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Why locating MH370 in the Southern Ocean is so difficult
Quartz ^ | March 24, 2014 | Erik van Sebille

Posted on 03/25/2014 6:27:58 AM PDT by don-o

Searching for the debris of flight MH370 in the Southern Ocean is not just a case of looking for a needle in a haystack; it is a case of searching for a needle that moves hundreds of kilometers every day in one of the most hostile and constantly changing areas in the world. +

To make matters worse, it is also one of the most remote locations on Earth. +

I should know, I’ve seen this myself.

(Excerpt) Read more at qz.com ...


TOPICS: Miscellaneous; Science
KEYWORDS: china; malaysia; mh370; waronterror
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SCIENCE!

This one may join Amelia Earhart as an unsolved mystery.

1 posted on 03/25/2014 6:27:58 AM PDT by don-o
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To: don-o

Regardless of the sea, the plane’s pilot did some pretty crazy acrobatics. Veering several times, climbing, descending, climbing again, over quite a time span. Yet, no contact from anyone with anyone, that we know of, even though the opportunity for communication was there. There was no mechanical problem here. High mischief was afoot!


2 posted on 03/25/2014 6:34:57 AM PDT by ArtDodger
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To: don-o

I think this is why this spot was chosen by those who took the airplane (most likely the crew). My personal guess is that they attempted to land the airplane in the water so that it would not break up (like U.S. Air on the Hudson). Sooner or later the plane would sink to the bottom of a very deep ocean in a part of the world that is difficult for ships to operate.


3 posted on 03/25/2014 6:36:15 AM PDT by ALPAPilot
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To: don-o

The whole thing smells fishy.


4 posted on 03/25/2014 6:38:23 AM PDT by BenLurkin (This is not a statement of fact. It is either opinion or satire; or both.)
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To: don-o

Because ... it’s not there?


5 posted on 03/25/2014 6:38:46 AM PDT by workerbee (The President of the United States is DOMESTIC ENEMY #1!)
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To: don-o

The article doesn’t quite spell out that search planes must accommodate fuel needs for the 3000 mile roundtrip from Perth. That doesn’t leave much fuel for extensive search time per flight.


6 posted on 03/25/2014 6:39:31 AM PDT by NautiNurse (Obama sends U.S. Marines to pick up his dog & basketballs. Benghazi? Nope.)
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To: NautiNurse
Until someone drags up a tail number my take is that someone stole an airplane.
7 posted on 03/25/2014 6:43:05 AM PDT by ANGGAPO (Layte Gulf Beach Club)
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To: NautiNurse

Well, that is outside the subject of the article. He’s giving us what conditions are being encountered.


8 posted on 03/25/2014 6:48:26 AM PDT by don-o (He will not share His glory and He will NOT be mocked! Blessed be the name of the Lord forever!)
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To: don-o

How can people doubt the always reliable Malaysian government? Nothing to see here...move along. Just like Benghazi?


9 posted on 03/25/2014 6:52:22 AM PDT by hal ogen (First Amendment or Reeducation Camp?)
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To: don-o
"This is the first time we have been asked to find something with just a single signal once an hour. It really is a great tribute to our scientific team that they were able to achieve this." InMarsat

So the Malaysians want to get the relatives out of town and off their hotel bill, staging this "loss of all hope," celebraconfirmation of the insurance pay-offs, with "analysis unlike anything that's ever been done before" to reconstruct the site at such an inhospitable point on their previously-drawn arc where any actual debris or cigar butt on the ocean can move a hundred kilometers in a day, such that nothing is likely EVER TO BE FOUND.

So much the better in the Malaysians' eyes.

Curious that there has never been mention of any ELT signal or black box ping originating from this human-forsaken place. So the Inmarsat guys were working to extrapolate a position off the last two or three pings, whose only location would be one of (reduced to two) arc points, guessed to be the southern, not northern one.

Has such a steaming pile of over-extrapolated information ever been foisted on the world?

Oh, yeah, it's been fooling hundreds of millions for over a decade and called "global warming,"

HF

10 posted on 03/25/2014 6:56:23 AM PDT by holden
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To: hal ogen
How can people doubt the always reliable Malaysian government?

The Malaysian government had to be dragged kicking and screaming out of the South China Sea and the Andaman Sea to this location.

They wanted to place the blame on mechanical failure and Boeing, but this location means that their pilot likely did it and it will cost them dearly now.

11 posted on 03/25/2014 7:04:48 AM PDT by Uncle Chip
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To: don-o

> Why locating MH370 in the Southern Ocean is so difficult
It would be difficult to find the plane in the Southern Ocean if the plane were parked on a tarmac in Northern Pakistan or Iran while it gets a new coat of paint.


12 posted on 03/25/2014 7:05:25 AM PDT by BuffaloJack (Freedom isn't free; nor is it easy. END ALL TOTALITARIAN ACTIVITY NOW.)
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To: don-o

MH370: Families Called to Urgent Meeting; Malaysia Press Conference 10 a.m. EDT 3/24/14
http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/f-news/3136667/posts

MALAYSIAN AUTHORITIES: The Plane Crashed With No Survivors
http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/f-news/3136697/posts

Malaysia Grand Prix pushes grieving families of jet passengers from hotel
http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/f-news/3136731/posts

Officials Say Missing Malaysia Airlines Plane “Ended in the Southern Indian Ocean”
http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/f-news/3136711/posts

WORLD NEWS Malaysia Airlines Flight 370 Ended in Indian Ocean, Prime Minister Says
http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/f-news/3136787/posts

How British satellite company Inmarsat tracked down MH370
http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/f-news/3136789/posts

Aussie Flight Disaster Film ‘Deep Water’ Shelved Over Eerie Resemblance to Missing Malaysia Flight
http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/f-chat/3136793/posts

Malaysia Airlines crash: Suicide mission theory of MH370 investigators
http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/f-news/3136904/posts

Flight 370: Storm of emotions over lives “lost” as storm at sea delays search
http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/f-news/3137006/posts

How a UK firm ... used a nineteenth century mathematical model to track missing flight MH370
http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/chat/3137015/posts


13 posted on 03/25/2014 7:09:36 AM PDT by Star Traveler (Remember to keep the Messiah of Israel in the One-World Government that we look forward to coming)
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To: don-o

And DB Cooper ... :-) ...


14 posted on 03/25/2014 7:10:02 AM PDT by Star Traveler (Remember to keep the Messiah of Israel in the One-World Government that we look forward to coming)
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To: BenLurkin

Yep ... there’s a lot of fish in the sea ... LOL ...


15 posted on 03/25/2014 7:10:54 AM PDT by Star Traveler (Remember to keep the Messiah of Israel in the One-World Government that we look forward to coming)
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To: don-o
Islam happens. Hardly need to know anything more. If every nut and bolt were recovered and if after months of study it was determined that the engines were defective or that there was a problem with stress fracturing, etc., everyone would be satisfied because remedial steps could be taken to ensure that it never happened again. But in this case, we don't need to recover a single nut or bolt to know all we need to know about what happened on that plane, or to comprehend any number of steps that could be taken to prevent it happening again.
16 posted on 03/25/2014 7:12:02 AM PDT by LibWhacker
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To: BuffaloJack

LOL AND DITTO!!!!


17 posted on 03/25/2014 7:12:17 AM PDT by Kit cat (OBummer must go)
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To: hal ogen

Well ... you might want to assess the dependability of Inmarsat and the AAIB (UK Air Accident Investigation Board) ... as they are the ones that put all the resources for searching, in this area — by their analysis.


18 posted on 03/25/2014 7:14:15 AM PDT by Star Traveler (Remember to keep the Messiah of Israel in the One-World Government that we look forward to coming)
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To: don-o
" is not just a case of looking for a needle in a haystack; it is a case of searching for a needle that moves hundreds of kilometers every day in one of the most hostile and constantly changing areas in the world."

To make matters worse, it is also one of the most remote locations on Earth.

Wait, are they talking about Michelle Obama's butt?

19 posted on 03/25/2014 7:14:40 AM PDT by chris37 (Heartless.)
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To: don-o

O’Reilly took a victory lap last night on his show on FoxNews, beating his chest yelling “I told you so a week ago”. I listened for a few minutes until it became apparent he was going to go on like that for the whole show.

For the sake of the people who lost loved ones, I hope the ‘black box’ is found to give them closure. It would also be sweet to prove the big blowhard O’Reilly wrong.


20 posted on 03/25/2014 7:15:55 AM PDT by shove_it (my real nickname is Otter)
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To: BuffaloJack

The only problem with your assessment is that Inmarsat and the AAIB (UK Air Accident Investigation Board) - with their analysis - puts the location of the plane in the present area where they are now searching.


21 posted on 03/25/2014 7:16:58 AM PDT by Star Traveler (Remember to keep the Messiah of Israel in the One-World Government that we look forward to coming)
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To: ArtDodger

Hmmm ... it sounds like he went off his Prozac ... LOL ...


22 posted on 03/25/2014 7:20:36 AM PDT by Star Traveler (Remember to keep the Messiah of Israel in the One-World Government that we look forward to coming)
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To: don-o
One of the unique features of the Southern Ocean is that it is the only place in the world where water can keep on moving eastward without ever hitting land. Because of this, and the strong winds, the water is swept along at very high speeds, sometimes almost 2m a second. This is much faster than any other place in the world.

+ At those high speeds, the current becomes unstable. It starts breaking up and forms eddies. These eddies are similar to the vortices you may see behind wakes in a river or the spiraling and treacherous winds that can form behind tall buildings in the inner city on a windy day.

Thanks for an interesting article.

23 posted on 03/25/2014 7:20:50 AM PDT by BunnySlippers (I LOVE BULL MARKETS . . .)
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To: shove_it
On O'Reilly, Goldberg Calls Out Fox News' MH370 Coverage

Just found a clip with Goldberg including Fox (and the General) in journalist malpractice

24 posted on 03/25/2014 7:21:31 AM PDT by don-o (He will not share His glory and He will NOT be mocked! Blessed be the name of the Lord forever!)
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To: don-o

“that moves hundreds of kilometers every day”

Wow, that’s a fast current. /sarcasm


25 posted on 03/25/2014 7:22:50 AM PDT by CodeToad (Keeping whites from talking about blacks is verbal segregation!)
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To: BunnySlippers

Does anyone know what “2m a second” is as a rate of speed?


26 posted on 03/25/2014 7:22:50 AM PDT by BunnySlippers (I LOVE BULL MARKETS . . .)
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To: CodeToad

Why the /sarc? Are you saying his facts are wrong? That we can dig into.

Can you add something to disprove?


27 posted on 03/25/2014 7:27:33 AM PDT by don-o (He will not share His glory and He will NOT be mocked! Blessed be the name of the Lord forever!)
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To: don-o

Oh God! Thy sea is so great and my boat is so small.


28 posted on 03/25/2014 7:34:45 AM PDT by centurion316
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To: All
Flight MH370 confirmed lost: experts respond

Here's a link to another page on the website of the OP with some possibly interesting Q & A.

29 posted on 03/25/2014 7:35:25 AM PDT by don-o (He will not share His glory and He will NOT be mocked! Blessed be the name of the Lord forever!)
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To: Star Traveler

DB Cooper is my favorite mystery.

:-)

.


30 posted on 03/25/2014 7:37:55 AM PDT by Mears
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To: BunnySlippers

2m sec = 120m minute = 7200m hour (7.2 kilometer/hour) = 172.8 km day = 107.136 statute miles day or 123.20 nautical miles/day


31 posted on 03/25/2014 7:39:21 AM PDT by DocRock (All they that TAKE the sword shall perish with the sword. Matthew 26:52 Gun grabbers beware.)
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To: BunnySlippers

How fast Superman has to run to get liftoff.


32 posted on 03/25/2014 7:40:03 AM PDT by Uncle Chip
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To: workerbee

That’s what I think too. Can’t find it in the ocean if its in a hanger somewhere.


33 posted on 03/25/2014 7:41:02 AM PDT by kjam22 (my music video "If My People" at https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=74b20RjILy4)
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To: Mears

Yep ... I was there in Portland, the night that it happened. And, you know DB got a certain distance (whether dead or alive) because of a small amount of money found near Portland - exposed by the river, many years later.

It’s still a great mystery. The last I heard, a few years ago, there was still an FBI agent “on the case”.


34 posted on 03/25/2014 7:42:20 AM PDT by Star Traveler (Remember to keep the Messiah of Israel in the One-World Government that we look forward to coming)
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To: don-o

Yes, I saw that last night. Goldberg and O’Reilly were right about the stupid ‘black hole’ speculation. The matter is not settled though. I’d still have hope if any of my loved ones was on that plane.


35 posted on 03/25/2014 7:45:00 AM PDT by shove_it (my real nickname is Otter)
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To: don-o

Everyone think this location is now settled, but not one of these debris pieces supposedly seen from satellite has been recovered.


36 posted on 03/25/2014 7:51:16 AM PDT by PGR88
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To: BunnySlippers

Its around 4.5 mph. Doesn’t sound fast...but its 100 miles a day, which can add up.


37 posted on 03/25/2014 7:53:07 AM PDT by lacrew (Mr. Soetoro, we regret to inform you that your race card is over the credit limit.)
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To: don-o

If you don’t know ocean currents it isn’t my job to educate you. Go do some research.


38 posted on 03/25/2014 8:03:06 AM PDT by CodeToad (Keeping whites from talking about blacks is verbal segregation!)
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To: DocRock; CodeToad

Thanks. So the “hundreds of kilometers” is not that far off - though “over a hundred” or nearly two hundreds” would have been better.


39 posted on 03/25/2014 8:09:18 AM PDT by don-o (He will not share His glory and He will NOT be mocked! Blessed be the name of the Lord forever!)
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Because it wasn’t there in the first place, second place, or last place.


40 posted on 03/25/2014 8:09:26 AM PDT by SunkenCiv (https://secure.freerepublic.com/donate/)
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To: SunkenCiv

What has happened to the “To” and “reply to post #” in your replies?


41 posted on 03/25/2014 8:34:28 AM PDT by don-o (He will not share His glory and He will NOT be mocked! Blessed be the name of the Lord forever!)
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To: don-o

The ocean eats things. It’s scary how often boats go down without a trace. The thing I’ve been pointing to on this is that it took us 6 weeks to find the Challenger’s cockpit and hundreds of cameras and all of NASA’s tracking equipment watched it happen. When you get a situation like this where basically nothing was watching when the plane went down the chances of it being found are basically zero. If it’s found it’ll be one of those random events, somebody will be doing the Cousteau in just the right place and find the tail.


42 posted on 03/25/2014 8:43:47 AM PDT by discostu (Call it collect, call it direct, call it TODAY!)
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To: All

Does anyone really believe that in the era of the hubble telescope, G.P.S. tracking and spy satellites that can read a license plate from space, that all the governments of the world couldn’t track or find a 300 foot airliner equipped with satellite technology? In the words of “INMARSAT” “NOT LIKELY”


43 posted on 03/25/2014 8:57:12 AM PDT by mulder1 ("The past is prologue")
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To: mulder1
Does anyone really believe that in the era of the hubble telescope,

Looking up - not down

G.P.S. tracking

Someone signal turn off

and spy satellites that can read a license plate from space,

License plate too small. Be like an ant on a football field.

that all the governments of the world couldn’t track or find a 300 foot airliner equipped with satellite technology?

Kinda looks that way.

44 posted on 03/25/2014 9:28:07 AM PDT by don-o (He will not share His glory and He will NOT be mocked! Blessed be the name of the Lord forever!)
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To: BuffaloJack

I foresee a news article a year or two from now with the headline “Could this be Flight MH370?” with photos of a 777 in some Middle East country painted in a different scheme and a blurred photo of a plane part showing a serial number specific to the lost plane.


45 posted on 03/25/2014 9:56:49 AM PDT by Rebelbase (Tagline: optional, printed after your name on post)
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To: mulder1

Things disappear in the ocean all the time. Ships go down in well traveled water and never get found. A lot of the stuff you’re point too means nothing. The Hubble doesn’t look at earth, GPS requires a device to be pinging satellites, spy satellites can read lots of fine detail AFTER you know where to point them. 300 feet of plain in in 28 MILLION square miles worth of ocean (assuming it went down in the Indian Ocean like Inmarsat thinks) is basically invisible. Even if we drop it to the Southern Indian Ocean now you’ve “reduced” the zone to 14 million square miles.

This is reality not a TV show, mysteries don’t get solved in 42 minutes in reality. Out in reality mysteries often never get solved.


46 posted on 03/25/2014 10:04:20 AM PDT by discostu (Call it collect, call it direct, call it TODAY!)
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To: discostu
Then I guess we need out taxpayer money back. All of these great boastings about satellite technology are buls__t. Just another excuse for GOVERNMENT & BIG CORPORATIONS to steal our money.
47 posted on 03/25/2014 10:12:02 AM PDT by mulder1 ("The past is prologue")
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To: mulder1

They aren’t BS at all. They just don’t apply to this situation. They’re useful for looking at things we KNOW where to look. We look at military bases of known enemies all the time, they’re good for that, we know where the bases are. This went down in the middle of nowhere. The last time anything interesting happened in this part of the world was never. There was simply no reason to have of our satellites looking there, even if they were passing over at just the right moment they weren’t taking pictures because pictures of empty ocean are a waste of bits. The only BS in all this is coming out of you expecting all the world to work like an NCIS episode.


48 posted on 03/25/2014 10:19:45 AM PDT by discostu (Call it collect, call it direct, call it TODAY!)
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To: BunnySlippers

>>, the water is swept along at very high speeds, sometimes almost 2m a second.

It starts breaking up and forms eddies. <<

Around and around in a circle -— at very high speeds, sometimes almost 2m a second.


49 posted on 03/25/2014 11:06:33 AM PDT by B4Ranch (Name your illness, do a Google & YouTube search with "hydrogen peroxide". Do it and be surprised.)
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To: don-o

They were on that plane that went down.


50 posted on 03/25/2014 11:32:38 AM PDT by SunkenCiv (https://secure.freerepublic.com/donate/)
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