Archaeologists Uncover Ancient Maritime Spice Route Between India, Egypt

Popular Science ^ | 2-8-2004

[VadeRetro]

There seem to be two different traditions about Prester John, one putting him in Africa and one in Asia. Both seem to be rooted in the existence of Christian communities, Copts in Africa and Nestorians in Asia.

[Chris Talk]

In saying there was no reference to Asia or its trade in Columbus' contract with the Monarchs, which is the best evidence of what he intended to find, and why...

I by no means meant anything so trivial as that the WORD "Asia" did not appear in it, which of course did often mean Anatolia in those days. I meant, of course, that there was no reference under any name to any part of what we call Asia, nor any evidence that any such hope was any significant part of the reason for his trip.

Indeed, since this contract was intended to make Columbus and all of his descendants rich, and titled nobility, forever... had any such possibility as the trade with rich Asia [modern sense] been seriously entertained, it surely would have been mentioned. Nearly all serious Europeans, including Columbus, understood where China was and how far west of Seville it did in fact lie.

Again, it alluded only to "certain islands and mainlands in the Ocean Sea," i.e. the western Atlantic.

It was only upon finding the inhabitants to be Asian, and the lands to resemble the Spice Islands, that the small-world hypothesis for a time, came to be entertained by him and any serious others.

[Modernman]

Don't forget, he was also looking for the Kingdom of Prester John and a route to attack the Ottoman Empire from behind

Wasn't "Prester John" just a bastardization of "Genghis Kahn?" IIRC, the Crusaders heard stories of a great warrier who was smiting the Muslims in the 13th century and put together a bunch of rumors and wild stories and concluded that there was a Christian king coming to their rescue.

[VadeRetro]

Per the Catholic Encyclopedia entry, you've mentioned one particular stage of a five-stage legend.

[Cronos]

I thought Prester John was to do with the Ethiopian Emperors -- the ancestors of Haile Selassie.

[Little Ray]

Historical foundation of the origin of the legend.
Otto von Freising does not mention the exact year of the battle between the Eastern conqueror and the Persian sultan; he only remarks that in 1145 it had taken place "ante non multos annos". On the other hand, there is found in the Annals of Admont (1181), part of which, as far as 1141, are a continuation of Otto's chronicle, the following note: "Johannes presbyter rex Armeniae et Indiae cum duobus regibus fratribus Persarum et Medorum pugnavit et vicit". Minute research has shown that in that year the Persian Sultan Sanjar was completely vanquished by a conqueror from the east, not very far from the ancient Ecbatana. The Arabic historian Ibn-el-Athir (1160-1233) says that, in the year of the Hegira of 536 (1141), Sanjar, the most powerful of the Seljuk princes, had mortally offended his vassal the Shah of Kharezm. The latter called to his assistance Ku Khan, or Korkhan of China (Chinese, Yeliutasche), who had come in 1122 from Northern China at the head of a mighty army. Korkhan killed Sanjar and l00,000 of his men. The Arabic versions are substantially corroborated by other Asiatic historians of that epoch: by the Syrian writer Abulfaradsch (on account of his Jewish descent called Bar Hebraeus, 1226-86), by the Arabic Abulfeda (1273-1331), the Persian Mirkhond (1432-89) etc. It is not certain whether the Spanish Jew, Benjamin of Tudela, who travelled in Central Asia in 1171, refers to this event. If so, the hypothesis based on the researches of d'Avezac, Oppert, Zarncke, and Yule becomes a certainty, i.e. the land of this uncertain and shifting legend is the kingdom of Karakhitai (1141-1218), founded in Central Asia by the priest-king of the tale. The disputed points are the name, the religion, and the priestly character of the mysterious personage.

Independently of the much earlier work of d Avezac, Oppert thinks that Ku-Khan, Korkhan or Corchan (Coirchan), as the East-Asian conqueror is called in the chronicles, could easily have become Jorchan, Jochanan, or in Western parlance, John; this name was then very popular, and was often given to Christian and Mohammedan princes (Zarncke). History knows nothing about the Christianity of Yeliutasche. Yet it is clear that the league of the West against the Mohammedans stirred up the oppressed Christians on the borders of Tatar Asia to look for a deliverer. The sacerdotal character of the legendary king still offers an unsolved riddle.

http://www.newadvent.org/cathen/12400b.htm

[SunkenCiv]

Not a ping, just a GGG update.

Please FREEPMAIL me if you want on, off, or alter the "Gods, Graves, Glyphs" PING list --
Archaeology/Anthropology/Ancient Cultures/Artifacts/Antiquities, etc.
The GGG Digest -- Gods, Graves, Glyphs (alpha order)

[blam]

You found it. Thanks...Happy New Year.

[SunkenCiv]

Just updating the GGG information, not sending a general distribution.

To all -- please ping me to other topics which are appropriate for the GGG list. Thanks.

Please FREEPMAIL me if you want on or off the
"Gods, Graves, Glyphs" PING list or GGG weekly digest
-- Archaeology/Anthropology/Ancient Cultures/Artifacts/Antiquities, etc.
Gods, Graves, Glyphs (alpha order)

[SunkenCiv]

Astronomy & Geophysics
Volume 45 Issue 1 Page 1.23 - February 2004
doi:10.1046/j.1468-4004.2003.45123.x
Volume 45 Issue 1

Comet impact
A comet impact in AD 536?
Emma Rigby1, Melissa Symonds2 and Derek Ward-Thompson2

Emma Rigby, Melissa Symonds and Derek Ward-Thompson review the evidence for the possibility that a comet may have impacted the Earth in historical times, and discuss the size of the putative comet.

Abstract

A global climatic downturn has previously been observed in tree-ring data associated with the years AD 536–545. We review the evidence for the explanation of this event which involves a comet fragment impacting the Earth and exploding in the upper atmosphere. The explosion would create a plume, such as was seen during the impact of comet Shoemaker-Levy 9 with Jupiter. The resulting debris deposited by the plume on to the top of the atmosphere would increase the opacity and lower the temperature. We calculate the size of the comet required, and find that a relatively small fragment of only about half a kilometre in diameter could be consistent with the data. We conclude that plume formation is a by-product of small comet impacts that must be added to the list of significant global hazards posed by near-Earth objects.

Article published online 28 Jan 2004

Affiliations

1Cardiff University, UK (now at Edinburgh University, UK)2Cardiff University

The authors thank Mike Baillie, Mark Bailey, Martin Johnson, Ted Johnson-South and David Williams for interesting and helpful discussions.

To cite this article
Rigby, Emma, Symonds, Melissa & Ward-Thompson, Derek (2004)
A comet impact in AD 536?.
Astronomy & Geophysics 45 (1), 1.23-1.26.
doi: 10.1046/
j.1468-4004.2003.45123.x

Blackwell Synergy® is a Blackwell Publishing, Inc. registered trademark

---

· Catastrophism ping list · join · view topics · view or post blog · bookmark ·

---

[SunkenCiv]

· join list or digest · view topics · view or post blog · bookmark · post a topic ·
	Gods Graves Glyphs	Just updating the GGG info, not sending a general distribution. To all -- please ping me to other topics which are appropriate for the GGG list. GGG managers are SunkenCiv, StayAt HomeMother, and Ernest_at_the_Beach
·Dogpile · Archaeologica · ArchaeoBlog · Archaeology · Biblical Archaeology Society · · Discover · Nat Geographic · Texas AM Anthro News · Yahoo Anthro & Archaeo · Google · · The Archaeology Channel · Excerpt, or Link only? · cgk's list of ping lists ·

[SunkenCiv]

· join · view topics · view or post blog · bookmark · post new topic ·

[SunkenCiv]

· GGG managers are SunkenCiv, StayAt HomeMother, and Ernest_at_the_Beach · · join list or digest · view topics · view or post blog · bookmark · post a topic · subscribe ·
	Antiquity Journal  & archive  Archaeologica  Archaeology  Archaeology Channel  BAR  Bronze Age Forum  Discover  Dogpile  Eurekalert  Google  LiveScience  Mirabilis.ca  Nat Geographic  PhysOrg  Science Daily  Science News  Texas AM  Yahoo  Excerpt, or Link only?	Just updating the list(s) info, not sending a general distribution. · join · view topics · view or post blog · bookmark · post new topic · subscribe · To all -- please ping me to other topics which are appropriate for the GGG list.
· History topic · history keyword · archaeology keyword · paleontology keyword · · Science topic · science keyword · Books/Literature topic · pages keyword ·

[bert]

——We talk today about globalism as if it were the latest thing——

We trade today using rules and laws dating back into the unknown. The marine insurance and letters of credit are truly ancient relics that still protect and promote the interests of traders who never see each other but get along well with the intervention of middlemen and contracts that both parties accept.

The process certainly precede the Romans, and goes back to at least the sailors and traders of Crete who owned the Med

The introduction of e mail and instant transmission of every kind of document and video presentation into the trade communications has allowed elimination of the middleman. Direct access to a trading pardner allows the development of trust or mistrust one on one. Global trade can only grow. To ignore and impede is detrimental to one’s well being

[SunkenCiv]

[SunkenCiv]

This topic was posted 2/8/2004, thanks again blam.

• The Roman Empire and the Indian Ocean | Raoul McLaughlin | full text PDF | Shiver Me Timbers!

  ---

• Romans in Okinawa - Japan? [5:58] [04/16/2024]
• Ancient Roman coins unearthed at Japan castle [09/28/2016]
• Roman coins discovered in ruins of Japanese castle [09/28/2016]
• Roman coins ID'd in Japanese ruins, but their origin baffles [10/18/2016]

  ---

• 1st-century Buddha statue from ancient Egypt indicates Buddhists lived there in Roman times [01/15/2024]
• Historical Bangor - Episode Three: The Roman World Map of Marcus Agrippa [12/23/2022]
• Ancient Irish Halloween Tale - 'Echtra Nera' [11/01/2022]
• Exhibition: Roman Coins in India [2011] [10/13/2022]
• Book Review: Federico De Romanis and Marco Maiuro, eds., Across the Ocean: Nine Essays on Indo-Mediterranean Trade [08/14/2021]
• Mould for minting Roman coins found in Talkad [India] [05/30/2014]
• South Indians in Roman Egypt? [04/07/2010]
• More evidence unearthed at ancient port of Muziris [03/19/2010]
• Tamil Brahmi script in Egypt [12/03/2007]
• Archaeologists Unearth Roman Era Artefacts In Kerala (India) [03/25/2007]
• Ancient Indian port linked to Roman Empire faces extinction(India) [08/22/2006]
• Search For India's Ancient City (Muziris - Roman) [06/11/2006]
• Scientists Discover Ancient Sea Wharf (Marine Silk Road) [12/30/2004]
• The Voyage around the Erythraean Sea [09/12/2004]
• Tamil Trade [09/11/2004]
• Archaeologists Find Silk Road Equal [06/12/2002]