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Is this the first ever portrait of Jesus?
Daily Mail ^ | 3 Apr 2011 | Nick Pryer

Posted on 04/03/2011 10:23:10 AM PDT by mandaladon

The incredible story of 70 ancient books hidden in a cave for nearly 2,000 years

The image is eerily familiar: a bearded young man with flowing curly hair. After lying for nearly 2,000 years hidden in a cave in the Holy Land, the fine detail is difficult to determine. But in a certain light it is not difficult to interpret the marks around the figure’s brow as a crown of thorns.

The extraordinary picture of one of the recently discovered hoard of up to 70 lead codices – booklets – found in a cave in the hills overlooking the Sea of Galilee is one reason Bible historians are clamouring to get their hands on the ancient artefacts.

If genuine, this could be the first-ever portrait of Jesus Christ, possibly even created in the lifetime of those who knew him. The tiny booklet, a little smaller than a modern credit card, is sealed on all sides and has a three-dimensional representation of a human head on both the front and the back. One appears to have a beard and the other is without. Even the maker’s fingerprint can be seen in the lead impression. Beneath both figures is a line of as-yet undeciphered text in an ancient Hebrew script.

Astonishingly, one of the booklets appears to bear the words ‘Saviour of Israel’ – one of the few phrases so far translated.

Photobucket

(Excerpt) Read more at dailymail.co.uk ...


TOPICS:
KEYWORDS: april2011; codices; fakes; godsgravesglyphs; jesus; jordan; leadcodices; littlebooks; religion
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Fascinating story !!!
1 posted on 04/03/2011 10:23:13 AM PDT by mandaladon
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To: mandaladon

It’s been proven a fake.


2 posted on 04/03/2011 10:30:15 AM PDT by SonOfDarkSkies
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To: mandaladon
The image is eerily familiar: a bearded young man with flowing curly hair...

Yes, I suppose one could.
I just as easily see an unkempt hippie from the Haight-Ashbury after a bad night.

I just hope this statement doesn't trigger mass killings worldwide...

< /sarc >

3 posted on 04/03/2011 10:32:39 AM PDT by Publius6961 (There has Never been a "Tax On The Rich" that has not reached the middle class)
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To: mandaladon
Here's a link to the "fake" conclusion...LINK.
4 posted on 04/03/2011 10:33:49 AM PDT by SonOfDarkSkies
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To: mandaladon

You sure that ain’t Ronald McDonald?


5 posted on 04/03/2011 10:34:27 AM PDT by bigheadfred (Beat me, Bite me...Make Me Write Bad Checks)
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To: SonOfDarkSkies
It’s been proven a fake.

Actually, it's been proven as debris from a flying saucer crash from around April 1, 134 A.D.

6 posted on 04/03/2011 10:35:16 AM PDT by Publius6961 (There has Never been a "Tax On The Rich" that has not reached the middle class)
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To: mandaladon

“extremist Zealot sect”

Man. The zealots were proved 100% correct, the Romans killed millions in Jerusalem, and 2000 years later the Daily Mail is calling them “extreme”.

It was the Romans who killed the millions Daily Mail.

But the people who opposed them were “extreme”.

Just goes to show, YOU *****MUST***** WIN.


7 posted on 04/03/2011 10:35:43 AM PDT by Christian Engineer Mass (25ish Cambridge MA grad student. Many younger conservative Christians out there? __ Click my name)
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To: Publius6961

Hah...I knew it!;-)


8 posted on 04/03/2011 10:37:09 AM PDT by SonOfDarkSkies
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To: SonOfDarkSkies

It’s been proven a fake.


This ‘proof’?

“It appears the IAA believed the booklets were forgeries on the basis that nothing like them had been discovered before. “

or this ‘proof’?

“The samples were then sent to the Swiss National Materials Laboratory at Dubendorf, Switzerland. The results show they were consistent with ancient (Roman) period lead production and that the metal was smelted from ore that originated in the Mediterranean. Dr Northover also said that corrosion on the books was unlikely to be modern. “


9 posted on 04/03/2011 10:39:05 AM PDT by chaosagent (Remember, no matter how you slice it, forbidden fruit still tastes the sweetest!)
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To: SonOfDarkSkies
"It’s been proven a fake."

Where is a link to your source that it is a fake?

10 posted on 04/03/2011 10:39:36 AM PDT by Spunky (Accept that some days you're the pigeon, and some days you're the statue.)
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To: Spunky

Link upthread.


11 posted on 04/03/2011 10:41:17 AM PDT by SonOfDarkSkies
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To: SonOfDarkSkies
"Here's a link to the "fake" conclusion"

I hadn't read far enough before I asked for a link. Sorry!

12 posted on 04/03/2011 10:41:23 AM PDT by Spunky (Accept that some days you're the pigeon, and some days you're the statue.)
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To: SonOfDarkSkies
"Here's a link to the "fake" conclusion"

I hadn't read far enough before I asked for a link. Sorry!

13 posted on 04/03/2011 10:41:23 AM PDT by Spunky (Accept that some days you're the pigeon, and some days you're the statue.)
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To: Spunky
No prob. Here's an interesting excerpt from Christianity Today...
Scholars Doubtful About Metal Plate Documents' Authenticity

Other Bible scholars and archaeologists contacted by Christianity Today were equally skeptical. "Don't get too excited until we know what we have," said Darrell Bock, Research Professor of New Testament Studies at Dallas Theological Seminary. Archaeologists pointed out that any ancient item discovered out of context faces huge hurdles before it can be authenticated and properly dated.

Then on April 1st, no less, the blog Paleojudaica posted a letter from Oxford University lecturer Peter Thonemann, which identified the text from one page of a codex as a crude reproduction of an inscription from an ancient tombstone that has been on display in an Amman museum for the past half century. "The only possible explanation is that the text on the bronze tablet was copied directly from the inscription in the museum," Thonemann wrote.


14 posted on 04/03/2011 10:46:48 AM PDT by SonOfDarkSkies
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To: mandaladon

Well what do you think about that...the cheese pizza was right!


15 posted on 04/03/2011 10:48:29 AM PDT by 240B (he is doing everything he said he wouldn't and not doing what he said he would)
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To: SonOfDarkSkies
Aw, c'mon...
Can you just picture an illiterate denizen of northern Jordan the 1950s or 60s deciding, "I'll just find me some copper and lead sheets and fire off a bunch of meaningless, but detailed laborious embossed plates, bury them somewhere and wait 61 years and see what happens... ?

I suppose that's possible.

16 posted on 04/03/2011 10:53:13 AM PDT by Publius6961 (There has Never been a "Tax On The Rich" that has not reached the middle class)
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To: mandaladon

Looks like a lion head to me.


17 posted on 04/03/2011 10:53:41 AM PDT by FReepaholic (Pray for Japan.)
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To: mandaladon
I think it's a Bert Lahr souvenir coin.
18 posted on 04/03/2011 10:56:14 AM PDT by wtc911 ("How you gonna get down that hill?")
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To: Publius6961
You never know...they might turn out to be real after all, but that Thonemann fellow at Oxford is betting his rep as an expert that they are forgeries.

I was disappointed to hear the theories of fakery. But, of course, where there's money to be made, there's always a clever forger around.

19 posted on 04/03/2011 10:57:59 AM PDT by SonOfDarkSkies
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To: mandaladon
Hold up a one dollar bill and see the resemblance to Washington.
20 posted on 04/03/2011 10:59:46 AM PDT by fish hawk (R. Emmett Tyrrell: Liberalism is dead. What we see now is "soft Nazis-ism".)
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To: mandaladon

To me it looks like the face of a lion.


21 posted on 04/03/2011 11:00:16 AM PDT by Beowulf9
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To: FReepaholic

Well, Christ is called the “Lion of Judah”. ;^)


22 posted on 04/03/2011 11:00:35 AM PDT by Shelayne (He who testifies to these things says, "Yes, I am coming quickly" Amen. Come, Lord Jesus! *Rev 22:20)
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To: mandaladon

First I heard of this so-called find was on Coast-to-Coast last night. For those who don’t know, that’s Art Bell’s old show, hosted by George Noory and assorted fill ins since Bell retired, moved to the Phillipines, and got himself a young wife. Since this is a C-to-C subject, that does not bide well for these metal books to be authentic.


23 posted on 04/03/2011 11:02:22 AM PDT by Wolfstar ("If you would win a man to your cause, first convince him that you are his friend." Abraham Lincoln)
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To: Shelayne

Maybe it’s Azlan.


24 posted on 04/03/2011 11:02:38 AM PDT by dfwgator
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To: mandaladon

A metallurgist should be able to determine if the metal is consistent with that from the claimed era?


25 posted on 04/03/2011 11:03:07 AM PDT by fso301
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To: mandaladon

26 posted on 04/03/2011 11:10:41 AM PDT by Cvengr (Adversity in life and death is inevitable. Thru faith in Christ, stress is optional.)
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To: mandaladon
It would seem the process used to make these codices would have been far advanced compared to later codices.

The process seems to be analogous to wood-cuts of more than a milennium later, and used a less-than-likely medium flat metal, that would have required multiple contemporaneous advances: metal imprinting of a "block at a time," lacing codex imprints together well before individual examples, and "negative engraving" of lettering to produce positives and mass-producible metal stamping. If these practices had existed in the first century or thereabouts, it is beyond curious and bizarre that these advances became "lost to the world," not to be used again by others for many hundreds of years.

HF

27 posted on 04/03/2011 11:14:44 AM PDT by holden
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To: SonOfDarkSkies

The soup Nazi says THESE are the original recipes. After he copied them, grandmama had them securely bound and put in a cave. The soup Nazi remembers it well.


28 posted on 04/03/2011 11:18:23 AM PDT by Sacajaweau
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It hasn’t been proven or dis-proven one way or another,it will be years to ascertain,

BTW, I looked up ancient lead tablets and this is nothing unusual, there were similar tablets from Corinth, they had curses written on them.


29 posted on 04/03/2011 11:24:21 AM PDT by Sophia777
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To: mandaladon

Regardless of it’s authenticity, is is, much like the “Shroud of Turin” pretty interesting.

It might also be interesting to put a picture of the “Mandilion” or facial portion of the Shroud next to or superimposed over this mysterious (if not somewhat dubious) image for comparison.

Producing such raised / “3-D” images on sheet metal is a very ancient and fairly simple process which can be accomplished with hand tools. IIRC it’s called “Repousse’”.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Repoussé_and_chasing

I’ve done it; how complicated can it be?


30 posted on 04/03/2011 11:31:20 AM PDT by George Varnum (Liberty, like our Forefather's Flintlock Musket, must be kept clean, oiled, and READY!)
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To: dfwgator

:^D


31 posted on 04/03/2011 11:40:29 AM PDT by Shelayne (He who testifies to these things says, "Yes, I am coming quickly" Amen. Come, Lord Jesus! *Rev 22:20)
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To: bigheadfred

32 posted on 04/03/2011 11:40:54 AM PDT by BenLurkin (This post is not a statement of fact. It is merely a personal opinion -- or humor -- or both)
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To: FReepaholic; Beowulf9

It’s Scrooge’s lion door knocker with the ghost of Marley. See post 32


33 posted on 04/03/2011 11:42:29 AM PDT by BenLurkin (This post is not a statement of fact. It is merely a personal opinion -- or humor -- or both)
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34 posted on 04/03/2011 11:51:12 AM PDT by BenLurkin (This post is not a statement of fact. It is merely a personal opinion -- or humor -- or both)
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To: mandaladon

Looks to me like one of those dinner rolls I’m supposed to be able to find Jesus’ face in.....yet I never can. But I hear they go for big bucks on e-bay.


35 posted on 04/03/2011 11:54:37 AM PDT by circlecity
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To: SonOfDarkSkies

I read your link, but is he even talking about the same codices? The photos of this find out of Jordan look and sound very different than the find he posts photos of and writes about—the way the inscriptions are written look nothing alike. They were even discovered in different places, so...

These look and read like possibly two separate finds that are being lumped together.

Time will tell, I guess.


36 posted on 04/03/2011 11:59:53 AM PDT by Shelayne (He who testifies to these things says, "Yes, I am coming quickly" Amen. Come, Lord Jesus! *Rev 22:20)
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To: Shelayne
I too have found that confusing...but best I can tell, they are the same codices. Here's an excerpt (note the link to the article which is the subject of this thread) from one of the contributors to the conversation at PaleoJudaica (the blog that has been at the center of this discussion).
FAKE METAL CODICES: MEDIA FAIL

The mainstream press just keeps churning this stuff out, oblivious to the specialist bloggers who have already demonstrated that the inscribed metal plates are forgeries.

Could this couple's Bible 'codices' tell the true story of Christ's life? (The Telegraph)

Is this the first ever portrait of Jesus? The incredible story of 70 ancient books hidden in a cave for nearly 2,000 years (The Daily Mail)

Jordan demands that Israel return ‘stolen artifacts’ (Jerusalem Post)

I can't find anything more from the BBC, which perhaps is to their credit a little. It's possible that they now have a clue and are trying to pretend that the whole thing never happened. But is it too much to hope for coverage of the debunking of the story?

As I've said before: when you read or hear, well, anything in the mainstream media, keep in mind that this is their mode of operation. Seize on a sensationalist story (while frequently ignoring interesting stories that are real but not sensationalist); no problem if the story is generated by an obvious crank, as such things frequently are; be too lazy to check out the crank's credentials or too ignorant to read the "energy vibration" warning signs; distort and sensationalize anything said by actual specialists; fail to make a few phone calls to outside specialists for a view; fail even to Google the story to see if any informed bloggers have a view or better information; and instead repeatedly draw on dubious press releases and earlier media stories, often focusing on and playing up the most lurid elements of the earlier coverage.

Background here and just keep following those links.

UPDATE: Aargh! The AP has been snookered too and the story is now multiplying like maggots on the carcass of the media's credibility.

UPDATE: At Rogue Classicism, David Meadows has a careful analysis of the latest from the Daily Mail and the Telegraph: Lead Codices – Once More into the ‘Reach’.

posted by Jim Davila | 4:50 AM


37 posted on 04/03/2011 12:17:15 PM PDT by SonOfDarkSkies
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To: FReepaholic
Looks like a lion head to me.

100% agree.

38 posted on 04/03/2011 12:33:14 PM PDT by newzjunkey (Obama will be president until Fri, Jan 20, 2017.)
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To: BenLurkin

39 posted on 04/03/2011 12:43:39 PM PDT by bigheadfred (Beat me, Bite me...Make Me Write Bad Checks)
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To: bigheadfred

Maybe you could do one with the “litterbox” picture of the face on Mars.


40 posted on 04/03/2011 12:45:41 PM PDT by Vroomfondel
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To: Vroomfondel

Show me the pic, please.


41 posted on 04/03/2011 12:46:50 PM PDT by bigheadfred (Beat me, Bite me...Make Me Write Bad Checks)
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To: bigheadfred
here ya go.

Intriguingly, given the lion commentary above, there is also this.

42 posted on 04/03/2011 12:55:08 PM PDT by Vroomfondel
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To: mandaladon
Who benefits from the discovery of yet another marvelous 'Christian' icon in the Middle East? Just over the last 5 years, we have witnessed the amazing Jesus ossuary, the 1st Centuary church mosaic floor, the First Temple ivory pomagranite. Now, the little book of lead sealed until the time of the end.

Regardless, whether fakes, frauds and/or original art. I can see only one beneficiary from the sudden discovery of these marvels.

43 posted on 04/03/2011 12:59:34 PM PDT by STD (Nobel Peace Prize Winner, Imam Barrack Hussein Obama Launches a War in Libya)
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To: SonOfDarkSkies
I looked up Elkington and the other two "scholars" quoted most often along with him on this story.

Their backgrounds and projects currently engaged in came across as pretty flaky to me.

At that point I began to get skeptical about these plates.

44 posted on 04/03/2011 1:02:12 PM PDT by Siena Dreaming
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To: Vroomfondel

Ooooohhh...I like the lion motif.

Consider the speculation that the Sphinx was built during the age of Leo.

And why not the face on Mars at the same time the ancient astronaut gods were jump starting us?

Ooooohhhh...


45 posted on 04/03/2011 1:07:20 PM PDT by bigheadfred (Beat me, Bite me...Make Me Write Bad Checks)
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To: Siena Dreaming

Elkington must be a solid source...he’s been a guest on Coast to Coast.;-)


46 posted on 04/03/2011 1:07:54 PM PDT by SonOfDarkSkies
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To: STD

Right.


47 posted on 04/03/2011 1:09:50 PM PDT by bigheadfred (Beat me, Bite me...Make Me Write Bad Checks)
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To: SonOfDarkSkies
Margaret Baker was another fruity who has been quoted.

What's weird is...I looked these people up on Wiki the other day and today I can't find these bio entries. Were they scrubbed because they came across as too wacky? Tin foil hat on.

48 posted on 04/03/2011 1:14:59 PM PDT by Siena Dreaming
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To: SonOfDarkSkies
Who benefits beyond the alleged seller? There's only one possible conclusion that educated people can reach. Somebodies stimulating the faith strings of Christian hearts and wallets.

I suspect that as the Middle East continues to become more unstable, the Ark of the Covenant, the Tomb of Jesus and the Temple Treasury will all suddenly re-appear.

After the location of John the Baptist's Cave was announced, we heard that searchers were close to locating the Temple Treasury. I'm waiting for somebody to claim they've located the Ark and the treasury.

49 posted on 04/03/2011 1:15:21 PM PDT by STD (Nobel Peace Prize Winner, Imam Barrack Hussein Obama Launches a War in Libya)
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To: STD
I suspect that as the Middle East continues to become more unstable

Actually, I've long thought that the WOT will ultimately bring MORE stability to the ME. And, if conservatives achieve some of their long-term goals in drilling domestically and the result of that is less dependance on foreign oil, the ME countries may have to find alternative sources of western dollars.

Working for a revived fascination for biblical sites and our historical Judeo-Christian heritage would be to the benefit of the ME countries. A surge in tourism would provide new jobs and revenue in the ME. Yes, and along with this will be a plethora of fakes and forgeries.

50 posted on 04/03/2011 1:38:31 PM PDT by Siena Dreaming
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