Factcheck.org's report on Bush / Kerry debate

http://factcheck.org/article.aspx@docID=275.html ^ | October 9th, 2004

[gov_bean_ counter]

Whatever the number it is right after the section on "Search before you post".

[WashingtonSource]

Good come back!

[TexasBud]

I didn't know what Bush meant by "need some wood." I don't get it. A joke?

[commish]

I didn't know what Bush meant by "need some wood." I don't get it. A joke?

Kerry made the absurd claim that because Bush got $84 from a blind trust that includes a Timber company, he OWNS a timber company and is a Small Business Owner.

BUsh looked at the audience and said "I OWN a timber company? " then jokingly said "Need some wood" to the audience.

[mj1234]

You can research the people at Factcheck-
Here is "SETH" piece:!

Seth Goldman earned his B.A. in political communication at George Washington University. He joined the Annenberg Public Policy Center in June, 2004 with previous experience as journalist, press relations assistant, and media researcher. He has worked at the Comy's campaign cmittee for a Democratic Majority and at Sen. Edward M. Kennedommittee. At GWU he founded and edited Sticks & Stones, an independent, student-run progressive newsmagazine.

Everyone there is associated with the Demon's party-
Cheney goofed big time mentioning them- this is a favorite
tactic of "progressives"- pick a unabscure kerry point
and say he was loose with the facts- then Skewer Bush on a 1/2 dozen major issues.- The local Afsme Union does
this all the time- that way they can say non-partisan
and keep their TAX FREE STATUS!!!!!

[browardchad]

We need to expand that quote a bit:

Kerry got his information from an article we posted Sept. 23 stating that Bush on his 2001 federal income-tax returns "reported $84 of business income from his part ownership of a timber-growing enterprise." We should clarify: the $84 in Schedule C income was from Bush's Lone Star Trust, which is actually described on the 2001 income-tax returns as an "oil and gas production" business. The Lone Star Trust now owns 50% of the tree-growing company, but didn't get into that business until two years after the $84 in question. So we should have described the $84 as coming from an "oil and gas" business in 2001, and will amend that in our earlier article.

So they (factcheck.org) posted erroneous information, but the essence of what they said is true, even though they had the facts wrong. Does CBS come to mind here?

It appears that factcheck.org is a bit of a misnomer.

[longfellow]

Jack Webb.

[HarryCaul]

I thought the "need some wood?" line was great. It was amusing, and at the same time captured a bit of the american entrepreneurial spirit. "I didn't know I had it, but since I do, wanna buy some?"

[gov_bean_ counter]

Thanks, this is a tough crowd in here.

[blogblogginaway]

The 'fact check' on the Canadian drug question is totally distorted by Factcheck.org.

They are disputing Bush saying "to get our seniors to sign up to these drug discount cards, and they're workin" is factual.

Of the seniors who have signed up they are seeing a huge reduction in perscription drug costs which is EXACTLY what Bush said.

Factcheck has taken the fact of that statement, called it a lie and distorted it to appear that program is a failure.

They should change their site's name to distortedfactcheck.org.

[jetson]

Read some of the fact check stuff...WEAK VERY WEAK. This is hair splitting stuff.

[Phsstpok]

Bush probably didn't know he was invested in a timer growing company.

What kind of timers?

egg timers?
Old timers?
Day-timers?
Countdown timers?
555 timers?

[Petes Sandy Girl]

Thanks everybody! I'm new here and still learning my way around.
On another site (nonpolitical) that I belong to, quite a bit of politics is being discussed. This site leans WAY to the left (I wanna puke) and some one posted this as a reply to a "got wood" post. I did remember Cheney bringing it up in the VP debates and wanted to make an intelligent reply.
Thanks for all the replies.

[bahblahbah]

heh timber

[ProudVet77]

Found it interesting that ABC was all over this right after the debate. They immediately tied W to a lumber company. Any bets if ABC knew about this comment before the debate, particularly in light of the memo from ABC news head yesterday.

[joesbucks]

11(a) refers to election time or during times of war, or just when a moderator deems it's hitting too close to home.

[DustyMoment]

Bush claimed Kerry's health-care plan would lead to rationing and "ruin the quality of health care in America," a claim unsupported by neutral experts.

This is astonishing!!! How can ANYONE make such a claim?? The only thing Kerry has said about his healthplan is something in a recent commercial in which he states that "healthcare should be a right, not a privilege." On the surface, then, using that statement as the only "detail" of his healthplan, Bush's assertion is correct.

One has only to look at the socialized healthcare in England and Canada (which, I have heard, Kerry plans to use for his model of Ameroca's socialized healthcare system) to see how correct Bush is. For factcheck.org to claim otherwise is outrageous and disingenuous.

[HighlyOpinionated]

My wife has told me her country's government said their government run healthcare system "lets you choose the doctors," just as Kerry did . . . Concerned Canadian citizens arrive at the Supreme Court on a double-decker bus to symbolize the threat of two-tier health care posed by the controversial Chaoulli case (Ottawa, June 8, 2004) Check out Canada's problems with Health Care. at http://www.healthcoalition.ca/ Makes you wonder.

[OKIEDOC]

These Fact Checks are not really truthful as given here. First a tree growing farm is not a timber company as these morons claim. A tree growing farm is a farm where trees are grown for resale to a timber company. Secondly I can report from first hand knowledge that medical personnel are required to practice defensive medicine. As an example a little girl came into a hospital with a small bump on her head. Due to the prospect of a potential lawsuit they were required to do extensive testing. MRI's, X-rays, and an overnight stay for observation. Cost of the goose egg was over two thousand dollars. Besides that the defensive medicine scared the mother out of her wits. Normally the hospital has to practice defensive medicine. It is drilled into them every day that every decision they make is under scrutiny. Some Cockroach trial lawyer will tie them up in litigation for the smallest mistake. Common sense will tell you that defensive medicine adds undue amounts to the cost of medicine. Mr. Kerry probably does not understand about such things. This is due to his extensive medical coverage furnished by the government or his rich wife. In my estimation 28 billion may be a low figure for this idiocy. The kind of health coverage Kerry wants to impose does not work. Having lived in foreign countries with mandated government health care it just does not work. When doctors can not make a decent living then they do other things. In Canada the question should be asked why it takes so long to get a operation scheduled. Why do many Canadians come to the United States and pay out of their pocket for operations? In one South American country Colombia with a form of mandated Social Security health care coverage the doctors have extremely low salaries. While riding on a city bus one day the driver bragged to me that he made more driving a bus than the doctor who treated him for high blood pressure. In Cuba many doctors drive cabs to support their first job of being a doctor. Americans need to wake up that nothing is free. The kind of health care that Kerry wants would be disastrous to all citizens in the long run.

[Kleon]

These Fact Checks are not really truthful as given here. First a tree growing farm is not a timber company as these morons claim.

Who really cares? It doesn't matter if it's a timber company or a toothpick factory. The real argument in the debate was over the definition of a small business. That's why Bush's "got wood?" response was perfect--it took attention away from the real issue, just like when people were debating 1970s fonts when the real issue was Bush's record.