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Islamic terror based on Qu’ran: ex-CIA official
The Canadian Jewish News ^ | December 9, 2004 | SHELDON KIRSHNER

Posted on 12/08/2004 3:28:15 PM PST by yonif

A former top official of the U.S. Central Intelligence Agency paints a menacing picture of the relationship between Islam and terrorism.

“Islamic terrorism is based on Islam as revealed through the Qu’ran,” keynote speaker Bruce Tefft claimed in a panel discussion at the University of Toronto on jihad and global terrorism. The session, held late last month, was sponsored by the Friends of Simon Wiesenthal Center and the Speakers Action Group.

Tefft, a founder of the CIA’s counter-terrorism center and now an advisor to the New York Police Department’s intelligence and counter-terrorism divisions, said that without Islam, the long-term strategy of Al Qaeda and its followers make little sense.

Linking Osama bin Laden to the attacks against the World Trade Center and the Pentagon in 2001, Tefft said: “To pretend that Islam has nothing to do with Sept. 11 is to willfully ignore the obvious and to forever misinterpret events.”

In a harsh indictment of Islam – the world’s fastest growing religion and the second-largest faith after Christianity – Tefft said that while there may be moderate Muslims, Islam itself is immoderate.

And, he added, “There is no difference between Islam and Islamic fundamentalism, which is a totalitarian construct.”

According to Tefft, the Qu’ran enjoins Muslims to believe that the whole world should be governed by the principles of Islam, an expansionist religion that has historically grown through conquest.

All infidels are to be converted, enslaved or killed, he said, drawing on the knowledge of Bernard Lewis, a Jewish historian who has written books about Islam and Islamic history.

Tefft, whose career at the CIA spanned 21 years, argued that Islam was a religion of peace and tolerance in its formative phase, but has since grown intolerant of non-Muslims.

Islam cannot be reformed because its teachings, as revealed through the Qu’ran, are regarded as the word of God, and to be a Muslim, a believer must accept the Qu’ran on a literal basis, Tefft said.

He said Islam views Judaism and Christianity as failed religions and itself as the only true religion.

Islamic terrorists are animated by passionate anti-Western convictions, Tefft argued. They blindly sacrifice their lives for the chance of going to paradise and enjoying the charms of 72 virgins.

To them, the United States is the epitome of evil, because its constitution separates church and state.

Tefft said Al Qaeda’s 700-page training manual covers all aspects of terrorism, from surveillance to assassinations, and is drawn from U.S., Russian and Iranian manuals .

“They’ve compiled the best of the best.”

Of the 6,000 or more mosques in North America, 80 per cent are radical in orientation and devoted to spreading an intolerant Wahabi strain of Islam. They are funded by Saudi Arabia, he said.

David Harris, the former head of strategic planning at the Canadian Security Intelligence Service, said that Islamic fundamentalists are hostile to Canada and consider it a “Little Satan.”

He warned that Hezbollah has begun surveying sites in Canada for possible terrorist attacks.

Canada, though, innocently thinks it is immune to such aggression, Harris said.

John Thompson, the president of the MacKenzie Institute, a Canadian research organization, said Al Qaeda has a reservoir of recruits for at least a generation to come.

Tom Kay, the chief of police in Owen Sound and the immediate past president of the Ontario Association of Chiefs of Police, said Canadian law enforcement agencies that combat terrorism are under-funded.

“We face complacency from people in power,” he said, referring to Canadian politicians at all levels.

It is scandalous that more money is not being allocated to counter-terrorism efforts, Kay said.

Leo Adler, the director of national affairs for Friends of the Simon Wiesenthal Center, urged Canada to be more resolute in fighting terrorism.

Rather than operating in a vacuum, Jihadists work with highly honed organizations that supply them with funds, logistical support and intelligence, Adler commented.


TOPICS: Foreign Affairs; Front Page News; News/Current Events; War on Terror
KEYWORDS: 911; cia; death; genocide; globaljihad; islam; islamists; jihad; koranimals; murderers; muslim; muslims; religionofpeace; terrorism; terrorist; waronterrorism
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To: yonif

From another freeper about a year ago:

"Kill the disbelievers wherever we find them" (Koran 2:191)

"Ye are the best of peoples evolved for mankind." (Koran 3:110)

"The punishment of those who wage war against Allah and his messenger and strive after corruption in the land will be to be killed or crucified, or have their hands and feet and genitals cut off, or to be expelled out of the land. Such will be their humiliation in the world, and in the next world they will face an awful horror." (Koran, 5:33-34)

"Not to make friendship with Jews and Christians" (Koran 5:51)

"Remember Allah inspired the angels: I am with you. Give firmness to the believers. I will instill terror into the hearts of the unbelievers: you smite them above their necks and smite all their fingertips off of them." (Koran, 8:12)

"In order that Allah may separate the pure from the impure, put all the impure ones [all non-Muslims] one on top of another in a heap and cast them into hell. They will have been the ones to have lost." (Koran, 8:37)

"If there are twenty amongst you, you will vanquish two hundred: if a hundred, you will vanquish a thousand of them [infidels]" (Koran 8:65).

Allah and his messenger announce that it is acceptable to go back on our promises (treaties) and obligations with Pagans and make war on them whenever we find ourselves strong enough to do so (Koran 9:3)

"Fight and slay the Pagans, seize them, beleaguer them, and lie in wait for them in every stratagem" (Koran 9:5)

Our God tells us to "fight the unbelievers" and "He will punish them by our hands, cover them with shame and help us (to victory) over them" (Koran 9:14).

"Until they pay the Jizya [a penalty tax for the non-Muslims living under Islamic rules] with willing submission, and feel themselves subdued" (Koran 9:29)

"Unless we go forth, (for Jihad) He will punish us with a grievous penalty, and put others in our place" (9:39).

"O Prophet! Make war against the unbelievers [all non-Muslims] and the hypocrites and be merciless against them. Their home is hell, an evil refuge indeed." (Koran, 9:73)

"Murder them and treat them harshly" (Koran 9:123)

"When you meet the unbelievers in jihad [holy war], chop off their heads. And when you have brought them low, bind your prisoners rigorously. Then set them free or take ransom from them until the war is ended." (Koran, 47:40)

"When we decide to destroy a population, we send a definite order to them who have the good things in life and yet sin. So that Allah's word is proven true against them, then we destroy them utterly." (Koran, 17:16-17)

"How many were the populations we utterly destroyed because of their sins, setting up in their place other peoples." (Koran, 21:11)

"strike off the heads of the disbelievers" (Koran 47:4)

"Seize ye him, and bind ye him, And burn ye him in the Blazing Fire. Further, make him march in a chain, whereof the length is seventy cubits! This was he that would not believe in Allah Most High. And would not encourage the feeding of the indigent! So no friend hath he here this Day. Nor hath he any food except the corruption from the washing of wounds, Which none do eat but those in sin." (Koran 69:30-37)

You can continue to hope that Americans are too lazy to read your holy screed (assuming it's "Just like the Bible") and addicted to the farce of multiculturalism to wake up and see you for what you are, but your co-religionists are working at a cross purpose. Each time a muslim draws inspiration from allah and kills as many infidels as he can, more civilized people realize that islam is a religion of hatred and violence.


51 posted on 12/08/2004 6:16:40 PM PST by Calamari (Pass enough laws and everyone is guilty of something.)
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To: yonif
Islamic terror based on Qu’ran: ex-CIA official

What gave it away?

Oh yeah...


52 posted on 12/08/2004 6:18:51 PM PST by Prime Choice (I like Democrats, too. Let's exchange recipes.)
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To: OnlyinAmerica

NUKE EM ALL!

Did you think that up all by yourself? How very clever of you.


Ok we start dropping Nukes....what happens on day two?
And what does the rest of the world do?
Does that include iraq?
What about the Muslims in India? Do we Nuke them too?

"It is easy to fly into a passion--anybody can do that--but to be angry with the right person and at the right time and with the right object and in the right way--that is not easy, and it is not everyone who can do it."
-- Aristotle


53 posted on 12/08/2004 10:05:33 PM PST by Valin (Out Of My Mind; Back In Five Minutes)
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Comment #54 Removed by Moderator

To: sarah_f

Do you know the purpose of nuclear weapons?
Here's a hint, they're made NOT to be used. Or used only as a last resort.

For what it's worth I do believe Assad and the Mullahs in Tehran's days are numbered. And I suspect so do they, that's why they are sending terrorist into Iraq.

All this NUKE EM ALL talk is just so much testosterone driven drivel, that allows people to sound oh so manly. Fortunately there's someone in the WH who actually thinks instead of feels.


55 posted on 12/08/2004 10:34:19 PM PST by Valin (Out Of My Mind; Back In Five Minutes)
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To: sarah_f
No muslims, no arabs, no terror.

Sure, of course there are all of these things and you don't own a nuke. Thinking this way is exactly the same as the radicals over there think. What's the diff? This stuff = that stuff

56 posted on 12/08/2004 10:49:08 PM PST by RightWhale (Destroy the dark; restore the light)
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To: Valin

Nice strawman, but the thread is bout this written threat to all human civilization:


"Kill the disbelievers wherever we find them" (Koran 2:191)

"Ye are the best of peoples evolved for mankind." (Koran 3:110)

"The punishment of those who wage war against Allah and his messenger and strive after corruption in the land will be to be killed or crucified, or have their hands and feet and genitals cut off, or to be expelled out of the land. Such will be their humiliation in the world, and in the next world they will face an awful horror." (Koran, 5:33-34)

"Not to make friendship with Jews and Christians" (Koran 5:51)

"Remember Allah inspired the angels: I am with you. Give firmness to the believers. I will instill terror into the hearts of the unbelievers: you smite them above their necks and smite all their fingertips off of them." (Koran, 8:12)

"In order that Allah may separate the pure from the impure, put all the impure ones [all non-Muslims] one on top of another in a heap and cast them into hell. They will have been the ones to have lost." (Koran, 8:37)

"If there are twenty amongst you, you will vanquish two hundred: if a hundred, you will vanquish a thousand of them [infidels]" (Koran 8:65).

Allah and his messenger announce that it is acceptable to go back on our promises (treaties) and obligations with Pagans and make war on them whenever we find ourselves strong enough to do so (Koran 9:3)

"Fight and slay the Pagans, seize them, beleaguer them, and lie in wait for them in every stratagem" (Koran 9:5)

Our God tells us to "fight the unbelievers" and "He will punish them by our hands, cover them with shame and help us (to victory) over them" (Koran 9:14).

"Until they pay the Jizya [a penalty tax for the non-Muslims living under Islamic rules] with willing submission, and feel themselves subdued" (Koran 9:29)

"Unless we go forth, (for Jihad) He will punish us with a grievous penalty, and put others in our place" (9:39).

"O Prophet! Make war against the unbelievers [all non-Muslims] and the hypocrites and be merciless against them. Their home is hell, an evil refuge indeed." (Koran, 9:73)

"Murder them and treat them harshly" (Koran 9:123)

"When you meet the unbelievers in jihad [holy war], chop off their heads. And when you have brought them low, bind your prisoners rigorously. Then set them free or take ransom from them until the war is ended." (Koran, 47:40)

"When we decide to destroy a population, we send a definite order to them who have the good things in life and yet sin. So that Allah's word is proven true against them, then we destroy them utterly." (Koran, 17:16-17)

"How many were the populations we utterly destroyed because of their sins, setting up in their place other peoples." (Koran, 21:11)

"strike off the heads of the disbelievers" (Koran 47:4)

"Seize ye him, and bind ye him, And burn ye him in the Blazing Fire. Further, make him march in a chain, whereof the length is seventy cubits! This was he that would not believe in Allah Most High. And would not encourage the feeding of the indigent! So no friend hath he here this Day. Nor hath he any food except the corruption from the washing of wounds, Which none do eat but those in sin." (Koran 69:30-37)


57 posted on 12/08/2004 10:53:45 PM PST by broadsword (When Islam creeps into a human society, oppression, misogyny and terror come hard on its heels.)
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To: yonif

“Islamic terrorism is based on Islam as revealed through the Qu’ran,” keynote speaker Bruce Tefft claimed in a panel discussion at the University of Toronto on jihad and global terrorism. The session, held late last month, was sponsored by the Friends of Simon Wiesenthal Center and the Speakers Action Group.

>>>

He could be onto something here...

http://muhammadanism.org/Muhammad/Muhammad_Terrorism.htm#Actions


58 posted on 12/08/2004 10:55:36 PM PST by ApesForEvolution (You will NEVER convince me that Muhammadanism isn't a death cult that must end. Save your time...)
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To: Valin

There you go again...


59 posted on 12/08/2004 10:56:14 PM PST by ApesForEvolution (You will NEVER convince me that Muhammadanism isn't a death cult that must end. Save your time...)
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To: broadsword

"And seek not occasions for mischief in the land: for Allah loves not those who do mischief"

Beware of excesses in matters of religion. For, as a matter of fact, those before you were destroyed by religious immoderation"

"He who kills himself with anything, Allah will torment him with that in the fire of Hell"

"...If anyone killed a person not in retaliation for murder or to spread mischief in the land, it would be as if he killed the whole of mankind. And (likewise) if anyone saved a life, it would be as if he saved the whole of mankind"


If you want we can swap verses until the cows come home.


60 posted on 12/08/2004 10:56:33 PM PST by Valin (Out Of My Mind; Back In Five Minutes)
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To: Valin

I don't believe nukes would have to be used to do what needs to be done...it sure would be most effective and probably the best strategic move, but we haven't bled enough yet to get serious about ending this overripe death cult...


61 posted on 12/08/2004 10:58:45 PM PST by ApesForEvolution (You will NEVER convince me that Muhammadanism isn't a death cult that must end. Save your time...)
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To: Valin

You can channel satan (Mein Koran) all night long if you'd like.

We'll be over ... here. Have fun...


62 posted on 12/08/2004 10:59:58 PM PST by ApesForEvolution (You will NEVER convince me that Muhammadanism isn't a death cult that must end. Save your time...)
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To: ApesForEvolution

I'm sorry. I blame society, my dad didn't buy me a red wagon, the dog ate my homework...opps wrong thread.


63 posted on 12/08/2004 11:00:05 PM PST by Valin (Out Of My Mind; Back In Five Minutes)
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To: Valin

I wish you all the best...


64 posted on 12/08/2004 11:02:13 PM PST by ApesForEvolution (You will NEVER convince me that Muhammadanism isn't a death cult that must end. Save your time...)
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To: Valin

I'll call that hand. What you got? Bluffing?


65 posted on 12/08/2004 11:08:25 PM PST by broadsword (When Islam creeps into a human society, oppression, misogyny and terror come hard on its heels.)
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To: ApesForEvolution

Regarding #60: That's what I thought.


66 posted on 12/08/2004 11:29:04 PM PST by broadsword (When Islam creeps into a human society, oppression, misogyny and terror come hard on its heels.)
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To: Valin

But you cannot find, in Christian doctrine, the sort of ambiguity that allows people to simultaneously condone and eschew mass murder.

(Yes, this is an invidious comparison, and I'm not even a Christian - but I agree with Ann Coulter; we should just occupy them and cram Christianity down their throats - they'd end up thanking us for it.)


67 posted on 12/08/2004 11:57:03 PM PST by fire_eye (Socialism is the opiate of academia.)
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To: RightWhale

Please explain to me how I can be sure that is the *last* gasp.

Please explain why, in view of the history of islam, I should now believe that it has permanently become something other than what it has been since its inception.

Please provide evidence for why if islam achieves dominance, it will not simply oppress and exterminate everyone who chooses not to convert to islam, and will instead behave tolerantly toward the non-islamics in its midst. Please explain why it will completely change its behavior in that regard, from this point forward.

I need all those explanations in order to make an informed decision with regard to how I can trust islam.

Otherwise I'm likely to conclude that it needs to be wiped off the face of the earth so we can all live in peace. Right now, that's the conclusion toward which I'm tending (and it looks like even the CIA has woken up and smelled the nerve gas).

Perhaps your explanations can stop the holocaust... We're all waiting...


68 posted on 12/09/2004 12:05:22 AM PST by fire_eye (Socialism is the opiate of academia.)
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To: broadsword

BTTT


69 posted on 12/09/2004 12:34:19 AM PST by ApesForEvolution (You will NEVER convince me that Muhammadanism isn't a death cult that must end. Save your time...)
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To: stockpirate

LOL!


70 posted on 12/09/2004 12:36:21 AM PST by 7.62 x 51mm (• veni • vidi • vino • visa • "I came, I saw, I drank wine, I shopped")
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To: sarah_f

...amd convenience store clerks. LOL.


71 posted on 12/09/2004 12:37:39 AM PST by 7.62 x 51mm (• veni • vidi • vino • visa • "I came, I saw, I drank wine, I shopped")
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To: yonif; ApesForEvolution; broadsword; RightWhale; Valin; sarah_f; Prime Choice; Happy2BMe; ...
Thanks for posting this yonif. I have exchanged Freepmail with you in the past I believe. You are in Israel and I am in Southeast Asia.

I post a lot here on this subject because I have an intimate knowledge of the subject and the people who practice it. Any attempt to explain this further could cause problems for me which I am sure Mr. Yonif and Mr. Ali Sina understand. Over time it is my hope that a lot of my fellow Freepers will understand the reasons why as well..

This is a truthful hardhitting analysis that all of Freerepublic, the West and America needs to read and understand and I have taken the liberty of 'pinging' several people whom I feel might have an interest in the subject.

Further down the thread you will see a link posted to a site called FaithFreedom which is run by an Ex-Muslim (Mr. Ali Sina) who is an Iranian now living in the United States.

I became friends with Ali Sina over the internet when we were discussing how we did not share Dr. Daniel Pipes views on Islam. Later both myself and Mr. Sina exchanged letters with Dr. Pipes and his assertion that 'moderate' Muslims can bring about a kinder, more tolerant version of Islam like Christianity has been doing. Both Mr. Sina and myself agreed that there is no such thing as a "moderate muslim" and to imply that there is or that there can be a more moderate and tolerant version of Islam is misleading.

My explanation to Dr. Pipes was that in Islam this was not possible and the reasons are as follows ~

Unlike Christianity, the Quran is believed to be the direct word of God and therefore leaves no room for interpretation unlike the Bible which is a collection of stories according to the apostles. To change Islam would be like Christians changing the Ten Commandments. It can't be done because as we all know, this IS the word of God.

The word 'Islam' does not mean 'peace' as I have seen here before, but rather SUBMISSION which is extreemly important for non-muslims to understand. Submission to the will of Allah and therefore a Muslim has no right to question and/or attempt to question and/or interpret the Quran. He must submit.

If you understand this absolute, then you can understand that there is and can be no such thing as a 'moderate muslim' - there is only 'good muslims' and 'bad muslims' - the bad ones are the ones who don't submit to the will of Allah.

Many Westerners to this day speak of the deafening silence of the Muslim countries and Muslims worldwide - and ask why the Muslims worldwide don't speak out against the extremism in their midst, all the while, never completely understanding that 'extremism' is Islam does not exist but rather 'fundamentalism' and that is the strict and literal adherence to the Quran (the word of God), and once again - submission.

When Muslims and Muslim countries are pressured either by the Western media or Western governments to speak out against so-called "extremism", they find themselves only able to make benign statements such as "killing of innocents is wrong", "killing innocent women and children is wrong" or we are saddened to see so many innocent people die.

Ask yourself, would you call a Christian who follows the ten commandments and does not stray an 'extremist' or would you call him a "good Christian"?

What emboldens the Muslims worldwide and what is fueling their expansion now is what they see as the decadence and accelerated decline of Western civilization the death throes of Christianity and the rise of secularism.

Homosexual rights and gay marriage in my opinion was really one of the breaking points in the last several years from where I sit. How does a good Christian and a conservative explain that their fellow Christians in America approve of gay marriage and even elect a homosexual as their bishop? Needless to say it boggles the mind. There is no explanation.

A few years back an American multinational company which has a factory here in Malaysia came out with a company head office endorsed circular promoting a "coming out day" for closeted homosexuals within the company worldwide and mandatory "tolerance training" for the 'bigots' (ie. those employees who are repulsed by homosexual behaviour and find it sinful). Needless to say, that went over like a lead balloon.

When Muslims call America "The Great Satan" they are not joking. Many of them despise and hate America's invasive culture.

There is a solution to all of this and it is not multiculturism, diversity or tolerance. It is sorry to say, exactly what Ann Coulter said right after 9/11.

72 posted on 12/09/2004 12:50:01 AM PST by expatguy (Fallujah Delenda Est!!)
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To: expatguy

Bump Post for later


73 posted on 12/09/2004 12:54:10 AM PST by ApesForEvolution (You will NEVER convince me that Muhammadanism isn't a death cult that must end. Save your time...)
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To: Dark Wing

book mark


74 posted on 12/09/2004 2:48:40 AM PST by Dark Wing
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To: little jeremiah

Ping


75 posted on 12/09/2004 9:12:30 AM PST by EdReform (Free Republic - helping to keep our country a free republic. Thank you for your financial support!)
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To: expatguy

Thanks for the ping!


76 posted on 12/09/2004 9:39:53 AM PST by Alamo-Girl
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To: expatguy

"Unlike Christianity, the Quran is believed to be the direct word of God and therefore leaves no room for interpretation unlike the Bible which is a collection of stories according to the apostles."

This is your personal belief.

Whether you choose to use the word "bad" or "moderate" is immaterial. That's semantics. There are different muslim sects. They practice and believe differently. Sufis are not wahabbis. Whether you want to label one good, bad, moderate, cloudy, it doesn't matter.

As for your Iranian friend, we certainly have something in common there. I can understand his leaving his faith. He lived under a fanatical tyrannical system. I'm glad he escaped.

I also think it's important to distinguish between what is said and/or felt by middle eastern people because of their religion and what is said because of their geography and history. Anti-American or anti-British sentiments, have a lot to do with history and oil. I'm sure you're aware of that.

Count me on the Daniel Pipes side of this argument.


77 posted on 12/09/2004 9:41:36 AM PST by nuconvert (Everyone has a photographic memory. Some don't have film.)
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To: broadsword
misogynistic,

Explain 1 Timothy 2:11-15, then.

78 posted on 12/09/2004 9:43:48 AM PST by Chemist_Geek ("Drill, R&D, and conserve" should be our watchwords! Energy independence for America!)
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To: yonif; Mo1; Howlin; Peach; BeforeISleep; kimmie7; 4integrity; BigSkyFreeper; RandallFlagg; ...
“Islamic terrorism is based on Islam as revealed through the Qu’ran,”

Wow, News Flash!!

79 posted on 12/09/2004 9:48:31 AM PST by OXENinFLA
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To: Chemist_Geek

There is nothing misogynistic in it at all. Christianity elevates and respects women, and does not cut their genitals off, forbid them an education, force them into burkahs, cut their fingers off, rape them or consider them to be mere rewards for a man's penis in "heaven" as does Islam.

Your attempt at moral relativism between that day and night is lame and vile. Go back to your filthy prayer rug.


80 posted on 12/09/2004 9:50:13 AM PST by broadsword (When Islam creeps into a human society, oppression, misogyny and terror come hard on its heels.)
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To: fire_eye
how I can be sure

Go ahead, wipe 1.2 billion off the face of the earth. Your desire to do so makes you the same, equivalent, and equal to those very persons you so dislike. Another copy from the same mold. Cut from the same cloth. Separated at birth. lalalalalalalal

81 posted on 12/09/2004 9:53:28 AM PST by RightWhale (Destroy the dark; restore the light)
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To: expatguy
the Quran is believed to be the direct word of God and therefore leaves no room for interpretation

It is considered to be inspired through the personality and point of view of the writer, scribe, speaker, whatever, not direct, and must be interpreted. The terrorists and their madrassas are of course not interpreting and that is their mistake. So, that premise is generally incorrect and misleading and the rest of the essay fails.

82 posted on 12/09/2004 10:01:26 AM PST by RightWhale (Destroy the dark; restore the light)
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To: RightWhale
"...It is considered to be inspired through the personality and point of view of the writer, scribe, speaker, whatever, not direct, and must be interpreted...[sic]"

Im sorry but I disagree with this.

Islam divides all human activity into five categories from the permitted (halal) to the sinful (haram), leaving little room for human interpretation, let alone ethical innovations.

83 posted on 12/09/2004 10:21:49 AM PST by expatguy (Fallujah Delenda Est!!)
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To: expatguy

Yeah. It's fine to disagree. Shows that this Islam thing is highly interpreted.


84 posted on 12/09/2004 10:23:57 AM PST by RightWhale (Destroy the dark; restore the light)
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To: nuconvert
"Unlike Christianity, the Quran is believed to be the direct word of God and therefore leaves no room for interpretation unlike the Bible which is a collection of stories according to the apostles."

This is your personal belief.

The Gospel according to Matthew, Mark, Luke, John?

Are you to imply that the bible was written my God?

85 posted on 12/09/2004 10:30:24 AM PST by expatguy (Fallujah Delenda Est!!)
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To: RightWhale
Yeah. It's fine to disagree. Shows that this Islam thing is highly interpreted.

Rather it shows that Islam is not understood.

Your sarcasm however was duly noted.

Have a nice day.

86 posted on 12/09/2004 10:38:02 AM PST by expatguy (Fallujah Delenda Est!!)
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To: expatguy
Rather it shows that Islam is not understood.

Not even by the 1.2 billion Moslems. There should be more to it than running the rituals. This is automatic religion for the busy man on the go.

87 posted on 12/09/2004 10:43:26 AM PST by RightWhale (Destroy the dark; restore the light)
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To: broadsword
Chritianity in the midevil times prohibited education, printed or written materials not approved by the church. Women were forbidden to do much of anything. The governments at the church's direction, tortured and murdered millions whose only crime was asking questions, pursuing science, or didtributing written materials.

Chritianity had it's very dark times. Not quite like Islam who is stuck there forever, but it was a horrible enterprise as well.

88 posted on 12/09/2004 3:41:55 PM PST by blackdog (May Islam meet Tennyson's "Ninth Wave" in my lifetime.)
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To: jan in Colorado

ping


89 posted on 12/12/2004 6:20:03 AM PST by jan in Colorado
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