Posted on 03/17/2014 9:08:13 PM PDT by Swordmaker
Obfuscating. . . your claim was that Apple PAID for the regulation. . . then outsourced to avoid them. Apple has never had a union issue. They've always paid among the highest wages. Apple could leave high tax California, yet hasn't. Yes, they don't like the idiotic regulations, but did not move the manufacturing to avoid them. Study WHY THEY DID. . . it has a lot more to do with supply chain accessibility. . . and, as I said the ability to stay competitive. Apple no longer sells MacBook Pro at a starting price of $2495. They start at half that. They could not manufacture here, maintain the same quality AND sell at that price. Steve Jobs told that to Obama. . . and, yes, it has a lot to do with the regulatory environment. He also told him that getting a new standard assembly line going in China takes THREE MONTHS. . . compared to more than THREE YEARS here, and no tech company can survive in that environment.
Unfortunately, a LOT of those regulations grew under REPUBLICAN administrations as well as DEMOCRAT administrations. It's the nature of the bureaucratic beast to be productive when you give it the job of producing rules; it's going to be productive: good rules, bad rules, so-so rules, and completely TERRIBLE rules. . . In abundance. . . it's the one thing Government is GOOD at!
What do think makes the Android phone so "vastly superior?" I've helped friends with their problems with their Androids. . . and they were glad to finally get rid of their "superior Android" phones in favor of an iPhone that actually worked every time. So, exactly what makes the Android phones superior?
What the...you want to redefine what it means to stay competitive and then explain exactly what it means to stay competitive.
“...getting a new standard assembly line going in China takes THREE MONTHS. . . compared to more than THREE YEARS here, and no tech company can survive in that environment.”
No kidding, and of course, that’s the ONLY reason to build in China. You’d never do it to avoid US minimum wage laws, or skirt US health and labor regulations.
And by the way, you have only ONE quote from Steve Jobs meeting with Obama. There may be a second one out there, but it is abundantly clear that you do not have a transcript of the conversation, so acting like there was only one sentence uttered is as blind as we accuse the press of being.
We are just asking for facts, not myths without proof. We have experience WITH the products and when you guys tell us things we know are NOT true, based on total ignorance, on something you heard, and you do it with such assurance of your own superiority, it makes us angry because you just perpetuate the false stereotype that the FUD propagandists have been spreading. . . especially when the anti-Apple FUDsters claim Apple users are ignorant, when it is WE who have far more experience than most Windows users, as most of us are experienced on BOTH platforms! At this time, 90% of Mac users came from the Windows world. . . and to keep claiming that Apple users don't know anything about Windows is disingenuous as most of us have made a FAR MORE informed choice about buying a Mac than did those who own a Windows box. THEY are the ones who spout ignorant, ill-informed factoids about Apple products they have never touched, much less used. It is they who are the snobs.
When did you join the Democrat party?
By-the-way, Apple did not “build” a factory in China.
And by the way, what if I told you I liked the rules. I worked in two print shops where the air burned my eyes and throat. Both were staunch conservatives who wouldn’t even open a damn window for me. The mom and pop kinda place that we’re supposed to love. But they were not just exempt from the rules, they didn’t have the decency, as Christian “brothers” to as much as install a bathroom vent or at the very least keep the damn door closed between my office and the shop. One guys wife died of liver disease sitting in the same chair that I was now occupying. Non-smoker, non drinker. I like the rules. They didn’t apply to me. I was hired as a private contractor. No benefits. I really like the rules. Are they thriving now because they didn’t have to comply with those rules. No, both out of business.
You read off Apple Press Releases like they’re some kind of inerrant scripture. I could never do that. It’s just...weird.
“When did you join the Democrat party?”
You make a brilliant point. No, genius, that’s the approved term.
“By-the-way, Apple did not “build” a factory in China.”
So China built it for them? How sweet. And when the Geneva man shows up I’m sure they all have warm blankets too.
You really haven't a clue how this works, do you, "Genius?" Apple owns NO facilities in China. Just as HP, IBM, Microsoft, Google/Motorola, Sony, Samsung, and a host of other consumer electronics companies own no manufacturing facilities in China. Like those other companies, Apple contracts with a Chinese owned company to build Apple products to Apple's designs. . . and Apple's contract specifies that company MUST meet certain pay, environmental, work hours, and other standards, the other companies have NOT required. Apple sends monitors to assure the contractors comply and Apple has pulled Multi-billion dollar contracts from companies that did NOT COMPLY! So, leonard210, you really DON'T know anything at all about what you are blithering on about. It's a good thing ignorance is curable, by education. Failing to get educated, or refusing to do so, is STUPID. Don't stay ignorant, Leonard. Don't be one of the "low information" crowd!
No Leonard, I don't. I find out the facts from primary sources. YOU believe the propagandists. You bosses were stupid. They didn't understand enlightened self-interest. I do. . . and so does Apple.
“Apple’s contract specifies that company MUST meet certain pay, environmental, work hours, and other standards, the other companies have NOT required. Apple sends monitors to assure the contractors comply and Apple has pulled Multi-billion dollar contracts from companies that did NOT COMPLY!”
So Apple pay, environment, work hours and other standards in China are equivalent to US pay, environment, work hours and other standards? You are correct, I’m just an uneducated rube. Hey, I have an idea, if it’s all just same-same, why not build where you spent money on the politicians who wrote those glorious standards.
“I find out the facts from primary sources.”
You have such a cute way with words. I never noticed that before. So none of your primary sources are Apple Press Releases? Gee, I’d think that an Apple Press Release would be considered a primary source. Oh, there I go again, just demonstrating my ignorance.
“Apple’s contract specifies that company MUST meet certain pay, environmental, work hours, and other standards, the other companies have NOT required. Apple sends monitors to assure the contractors comply and Apple has pulled Multi-billion dollar contracts from companies that did NOT COMPLY!”
You claim that you and Apple understand “enlightened self-interest” and that they really put their foot down with those Chinese fellows and required them to meet “pay, environment, work hours, and other standards.” And that Apple is not really a big lefty company, they’re just a little left-ish. But when I rhetorically point out that companies would never “build” or shall I say, ship their manufacturing out of the country to avoid US minimum wage laws, or skirt US health and labor regulations, you immediately identified me as a Democrat. How does that work again?
Apple certainly is one of them. . . but I corroborate those with other sources. You ARE demonstrating your ignorance. Get an education. Don't assume you know what you're talking about. I have been following and reporting on Apple for thirty years. . . I am also a classically educated economist. I know what I'm talking about and it's clear you don't. You ASSUMED Apple built and owned factories in China. They don't. You assumed Apple pays wages in China to assembly line workers there. . . they don't. . . But they CAN require that the workers on their products get paid THREE TIMES the prevailing factory wage, but you STILL complain, because you haven't bothered to find out the facts! If that is not parading your ignorance,what is it???
Is there a competitor of Apple who has done better in this regard? I don’t believe there is.
As far as left-leaning, I also don’t believe anybody associated with Apple can hold a candle to Bill Gates.
So, I’m not sure what all the beating up of Apple on outsourcing and politics is intended to convey.
It works because you, so far seem to love every regulation the government foists on us. . . and think that's just good and dandy. Tell me Leonard, WHY didn't you open you own damn window???? Why wait for your bosses, or the government, to open it for you? That's what I do!
“Apple certainly is one of them. . . but I corroborate those with other sources.”
So you never quote an Apple Press Release unless you’ve corroborated it from where? How can you get more primary than the company? Do you have an insider that corroborates all your Apple facts? Wait, that would still be “the company”. See, you’re just so much better at this stuff than I am.
Quit with the snarky remarks, Leonard. You don’t do it very well. You look more and more like an insulting a Democrat with every post. I tire of you putting lies into my mouth.
“It works because you, so far seem to love every regulation the government foists on us. . . and think that’s just good and dandy. Tell me Leonard, WHY didn’t you open you own damn window???? Why wait for your bosses, or the government, to open it for you? That’s what I do!”
Now that’s just creepy dishonest. You’ve never had a real job, have you? Not only did I open a window, I bought an industrial air cleaner. And they closed the window. And it was part-time cause I have several chronic conditions and did the f-ing best I could. But I still paid out my own money for an air cleaner and recharges. And the struggle was to keep my invoices low enough to not lose that job while trying to balance the crappy air and cost of recharges. It’s real creepy of you to make those assumptions. Real creepy.
“I tire of you putting lies into my mouth.”
I have not put one lie in your mouth. I am using your own words to try to get you to clarify. When you snark and name call, I snark back. Don’t like it? Don’t do it.
I know you have a superior knowledge of Apple approved information, but by bringing other companies into the conversation you make my point. You’re saying, “See, they’re doing it too.” Doing what? Sending money and other forms of support to Democrats, who you admitted are not the only ones who write laws and regulations, while at the same time manufacturing their products in countries that will never have to adhere to the same draconian standards here. When you’re pointing at THEM, you seem to know it’s kinda bad, but when you look back at Apple, you have nothing but praise.
That’s almost as creepy as your lying about the circumstances of my life.
Disclaimer: Opinions posted on Free Republic are those of the individual posters and do not necessarily represent the opinion of Free Republic or its management. All materials posted herein are protected by copyright law and the exemption for fair use of copyrighted works.