Posted on 11/14/2004 5:23:06 PM PST by Cyropaedia
In light of the upcoming film Alexander (the Great), who in your opinion were actually the greatest military commanders our world has known...?
Mine are Genghis Khan, Alexander, and U.S. Grant.
Patton, McArthur, Sherman (I'm from the South and his ruthless March to the Sea was a back-breaker), Hannibal, Lee, Schwartzkopf, Washington. I think most of the great generals had one of two plans in common:
Deception on a large scale against the enemy and
Overpowering forces that took the will to fight out of the opposition.
IMHO, Napoleon beat Wellington the one time when he was in Spain and would have cleaned his clock if he wasn't busy in Russia. Napoleon's Marshalls in Spain were egotistically uncooperative and vainly refused to cooperate with each other to defeat the British. Napoleon would have stopped that nonsense in a heartbeat.
Yes, Wellington beat Bonapart at Waterloo. But you have to realize that almost all Bonapart's best Marshalls were dead. Almost everything that could go wrong, did go wrong and Napoleon STILL almost beat Wellington, who himself admitted the battle was "a close run thing."
The extent of Wellington's personal command at Waterloo didn't really go beyond reverse slope tactics, and trying to keep his Allies from running away. It wasn't so much Blucher who won the battle for Wellington, as it was Grouchy marching and counter-marching, completely failing his orders to prevent the Prussians from assisting Wellington AND failing to "march to the sound of the guns" and assist Napoleon at Waterloo.
You can bet that if Lannes or Bernadotte had lead those Corps, Napoleon would have defeated Wellington at Waterloo. I am convinced.
Wellington won the day and he earned it. He was more than competent. But I don't understand why any one would consider him a great General.
I seriously doubt that Ghengis Khan could have defeated an equal Roman army at the Empire's zenith. His greatest weakness was not having efective infantry. GK had the advantage of facing enemies with no effective and capably lead army. The Mongols were nothing but hit and run cavalry and the well organized legions of the early Roman Empire would have destroyed his army.
How about Vlad the Impaler? Vlad Tepes.
Suleyman the Magnificent.
The Nazi Submarine commanders had some excellent Officers as well although once again I am not able to remember the names.
Oh, and don't forget Chairman Mao.
Arioch7 out.
Well no, but that's all in good fun I think. Or at least I HOPE it is. In any event, the discussion has been kept to tactics and their efficacy.
I don't know much about war, but this is a great thread.
Adolph and I share the same last name ( the one from Kentucky, not the one from Austria).
Yeah, you can tell a lot about an Army by the way their soldiers are called to attention. The Germans are sharp and short with the stabbing "Achtung!" There's no way to ignore that. The French have the long nasally drone of "Ahhh-tahhn-seee-oone!" like a Move-on slacker slurping a creamy latte mocha. The Brits stuck us via English with the drab "Attention!" but thankfully our NCOs have shortened it to the twin bayonet thrust of "TEN-HUT!"
Great feat of Seamanship to sail in an open boat over 4000 miles.
He is not considered a great naval commander.
That is absolutely one of the most ignorant statements I have read on FR. Damn.
Julius Ceasar
Grant was well on the road to mastering the phyrric victory. Only the North's edge in industry and population saved his butt.
But it seems few will give him credit for that saying.
There are several causes but if you don't include among them, the desire on the part of the Southern states to protect the institution of slavery and to perpetuate its spread into the territories, you're not being honest.
"He is not considered a great naval commander."
Yeah, I guess not. He totally failed in that "commands the loyalty of his sailors" part of the test.
Sorry---I believe it was Isaac Hull, not Stphen Hall. Commander of the Consititution in several heroic acts in engaging or excaping British men of war.
How can you include Halsey and omit Spruance?
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