Vanity - .308 rifle query

me

[West Texas Chuck]

If I ever get gainful employment again, I plan to buy a rifle. I don't consider a 5.56mm to be a proper battle rifle, call me a doofus but I want a .30 caliber firearm with a shortish barrel. No AKs, that might come later.

I have all the handguns I need, as far as She Who Must Be Obeyed knows anyway. Might pick up another or two along the way, but I want a long gun. Don't know squat about semi-auto rifles, but I am a good learner.

[West Texas Chuck]

I have my eye on a Springfield SOCOM-16. I like the way it looks, and I think I can learn how to operate and own an M1A style weapon. Don't know for sure how my old broke down shoulder will handle the recoil of a .308 but I like the cut of that thing's jib. I'm good with iron sights, for a start anyway.

What say you FReepers.

[West Texas Chuck]

At the moment, this is my Kim Kardashian:

http://www.springfield-armory.com/armory.php?version=35

I am open to criticisms, advice, insults, or guidance.

[expat1000]

I was going to reminisce about M14s but that piece looks sweet! 8.8 lbs should eat up a lot of the recoil, not that .308 is that bad anyway (I will be called a wimp here for sure for saying it has any recoil at all!)

[FromTheSidelines]

You want a compact 308? There's really only one option: the Kel Tec RFB (bullpup configuration):

Magazine fed 308, spent brass comes out the front so you can fire from either right or left shoulder, has an 18.1" long barrel and 26.1" overall length (both just barely legal), and is one sweet firing rifle. I've got to shoot one, twice, for several magazines. VERY well balanced with the bulk of the weight centered between your fore hand and the shoulder, and it literally centers on the pistol grip - perfectly centered mass there.

I'm saving up for one - I think it's about the best option for a 308 out there, save something needed for serious target shooting. I was putting together 2-3 MOA groups in my first magazine, and tightened up to 1.5 to 2 MOA on my second (4X scope was mounted). Plenty accurate for anything I'd ever need it for.

Besides, having such a compact rifle would be great when out hunting in thick underbrush - no more trying to handle a 42" long rifle!

[Monitor]

There’s nothing like reaching out and touching something at 600+ yards. When you have to get in your car to drive to your target, you know it’s long range.

I have a Remington 700 PSS chambered in .308 with a Leupold LR-M3 3.5-10x40mm scope with mil-dots and side-focus. It’s my 300+ yard gun. Anything inside 300 yards is reserved for my AR-15.

If I didn’t already have the AR-15, I’d get a SOCOM for that job.

[USNBandit]

I bought a SOCOM 16 and was thoroughly disgusted with it. It functions fine, but it doesn't group, it patterns. Unless you are using national match ammo, it shoots 5 inch patterns at 100 yds. I sent it back, they recrowned the barrel, fired a barely 3" group off a machine rest with Federal National Match 168 gr. and sent it back to me saying it now met their specifications.

Maybe 16 inches is too short for that round with the twist of the barrel? All I know is that I could have spent a third less money and bought an AR or maybe even one of the .308 AR variants and gotten a better shooting gun.

I carry an M-4 for work and even my of the rack M-4 with a 16 inch barrel and an EOTech (a damn CQB sight) shoots better unsupported than that SOCOM off a bench.

My recommendation would be to maybe look for a guy that is down on his luck and wants to unload a lightly used rifle that you can try out. Go at least 18 inches on the M1A. The Navy got away with cutting down their barrels when they put them in the Sage stocks, but I think they went to 20". Not sure on that.

I also just got to shoot a 16 inch SCAR in .308 and mama mia was that nice. The one I shot had a fairly high end ELCAN sight on it which was pretty sweet. Things I like about it is that the controls are ambidextrous, and very M-4/AR familiar, good rails, conventional gas system, folding stock is nice for getting out of a vehicle/aircraft, an the thing was a tack driver. Not so good, after using an M-4 for so many years having a moving operating handle is a bit annoying, especially when it is flying around on the left side of the gun. If I got one I would switch it to the other side. That is a standard feature and can be done in a minute with the same part. Another challenge which you have to expect with all .308s is that full auto is like Mr. Toad's Wild Ride. Not big on full auto myself, but short bursts are a must. Not sure if it would be much easier with a forward grip installed or not. That takes most of the skill requirement out with an M-4. You definitely can't square up on the target and let lose with a burst.

[Jonty30]

I say, go big or go home.

http://jonmackin.files.wordpress.com/2011/01/home_made_bazooka2.jpg

[RC one]

I have an Armalite AR-10T. I want the carbine version. Magazines are pricey. That's the only drawback. The HK91 is nice but it tears up your brass and; therefore, sucks for reloading which is a big problem IMO. The FN-FAL is fantastic but not as accurate as the Armalite and not as familiar to someone like me who was trained by the army on an M16 platform. The M1A is nice and capable of great accuracy. I was torn between the AR10 and the M1A. I opted for the Armalite because of the familiarity, accuracy, and the versatility. Mounting accessories to it is a breeze as well which is nice.

[West Texas Chuck]

I have a buddy who is an AR fag, he keeps trying to steer me into an AR-15 type weapon, Larue or Rock River. I’ll reconsider my choices, nothing is in stone yet. I just wonder about the 5.56mm chambering, it makes me think of a .22LR, but I am ignorant on battle rifles. Yeah, for what the SOCOM costs, I could buy two ARs. Much to learn.

Thanx for that input. Good info.

[Yosemitest]

How much do you plan to spend?

I bought an Amralite AR-10A2 CARBINE 7.62 W FORWARD ASSIST BLACK for around $1500.00 over a year ago.



I wished now that I had bought the AR-30 .308 WINCHESTER 26" BBL for about $100.00 more at that time, but now cost $2,021.00



If money was no consideration, I'd buy the Nemesis Arms, truly unique multi-caliber custom rifle, the Vanquish Multi-Caliber - $4450.00 USD for it's break-down concealment ability.

[West Texas Chuck]

I have actually fired the HK91. It was years ago, but it seemed easy to handle. I don’t remember it hurting, and I am not currently reloading so that is not an issue. Long sumbitch, though. I have been thinking about something more easily handled indoors in a pinch.

The AR-10 keeps coming up. I’ll have to do some more research before plunking down the bux.

[West Texas Chuck]

$1500 is actually about right. Like I inferred, I am sucking that state of Texas hind tit at the moment, but that will hopefully change soon.

Not buying any new weapons until it does ;)

[Yosemitest]

One other thing to study is the cost of a good scope.
Most military, and retired military consider the scope more important than the rifle.

[Arlis]

Get the AK first, then the Socom. AK’s = incredibly reliable, great short-mid range, enough power to knock em down good.

Socom = more distance, more power, more accuracy.

Odds are your needs are going to be closer up rather than farther away......

Of course, this is just my opinion....... :-)

[FromTheSidelines]

If you're not sure about the power of the 5.56, I'd suggest this set of tests from The Box O Truth. Especially the destruction wrought by that little 5.56mm bullet even after penetrating 30 sheets of Kevlar:

If you want 308 because you don't think 5.56 is deadly enough, you might want to reconsider. If you want 308 because you want the ability to reliably reach out and shoot 500+ yards, then you're going right. But for "close in" work against things that walk on 2 legs, the little 5.56mm is a very good option.

[West Texas Chuck]

Yeah, when I get to the point of needing a scope I figure to mount it on a Crusader Broadsword.

I know, in my dreams.

[bushpilot1]

Fired a .306 Savage bolt action when I was 8 years old..Oh man..

[bushpilot1]

Fired a .308 Savage bolt action when I was 8 years old..Oh man..

[RC one]

I watched my old man call out a blade of grass at 80 yards and then cut in half with his Bushmaster AR15 (xm15e2s actually). a blade of grass at 80 yards. think about that for a second. I then proceeded to shoot a full mag, basically hole for hole at 100 yards with the same rifle. with each round right in the bulls eye no less. That means that this weapon is, technically, capable of shooting better than a 1” group at 400 yards (so long as there are no exterior ballistics to contend with). a quality 5.56 mm AR15 assault rifle with a decent scope, a timney adjustable trigger and some good match grade ammo is extremely potent. If I had to go to war, I’d want that rifle and that ammo. period. I’d leave my AR10 behind if I had to choose between the two.

[West Texas Chuck]

People keep telling me this, maybe I should drop my notions about that round.

I guess I am being prejudiced. Like I said, I know little of this arena of the firearms world.