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Many see Bush immigration proposals as non-starter (Proposal Faces "Fierce" Resistence In House)
Reuters ^ | 01.07.04 | Alan Elsner

Posted on 01/07/2004 2:27:14 PM PST by Pubbie

WASHINGTON (Reuters) - President Bush dived into a heated political debate on Wednesday by proposing to create a class of legal "guest workers" in the United States, but analysts said it was doubtful the blueprint could gain congressional approval in this election year.

In a carefully balanced speech, Bush proposed giving some of the estimated 8 million to 14 million illegal immigrants in the country a way to gain three-year temporary work permits, but offered them no clear path to becoming U.S. citizens.

"Our laws should allow willing foreigners to enter our country and fill jobs that Americans are not filling. We must make our immigration laws more rational and more humane," Bush declared.

The proposal seemed calculated to win Bush Hispanic support ahead of the November presidential election while pleasing employers looking for workers to fill mainly manual, agricultural or low paid service jobs.

"The hype and misinformation that this speech will fuel in the immigrant community will be huge. Unfortunately, the excitement will far outweigh the real effect," said Jeff Goldman, an immigration lawyer with Testa, Hurwitz and Thibeault in Boston.

Bush was at pains to declare he was not offering amnesty for people who entered the United States illegally, but opponents of making concessions to the immigrants said that was exactly what he had done.

"This clearly is an amnesty. It provides not only amnesty but a reward for people who committed a felony by coming here illegally," said Rep. Elton Gallegly, a California Republican.

"There will be substantial opposition from Republicans, Democrats and millions of ordinary Americans once they realize what's involved," Gallegly told Reuters.

CAUTIOUS BACKING

While the proposals won some cautious backing from Hispanic groups and immigration backers, some analysts were doubtful that Bush would put much political muscle behind them in the face of fierce opposition from many in his own Republican political base.

"I don't think it's serious. Bush knows the politics. These proposals don't go far enough for most Democrats and they go too far for around 70 to 100 Republicans in the House of Representatives," said Steven Camarota, research director at the Center for Immigration Studies, which favors more stringent limits on immigration.

"Republican leaders in Congress won't want to bring up this issue, especially this year, because it divides them. Unless Bush twists their arms hard, this is going nowhere," he said.

Legal and illegal immigration to the United States, already at record levels in the 1990s, accelerated further after 2000 despite the economic slowdown, according to U.S. Census data.

From 2000 to 2002, net immigration to the United States averaged around 1.4 million per year, about half a million of whom entered or stayed in the country illegally.

Bush, who won around 35 percent of the Hispanic vote in 2000, would like to raise that proportion to 40 percent or higher this year. Even if he does nothing to push the proposals, the President will be able to incorporate them into his campaign message aimed at Hispanics.

"This makes no sense except political sense. It reeks of bad policy but screams of politics," said David Ray, assistant director of the Federation for American Immigration Reform, a group campaigning for sharply reduced levels of immigration.

FAIR argued that the plan undermined homeland security, granted an amnesty for law-breakers, established a back door immigration program and threatened the jobs and wages of American workers.

On the other side of the debate, immigration backers were disappointed that the plan offered no clear path for illegal immigrants to become citizens.

"The initial proposal falls short in helping newcomers become fully integrated into our society, but we look forward to working with the administration and Congress to shape the final legislation," said Leonard Glickman, president of the Hebrew Immigrant Aid Society, the country's oldest migration organization.


TOPICS: Extended News; Politics/Elections
KEYWORDS: aliens; amnesty; guestworker; guestworkers; immigrantlist; immigration
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"This clearly is an amnesty. It provides not only amnesty but a reward for people who committed a felony by coming here illegally," said Rep. Elton Gallegly, a California Republican.

"There will be substantial opposition from Republicans, Democrats and millions of ordinary Americans once they realize what's involved," Gallegly told Reuters."

Go Gallegly! Go!

1 posted on 01/07/2004 2:27:15 PM PST by Pubbie
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To: All
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Thanks for donating to Free Republic!

Move your locale up the leaderboard!

2 posted on 01/07/2004 2:27:34 PM PST by Support Free Republic (If Woody had gone straight to the police, this would never have happened!)
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To: Pubbie
Contact these GOP Congressmen - we need to flood their Fax machines and phone lines!

***REPUBLICAN HOUSE JUDICIARY COMMITTEE MEMBERS***




*Chairman Of The Committee, James Sensenbrenner*

Washington, D.C. Office
To write about issues pending in Congress, internships, flags, or tours, contact:
2449 Rayburn House Office Building
Washington, D.C. 20515-4905
Telephone: (202) 225-5101

My e-mail address is sensenbrenner@mail.house.gov.
If you contact me through e-mail, please include your postal mailing address.

*Henry Hyde*

Washington D.C.
2110 Rayburn House Office Building
Washington D.C. 20515
Phone: (202) 225-4561
Fax: (202) 225-1166

*Howard Coble*

Washington, DC
2468 Rayburn House Office Building
Washington, DC 20515-3306
Phone: 202.225.3065
Fax: 202.225.8611

EMAIL: howard.coble@mail.house.gov

*Lamar Smith*

Washington D.C. Office
2231 Rayburn House Office Building
Washington, DC 20515
202-225-4236
202-225-8628 fax

*Elton Gallegly*

Office of Congressman Elton Gallegly
2427 Rayburn HOB
Washington, DC 20515-0523 Phone: (202) 225-5811
FAX: (202) 225-1100

*Bob Goodlatte*

Washington, DC Office:
2240 Rayburn House Office Building
Washington, DC 20515
(202) 225-5431
(202) 225-9681 fax

*Steve Chabot*

Washington Office

129 Cannon House Office Building
Washington, D.C. 20515

(202) 225-2216
(202) 225-3012 (fax)

*Bill Jenkins*

Congressman Bill Jenkins
1207 Longworth Office Building
Washington, D.C. 20515
Phone No. (202) 225-6356
Fax. (202) 225-5714

*Chris Cannon*

Washington Office
118 Cannon House
Office Building
Washington, DC 20515
Phone: (202) 225-7751
Fax: (202) 225-5629
Email: cannon.ut03@mail.house.gov

*Spencer Bachus*

Washington, D.C. Office
442 Cannon Building
Washington, D.C. 20515
202 225-4921 phone
202 225-2082 fax

*John Hostettler*

Washington, DC Office
1214 Longworth House Office Building Washington, DC 20515
TEL: (202) 225-4636
FAX: (202) 225-3284

Email- John.Hostettler@mail.house.gov

*Mark Green*

Congressman Mark Green
1314 Longworth Bldg.
Washington, D.C. 20515
Phone: (202) 225-5665
Fax: (202) 225-5729

Mark.Green@mail.house.gov

*Ric Keller*

Washington Office:

419 Cannon House Office Building
Washington, D.C. 20515
Phone (202) 225-2176
Fax (202) 225-0999

*Melissa Hart*

Washington, DC Office
1508 Longworth House Office Building
Washington, DC 20515
Ph. 202-225-2565
Fx. 202-226-2274

*Jeff Flake*

Washington, DC Office Address:

424 Cannon House Office Building
Washington, D.C. 20515-0301


(202) 225-2635 - phone
(202) 226-4386 - fax

*Mike Pence*

In Washington DC
1605 Longworth HOB
Washington, DC 20515
(202) 225-3021 office
(202) 225-3382 fax

*J. Randy Forbes*

WASHINGTON DC OFFICE
307 Cannon House Office Building
Washington, DC 20515
Phone: 202-225-6365
Fax: 202-226-1170

*Steve King*

Washington, D.C. Office
Office of Congressman Steve King
1432 Longworth Office Building
Washington D.C. 20515
(202) 225-4426
Fax: (202) 225-3193

*John Carter*

Washington, D.C. Office
408 CHOB
Washington, D.C. 20515
(202) 225-3864

*Tom Feeney*

Washington, D.C. Office

323 Cannon House Office Building
Washington DC 20515
phone:(202) 225-2706
fax:(202) 226-6299

*Marsha Blackburn*

509 Cannon House Office Building
Washington, D.C. 20515
202-225-2811
202-225-3004 fax
3 posted on 01/07/2004 2:28:07 PM PST by Pubbie (* Bill Owens 2008 *)
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To: Pubbie
"There will be substantial opposition from Republicans, Democrats and millions of ordinary Americans once they realize what's involved," Gallegly told Reuters.

He's right. Wouldn't it be ironic if this is the first bill GWB vetoes?

4 posted on 01/07/2004 2:29:46 PM PST by rintense
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To: Pubbie
There is a GOD, There is a GOD!
5 posted on 01/07/2004 2:30:54 PM PST by chicagolady (Jesus, Be my Magnificent Obsession)
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To: rintense
Bush is hopeless on this issue - we need to call Congressmen where there is the most opposition to this thing - Don't Give Up!!!
6 posted on 01/07/2004 2:31:37 PM PST by Pubbie (* Bill Owens 2008 *)
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To: chicagolady
Don't Give Up the Ghost Yet - The Battle Has Just Begun!!!
7 posted on 01/07/2004 2:32:07 PM PST by Pubbie (* Bill Owens 2008 *)
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To: Pubbie
Go Mr. G go!! Stop this BS in its tracks!
8 posted on 01/07/2004 2:32:16 PM PST by KantianBurke (Don't Tread on Me)
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To: rintense
Its all calculated...No one said Bush isnt smart. It is not going to go through congress. And look at the last line of the proposal. "CONGRESS" has to write the legislation. This is doomed before it even starts...
9 posted on 01/07/2004 2:32:38 PM PST by futureceo31
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To: Pubbie
I think this program is ok if:

1. Federal and State income tax is withheld.
2. Medicaid fees are added as well as local town taxes to cover uninsured medical services.
3. A foreign worker payroll tax taken by local towns to cover the cost of educating the children.

In theory, this will help to pay for the "free" services given to illegals.

And, IMO, they do perform the jobs that nobody except felons, who can't get anything else, want.
10 posted on 01/07/2004 2:33:02 PM PST by 1stFreedom
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To: *immigrant_list; A Navy Vet; Lion Den Dan; Free the USA; Libertarianize the GOP; madfly; B4Ranch; ..
ping
11 posted on 01/07/2004 2:33:48 PM PST by gubamyster
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To: futureceo31
That's what I said on another thread, half joking. If Congress has to sort this out, it will never make it to the President's desk. And all he has to do is say he tried. Boo hoo.
12 posted on 01/07/2004 2:34:03 PM PST by rintense
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To: futureceo31
That's what I said on another thread, half joking. If Congress has to sort this out, it will never make it to the President's desk. And all he has to do is say he tried. Boo hoo.
13 posted on 01/07/2004 2:34:06 PM PST by rintense
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To: rintense
From the remarks I heard on talk shows dem's are all for this proposal and actually support it.
HUH? Why one has to ask?

Know what? As a Republican I can honestly say I do not support this proposal I am very much against it! Not that my opinion counts I guess.
14 posted on 01/07/2004 2:34:23 PM PST by stopem
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To: Pubbie
No taxes for our persecution
No taxes for Political Alibis

No selective prosecution of Americans
No selective Amnesty of Illegals

Amnesty for Americans
Save America, pay no taxes for your persecution
No taxes for persecuting children with your idols
The end is neigh, help your soldier, not the Political alibis

AMERICA IS NOT ZIMBABWE!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
No selective prosecution of Americans
No selective Amnesty of Illegals
15 posted on 01/07/2004 2:34:29 PM PST by JudgemAll
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To: rintense
And look at all the knee jerk reactions. Call Bush even Clinton. I mean, give me a break... He has tried to do things that he talked about in his campaign, and guess what is going to happen now.. The media is going to play to how the repbs are dissatisfied, and we know repbs will either vote for Bush or sit out the election and takes away attention from the Democrats... Beautiful....
16 posted on 01/07/2004 2:35:37 PM PST by futureceo31
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To: stopem
The irony is just so... ironic! A Republican proposes it, the Dems love it, and the Republicans hate it. It will never make it out of the House. Of course, we can always count on our RINO friends in the Senate to vote with the Dems. Perhaps, just perhaps, GWB will use his veto power! Once can dream, huh?
17 posted on 01/07/2004 2:37:02 PM PST by rintense
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To: JudgemAll
Its not going to happen. Read his speech. "Congress" is going to write the legislation. Who writes legislation in Congress. The repbs and they are definelty against it and Bush is not going to strong arm them to do this...
18 posted on 01/07/2004 2:37:33 PM PST by futureceo31
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To: Pubbie
I sure hope the House deep sixes GW's proposal. I admire this President but this is just hard to comprehend.
19 posted on 01/07/2004 2:37:58 PM PST by PISANO (God Bless our Troops........They will not TIRE - They will not FALTER - They will not FAIL!!!!!)
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To: Pubbie
It's a non-starter because there isn't much IN there.
20 posted on 01/07/2004 2:41:00 PM PST by cake_crumb (UN Resolutions = Very Expensive, Very SCRATCHY Toilet Paper)
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To: PISANO
I like Bush too, but this plan MUST be defeated or severely watered down or else the GOP will be the minority party for the next 50 years.
21 posted on 01/07/2004 2:41:06 PM PST by Pubbie (* Bill Owens 2008 *)
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To: cake_crumb
"It's a non-starter because there isn't much IN there."

What do mean? I thought Bush gave detailed proposals (Though he isn't sending a specific bill to Congress)
22 posted on 01/07/2004 2:42:03 PM PST by Pubbie (* Bill Owens 2008 *)
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To: futureceo31
Well, I am vehemently opposed for any blanket amnesty. That didn't happen. I do have a problem with rewarding those who are already illegal with another three years. There are just too many unanswered questions about this proposal. And I know we can count on Congress to screw it all up anyway. So I'll take a wait and see approach until the details are revealed.
23 posted on 01/07/2004 2:42:53 PM PST by rintense
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To: Pubbie
VIVA EL PRESIDENTE! VIVA EL COMMANDANTE JORGE!
24 posted on 01/07/2004 2:43:05 PM PST by CaptIsaacDavis (.)
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To: rintense
Wish everyone else would see this the way you and I do. As the speech indicates, Congress HAS TO WRITE the legistlation. I dont see anything coming out of it...
25 posted on 01/07/2004 2:44:36 PM PST by futureceo31
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To: CaptIsaacDavis
THE SCHEME SETS UP A STRUCTURE TO LET COMPANIES PUT LABOR OUT THE LOWEST BIDDER!
26 posted on 01/07/2004 2:44:39 PM PST by CaptIsaacDavis (.)
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To: Pubbie
I'm as opposed to illegal immigration as the next guy, and agree that amnesties end up rewarding those who broke the law instead of waiting for their turn to emigrate legally, but I think a guest-worker program, in theory, is a great idea. You give them permission to work for, say, 24 months, and they can apply for permission to work for another 24 months; if they don't follow the rules, they get deported. But guest workers' time in the U.S. would not count towards the time required to become a citizen; if they want eventual citizenship, they would need to apply for a visa and then pay their dues just like everyone else. And their "social security" money would be deposited in a Mexican bank, which they would only be able to access when they go back home when their guest-worker permit runs out, so they wouldn't be able to stay in the U.S. living off their savings. The hardest part would be what to do with their family, since if we let their wives join them in the U.S. any children born north of the Rio Grande would be U.S. citizens pursuant to the prevailing interpretation of the 14th Amendment. I would prefer if their family has to stay in Mexico, and they can send them money and visit them once in a while. Americans who are stationed in an aircraft carrier or in the Korean DMZ can't bring along their wives, so I don't see why we can't expect guest workers to live away from their families for 2 years or so.

Most Mexicans come over to the U.S. to work, not to try to collect welfare. And we certainly need workers for many industries in which native-born Americans refuse to work. I don't see why we can't accomodate Mexican guest workers, while protecting our right to decide who can enter our country and who can become a U.S. citizen.
27 posted on 01/07/2004 2:47:07 PM PST by AuH2ORepublican (Extremism in the defense of liberty is no vice, moderation in the pursuit of justice is no virtue.)
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To: Pubbie
"This clearly is an amnesty. It provides not only amnesty but a reward for people who committed a felony by coming here illegally," said Rep. Elton Gallegly, a California Republican.

Oh, no, but it's not an amnesty. George W. Bush says it's not an amnesty, so therefore it's not an amnesty.

I think the problem is that the President thinks that all those illegals are going to herewith obey the law, which is the only way the program would work. Otherwise, they'll milk the benefits and continue to take money under the table and our borders will be overrun in even greater numbers of illegals.

28 posted on 01/07/2004 2:49:30 PM PST by JoeSchem
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To: Pubbie
You'd think California Republicans, if any at all, would understand the scope of the illegal alien problem.

Thank God Elton does, but so many others have gone the way of David Dreier and are "establishment", they go along with Bush and sell out.

Hopefully enough Republican voters will remind them all who their real bosses are and demand they not support amnesty, or they lose their next election.
29 posted on 01/07/2004 2:50:08 PM PST by StoneColdGOP (McClintock - In Your Heart, You Know He's Right)
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To: AuH2ORepublican
Those Immigrants will become citizens in a couple of years under this plan - and when they are citizens they will vot 80% Democrat and the Republicans will be WIPED OUT as a political force in the country.
30 posted on 01/07/2004 2:50:16 PM PST by Pubbie (* Bill Owens 2008 *)
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To: CaptIsaacDavis
VIVA EL PRESIDENTE! VIVA EL COMMANDANTE JORGE!

Shut up, Subcommandante Marcos!

31 posted on 01/07/2004 2:54:48 PM PST by navyblue
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To: futureceo31
Yes. The Republicans in Congress will stop this...just like CFR. Or, they will indeed stop it, and be painted as racist xenophobes by the Democrat media.

Karl Rove's genius has failed here.
32 posted on 01/07/2004 2:55:11 PM PST by IGOTMINE (All we are saying... is give guns a chance!)
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To: 1stFreedom
"1. Federal and State income tax is withheld. "
It would have to be, just like everyone else.

"2. Medicaid fees are added as well as local town taxes to cover uninsured medical services."
Ditto for Medicaid.

"3. A foreign worker payroll tax taken by local towns to cover the cost of educating the children. "
This is one of those common misconceptions. Schools are usually paid for with property taxes or state revenues. So even now, if the worker is renting or buying a home, he/she pays local property taxes (taxes are figured into rent, believe me). You might have constitutional problems with additional taxes focused just on foreign workers for the same services everyone else receives; they would be paying twice for the same service.

"In theory, this will help to pay for the "free" services given to illegals. "
Under this program, they would not be "illegals", they would be here legally; and they would already be paying for those "free" services the same way you do - through income, property and sales taxes.

33 posted on 01/07/2004 2:58:30 PM PST by CA Conservative
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To: All
This may not be what we all want, but it's not as bad as some had thought it would be. From a homeland security aspect alone, this helps in my opinion.

The workers are going to find a way to be here anyway. This at least will help to know who they are. (the ones that legally participate anyway.) I would rather see it happen this way. I have been on scene when one of those trucks full of dead men who just wanted to work, were found. It is a heartbreaking sight.

My ex-husband is a Border Patrol agent, with a high level homeland security position and he says it will help. I believe him. He has a strong tendency towards negativity a lot of issues. So, if this doesn't raise alarms in him, I'm not going to let it alarm me.
34 posted on 01/07/2004 2:59:57 PM PST by texasflower (in the event of the rapture.......the Bush White House will be unmanned)
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To: CA Conservative
>> You might have constitutional problems with additional taxes focused just on foreign workers for the same services everyone else receives; they would be paying twice for the same service.

Not really. Non-citizens don't enjoy the same rights as citizens -- though the 14th amendment does give them some level of rights.

35 posted on 01/07/2004 3:00:49 PM PST by 1stFreedom
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To: stopem
From the remarks I heard on talk shows dem's are all for this proposal and actually support it.

Then you and I listen to different talk shows. The Dems hate it because it doesn't grant permanent residency, citizenship or voting rights to these people. By registering these people as foreign workers, it identifies them, and makes vote fraud that much more difficult.

36 posted on 01/07/2004 3:01:21 PM PST by CA Conservative
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To: futureceo31
No one said Bush isn't smart

You can't be serious?? Bush gone in four is a smart move??

37 posted on 01/07/2004 3:02:20 PM PST by org.whodat (Someone turn Bush over he's done.)
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To: CaptIsaacDavis
THE SCHEME SETS UP A STRUCTURE TO LET COMPANIES PUT LABOR OUT THE LOWEST BIDDER!

And the problem with that is...???? I belive that is called "capitalism", a very conservative concept.

38 posted on 01/07/2004 3:02:50 PM PST by CA Conservative
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To: IGOTMINE
The supreme court let us down on CFR. Remember McCain was all for it and if this hadnt happened, there is no telling what he might have done. Enough idiots still support him and he might have run in the primaries. Suffice it to say that the legislation as per what Bush said, HAS TO BE WRITTEN in Congress and this is not coming from the senate.
39 posted on 01/07/2004 3:03:08 PM PST by futureceo31
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To: CA Conservative
"makes vote fraud that much more difficult."

Are you kidding? You hear that part when Bush said they can "travel freely" and "documents that we take for granted?" He meant Drivers' Lisc. In most states all you need to vote is to show ur Driver's Lisc. Thank you for playing.

40 posted on 01/07/2004 3:03:52 PM PST by KantianBurke (Don't Tread on Me)
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To: org.whodat
Has not happened yet. This was the same cries when he did CFR and no child left behind. He promised CFM, education reform, immigration reform in his campaign. Just forgetting about it is not going to make the issue go away and deporting all illegal immigrants is not going to happen. So someone has to stand up and "TRY" to do something about it. I would much rather have Bush do it than a Dim...thats for sure...
41 posted on 01/07/2004 3:04:59 PM PST by futureceo31
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To: CaptIsaacDavis
I am confused. Isnt the 'free market' a system where companies try to find the lowest bidder and workers try to find the highest wage?


So this is the free market. hmmm.
42 posted on 01/07/2004 3:06:04 PM PST by WOSG
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To: 1stFreedom
And, IMO, they do perform the jobs that nobody except felons, who can't get anything else, want.

That is not true. The economics is was taught says's that if you cannot get someone to work at a certain level you raise the pay. Next, all those little illegals that come here under this amnesty deal will have little women whelping and what is the legal status then?

43 posted on 01/07/2004 3:06:50 PM PST by org.whodat (Someone turn Bush over he's done.)
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To: 1stFreedom
Not really. Non-citizens don't enjoy the same rights as citizens -- though the 14th amendment does give them some level of rights.

True, but the right to a public education is one of those that the courts have already upheld, whether or notwe agree with that.

44 posted on 01/07/2004 3:08:14 PM PST by CA Conservative
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To: org.whodat
Next, all those little illegals that come here under this amnesty deal will have little women whelping...

You are the type of person that gives conservatives a bad name. That is a very demeaning and derogatory turn of phrase, implying that these people are animals of some sort, less than human.

BTW, under this program, they won't be "illegals".. get that through your head.

45 posted on 01/07/2004 3:12:38 PM PST by CA Conservative
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To: KantianBurke
He meant Drivers' Lisc. In most states all you need to vote is to show ur Driver's Lisc. Thank you for playing.

Soon to be made MUCH easier in Califonia once Mr. Schwarzenegger signs the "right version" of the law to give illegals licenses.

46 posted on 01/07/2004 3:12:46 PM PST by StoneColdGOP (McClintock - In Your Heart, You Know He's Right)
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To: CA Conservative
Non-citizens have more rights in public education than citizens. In California the average dollar amount per year spent on a citizen child is roughly $3500. The amount paid per immigrant child is $7000. To attend college in California, if you are an out of state American citizen, you have to pay out of state tuition which is often double or more of in state tution. Illegal immigrants pay in state tutition, and often get the tab picked up for their education completely.

So you see, non-citizens really do have an advantage.
47 posted on 01/07/2004 3:15:17 PM PST by hedgetrimmer
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To: rintense
MESSAGES SENT to all you listed plus those from my own address book. Thanks for the reminder and list!
Regards,
Penny
48 posted on 01/07/2004 3:16:36 PM PST by Penny
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To: hedgetrimmer

Silly Rabit! Laws, taxes and rules are for chumps!

49 posted on 01/07/2004 3:18:45 PM PST by KantianBurke (Don't Tread on Me)
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To: Pubbie

50 posted on 01/07/2004 3:20:34 PM PST by Prime Choice (Americans are a spiritual people. We're happy to help members of al Qaeda meet God.)
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