"Naked" Miss Afghanistan slammed (Shut-Up Burqa Boys, she lives in the Land of the Free)

AFP via Melbourne Herald Sun ^ | 27 October 2003

[Alter Kaker]

Then we have white slavery which is endemic through the Muslim Middle East. There, when a girl or woman walks unclothed in front of others, it is not of her free will, but because she is about to be purchased.

This is whole other topic than that initially argumented, but I have seen no "evidence" for this contention. Rumors of "white slavery" have long abounded (and were widespread belief in 19th century), but is this more common than Chinese "slaves" in America or Albanian and Moldovan slaves in Italy or Israel? In part of Africa (Mauritania) this is certainly case, but I see no evidence in "mainstream" Arab Muslim countries.

You people put me in amusing position defending Arabs, but I do not mind. Legitimate criticism is better than libels.

[John O]

Jesus was carpenter. All Christians are followers of Jesus. Therefore all Christians try to be carpenters? Logic is interesting

You really don't want to get into a comparison of Jesus vs mohammed.

Jesus was a good and holy man. He fulfilled the law perfectly. He did not lie, cheat, or steal (that is, He did not sin). All Christians are followers of Jesus. Therefore all Christians try to be like Jesus.

Jesus left behind a group of followers who have changed the world into a better place, and who continue to do so.

Mohammed on the other hand was a low-life dictator who lied, cheated, stole and raped his way to power. Taking every advantage of his allies, his followers and anyone else stupid enough to believe him.

Mohammed left behind a group of followers whose main achievement is terror and mass murder and holding people in the stone age.

[Alter Kaker]

You really don't want to get into a comparison of Jesus vs mohammed.

No I don't, since I have no use for either. My point was to illustrate demented attempt at logical thinking on your part. Not every aspect of Jesus life is to be emulated (like being carpenter) just as not every aspect of Mohammed life is to be emulated by those devout. If you say otherwise, you are being silly.

Therefore all Christians try to be like Jesus.

Therefore all Christians should be carpenters? I do not understand. You look for Jesus' teachings as example, but Mohammed's practice. Seems like double standard to this third party.

[Snardius]

Oh...my...Argentina! Argentina!!

[SarahW]

Unam Sanctimonious, choose your own dress. You've got no right to dictate hers.

[Snardius]

Pitter-patter goes my heart...
For the lovely Miss Argentina.

[Bob J]

Surabi said according to Afghan culture women should not demonstrate their worth using their "beauty or bodies" but by their skills and knowledge.

Except of course when they strap 50 lbs of TNT to their bosoms...

[finnman69]

[Unam Sanctam]

I am not dictating her dress. But I have EVERY RIGHT to express my opinion. I also have my right to my beliefs. I have a right to be sanctimonious if I wish. I know that you modern promiscuous sex-promoting anti-religious bigots feel that you can spew hatred of traditional religious believers with impunity, but then cry for censorship if any traditional religious believer so much as expresses his or her opinion. Frankly, dressing like Madonna or Britney Spears is a step backward for women. The sexual revolution had a victim, and it is women, since it freed men from any obligations to commitment. That's what I believe and what I will continue to believe. I am simply saying that this is not progress for women or for Afghanistan, plus it is unwise to provide propaganda for the Taliban, particularly since the new regime is not yet secure. But apparently the model dwells in the US and did it of her own accord, so there is nothing one can do about it. However, I still believe it unwise, and if she falsely acted as if she was officially representing her government, then that is dishonest.

[traumer]

First, give her some food.....

[Fzob]

< snip >

"Appearing naked before a camera or television is not women's freedom but in my opinion is to entertain men," Minister Habiba Surabi said.

"We condemn Vida Samadzai, she is not representing Afghanistan's women, and this is not women's freedom."

Surabi said according to Afghan culture women should not demonstrate their worth using their "beauty or bodies" but by their skills and knowledge.

"In the name of women's freedom, what this Afghan girl has done is not freedom but is lascivious," the minister said.

< snip >

Outside of the technical issue that she is not naked, I'm finding it hard to find something in these statements I strongly disagree with. Calling her lascivious is a bit over the top though.

[John O]

You look for Jesus' teachings as example, but Mohammed's practice. Seems like double standard to this third party.

Actually we look both to Jesus' teachings and to his practice. He was flawless in both. He was a carpenter, he earned His own living. That is something to be followed.

Also, my understanding of the koran and the rest of the islamic writings is that every aspect of mohammed's life was to be emulated.

[Alter Kaker]

Also, my understanding of the koran and the rest of the islamic writings is that every aspect of mohammed's life was to be emulated.

And this is as metaphoric in Islam as is in Christianty. You are not expected to live exactly like Mohammed just as not all Christian is expected to live exactly like Jesus by being carpenter and living in desert and dying as martyr and whatnot. You cannot impose flexibility in analysis of your own religion while holder stricter scruples to others.

[SarahW]

Bikinis did not free men from having to "commit".

You have a right to be called sanctimonious, and wrong. By me.

Who is censoring you, anyway? Just mind your own dress, if you feel it protects you from your sin nature. (It doesn't.)

[SarahW]

If the muslim faith weren't so legalistic, with submission of the will via mind-numbing rules and regulations its object, I might take you more seriously.

[Alter Kaker]

Yes, Islamic faith is stupid religion. This is all seperate from original point which is that it is stupid to make blanket statement about Muslims being pedophiles and homosexuals when such things seem not more common in Islam countries than in West.

[Clemenza]

Check out #66

[Unam Sanctam]

So I suppose because there are no such demonstrations we should give up trying to help build a humane and democratic society in Afghanistan and Iraq? Should we exclude even the possibility of an enlightened version of Islam? Should we just nuke all the inhabitants of Afghanistan and Iraq because they are Moslems, or should we try to continue the great long term project of President Bush in trying to help the Moslems see a better way? The President and National Security Rice have a wiser and more prudent course than those who simply want to write off Moslems as a whole.

[MegaSilver]

And the downside to this is...?

While I personally think that a Miss Afghanistan is perfectly fine, it's not like we want to be *ostracizing* Muslims. Yes, it is a political religion. Yes, it is conductive to violent behavior. But let's tackle the problem as tastefully as we can; let's not give extremist Arabs a reason to hate us even more than they do.