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What Killed Lenin? Poison Called Possibility
Washington Times ^ | Sunday, May 6, 2012 | Alex Dominguez

Posted on 05/06/2012 8:59:15 PM PDT by nickcarraway

Stress, family medical history or possibly even poison led to the death of Vladimir Lenin, contradicting a popular theory that a sexually transmitted disease debilitated the Soviet Union’s founder, a UCLA neurologist said.

Dr. Harry Vinters and Russian historian Lev Lurie reviewed Lenin’s records Friday for an annual University of Maryland School of Medicine conference that examines the deaths of famous figures.

The conference is held yearly at the school, where researchers in the past have re-examined the diagnoses of figures including King Tut, Christopher Columbus, Simon Bolivar and Abraham Lincoln.

(Excerpt) Read more at washingtontimes.com ...


TOPICS: History; Miscellaneous
KEYWORDS: abrahamlincoln; bolivar; columbs; columbus; custer; godsgravesglyphs; history; kingtut; lenin; maryland; russiaussr

1 posted on 05/06/2012 8:59:19 PM PDT by nickcarraway
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To: nickcarraway
What Killed Lenin? Stalin Called Probability
2 posted on 05/06/2012 9:04:47 PM PDT by BigEdLB (Now there ARE 1,000,000 regrets - but it may be too late.)
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To: nickcarraway

Communism killed Lenin just as surely as Zero plans to kill the American Republic.


3 posted on 05/06/2012 9:05:26 PM PDT by STD ([You must help] people in the community…feel so frustrated, so defeated, so lost, so futureless)
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To: nickcarraway

Whoever it was and whatever it was, give them a fricking medal, NOW.

Calling Mr. Putin, calling Mr. Putin, your glowing Vodka Martini is ready.


4 posted on 05/06/2012 9:05:42 PM PDT by MadMax, the Grinning Reaper
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To: BigEdLB

Allegedly Beria had poisoned Stalin, since he learned Stalin was about to purge the entire Politburo.


5 posted on 05/06/2012 9:09:04 PM PDT by dfwgator (Don't wake up in a roadside ditch. Get rid of Romney.)
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To: MadMax, the Grinning Reaper

What if Lenin had lived, and blocked Stalin’s path to power?


6 posted on 05/06/2012 9:12:11 PM PDT by dfwgator (Don't wake up in a roadside ditch. Get rid of Romney.)
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To: dfwgator

Not much difference, really. He was just as ruthless as Stalin, just in a slightly different way.


7 posted on 05/06/2012 9:15:20 PM PDT by 17th Miss Regt
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To: nickcarraway

” - - - possibly even poison led to the death of Vladimir Lenin - - - “

Maybe it was arsenic? It seems to be a Commie poison of choice - - - .


8 posted on 05/06/2012 9:17:46 PM PDT by Graewoulf ((Dictator Baby-Doc Barack's obama"care" violates Sherman Anti-Trust Law, AND U.S. Constitution.))
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To: nickcarraway

I read someplace that Stalin had three doors to his quarters. His cooks left his meals outside each door. Stalin would take one meal at random for himself, and the cooks had to eat the other two.


9 posted on 05/06/2012 9:24:39 PM PDT by haroldeveryman
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To: haroldeveryman

The accounts of Stalin’s stroke and his last few hours alive are telling. They let him lie on the floor and smirked as he wet his pants. He could only stare up at them.


10 posted on 05/06/2012 10:41:38 PM PDT by unkus (Silence Is Consent)
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To: dfwgator

Lenin was smarter than Stalin. Stalin was more brutal than Lenin, if that was possible. However, I think that Russia would have been different by some degree if Lenin has kept Stalin from power. The same for the way the Soviet Bloc would have been formed.

Also, Lenin would have to deal with Trotskyite. Stalin did, by killing him.

All theoretical constructs. Was is, is.


11 posted on 05/06/2012 11:28:48 PM PDT by MadMax, the Grinning Reaper
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To: dfwgator

Lenin was smarter than Stalin. Stalin was more brutal than Lenin, if that was possible. However, I think that Russia would have been different by some degree if Lenin has kept Stalin from power. The same for the way the Soviet Bloc would have been formed.

Also, Lenin would have to deal with Trotskyite. Stalin did, by killing him.

All theoretical constructs. What is, is.


12 posted on 05/06/2012 11:29:18 PM PDT by MadMax, the Grinning Reaper
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To: MadMax, the Grinning Reaper

This conjecture provides yet another avenue of rationalization for the socialist left: ‘If Lenin hadn’t been poisoned by Bush - er I mean Stalin - communism would have worked and the world would be a workers paradise’. Or something like that.


13 posted on 05/07/2012 1:36:09 AM PDT by pieceofthepuzzle
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To: nickcarraway
researchers in the past have re-examined the diagnoses of figures including ... Abraham Lincoln.

Shot in the head would not seem to be a controversial diagnosis.

14 posted on 05/07/2012 1:39:51 AM PDT by Sherman Logan
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To: Graewoulf

Overdosing on the treatment for syphilis?


15 posted on 05/07/2012 1:49:50 AM PDT by monocle
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To: Sherman Logan
Shot in the head would not seem to be a controversial diagnosis.

His treatment was controversial. The doctors removed the bullet and probed the wound with unwashed hands. It is not certain he would have lived much longer if left less attended, but the doctors, on balance, probably did more hard (unintentionally) than good. Some speculate he might have recovered.

16 posted on 05/07/2012 3:34:25 AM PDT by Lonesome in Massachussets (Rush: If Ward Churchill had a daughter, she’d look like Elizabeth Warren.)
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To: nickcarraway

One of the more intriguing cases is Tycho. Tycho’s death benefited Kepler enormously. Not only did Kepler get Tycho’s job as the Holy Roman Emperor’s astronomer (a pretty lucrative gig) but he usurped (Kepler’s words) his twenty odd years of observations. Tycho had the first set of reliable, accurate, reasonably long term set of planetary observations in history. Their collection had been a major undertaking, comparable in terms of cost to Renaissance Denmark to the cost of the Apollo Program to 1960’s America. By luck they fell into the hands of one of the few people in the world with the skill and patience to exploit them. Kepler overturned both Copernicus and Ptolemy, and can be said to the first real advance in astronomy since Ptolemy. (Ptolemy was a scientific giant, by the way.)

Tycho was reported to have died of burst bladder after refusing to excuse himself to relieve himself at a royal banquet. But in fact, the human bladder is extraordinarily tough and one would urinate involuntarily long before one could burst it. Some suspect he was poisoned and Kepler alone stood to gain.


17 posted on 05/07/2012 3:47:10 AM PDT by Lonesome in Massachussets (Rush: If Ward Churchill had a daughter, she’d look like Elizabeth Warren.)
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To: Lonesome in Massachussets

It’s not exactly controversial. The bullet entered the rear of his skull, transited the brain and ended up behind his eye. I’ve read a number of books about the assassination and none seriously contended there was any chance of his survival.

In particular, there was no way unwashed hands contributed to his death, since there was not sufficient time for this to have caused infection.

Here’s an article by a trauma physician who believes he would have died even with modern trauma center or battlefield emergency care.

http://showcase.netins.net/web/creative/lincoln/education/medical.htm

I wonder if you’re confusing his case with that of Garfield, who would almost certainly have survived with proper treatment.


18 posted on 05/07/2012 4:31:04 AM PDT by Sherman Logan
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To: Lonesome in Massachussets

Also, the bullet was not removed till the autopsy.


19 posted on 05/07/2012 4:40:51 AM PDT by Sherman Logan
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To: nickcarraway
What Killed Lenin? Poison Called Possibility

Well, we can't blame Castro...or can we?

20 posted on 05/07/2012 5:43:55 AM PDT by Caipirabob (I say we take off and Newt the site from orbit. It's the only way to be sure...)
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To: dfwgator

Of course Krushchev had Beria shot six months after Stalin died. So Nikita knew something was up.


21 posted on 05/07/2012 5:48:31 AM PDT by BigEdLB (Now there ARE 1,000,000 regrets - but it may be too late.)
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To: Sherman Logan
I wasn't confusing the cases, I remember an article in American Heritage magazine some years ago. The unwashed hands were significant in conveying the primitive state of medical knowledge at the time. I think it is fair to say that Lincoln's doctors probably did more harm than good.
22 posted on 05/07/2012 5:59:07 AM PDT by Lonesome in Massachussets (Rush: If Ward Churchill had a daughter, she’d look like Elizabeth Warren.)
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To: nickcarraway

Of course there is also the fact that Lenin had been shot in August 1918 and it was too dangerous to remove the bullet.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fanny_Kaplan


23 posted on 05/07/2012 6:41:25 AM PDT by Cheburashka (It's legal to be out at night in spacesuits, even carrying a rag dolly. Cops hauled us in anyway.)
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To: Lonesome in Massachussets

Doctors of the time did their best, but often as you say did more harm than good.

In our Civil War about two soldiers died from disease or wounds as opposed to being killed directly in combat. This was, however, much better than any previous war. If I remember rightly, the ratio was 7:1 for the Mexican War and higher than that for the Revolution.

The survival rate for wounded soldiers has gone up spectacularly, to the point where we drastically underestimate the violence of the Iraq and Afghanistan wars because they have caused comparatively few American deaths. This is more a function of the efficiency of the medical care they receive than it is of lowered violence.

The same is probably true of the vaunted decline in the US murder rate. It is largely due to fewer people dying because of better trauma care, not to a reduction in violence. IOW, people are still getting shot at a high rate, but more of them are surviving the experience.


24 posted on 05/07/2012 6:41:39 AM PDT by Sherman Logan
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To: nickcarraway

 GGG managers are SunkenCiv, StayAt HomeMother & Ernest_at_the_Beach
Thanks nickcarraway .

Just adding to the catalog, not sending a general distribution.

To all -- please ping me to other topics which are appropriate for the GGG list.


25 posted on 05/07/2012 8:13:36 PM PDT by SunkenCiv (FReepathon 2Q time -- https://secure.freerepublic.com/donate/)
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