not dying for Him).

You sound like someone who knows all the right words but is standing on the brink of absolute conversion (of course, I might be wrong and ask your forgiveness if I am).

That said, if I can be of assistance (I am only a humble servant of Him)...please let me know.

29 posted on 01/03/2010 7:03:44 PM PST by SonOfDarkSkies (Al Qaeda only hijacked commercial aircraft...Obama hijacked the White House!)
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To: bravotu; SonOfDarkSkies

OUR FATHER IN HEAVEN . . .

FORGIVE US OUR SINS,

AS

WE FORGIVE THOSE WHO SIN AGAINST US.

#############

Jesus The Christ linked the two very crucially with eternal life implications.

I’ve never found it fruitful to argue with Jesus.


30 posted on 01/03/2010 8:04:03 PM PST by Quix (POL Ldrs quotes fm1900 TRAITORS http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/religion/2130557/posts?page=81#81)
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To: steve8714

How’s that?

In Biblical terms, from Christ’s own instructions on how to pray . . . as well as other verses . . .

INSUFFICIENT.

We can CHOOSE to forgive. It is a decision.

We can ASK GOD TO MAKE THE EMOTION AND HEART LEVEL REALITY DIFFERENT AND TO CONFORM TO HIS LOVE, GRACE AND MERCY.

WE CAN AND MUST FORGIVE

AS

WE WANT TO BE FORGIVEN.

NONE OF US can bear the penalty for the least of our sins.

Maybe we have to confess forgiveness every time a memory comes up. Maybe we have to pray God’s blessing on them every time a memory comes up. Maybe we have to ask God to change our heart and our emotions about it every time a memory comes up.

Persistence in such WILL RESULT IN CHANGE. God is faithful.

OR

We can refuse and bear the consequences in our bodies, in our relationships, in our spiritual health. Unforgiveness is literally tied to all manner of serious health issues.

See

A MORE EXCELLENT WAY

by Henry Wright.

Unforgiveness turns out to be for the forgiver much more than the forgiven.

USUALLY, forgiving someone means God will have freer reign in dealing with their crud much sooner and much more forcefully. Somehow, it’s as though there’s a spiritual law that God won’t cross near as often or as soon or as much as long as we are unforgiving toward someone. It’s as though He lets our censure of them suffice for His punishment.

We forgive them, then He is freer to deal with them much more forcefully.


31 posted on 01/03/2010 8:08:27 PM PST by Quix (POL Ldrs quotes fm1900 TRAITORS http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/religion/2130557/posts?page=81#81)
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To: Quix

Funny ,
King David did not Forgive The Giant Before He Cut His Throat.

The Money Changers??? Chased with a WHIP????

Saducees and the Others, Jesus called Them WHAT?

Whited TOMBS?

I Read This Bible in its Entireity,
and it tells Me of the Goodness And Severity of GOD!
I Like What You Guys are Saying But GET Mad ,SAINTS!
Time is to Short,to Tolerate All This ‘Ungodliness’
If You ain’t Part of the Solution,You The Problem!


32 posted on 01/03/2010 8:21:14 PM PST by bravotu (Have a Nice Day !)
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To: SentForth5

Sounds logical.

I don’t find that instruction Biblical.

God commands us to forgive all regardless of whether they ask for it, or not.

FORGIVE US OUR SINS, LORD,

!!!AS!!!!

WE FORGIVE THOSE WHO SIN AGAINST US.

###

Matthew 6:14
“For if you forgive men their trespasses, your heavenly Father will also forgive you.

2.Matthew 6:14
“For if you forgive men their trespasses, your heavenly Father will also forgive you.
Matthew 6:13-15 (in Context) Matthew 6 (Whole Chapter)
3.Matthew 6:15
But if you do not forgive men their trespasses, neither will your Father forgive your trespasses.

Matthew 18:20-22 (New King James Version)
20 For where two or three are gathered together in My name, I am there in the midst of them.”

The Parable of the Unforgiving Servant

21 Then Peter came to Him and said, “Lord, how often shall my brother sin against me, and I forgive him? Up to seven times?”
22 Jesus said to him, “I do not say to you, up to seven times, but up to seventy times seven

Matthew 18:35
“So My heavenly Father also will do to you if each of you, from his heart, does not forgive his brother his trespasses.”

Mark 11:25
[ Forgiveness and Prayer ] “And whenever you stand praying, if you have anything against anyone, forgive him, that your Father in heaven may also forgive you your trespasses.

Luke 6:37
[ Do Not Judge ] “Judge not, and you shall not be judged. Condemn not, and you shall not be condemned. Forgive, and you will be forgiven.

Luke 7:47
Therefore I say to you, her sins, which are many, are forgiven, for she loved much. But to whom little is forgiven, the same loves little.”

QUIX: IN MY EXPERIENCE, those who have the hardest time forgiving still have an unrealistic understanding of their own sinfulness, wretchedness.

Luke 11:4
And forgive us our sins, For we also forgive everyone who is indebted to us. And do not lead us into temptation, But deliver us from the evil one.”

)
34.Luke 17:3
Take heed to yourselves. If your brother sins against you, rebuke him; and if he repents, forgive him.

Luke 17:4
And if he sins against you seven times in a day, and seven times in a day returns to you, saying, ‘I repent,’ you shall forgive him.”

)
37.John 20:23
If you forgive the sins of any, they are forgiven them; if you retain the sins of any, they are retained.”

2 Corinthians 2:2-4 (New King James Version)
2 For if I make you sorrowful, then who is he who makes me glad but the one who is made sorrowful by me?

Forgive the Offender

3 And I wrote this very thing to you, lest, when I came, I should have sorrow over those from whom I ought to have joy, having confidence in you all that my joy is the joy of you all. 4 For out of much affliction and anguish of heart I wrote to you, with many tears, not that you should be grieved, but that you might know the love which I have so abundantly for you.

2 Corinthians 2:7
so that, on the contrary, you ought rather to forgive and comfort him, lest perhaps such a one be swallowed up with too much sorrow.

2 Corinthians 2:10
Now whom you forgive anything, I also forgive. For if indeed I have forgiven anything, I have forgiven that one for your sakes in the presence of Christ,


33 posted on 01/03/2010 8:22:05 PM PST by Quix (POL Ldrs quotes fm1900 TRAITORS http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/religion/2130557/posts?page=81#81)
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To: freedomyes

I disagree.

The Scriptures I listed above demonstrate to me that God expects me to forgive,

REGARDLESS.

Sure, I should work for repentance. However, that’s mostly FIRST between God and the person. Only Holy Spirit can work in them repentance.

In any case, I forgive immediately.

And when I pray the Lord’s Prayer, I pray . . .

“Forgive me my sins as I forgive those who sin against me. Father, I forgive all—everything. I repent of having anything against anyone. I repent of any unfitting judgment.” And if God reminds me of any issue, I forgive it specifically immediately—REGARDLESS.

That frees me spiritually. That blesses me spiritually.

It also looses the other person for God to deal with them more intensely directly.


34 posted on 01/03/2010 8:26:57 PM PST by Quix (POL Ldrs quotes fm1900 TRAITORS http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/religion/2130557/posts?page=81#81)
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To: SonOfDarkSkies

Anger and unforgiveness devours ones heart and soul. Therefore you forgive others/love your enemies for you own sake...so that your soul is not blemished.

###

ABSOLUTELY.


35 posted on 01/03/2010 8:27:44 PM PST by Quix (POL Ldrs quotes fm1900 TRAITORS http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/religion/2130557/posts?page=81#81)
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To: SonOfDarkSkies

ABSOLUTELY TRUE:

###

If you don’t take it on yourself to forgive your enemies, that hatred (that’s what it is) will dominate your life.

Is forgiveness the same as forgetting? Of course not.

Is forgiveness something that is easy or quick? Of course not!

If someone murders your family, you can either smolder with anger and have your life ruined by the anger OR you can start the process of purging that anger from your heart.

People are gonna hurt you in life...that’s the nature of living. Parents are going to hurt you, friends are going to hurt and your enemies are definitely going to hurt you.

But it is up to you to deal with it and get over living a life wherein all your thoughts are dominated by blame (and that’s what unforgiveness is).

God is telling us to “get over it and move on”!!!

God is telling us to focus on Him...not spend our lives nursing our wounds.


36 posted on 01/03/2010 8:28:53 PM PST by Quix (POL Ldrs quotes fm1900 TRAITORS http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/religion/2130557/posts?page=81#81)
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To: yefragetuwrabrumuy

Their punishment for their “sin” of tyranny is to use themselves up. So by refusing to play along, you do not stand in the way of their punishment. If you suffer and play a victim, you stand in the way of their getting their just desserts.

####

I beleive there’s a very true spiritual principle involved as you outline it.


37 posted on 01/03/2010 8:30:41 PM PST by Quix (POL Ldrs quotes fm1900 TRAITORS http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/religion/2130557/posts?page=81#81)
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To: Amos the Prophet

INDEED:

###

esus was crucified for the good he did.Yet he prayed for his tormentors asking God to forgive them, “for they know not what they do.” There were those, however, who knew precisely what they were doing, or so it seems. This is the most difficult sin to pray for

. . .

We respond as Christians to those who injure us by “eating the sin.” We pray not only for God to touch the aggravator, we also pray that He will lift us above the torment of our attacker and not allow us to torment in return. This means allowing the world to win in order for Christ to have the final victory. Martyrdom is made of this kind of stuff.

###########

ABSOLUTELY.

I think folks fail to realize that when we judge someone else’s sins as too horrible for OUR forgiveness, we are judging ourselves to be GREATLY MORE RIGHTEOUS than the other person.

That PRIDE is eternally poisonous.

We are also failing to realize that our own . . . cruc . . . is equal to anyone else’s crud.

or

We are failing to realize that given THEIR genetics, their parenting, their conditioning, their circumstances . . .

WE MIGHT HAVE DONE WORSE quite easily.

God will not tolerate that PRIDE in Heaven. We must forsake it here. We MUST CHOOSE

TO FORGIVE—REGARDLESS.

I believe that CHRIST FORGAVE ON THE CROSS THOSE WHO KNEW AND THOSE WHO DID NOT KNOW WHAT THEY WERE DOING.

Now, certainly to appropriate His Eternal life, individuals must confess, repent, etc. That’s a different issue.

WE AS FOLLOWERS OF CHRIST MUST FORGIVE AS WE WANT TO BE FORGIVEN. I WANT TO BE FORGIVEN TOTALLY REGARDLESS.

I CHOOSE TO FORGIVE TOTALLY, REGARDLESS.


38 posted on 01/03/2010 8:36:13 PM PST by Quix (POL Ldrs quotes fm1900 TRAITORS http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/religion/2130557/posts?page=81#81)
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To: gathersnomoss

FORGIVENESS

does NOT necessarily have anything to do with removing God’s nor government’s punishment.

A family that forgives the murderer of their father still recognizes that it’s fitting for the murderer to be executed even when their forgiveness has introduced him to Salvation in Christ.

GOD IS IN CHARGE OF PUNISHMENT.

WE ARE NOT PROSECUTOR, JUDGE AND JURY. GOD IS.


39 posted on 01/03/2010 8:38:04 PM PST by Quix (POL Ldrs quotes fm1900 TRAITORS http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/religion/2130557/posts?page=81#81)
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To: freedomyes

I forgive the traitorous destroyer from hell frequently.

I also ask God to cause him to fall into the pit he has dug for the rest of us.

I forgive to keep my soul, my heart clear.


40 posted on 01/03/2010 8:39:08 PM PST by Quix (POL Ldrs quotes fm1900 TRAITORS http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/religion/2130557/posts?page=81#81)
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To: Earthdweller

I

KNOW

FROM VERY HARD PERSONAL EXPERIENCE,

IT IS NOT

impossible to forgive the same offense over and over and over.

There is a time when God may require me to stand up to the offense, prevent the offense or even punish the offense.

THAT’S DIFFERENT AND DOES NOT NECESSARILY HAVE ANYTHING TO DO WITH MY HEART AND SPIRIT AND WILL TO CHOOSE FORGIVENESS.

FORGIVENESS IS MY DUTY TO MY GOD WHO HAS FORGIVEN ME SO MUCH.


41 posted on 01/03/2010 8:40:46 PM PST by Quix (POL Ldrs quotes fm1900 TRAITORS http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/religion/2130557/posts?page=81#81)
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To: Amos the Prophet

It was a small offense, Amos.

Scripture instructs that there’s a time to hold to account and a time to let it go.

I believe that one is fitting to let it go, regardless.


42 posted on 01/03/2010 8:42:04 PM PST by Quix (POL Ldrs quotes fm1900 TRAITORS http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/religion/2130557/posts?page=81#81)
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To: Earthdweller

FORGIVENESS

HAS NOTHING TO DO

with allowing evil to thrive.

FORGIVENESS is about my humility, my forgiveness, resisting my pride

AND RESIGNING FROM BEING PROSECUTOR, JUDGE AND JURY AND INSISTING THAT GOD BE IN ALL THOSE ROLES VS ME PLAYING GOD.


43 posted on 01/03/2010 8:43:12 PM PST by Quix (POL Ldrs quotes fm1900 TRAITORS http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/religion/2130557/posts?page=81#81)
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To: bravotu

WELL PUT.


44 posted on 01/03/2010 8:43:48 PM PST by Quix (POL Ldrs quotes fm1900 TRAITORS http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/religion/2130557/posts?page=81#81)
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To: bravotu

WELL PUT:

###

All God asks of you is to trust and obey. Remember that old-time hymn? “Trust and obey for there’s no other way to be happy in Jesus but to trust and obey.”

That’s it—start to finish.

The Bible tells us that God’s ways and thoughts are far above ours. Therefore, stay out of deciphering God’s ways and thoughts and let God be God.

Just trust and obey God in the moment.


45 posted on 01/03/2010 8:44:51 PM PST by Quix (POL Ldrs quotes fm1900 TRAITORS http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/religion/2130557/posts?page=81#81)
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To: bravotu

FORGIVENESS

IS ANYTHING BUT WIMPY.

HOLY SPIRIT alone can give us the specific instructions and wisdom for when to turn the other cheek and when to stand up firmly and fiercely to evil.

HE REQUIRES THAT WE BE WILLING TO DO EITHER AND WHATEVER HE INSTRUCTS IN BETWEEN.


46 posted on 01/03/2010 8:46:34 PM PST by Quix (POL Ldrs quotes fm1900 TRAITORS http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/religion/2130557/posts?page=81#81)
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To: goat granny

Nevertheless,

HE REQUIRES US

to FORGIVE REGARDLESS—24/7.


47 posted on 01/03/2010 8:47:30 PM PST by Quix (POL Ldrs quotes fm1900 TRAITORS http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/religion/2130557/posts?page=81#81)
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To: SonOfDarkSkies

INDEED:

######

As has been said upthread, Faith in Jesus/Yeshuah is not for the faint of heart or the cowardly.

You are called to live in Jesus/Yeshuah’s example, to let His Spirit come into you and live in you...and he was never wimpy. But his method of warfare does not involve hatred of his enemies.

A person can fight without a heart filled with hatred. If your fight is energized by hatred, you won’t go far.

On the other hand, if your fight is energized by His Spirit, while it won’t be necessarily be fun, you will be victorious (and there is great satisfaction in fighting as He commands)

If you think those of us who try to live as he commands are choosing a wimpy way of life...you haven’t tried it yet.

Martyrdom (that’s what he calls us to) is not for cowards. He calls you and all of us to lay down our lives for Him. He calls us to give up our rights to ourselves and that involves our emotions (such as hatred and blame).

Dying to Him is probably the most frightening thing in life (except not dying for Him).

You sound like someone who knows all the right words but is standing on the brink of absolute conversion (of course, I might be wrong and ask your forgiveness if I am).

That said, if I can be of assistance (I am only a humble servant of Him)...please let me know.


48 posted on 01/03/2010 8:48:32 PM PST by Quix (POL Ldrs quotes fm1900 TRAITORS http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/religion/2130557/posts?page=81#81)
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To: bravotu

You don’t KNOW that David did not forgive Goliath. Scripture doesn’t say one way or the other.

None of your other examples preclude forgiveness at all.

Lots of things are plausible.

The Scriptures I cited above insure clearly that GOD’S ATTITUDE TOWARD US IS THAT WE MUST BE FORGIVING REGARDLESS, IF WE WANT FORGIVEN, REGARDLESS . . . OR EVEN . . . IF WE WANT FORGIVEN AT ALL.


49 posted on 01/03/2010 8:50:18 PM PST by Quix (POL Ldrs quotes fm1900 TRAITORS http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/religion/2130557/posts?page=81#81)
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To: Quix
He may require you to forgive injury done to another, but I don't find that any place in scripture...forgive what you do me, yes.......anyone that thinks they are required to forgive damage done to another is taking it upon themselves a act arrogantly. As if I had to power or required to forgive someone that did great harm to you....I say No I am not required nor have the power to do that..Only you have that power and are required to forgive if asked...

If I take it upon myself to forgive anothers damage I am acting outside of what is required...

50 posted on 01/03/2010 9:02:52 PM PST by goat granny
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