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Deliveryman: I Shot Man In Self-Defense(Fired from Pizza Hut for Saving his life from Thug!!)
http://www.theindychannel.com ^ | 05-18-2004

Posted on 05/21/2004 10:26:28 AM PDT by NJ Freeper

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To: Crazieman

I will also not purchase from pizza hut. Disgusting policy.


101 posted on 05/22/2004 11:57:18 AM PDT by amordei
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To: Law is not justice but process
Call them Pizza Marshals..........Mushroom Marshals, Pepperoni Police, Cheese Cops !.... Now thats just worth a grin.

Stay safe !

102 posted on 05/22/2004 11:59:11 AM PDT by Squantos (Be polite. Be professional. But, have a plan to kill everyone you meet.)
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To: Beelzebubba; PoorMuttly
In my experience if ya have been raised exposed to trauma from contact sports, fights and ass whuppins from siblings and friends in play or pissin matches then your bodies ability to stand up to multiple wounds from any handgun round is high.

If you lived a protected life from such "exposure" where ya panic over a paper cut then you'll drop from a .22 rimfire round. I have been places where victims had never seen a TV show or Movie and didn't know they were supposed to fall down and die when shot.

The best chance one has in a handgun fight IMO is to make the fastest and quickest hits on his / her agressor with a modern hollowpoint projectile that has the speed and velocity to expell it's energy inside of a body cavity vs entry and exit hole and do such with as large a diameter "permanent wound channel" as possible be it a 40 short and wimpy or a nothing but 45 ACP !

Just my opinion.....Stay Safe !

103 posted on 05/22/2004 12:12:12 PM PDT by Squantos (Be polite. Be professional. But, have a plan to kill everyone you meet.)
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To: Onelifetogive
If Pizza Hut knowingly allows delivery people to pack heat, they are open to law suits. If you want to FREEP someone, FREEP a Dimocrat who stuck us with judges who make protecting one's own life risky.

Perhaps what's needed is a law which explicitly provides that a company shall not be held liable in cases where one of their employees uses a lawfully-caried firearm for self-defense, or what that employee claims to have believed was self-defense, unless the employer either supplies the weaponry or training or requires the employee to carry a weapon.

104 posted on 05/22/2004 12:56:16 PM PDT by supercat (Why is it that the more "gun safety" laws are passed, the less safe my guns seem?)
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To: Joe Hadenuf

I'd never want to work for a company that cares more about the bottom line than about my welfare as an employee. If they pay me so much to help them stay in business, what business is of theirs if I protect my life? Don't forget, training a replacement employee is expensive. The no CCW policy of Pizza Hut and other pizza delivery companies is stupid. I agree, a company has a right to tell an employee to surrender company money or assets to a criminal if that is the employer's policy but no company that has to tell any one surrendering their lives is a condition for keeping their job.


105 posted on 05/22/2004 2:09:26 PM PDT by goldstategop (In Memory Of A Dearly Beloved Friend Who Lives On In My Heart Forever)
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To: Squantos

I'm sure that is a sound theory. It appears that in reasonably powerful loads, like 9mm (not .380, .32, .25ACP...in which ball is best...so it penetrates at all..) the smaller the caliber, the more important expansion is for effectiveness, which then makes bullet integrity very important...so it doesn't just fall apart right away...and then again, even if it does expand, there needs to be enough velocity so that the expanded bullet doesn't prematurely slow down, and not sufficiently penetrate. Rocket science...even if it is on the way to a vital or structurally important "off switch."

Sooo....bigger and heavier is better, whenever possible...unless the range is long, and bullet drop would preclude an accurate hit. Yeow.

So I take it you are no fan of the miracle .40...er...10mm Short.


106 posted on 05/22/2004 2:11:16 PM PDT by PoorMuttly (Cud. The other green meat.)
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To: PoorMuttly
I'm a fan of the caliber I have when the need arises........be it the 10MM stepchild 40 S&W or my beloved 45ACP ! I prefer but never defer.......:o)

Stay Safe PM !

107 posted on 05/22/2004 2:44:04 PM PDT by Squantos (Be polite. Be professional. But, have a plan to kill everyone you meet.)
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To: PoorMuttly

In November 1992, South Carolina Highway Patrolman Mark Coates shot an attacker four times in the torso with his 4 inch Smith & Wesson .357 Magnum revolver. His attacker, an obese adult male who weighed almost 300 pounds, absorbed the hits and shortly thereafter returned fire with one shot from a single-action North American Arms .22 caliber mini-revolver. Coates was fatally wounded when the tiny bullet perforated his left upper arm and penetrated his chest through the armhole of his vest where the bullet cut a major artery. Coates, who was standing next to the passenger-side front fender of the assailant's car when he was hit by the fatal bullet, was very quickly incapacitated.

The slaying was recorded by the video camera mounted in Coates' cruiser.

After Coates was hit, he immediately ran several feet, scrambling around the front of the assailant's car while simultaneously radioing dispatch that he'd been shot. As he neared the driver's-side front fender he suddenly collapsed onto the pavement.

Trooper Coates fired four 145 grain Winchester Silvertip .357 Magnum bullets directly into his assailant's heavy abdomen, achieving solid hits with each. These particular bullets penetrate deeper than 125 grain JHPs, however none ruptured any vital cardiovascular structures. During the initial ground struggle, Coates was shot twice, but his vest protected him. After fighting off his attacker, Coates quickly climbed to his feet and emptied his revolver. At that particular moment the assailant was still lying on the ground. The combination of the assailant's obesity and the unusual angle at which the bullets entered his body worked to the disadvantage of Trooper Coates.

The Coates shooting exemplifies the fable of energy transfer, especially when encountering a determined attacker. The .357 Magnum cartridge is regarded by many as the ultimate manstopper; a true one-shot stop wonder. The Winchester 145 grain .357 Magnum cartridge is given a one-shot stopping power rating of 86 percent by Marshall and Sanow. According to this rating system, a single hit ANYWHERE in the torso is supposed to be highly effective in stopping an attacker, regardless of whether or not the bullet destroys vital tissue. But on this night, it failed FOUR TIMES! The assailant easily absorbed four bullets in his body, each delivering over 450 foot pounds of kinetic energy. This is equivalent to being hit four times by a baseball going approximately 210 miles per hour.

None of Coates' powerful .357 Magnum bullets were effective, but the bad guy's weak .22 caliber bullet was. The .357 Magnum bullets dumped all their energy into the attacker, whereas the single .22 caliber bullet disrupted vital tissue. The assailant survived the shooting, was convicted of murdering Coates and was sentenced to life in prison.

Another shooting that was captured on video helps explain a reaction known as psychological collapse.

A few years ago, two Houston police officers cornered a suspected motorcycle thief at gunpoint against a chain-link highway perimeter fence. Upon being cornered, the suspect drew a revolver and threatened to kill himself. After negotiating for awhile, the officers convinced the suspect to put down his gun, and to catch and put on a pair of handcuffs that the officers were going to toss to him. The confrontation ended after the offender obtained the handcuffs, then reached to pick up the revolver that lay on the ground beside him. Despite a warning, he grasped and lifted the weapon. One officer opened fire with a Colt Government Model .45 ACP. Upon being hit in the right shoulder by a 230 grain Federal HydraShok JHP bullet, the surprised offender's facial expression instantly conveyed shock, horror and utter disbelief.

As he immediately slumped unconscious onto his left side, two more HydraShoks perforated his right upper arm and buried themselves in his right upper torso. The second officer, startled into reacting by the first officer's gunshots, fired several rounds from his Colt Combat Commander .45 ACP. He attained a single hit with a 185 grain Federal Hi-Shok JHP bullet, which perforated the offender's left arm and grazed, but did not enter, his left upper torso.

The offender survived the shooting, and according to Houston Police, the only vital structure hit by any of the bullets was the brachial artery of the right upper arm, which was repaired during surgery. The initial wound could not have caused the offender to collapse unconscious from blood loss as quickly as he did, nor were any central nervous system structures disrupted by the bullets. Although he rapidly collapsed unconscious after the first bullet struck him, there was no physiological reason for him to do so.

When a person is shot in the body with a handgun and falls down unconscious within a half-dozen seconds, it can only be attributed to a psychological reaction to being shot. This person simply faints from the sudden realization and fright that he has been shot, not from blood loss or any other reason. (This discussion does not apply to rifle bullets. Obviously, wild animals that immediately collapse after being shot by a centerfire rifle bullet do not faint from fright. The wound dynamics of rifle bullets are markedly different, but the physiological mechanisms are identical.) In order to be FORCED to collapse an attacker must lose at least 20 percent of his total blood volume (unless the bullet damages his brain or cervical spinal cord). This will take several seconds to occur, even with a direct hit to the aorta or vena cava with a large caliber bullet.

Most "stops" are psychological, not physiological in nature. The bad guy either faints or makes a voluntary decision to stop what he's doing. It's possible that a bullet with more "wallop," one that quickly delivers its energy and produces more blunt force sensation, might play a role in producing psychological collapse. But, psychological reaction to being shot is highly erratic and unreliable. It doesn't happen to everyone, especially a highly motivated attacker who's determined to cause as much harm as he can before he's stopped.

Unless you're clairvoyant, you cannot predict the exact circumstances of any self-defense situation you might find yourself in. Therefore, your goal in choosing a bullet for personal defense should be to select one that will be effective in as many different scenarios as possible. Your bullet must be able to penetrate deeply enough to contact and destroy tissue that is critical to the immediate survival of your attacker.

The two most important factors in stopping a bad guy are: 1) where you place your bullets, and 2) what organs your bullets penetrate and damage.

How much penetration is adequate? According to the nation's most prominent wound ballistics experts, your bullets should penetrate at least 12 inches of soft tissue. Penetration beyond 18 inches is considered too much, and a less penetrating design should be considered to optimize the cartridge's wounding potential.

But with small caliber cartridges such as .22 LR, .25 ACP, and .32 ACP (and sometimes .380 ACP), you're better off selecting a non-expanding bullet that might exceed 18 inches of penetration than to choose a bullet that expands and underpenetrates. When a bullet expands, the increased diameter and non-aerodynamic shape acts like a parachute to quickly slow and stop the bullet as it penetrates flesh. These tiny bullets lack the mass and momentum to achieve adequate penetration after they expand.

Bullets that meet the 12-18 inch penetration guidelines have proven to be very effective in police shooting incidents that have been investigated by reputable researchers who use the scientific method. These findings have been verified and validated by other distinguished wound ballistics researchers who've fully reviewed the data. These findings are far superior in validity to the Marshall/Sanow "one-shot stopping power" junk-science that is published in newsstand gun magazines.

Excerpt from:

http://www.firearmstactical.com/tactical.htm


108 posted on 05/22/2004 2:44:09 PM PDT by PoorMuttly (Cud. The other green meat.)
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To: PoorMuttly

Here's another tidbit re: the attacker still standing after shot:

"Mr. Diallo was standing practically against the door at the rear of the apartment entry, with his left side facing outward toward the officers, when he failed to obey the officers' orders, reached under his coat, came out with a black wallet - that appeared to be a gun in the dim light - and the shooting began.

The early shots entered his left side. These shots would have been unlikely to cause Mr. Diallo to give any perceptible sign that he had been hit. It should be noted that bullets penetrating a human body in most locations most often cause no immediate outward reaction in the person hit.

This comes as a surprise to most laymen since the entertainment media almost always shows such persons being knocked backward and the immediate appearance of blood at the supposed entrance wound. It must be emphasized that such reactions do not happen in real life.

In fact, the inability of policemen to be able to tell if their shots have hit is often a source of confusion and consternation for them during gunfights. To have a reasonable chance of surviving gunfights, police must be trained to continue firing until they are sure the threat has ended."

from:

http://www.newsmax.com/articles/?a=2000/2/28/60241


109 posted on 05/22/2004 3:00:33 PM PDT by PoorMuttly (Cud. The other green meat.)
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To: antiblazer
"If he's acting in self-defense, he might shoot 1 or 2 bullets and run away. But he just stands there and fires off 15 rounds one after another. WTF?? Sounds like another trigger-happy NRA fanatic"

I guess many police must be "trigger-happy" as well since they often empty their pistols in such close encounters of the ugly kind. While many, at least here in Texas, are "NRA fanatics" as well, they tend to be the ones who don't find themselves still pulling the trigger on an empty pistol.

110 posted on 05/22/2004 3:22:05 PM PDT by El Gato (Federal Judges can twist the Constitution into anything.. Or so they think.)
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To: Xenalyte
Yeah yeah yeah, and what if a frog had wings? He wouldn't bump his ass when he hopped. Try to keep it in the realm of the plausible.

T'wasnt' all that long ago that "no negras", "no wimmin", and "no old coots" was quite common practice. The last one still is in some areas and fields, where "old" starts at about 35 or 40.

111 posted on 05/22/2004 3:26:43 PM PDT by El Gato (Federal Judges can twist the Constitution into anything.. Or so they think.)
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To: Xenalyte
Is it possible they say that to every border-crosser? I have trouble believing you were singled out.

Depends on wether the CHL/CCW data is public record. If it is, and it's keyed to other ID, such as driver's license number, then they could very well know of the CCW permit without ever seeing it. While the database is not generally a public record here in Texas, the CHL license has your DL number right on it, and the police (at all levels) have access to the cross index. In fact the law provides that all law enforcement agencies in the licensee's county of residence be notified when a CHL is issued. Other individuals can can ask the DPS if a particular individual is licensed, but they cannot obtain a list of all licensees. Thus Pizza Hut could request information on each of it's employees, or even applicants. There is no law prohibiting discrimation in employement based on possession of a CHL, or NRA membership for that matter.

112 posted on 05/22/2004 3:40:12 PM PDT by El Gato (Federal Judges can twist the Constitution into anything.. Or so they think.)
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To: goldstategop
I'd never want to work for a company that cares more about the bottom line than about my welfare as an employee.

If today's tort system were reasonable, I'd agree with you. But how much liability exposure should companies accept for their employees? IMHO, there needs to be a law which provides that employers shall not be liable for actions their employees commit with weapons unless:

If such a law were in place, I would find actions such as Pizza Hut's here to be without basis. Unfortunately, in today's legal climate I'm not so sure I can fault them. There are too many parts of the country where a shyster could find a jury to sock a large corporation for millions of dollars if they knew an employee carried a weapon and did nothing to stop it.
113 posted on 05/22/2004 3:47:34 PM PDT by supercat (Why is it that the more "gun safety" laws are passed, the less safe my guns seem?)
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To: goldstategop
Another thing to consider: while it could be important from a legal perspective that the company "officially" forbid CCW, that does not imply that it must make much effort to enforce their policy. It may be (at least in some areas) that it's okay for people to carry so long as nobody in the company "officially" knows about it. Unfortunately, in the circumstances here it's impossible for the company to maintain its "official" policy without acting on it.

IMHO, the best course of events here (aside from some states passing liability reforms) would be for someone at Pizza Hut to politely and confidentiality suggest that an employee lawsuit would be responded to with a reasonably-decent confidential settlement offer.

114 posted on 05/22/2004 4:02:39 PM PDT by supercat (Why is it that the more "gun safety" laws are passed, the less safe my guns seem?)
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To: evets
Great Pics!
9 Cal. vs. 50 Cal.

BANG!

Knock Down Power!

"One shot and go about your business."

115 posted on 05/22/2004 4:02:47 PM PDT by Major_Risktaker (Oderint dum metuant)
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To: PoorMuttly
Uhhh ya have to quit posting to yourself PM......that's against the law in some states........:o) Can't find yer good info if ya dont send up a proper flare my friend.

Stay Safe !

116 posted on 05/22/2004 8:10:26 PM PDT by Squantos (Be polite. Be professional. But, have a plan to kill everyone you meet.)
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To: School of Rational Thought
Was his handgun confiscated? Did he not like his handgun?s performance? Did I miss something in the article?

It's one of the common themes at the range I range I shoot at. If you are involved in any sort of shooting, righteous or no, the weapons are confiscated as 'evidence' for at long as the case remains open. This can take 6 to 12 months, or longer, even if no action is ever taken.

Subject normally comes up as we stare at the $2000 Wilson's. The thought of one of them rusting away on an evidence shelf, or worse, having the parts 'replaced' with junk just doesn't seem right. ;)

Better a standard reliable $450 service pistol that can be replaced.

117 posted on 05/22/2004 8:25:15 PM PDT by kAcknor (That's my version of it anyway....)
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To: kAcknor
at the range I range I shoot at.

Really shouldn't watch torture and punishment devices on the History channel as I type...

118 posted on 05/22/2004 8:29:35 PM PDT by kAcknor (That's my version of it anyway....)
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To: Squantos

I should have done a ping. Didn't want to clog up your comments list.

Why do you think they call it Muttly?!!


119 posted on 05/22/2004 10:40:29 PM PDT by PoorMuttly (Cud. The other green meat.)
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To: Squantos

I found some great info. there about shotgun loads for defense, too. I'll post them if anyone but us is interested.

Hey...what happened to the Gunshop Porch? Even the bang_list is antique. I'd love to disseminate this stuff to the troops.

(BTW..it said birdshot is a non-stopper..but # 1 Buck is tops, and doesn't overpenetrate, like 00)


120 posted on 05/22/2004 10:46:29 PM PDT by PoorMuttly (Cud. The other green meat.)
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To: PoorMuttly; TEXASPROUD
We used to reload some rounds with #4 buck using #9 shot as a filler between the #4's............I think there was a like product used by the SAS called a Malaysian load for jungle and close quarters.

I'll ping my resident SAS subject matter expert Texasproud to verify the SAS use of such......:o)

Stay Safe Ya'll !

121 posted on 05/23/2004 12:48:41 AM PDT by Squantos (Be polite. Be professional. But, have a plan to kill everyone you meet.)
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To: Squantos

I always wondered why that #9 or such "buffer" wasn't done, since there's so much wasted room between buckshot. Now I know it was !

The mantra is the Treasury uses #4, which I suppose Mel Tappan ("Survival Guns" paperback...still sound advice) popularized. The Wound Ballistics guys say #1 works best indoors, gets the job actually done, and doesn't overpenetrate walls and such. They claim birdshot creates a horrible wound (from which most eventually succomb, I assume), but these professional Wound Ballistics specialists are primarily interested in what STOPS them NOW...which usually, more reliably, means death...the other variations giving enough time for one to be killed. They rip Marshall & Sanow a new one too. Woah.

Hey...do you and yours know about (like you wouldn't) the V.N. room-clearing trick of reloading a 12ga. shell with $1.60 in dimes ? Said to fly everythere, and do a serious job. This is, I suppose, what Thurston Howell III uses as a Trap load.


122 posted on 05/23/2004 7:25:31 AM PDT by PoorMuttly (Cud. The other green meat.)
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To: Squantos

Table 1. Lead Birdshot

Shot
Number Pellet Diameter
(Inches) Average Pellet
Weight (Grains) Approximate # of
Pellets per Ounce
12 .05 .18 2385
11 .06 .25 1750
9 .08 .75 585
8 1/2 .085 .88 485
8 .09 1.07 410
7 1/2 .095 1.25 350
6 .11 1.95 225
5 .12 2.58 170
4 .13 3.24 135
2 .15 4.86 90
BB .18 8.75 50

Table 2. Lead Buckshot

Shot
Number Pellet Diameter
(Inches) Average Pellet
Weight (Grains)
4 .24 20.6
3 .25 23.4
2 .27 29.4
1 .30 40.0
0 .32 48.3
00 .33 53.8
000 .36 68.0


123 posted on 05/23/2004 7:29:00 AM PDT by PoorMuttly (Cud. The other green meat.)
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To: PoorMuttly
I use a Benelli M1 which can be stuffed with 9 rounds if ya use the follower trick. My first three rounds are copper solid slugs for kevlar clad criminals (they'll break ribs under body armor) and then #5 turkey shot for urban area.

But in my casa firearms are only after locks , electronics, outside puppies, locks, electronics and inside puppies have failed in my security plan.

You still have Mel's paperback ???? Kewl ! That was a childhood read that I could'nt put down.

Stay Safe !

124 posted on 05/23/2004 10:29:58 AM PDT by Squantos (Be polite. Be professional. But, have a plan to kill everyone you meet.)
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To: PoorMuttly
The dimes thang was just played out in a Wild West Tech show on the Hitler Channel about Billy The Kid When he killed his jailer "Bob" with such a load. Fired from the alledged distance it didn't hit shit. Also when fired from close enough to hit a target (a pig carcass) it didn't penetrate at all. The dimes were superfical injuries pretty much on that show. Leading one to believe that myth was involved in the tale. I have seen some exotic loads that used two cast lead balls connected by some wire cable fishing leader. They seem to be pretty nasty in theory but the little gators will dine on your life if ya ever have to use such in self defense.

During the 4th of July I like to light up our backyard BBQ with some of the magnesium dragons breath loads fired into the night sky with my benelli........... Great light and noise show. I suspect that 9 rounds of that at close range are the poor mans flame thrower. They are expensive but real fun as a "eye opener".............:o)

Bottom line for me is KISS principal. More can be done with a dove load at close inside the dwelling than most know. A 12 gauge ain't a Claymore mine albeit the old duckbill attachments make em such. I haven't seen duckbills for sale anywhere recently. A "friend" has a AOW NFA rig called a SERBU that has a duckbill installed . At 15 feet the pattern will cover an entire doorway if held sideways and fired. Downside is slugs are not included in the diet or self destruct "eaker" mode kicks in.

Stay Safe Muttly !

125 posted on 05/23/2004 10:51:39 AM PDT by Squantos (Be polite. Be professional. But, have a plan to kill everyone you meet.)
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To: Squantos

Huh. End of a great Muttly formula. Never thought dimes had enough weight...but never tried.

Since I was a pup...realized that #5 shot is the very best upland game load for me, even in 20ga....only choke is important. It hits harder, farther. 4 is too big, 6 too small. I have done great rabbit work with an old rusty Stevens single-barrel 3" with #5 Turkey loads, on the ranch, when that's all I had...and normal loads shot low and left, for unknown reason. 3" shot straight...although I found it adviseable to try to "clip" them with the edge of the pattern, if possible, if the barbecue awaited, as it was last Thanksgiving ! As you said...use what you have, if it's all you have. Case in point: ran out of 3"-#5s afield...only had one 3"-#4 BUCK left...bunny appeared @ 40+ feet away (rabbits are attracting lots of coyotes, bobcats...cougars..) so my mission is to thin their ranks...so I aimed high, and caught him in the head with a pellet or two..which sent him skidding sideways head first around 15 feet ! What a sight. Didn't sperl no meat neither.

BTW, unrelated..came across this FIY:

Fackler, when asked to estimate the survival time of someone shot in the front mid-abdomen with a Glaser slug, responded, "About three days, and the cause of death would be peritonitis."


126 posted on 05/23/2004 11:33:29 AM PDT by PoorMuttly (Cud. The other green meat.)
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To: All
Back about 10 years ago Pizza Hut fired a delivery man in Kansas for defending himself against armed robbers by use of his AR 15.

Here in West Texas we've had Japan Eleven fire employees for {non-gun} action against thugs. In Odessa in the 90s one guy who had just been selected Employee of the Year or some such award was punished for protecting one of the women customers from assault by a gang punk. I loathe the vermin.

I should add that occurred at least twice in Odessa.

127 posted on 05/23/2004 12:10:52 PM PDT by Rockpile
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To: Squantos

Score for the afternoon...testing my ol' s/s 29" bbl. double trigger 2 3/4"...Muttly 6...Varmints 1 (too long a shot). High Brass #6 Federals worked great. Win. #8's were almost useless except for the noise, then mulched a bunny at 60 ft...so I threw it near the coyote den as chum. They are on my list, so it wasn't wasted.

That duckbill thing is the "Wing Diverter," invented by Dr. Eustus Wing, with whom I once spoke on the telephone in the 70's. Wish I still had that gizmo. There were 2 kinds...a mild one which threw an oval pattern, and an LE Only one, which threw a horizontal spread..great for riot-control, ricocheting shot off the ground, and annoyingly into the legs of the opponents, he said...or a one-shot machinegun-type field of fire with Buckshot, really quite astounding...until you blow it off with a slug. The oval one cleared slug diameter..and was great. It is essentially a ported muzzlebrake.


128 posted on 05/23/2004 7:21:24 PM PDT by PoorMuttly (Cud. The other green meat.)
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To: LetsRok
I disagree. PizzaHut violates Constitutional protections when they forbid a citizen from carrying a firearm in his own vehicle. And, of course, it does make sense to boycott PepsiCo for their policies. People in PepsiCo's corporate structure came up with the policy. Not liberal judges or Demoncrat politicians.

The deliveryman is better off not working for a company that would never stand behind him. A company that willingly puts its employees at mortal risk for profit is no good employer. PepsiCo proves that it deserves neither the consumers money, nor the consumers loyalty.

129 posted on 05/23/2004 7:31:36 PM PDT by Thumper1960 ("Islam" is a cult, led by psychopaths and dedicated to destruction as a way of life.)
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To: NJ Freeper

Wonder if Bruce Springsteen is gonna come out with a new song..."15 times..."


130 posted on 05/23/2004 7:31:58 PM PDT by Cap'n Crunch
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To: Mulder
Whoever said you need a permit to carry a weapon?

The guv'mint?

LOL

131 posted on 05/23/2004 7:34:28 PM PDT by Thumper1960 ("Islam" is a cult, led by psychopaths and dedicated to destruction as a way of life.)
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To: NJ Freeper
All this for a pizza!?

And the guy wants this job back?

132 posted on 05/23/2004 7:46:25 PM PDT by Old Professer
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To: Thumper1960
The deliveryman is better off not working for a company that would never stand behind him. A company that willingly puts its employees at mortal risk for profit is no good employer. PepsiCo proves that it deserves neither the consumers money, nor the consumers loyalty.

I don't know. Maybe Pizza Hut does not think is a good idea if my customers get the idea that the guy knocking on their door is also armed. Some families may want to order their pizza elsewhere.
133 posted on 05/24/2004 2:59:58 AM PDT by LetsRok
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To: Still Thinking

Workmen's comp is sometimes self-insured. As far a liability and/or casualty, Any larger insurance company would handle it if the company had the bucks. I audit insurance company's a lot and have never seen a security company on any of their books, now that I think about it.


134 posted on 05/24/2004 7:31:29 AM PDT by Safetgiver (A headless horseman for the new millenium!!)
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To: LetsRok
If your customers have to worry about your employees,(for any reason) I'd wager they'd be getting their pizzas elsewhere, anyway.
135 posted on 05/24/2004 4:32:15 PM PDT by Thumper1960 ("Islam" is a cult, led by psychopaths and dedicated to destruction as a way of life.)
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To: wingnutx

Does that mean I could walk up to the Brinks,Wells Fargo, etc. armored car and ask pretty please for some money?


136 posted on 05/24/2004 4:50:21 PM PDT by Studebaker Hawk (GUNS: more than I need; not as many as I want.)
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To: NJ Freeper

I used to deliver for Channello’s Pizza and they had the same policy. One of our drivers shot a bad guy and a short time late a store manager did the same thing while protecting store employees.
The day after the drive escaped death Channello’s changed the policy from “forbidden to carry” to “discouraged from carrying”.


137 posted on 05/24/2004 4:57:11 PM PDT by R. Scott (Humanity i love you because when you're hard up you pawn your Intelligence to buy a drink.)
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To: Little Ray

Pre-fragged rounds are the only way to go.


138 posted on 05/24/2004 4:59:19 PM PDT by R. Scott (Humanity i love you because when you're hard up you pawn your Intelligence to buy a drink.)
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To: LetsRok
He should be fired. The company policy says that employees are not allowed to carry guns. If he didn't get fired the company would have to allow all employees the ability to register for a carry permit.

I think the surviving family of the next PH deliveryman that gets killed should sue PH for putting them in dangerous situations but not allowing them to defend themselves.
139 posted on 05/24/2004 5:33:30 PM PDT by gitmo (Thanks, Mel. I needed that.)
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To: Slings and Arrows

"Sounds like he needs to use a larger caliber, though."
As he shot 15 rds (w/o reloading) he must have used 9mm. We are not told how many shots he placed on the target (remember these cops in NYC few yrs back?- 41 shot, 19 hits.) If his shooting was anything like that, he needed large capacity. As for 9mm, HydraShock (147gr) is pretty decent, especially from >6" barrels (or in "+P+").


140 posted on 05/24/2004 5:42:26 PM PDT by GSlob
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To: GSlob

True, we do not know how many shots he put on target, and yes, he was probably using 9mm. As to the merits/dismerits thereof, I refuse to get involved in religious arguments. ;-)


141 posted on 05/24/2004 6:16:23 PM PDT by Slings and Arrows (Am Yisrael Chai!)
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To: Gator113
Did the Pizza's get delivered on time??

More importantly, did the drive get a decent tip?

142 posted on 05/25/2004 3:00:49 AM PDT by R. Scott (Humanity i love you because when you're hard up you pawn your Intelligence to buy a drink.)
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To: Studebaker Hawk

No, but if you point a gun at them they will hand it over immediately. If you shoot first they will shoot back.


143 posted on 05/25/2004 6:11:45 AM PDT by wingnutx (Are you a monthly donor? Why not? (the freeper formerly known as Britton J Wingnutx))
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To: NJ Freeper

BUMP!


144 posted on 06/16/2008 6:19:53 PM PDT by endthematrix (Now that we use our corn for fuel, when do we eat coal for dinner?)
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To: G.Mason

145 posted on 01/01/2013 5:45:20 AM PST by ASA Vet (There are 10 kinds of people in the world. Those who understand binary, and those who don't.)
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To: LetsRok
The company policy says that employees are not allowed to carry gu

My nephew works for a large construction company in S.E. Michigan and because their reps travel into Detroit alot, the owner paid all the applicable training and application fees associated with obtaining a CPL in Michigan for any of them who wished to take advantage of the offer.

146 posted on 01/01/2013 5:53:00 AM PST by Hot Tabasco (Jab her with a harpoon.....)
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