Vanity - Sen Ted Cruz is natural Born Citizen!!!

[Perdogg]

Sen Ted Cruz's mother was a US Citizen at the time of his birth, therefore he is nBC! He just said on Hannity he was a US Citizen at time of birth.

[KC_Lion]

What Difference Does it make!?!?!

[David]

Sen Ted Cruz's mother was a US Citizen at the time of his birth, therefore he is nBC! He just said on Hannity he was a US Citizen at time of birth.

That is just great--because I am a strong Cruz fan.

Did he happen to give you a USCA citation which provides for how he got to be a U S Citizen at Birth?

There are two issues here: One, was he a citizen when he was born; and Two, was he a "Natural Born Citizen" within the meaning of Article II, Sec. 1 of the U S Constitution. Which issue are we talking about?

And we don't know all the facts with respect to the current hot issue which is citizen at birth.

What we do know is that he had a mother and father who were married to each other; that his mother was a U S Citizen; that his father was not a U S Citizen; and that Cruz himself was not born within the confines of the several states.

What we do not know is the exact date of his birth; the exact date of the birth of his mother; and the amount of time his mother was a resident of the United States after age 14.

The question of citizenship at birth turns on the citizenship statute in effect at the time he was born. I believe that statute provided that a person who was the son of a citizen mother, non-citizen father, is a citzen at birth only if the mother had resided in the United States for five years after the age of 14. That is in part based on an assumption about Kruz's birth date--the statutory perameters changed at various times in the 60's and 70's. The effective date for the amendments of the statute are in the USCA footnotes for anyone who chooses to look.

There are two further problems with the statute.

The consensus of the Constitutional Law Bar (per the Cornell Law Review article on the subject) is that the statute is unconstitutional because a father citizen's child would not have the same rights if the mother was not a citizen.

And, further, the Congressional Research Service opinion on the topic attempts to equate citizenship at birth with Natural Born Citizenship at Law. There are several reasons why that reasoning is faulty. But one of the principal reasons as one of the posters to which this is addressed infers above, may be that Congresses only power over citizenship is naturalization--thus if Congress seeks to make a person who is not a Natural Born Citizen a citizen at birth even though such person was born outside the geographical limits of the several states, such citizenship is by naturalization and not Natural Born.

Absent a naturalization proceeding (which has not happened in the case of Cruz) Cruz is a citizen only if the mother citizen statute is constitutional and his mother meets the statutory test to confer citizenship--and citizenship (for a term of years--I believe 9) is required to be eligible to hold the office of United States Senator. Both questionable.

Further, as to issue #2, Natural Born under Article I: Birth outside the United States resolves the issue against him.

[morphing libertarian]

Let him announce soon and see what the dems say

[allmendream]

“Vattel 217. Children born in the armies of the state.
For the same reasons also, children born out of the country, in the armies of the state, or in the house of its minister at a foreign court, are reputed born in the country; for a citizen who is absent with his family, on the service of the state, but still dependent on it, and subject to its jurisdiction, cannot be considered as having quitted its territory.”

As to defining what is “natural born” - Vattel in 212 is more accurately translated as “indigenous or natives”. There is nothing in the original French that could be accurately translated to “natural born” which was the common term in English law for one born a citizen.

[noinfringers2]

Were Cruz’s parents,either one, in a foreign country fighting or even representing for the USA? I will be waiting for you to find the words of Vattel that supersede the actual quote I cited. I believe the Constitution was a very good resoned and constructed document for times then and now.

[allmendream]

I brought it up in regard to McCain. McCain would be a “native or indigenous” citizen according to Vattel 217. The “actual quote” you cited is a mistranslation of 212. And 217 provides an exception to the definition of “natives or indigenous” provided in 212. Was Vattel speaking of natural-born subjects as well as citizens? Nothing in the French translates to either “born” or “citizen”.

Yes the Constitution was extremely well reasoned, and only those who were citizens at the time of the adoption and natural born citizens were qualified for the Presidency. This leaves out the only other type of citizen the Constitution provides for, those being naturalized citizens.

Do you contend that Senator Cruz is a naturalized citizen? What type of citizen do you suppose Senator Cruz is? Based upon what law?

[deport]

Cruz was born in Canada to parents weren’t working in the oil industry while there. Unlike McCain whose parents were in the military or Obama who supposedly was born in HI. Cruz’s father didn’t become a naturalized citizen until 2005.

[Agamemnon]

Yes, he was born a US citizen, but he does not appear to meet the standard of ‘natural born citizen’ as was used and applied at the writing of the Constitution.

If we fail to throw him out on this basis, his Presidency will set the new precedent in practice. The USSC swore him in twice.

It will then become the standard Constitutional interpretation that NBC = born to at least one full US citizen.

It will do us no good to restrict ourselves and our selections when the USSC will have already set precedence for that standard with Obama and a de facto definition of what NBC may include.

Let's run Cruz/Rubio if they're up to the task. The libs will regret the precedent they allowed go be set with Obama.

FReegards!

[Joe Marine 76]

“Cruz/Rand 2016” Yes please!

No more Bushes.

Also, John Bolton as Sec State and Sarah Palin as Sec Energy... to disband it.

[9YearLurker]

Rubio IMO is very much NOT up to the task. An overambitious and duplicitous pro-amnesty Bush property.

[Elsiejay]

And his father held citizenship in which nation at the time of Sen. Cruz’ birth?

[philman_36]

The question of citizenship at birth turns on the citizenship statute in effect at the time he was born.

We're right back to where we were years ago...what statute are you talking about? Are you talking about a statute from USC 8?

And isn't Congress' authority only related to establishing a uniform rule of naturalization?

So how can a statute written after the Constitution was written have a higher standing than the Constitution?

[randita]

Re: Cruz's mother:

Eleanor Darragh, Cruz’s mother, was a working-class Delaware native who studied math at Rice University. Cruz once told a tea party group that his mother refused to learn how to type, so that when men asked her to type things up for her she could say, “I would love to help you out, but I don’t know how to type. I guess you’re going to have to use me as a computer programmer instead.”

Source: http://www.washingtonpost.com/blogs/the-fix/post/who-is-ted-cruz/2012/08/01/gJQAqql8OX_blog.html

[Bubba Ho-Tep]

Don’t forget the birther theory that mothers under a certain age can’t pass on citizenship, even if their kids are born in the US.

[truth_seeker]

“The birthers will disagree.”

Their accomplishments?

[noinfringers2]

My info is that Ted Cruz was born in Calgary, Alberta Canada and his father at the time was a Cuban citizen who fought for the Castro revolution but later turned against Castro and only his mother was a USA citizen. A very fascinating family history but as I see it, as a plain USA born citizen with/from non-naturalized parents at birth, Cruz is less eligible to be POTUSA than I am even though I served overseas in WWII.

[David]

"The question of citizenship at birth turns on the citizenship statute in effect at the time he was born."

We're right back to where we were years ago...what statute are you talking about? Are you talking about a statute from USC 8?

And isn't Congress' authority only related to establishing a uniform rule of naturalization?

So how can a statute written after the Constitution was written have a higher standing than the Constitution?

In inverse order: It can't (have higher standing than the Constitution); I haven't researched the question but as far as I know and certainly as far as the Constitution goes, it (the authority of Congress is limited to naturalization) is.

That is what I thought I said.

If what you are asking is how he gets to be a citizen at birth without being under the naturalization power, the answer is I don't know; I haven't looked at international law and other authorities on the question and probably should; but I don't see that he does.

But--there is no reason Congress can't exercise its naturalization power to make a person a naturalized citizen at birth either; and I would see that as what the citizenship statutes do.

So if you thought he got in under a citizenship statute at birth, he became a citizen at birth--it is just that he is a naturalized citizen, not a Natural Born Citizen.

If that reasoning is sound, and it may not be correct, it is the answer to the Natural Born question as far as person's born outside the US.

Frankly, I think that casts doubt also on the ancient historical question as to Goldwater--how does Goldwater get to be Natural Born?

[randita]

Don’t forget the birther theory that mothers under a certain age can’t pass on citizenship, even if their kids are born in the US.

You cite yet another variant. The mother could be a Daughter of the American Revolution, but if the father was not a U.S. citizen at the time of the child's birth or if the child wasn't born in one of the 57 U.S. states, "no eligibility for you".

[9YearLurker]

There is a difference between a naturalized citizen and a natural born citizen. A naturalized citizen can be created by statute, but a natural born citizen is only such by circumstance.

[Smokeyblue]

So many Freepers so happy to destroy the Constitution.

Oh goody: Our next usurper is on the way.

Revealed: How immigrants are gaining U.S. citizenship by getting married on Skype - to people thousands of miles away

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2289177/Revealed-How-immigrants-using-Skype-weddings-gain-U-S-citizenship--saying-I-thousands-miles-away.html

Online global unions via webcam are the first step to attaining a visa or citizenship for a non-American spouse

Many fear that such proxy weddings will help facilitate marriage fraud, as well as see an increase in the number of sex trafficking victims

A rise in Skype weddings is allowing immigrants to legally gain American citizenship by exchanging vows from opposite ends of the globe, it was revealed today.