By the Wave of His Hand

My own thoughts... ^ | 02/17/05 | DoughtyOne

[SandRat]

What Jinx said!

[editor-surveyor]

We dare not propose the true solution here; Jim has stated plainly that he does not wish to have this issue pressed here. My guess is that the big guns were pointed his way, and they made him an offer he couldn't refuse; it seems that the powers that be have deemed that we are to lose on this issue (and thus ultimately lose all issues).

[JustAnotherSavage]

BTT

[broadsword]

Good post. You nailed it again. Wonder if you will be pulled, banned or suspended for it... or folded, spindled and mutilated?

[Do not dub me shapka broham]

I don't think you need to craft any elaborate conspiracy theories in order to explain someone's-as far as I can discern, genuine-position on a particularly controversial cultural issue.

Personally, I think that the notion that abolishing every single social welfare program in this nation-which is something that will never occur-will curtail this problem, is a diversion from the real issue at-hand.

Our government could be positively spartan-insofar as doling out free goodies to the underclass-and there would still be a seemingly endless stream of illegal aliens flooding across our Southern border.

When you live in a third world country, the incentive-or lack therof-of government largess is of secondary importance to your ultimate quest to elevate your current economic status.

[Cyber Ninja]

Have you seen any threads that discuss the gap that
does/will exist in Workers Comp coverage for ‘guest workers’?

They (illegals) are not covered at all now.
[Other than the use of Emergency Rooms.]
Won’t the libs/do-gooders want to insure these
(now legal) guest workers?

Oh, the costs! Oh, the law suits!

OBTW, DoughtyOne, well writen.

[Do not dub me shapka broham]

The labor unions are fast becoming an extinct breed.

The only methods by which they are able to replicate themselves are,

1. To become increasingly reliant upon unionizing public sector employees,

and,

2. Legalizing the status of millions of "undocumented", i.e. illegal aliens. Who will-presumably, in gratitude to their patrons-join newly created service worker unions.

[Trinity_Tx]

Reagan called it one of the worse decisions he made as POTUS.

The border patrol wasn't properly funded and the new requirements under law that would punish employers who hired illegals, weren't properly enforced.

Anyone who thinks it would be different under the most recent proposals set forward by PresBush, doesn't understand history and the horrible consequences of the IRCA of 1986.

Without a better effort at sealing the borders; without enforcing existing law that punishes employers who hire illegals; and without a halt to all welfare benefit payouts to illegals and their children... NO guest worker program will ever work. The problem of illegal immigration will only be perpetuated and exacterbated, year after year.

---

Very well said.

[JustAnotherSavage]

"The labor unions are fast becoming an extinct breed."



All the arguements are about "survival". Some want to "survive" at the expense of the majority of us. The AFLCIO contributes to MALDEF.

[Trinity_Tx]

Another excellent editorial DoughtyOne.

I beg everyone to behave so we don't see this one pulled as well. It's so unfair for us all to be punished - wastes our time... what a loss.

So very frustrating and unfair.

/rant lol

[Do not dub me shapka broham]

They sold out when they decided to embrace the refurbished '60s radicalism of Sweeney and Trumka, over the old-line, patriotic ethos embodied by individuals such as the late Lane Kirkland.

[Cultural Jihad]

. . . and implied that those who have a problem with illegal aliens and who support our immigration laws are like the Nazis.

No, the flames started when some decided I was talking about them personally, since their whole persona and self-identity are so closely wrapped up in this issue of illegal immigration. The only reason I presented the information on ILLEGAL Jews in Europe was to show what can happen when people are marginalized and dehumanized, and to point out that the law is not some kind of a religion, and that the Allies established during the Nuremberg Trials that following lawful orders is not a valid excuse for anything.

Otherwise, those who worship laws would have to ascent to gun-grabbing for example, since it is all perfectly legal for people in a community to ban weapons.

[Spiff]

No, the flames started when some decided I was talking about them personally, since their whole persona and self-identity are so closely wrapped up in this issue of illegal immigration. The only reason I presented the information on ILLEGAL Jews in Europe was to show what can happen when people are marginalized and dehumanized, and to point out that the law is not some kind of a religion, and that the Allies established during the Nuremberg Trials that following lawful orders is not a valid excuse for anything.

Baloney. You know perfectly well why you made the Nazi allusion and so do the rest of us. And you succeeded in having the entire thread pulled. You're quite skilled at what you do. It is a wonder why it is still tolerated.

[A Navy Vet]

"And folks, if you think our government is going to order millions of illegal immigrants back to Mexico, taking their children out of our schools in the process, dragging them back to Mexico, so the parents can sign up for a guest worker program in the U.S., I’ll be glad to help you purchase some great coastal property in Florida that’s only under water eleven months of the years. Honest!"

The other absolutely idiotic part of this "guest worker" stupidity is the belief these "guests" will return to their native country once their permit has expired, especially after they've had an anchor baby or 5.

[broadsword]

"Some animals are more equal than others."
--George Orwell

[Regulator]

Wonderful article you wrote, thoughtful and intelligent.

Too bad rational criticism goes pretty much ignored these days.

That said, I hope your comments - which are identical to the thoughts of the vast majority of citizens - are used in any legislative debates, and that they prevail.

[Wolfstar]

Good day, DoughtyOne. Did you see the exceedingly interesting FR poll on the question of illegal immigration?

26.6% of respondents chose: "I would approve of a guest worker program if it requires illegals to go home first and apply for entry."

21.0% chose: "I would not approve of a guest worker program of any kind."

That might seem as though people are divided almost down the middle on this question. However:

15.3% chose: "I would approve of a guest worker plan similar to Tancredo's."

9.1%: "I might approve of a compromise guest worker program with some of Tancredo's ideas incorporated."

8.3%: "I approve of the president's guest worker plan as is or with minor changes."

In other words, 59.3% are at least open to a guest worker program of some kind, as long as it includes measures to protect American sovereignty and security.

I voted for the first choice. I approve if illegals go home first and apply for entry as guest workers, although I doubt this would ever happen. I would also want to see English be made the official language of the U.S.

[hchutch]

Maybe Cultural Jihad's looked at the evidence, and come to a different conclusion than you have. To be very blunt, it seems that your REAL beef with folks like Cultural Jihad and myself is that we think for ourselves.

In other word's we've commited a double-plus ungood thoughtcrime against you - and not only that we have had the temerity and nerve to question the questionable and to have refused to accept the unacceptable.

Thus, like those black conservatives who do not toe the NAACP line, we exist with targets on our backs for refusing to nod our heads and be part of the Michelle Malkin/Tom Tancredo "Amen Corner" here. The notion that conservatives can think this issue through and decide that something else is needed is as foreign to you as it is for the NAACP.

Obviously, something must be wrong with the non-conformists. We must be paid off. We must be race-baiters. We obviously have no respect for the rule of law. We must be Bush-bots. We have to be hiring illegals. We must be against the American culture. We are liars. We must not really be conservatives. We need to "discuss it with ourselves" to quote DoughtyOne, in order to prove we "really care" about issues like education, taxation, and law and order. All of those claims are false, especially with the broad brush they have been used for those who have had the temerity to think for themselves on this issue.

I will make it clear - my positions on this or any issue are not for sale by anyone. My opinions are nobody's but my own. Nobody has told me how to think. Any insinuation or claim otherwise is a LIE. I view DoughtyOne's screeds as nothing more than a pair of broad-brushed personal attack on those who do not share his views on how to deal with the real problems we have with illegal immigration. It is a disgusting and contemptible attempt to keep folks on a plantation of ideologial purity. It is an attempt to stifle discussion and debate. But I have the notion that discussion and debate doesn't interest you.

[bayourod]

"Those of us who have been proven right on every single count regarding the last amnesty for illegal immigrants"

But history has proven you wrong. The United States is better and stronger than ever. Our economy is one of the best in the world. Our standard of living has never been higher. Our Health is the best ever. Crime is down. Taxes have been cut.

You were wrong twenty years ago and you are wrong today.

[Trinity_Tx]

"The only reason I presented the information on ILLEGAL Jews in Europe was to show what can happen when people are marginalized and dehumanized,"


And it was unfair, CJ. Because, you kept saying it was our calling them "illegal" that made us "the same black hearts" as the Nazis.

But, even under Bush's plan, some will still be *illegal* and need to be deported. Yet, you wouldn't say those things, or post pics of Jews being loaded onto trains when it comes to him.

"and to point out that the law is not some kind of a religion... Otherwise, those who worship laws would have to ascent to gun-grabbing"

Unless you are an anarchist, you are just as selective in which laws are worthy as those you condemn. You simply have a different opinion about *which* laws qualify.

I'm not going to fuss with you, but there are some things we need to put an end to. These particular ideas/accusations are 2 of them. IMO