Posted on 03/12/2005 8:16:29 AM PST by Cagey
Well .. I have read #694 - and you have ONE VOICE against many - so that doesn't prove much.
Your claim that if a federal officer is off duty - he is no longer a federal officer is ludicruos.
If the President takes the day off - is he no longer the President ..??
If a Judge takes the day off - is he no longer a judge ..??
If a District Attorney takes a day off - is he no longer a DA ..??
Your argument has no credibility!
If you have ever watched a program called JAG or NCIS, you would have noted that even though a military person was NOT IN UNIFORM when they were killed - they were still a part of the military - and it was the military who investigated and punished the crime.
As a personal note - when I was an active Deputy - I was told to carry my badge and ID at all times - even when I was not in uniform. Why? Because even when I was not in uniform - I was still a Deputy. That's how it works. I cannot understand why this concept is so difficult for you.
I didn't get my legal training by watching TV. And when I was an ADA, if someone had attacked me because of my job, one set of rules would have applied, if they had attacked me without regard to my job, another set of rules would have come into play as to appropriate charges and sentences.
"I didn't get my legal training by watching TV"
That's kind of rude - when I have no idea who you are or what you do. And "ADA" means nothing to me.
I apologize, I wasn't intending to be rude.
You had indicated you had been in law enforcement. ADA is fairly common shorthand for Assistant District Attorney. Perhaps DAs are called State's Attorneys or Commonweath's Attorneys where you are from. I don't know what the shorthand for one of those would be. AUSA is an Assistant United State's Attorney.
Actually, Georgia has only called a state prosecutor "District Attorney" for about 30 years or so. Before that, he would have been called a "Solicitor General".
Okay - as a former Asst DA - I'm really amazed by this statement: "if someone had attacked me because of my job, one set of rules would have applied, if they had attacked me without regard to my job, another set of rules would have come into play as to appropriate charges and sentences."
Isn't that position considered a "member of the court" and as such I'm confused why if you were killed while at your job or in court vs. at home - it would make a difference how the shooter would be charged. That's amazing. I don't think I've ever heard of that before.
I'm not saying I am 100% certain on the law, I'm just saying that is my current understanding of it. I, too, was wondering why people were saying yesterday that it was automatically a federal offense without knowing for sure when Nichols discovered this guy was an ICE agent, because my understanding is the same as PAR35. I could be wrong, no doubt. Just stating my understanding, that's all. I'm all for the guy getting the death penalty for this and regardless of whether there are just state charges, or federal charges, I bet and hope, he gets it.
It isn't the location, but the motivation that is the key factor. An attack on a police officer or a prosecutor (or judge) because he is a police officer, prosecutor or judge is an attack on the entire criminal justice system, and must be dealt with in the most severe fashion. If the person is in a parking lot on a Saturday, with no indication of what they do for a living, and that person is attacked in the course of a random mugging, then it should be treated as an ordinary crime. On the other hand, if an off duty deputy saw the judge being mugged, yelled "I'm a cop" and both got shot, then (setting aside for a moment the states where multiple murders will get a death penalty), then the perp should get the death penalty for the deputy, but not for the judge.
In the present case, I don't really know enough to figure out if they have a good federal case as to the customs guy. Based upon my reading of the federal statute, if the guy was a random victim while working on his house in Buckhead, as some reports indicate, than it should be a state prosecution. If he spotted the perp and flashed his badge and attempted to intervene, then it might well be a good federal prosecution, but I suspect they don't really have the evidence to support that, even if that is what happened.
What if the shooter just happened to see the guy's wallet laying on the counter (in the new house) and opened it and found out the guy was a Customs Agent ..??
Would that meet the criteria ..??
And .. I suspect this could have happened because he also had the guys badge and his "glock" - according to one of the police officers who said they found the 3 items in the area of the shooter - which I presume means in the apt where they arrested him.
Wow! This seems like an extremely high burden to meet - the shooters intent - if he lies that could be a real challenge.
I hope you don't mind me throwing a theory out there, not that it counts for anything, but this guy seems to have a problem with authority. He kills the judge, court reporter and a deputy. He let's the guy on the street go (carjacking victims, tourist in for the tournament and kidnapping victim), but the ICE agent gets shot. Maybe he did in fact, realize this guy was an agent before he killed him. It will be interesting to see how they build the case from a federal charge standpoint.
"at what point did Nichols know he was an ICE agent?"
I agree - that by Georgia law - this appears to be the big question.
Because it could have gone either way. He might have stumbled across it when checking the guys house - and decided to get rid of him and take his ID - or he could have found it in the guy's vehicle after he had shot him.
I'm voting for the first scenario because I think he would have killed him as soon as he found out he was a Customs Agent.
Of course - we also don't know yet (do we) how the guy was shot. That would also tell us a lot about how the crime was committed.
I'm kind of leaning your direction too .. because of the same issues you mentioned. He didn't kill people on the street - only people of authority. He didn't kill the lady officer who escorted him - he only hit her with the butt of the gun. I know at first they reported that he shot her in the mouth.
It's been weird for me - because when I was a Deputy in Oregon, it didn't matter - if you killed a police officer of any ilk - the killing was an automatic federal case.
I guess I just thought it was the same everywhere. I'm kinda shocked that the law is different.
This is the amazing story of the lady who turned in Nichols.
http://www.ajc.com/news/content/news/noads/0305/14hostage.html
A little late but yes Georgia has death penalty.
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