Posted on 01/02/2010 5:26:21 AM PST by freedomyes
BTW, as a practical matter, MOST of the people who "sin" against you are not going to repent.
In fact, in many cases, such people will either not be aware of what they have done to you or will be of a different opinion as to events. If forgiveness REQUIRES repentance, humans beings would be overflowing with anger toward their fellow man.
It takes a small man to walk around with a heart full of unforgiven anger over past slights against himself...a very small man!
And to add insult to injury, how can a man approach God and ask for forgiveness when his heart is full of hatred toward his fellow man.
Sorry...but you are dead wrong on the subject of forgiveness.
In fact, you are the only Christian I have ever encountered who argued as you have about non-forgiveness.
I AGREE WHOLESALE.
And again . . . I’ve NEVER seen unforgiveness
WITHOUT BITTERNESS.
And the longer the unforgiveness, the worse the bitterness.
And bitterness is seriously implicated in solid research about arthritis and a list of other diseases.
But I also cannot harbor ill will toward them, that is not the same a forgiveness...To harbor ill will leads to bitterness and its called bitterness because because if you have really experienced it, it is bitter...That type of ill will wishes evil to the one that sinned against us.
To pray for someone that harms us or our loved one's relieves us of hatred, even if we have to pray for them each time during the day that anger may arise...That is done for our own benefit, and if our prayer is heard, it may benefit the one we pray for. That is not the same as saying I forgive you....
You are right, anger can be a great motivator and it can move us to righteous action..
;-)
I appreciate your clarification of your views.
I pray, that
IF
there is anything from my perspective on forgiveness
that God Himself would wish you to understand and own as your own
that HE HIMSELF WILL MAKE SUCH UTTERLY CLEAR TO YOU in the easiest, clearest, most comfortable way possible.
Blessings,
I appreciate your concern for my belief on forgiveness, but I believe God has made it clear to me on forgiveness, it may not be the same as yours, but that does not make you right and me wrong..Blessing to you also....
Repentance requires a change of heart and a request.
I am sorry, but it is just common sense to me. As I said in my post, if it makes you feel better forgiving those who could care less; for your sake of mind, fine.
I don’t claim to know 100% of the thorough-going absolute comprehensive Truth about much of anything—even of myself.
God has shown me more about forgiveness than a lot of other things. Yet, I still feel I’m in kindergarten.
Blessings,
Yeah, I agree that authentic, life changing, Salvific repentance requires a change of heart and seeking God’s forgiveness, cleansing, changing etc.
I find nothing in Scripture that says I MUST, OUGHT TO, SHOULD wait to forgive until I have all that signed, sealed and notorized . . . or even mentioned.
MANY Scriptures indicate quite otherwise as I’ve quoted above.
Folks on your side have offered nothing convincing Scripture-wise to counter that list of Scriptures indicating that God would have us FORGIVE regardless, routinely—at least as often as we pray . . .
OUR FATHER, WHO ART IN HEAVEN . . .
Which words in those Scriptures are not easy to understand?
“Common sense” can be a nice tid bit of confirmation of something . . . to a point.
I’ve never considered it absolutely reliable foundation in the least in determining comprehensive Biblical Truth.
I think we are called Children of God because we are all in kindergarten. We don’t really really grow up, just grow old.. :O( or :O) depending on how we feel about it..:O)
Plenty of truth to that.
Thx.
Killin’ Me ,Guys....
Bible, Does it Not Say?
Be Ye Angry And Sin NOT!
Self Pity ?
I am Pissed at Cowards Hideing Behind an Effeminate god.
Back to Your gay Parade.
Are You Crazy?!?
[I can forgive the Japanese for Pearl Harbor.]
Who are You To Forgive Them????
Do You understand that The Nation You Will Leave to Your Kids Will Not Tolerate Christianity .???
You Guys are To simple for Words.
We shall see who’s perspective is closest to
THE HEART OF GOD ALMIGHTY.
He happens to trump everyone and everything.
The Muslims will be eradicated from the earth.
Were the words in the Scriptures I posted above difficult? I didn’t think so.
I’ll take their perspective on God’s priorities and God’s heart in the matter over everyone else’s singly or all together.
Who said anything about being wimpy. Forgiveness is one of the strongest and fiercest things there is.
It also tends to loose God’s judgment much more fiercely on the forgiven if they are not in Right Standing with Him . . . and fierce consequences may still accrue even if they are.
Seems to me some folks have a wimpy relationship with Scripture or a wimpy relationship with God or they’d demonstrate more understanding of forgiveness and God’s attitude about it.
ExPlain This ,Please...
[I can forgive the Japanese for Pearl Harbor.]
You Live in a Place That is not Real.
I appreciate Your intentions but, In This Place and Time , We are Faceing ‘Suicide Bombers’ that Use Kids.
Leadership that is out to ‘Change’ Our Scripture Based Nation.
We Cannot Afford Your Form Of Religion and Expect to Survive as a Nation!
However, I believe you are spiritually quite wrong. And, that that error could have very dangerous implications for you, family and even in some contexts, our Nation.
Let's look at Mark 11:25: And when you stand praying, IF YOU HOLD ANYTHING
AGAINST ANYONE [NO HINT of only those who have repented],
FORGIVE HIM not qualified forgiveness--FORGIVE HIM!
[NO HINT OF GRABBING HIM BY THE THROAT AND EXTRACTING REPENTANCE FIRST.]
SO THAT your Father in heaven may forgive ***you*** your sins."
IT IS AN ISSUE OF TRUSTING GOD.
In my experience as well as my understanding of Scripture, if I want to be sure that God deals decisively with Japan as well as protects me from Japan, then I must deal in a Godly way with Japan. If I want to be sure that God quickly punishes Japan for some evil Japan has done, I must forgive Japan speedily. That's simply how God works.
Throughout the Old Testament, God REQUIRED the children of Israel to TRUST HIM against all odds, when that trust seemed to be most foolhardy. At the Red Sea with Pharoah and his army behind them.
At one point, at the prophet's prayers/instructions, God struck an attacking army blind. They led them into the camp of the Syrians or some such, IIRC. The soldiers asked on their regaining their sight, if they should all be killed. The prophet insisted absolutely not. Feed them and treat them well. You did nothing to capture them. Feed them and send them home. They did. They had no further trouble from them the rest of that king's reign.
In situation after situation, God required some seemingly silly thing to win the battle. How about marching around Jerico singing and playing instruments? How about REDUCING one's army to 300 against a massively larger army? How about the angelic army in chariots of fire encamped around about the prophet?
God's ways are not our ways.
HOWEVER, I WILL SAY THIS--Christ came first as a suffering servant, Lamb of God. Next He is coming as conquering King of Kings and Lord of Lords, the LION OF JUDAH IN ALL HIS FIERCENESS.
Certainly I would not hesitate to dispatch with great prejudice and firepower any enemy force threatening my loved ones. However, I'd also hope I could hear God clearly enough to do strictly WHATEVER HE ORDERED in any situation. HIS WAYS ARE ALWAYS CORRECT REGARDLESS OF HOW IMPOSSIBLE THEY SEEM.
The oligarchy is setting up Islam and Christianity to destroy each other to enable the establishment of a satanic world government requiring those left to worship satan all the easier.
God has a number of surprises in store for everyone and particularly for the oligarchy and for Islam. Islam WILL BE WIPED OFF THE GLOBE. Even the memory of it will be erased.
Yes, Americans need to wake up and be wise instead of foolish about Islam. CERTAINLY. Suicidal idiocies in D.C. are treasonous.
However, there is NO GREATER WISDOM, NO GREATER SECURITY AND NO GREATER FIERCENESS AND POWER than forgiveness in the Love and power of God's Holy Spirit and Christ's Blood.
NONE.
I am totally 100% convinced that there will be children younger than 8 years old who will in the not too distant future command that the earth swallow up generals and their entire army with a single spoken sentence. And it will be done. Those same children will walk in incredible forgiveness and even love of their enemies.
They will still likely command God's angelic armies to kill massive numbers of enemy soldiers at their word. And God will affirm the order to His angel armies.
God's economy is different. And, HE'S BOSS.
Either we do it His way and come out on top far more than possible any other way . . . or we don't and risk the consequences of rebellion.
Rebellion DOES NOT WIN battles of any kind.
This Nation will not survive as it has been in recent decades . . .
putting money before God;
putting sex before God;
putting pleasure before God;
putting politics before God;
putting corruption before God;
putting glorified sin in the media before God;
putting perversion before God in the media and in the schools;
The meek—humble and contrite before God—not wimpy—WILL INHERIT THE EARTH AND THE USA.
Yes, we don’t know what that Scripture THE RIGHTEOUS SHALL TAKE IT BY FORCE really means or has to do with. There’s some truth there that God must plan to make clearer as we go along. However, THE WEAPONS OF OUR WARFARE ARE NOT CARNAL . . . AGAINST PRINCIPALITIES IN HEAVENLY PLACES . . . TO THE PULLING DOWN OF STRONG HOLDS . . .
Guns etc. don’t work very well against fallen angels.
Prayer and the Name and Blood of Jesus do.
The righteous remnant will inherit a very changed USA. The old USA will never be again. However, God set this Nation up and I do not believe He’s going to abandon it totally to the enemy.
He will discipline us and take us to our knees for our National rebellions against Him. He will not totally destroy the USA, imho.
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