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Creation Controversy At The Tulsa Zoo
KOTV.com ^ | 6/7/05

Posted on 06/07/2005 9:47:45 AM PDT by Crackingham

A couple of displays at the Tulsa Zoo have angered some critics. And another that's been suggested is controversial too. Both have aspects of religion and another that's been suggested - are both creating controversy. Over by the elephants at the Tulsa Zoo, there is a statue of an elephant called "Ganesha". For Hindu's, Ganesha is a revered deity, one of the most important in the religion. But the curator of the exhibit at the Tulsa Zoo says it's not religious, in this setting. Brett Fidler: "We exhibit it out of the religious context, strictly as a museum piece."

For Dan Hicks and John Jones, that's unbelievable. They frequent the Tulsa Zoo with their children and Jones says he doesn't want to see religious icons at the zoo. John Jones: "we need to leave it to the display of animals, and the education of children about nature."

Hicks wants his religion included or the Hindu icon removed. He's suggested a biblical account of creation that zoo staff has so far, rejected. The Tulsa Zoo says the belief that God created the animals has no scientific merit and that's why it's not mentioned at the zoo. Brett Fidler: “we display things that have been proven through the scientific method and intelligent design has not been proven, to the point that it belongs at an institution like the Tulsa Zoo.”

The critics also think one of the zoo's most visible symbols, the big globe by the entrance, evokes religion through the saying "the earth is our mother, the sky is our father". Zoo staff says it's there to add a Native American flair, but Hicks believe it's another example of openness to anything but the Christian view.

The Tulsa Parks Board, which oversees the zoo, takes up the controversy at a meeting Tuesday. It will vote on whether or not to allow a display on the biblical view of creation.


TOPICS: Constitution/Conservatism; Culture/Society; Front Page News; Government; News/Current Events; Philosophy; US: Oklahoma
KEYWORDS: hindu; kotv; tulsa; tulsazoo; zoo
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1 posted on 06/07/2005 9:47:45 AM PDT by Crackingham
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To: Crackingham
"The Tulsa Zoo says the belief that God created the animals has no scientific merit"

Well folks, you heard it from the experts.

/sarcasm off

2 posted on 06/07/2005 9:56:07 AM PDT by BipolarBob (Yes I backed over the vampire, but I swear I didn't see it in my rearview mirror.)
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To: Crackingham
I'm not sure I agree with them trying to make a big creation versus evolution issue about this.. it is simply about a name..<br.
The zoo should just name an elephant "Jesus" or "Moses". Just like Ganesh (sp?), it is just a name.. (The name "Jesus" is a mistranslation anyway.)
3 posted on 06/07/2005 10:00:11 AM PDT by mnehring (http://www.mlearningworld.com)
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To: Crackingham

Good grief

The Tulsa Zoo is still my favorite (and America's favorite) zoo


4 posted on 06/07/2005 10:02:48 AM PDT by okstate
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To: BipolarBob

The belief that God created the animals, while true, does lack scientific merit. As for me, I think it's quite appropriate for an Indian elephant exhibit to include a statue reflecting Indian attitudes towards what an elephant is. And Noah's Ark is a magnificently appropriate theme for zoo art, since Noah's Ark is the ancient precursor to the form and function of modern zoos.


5 posted on 06/07/2005 10:03:59 AM PDT by dangus
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To: dangus

>> Dan Hicks... frequent[s] the Tulsa Zoo with [his] children. <<
Great. A bunch of Hicks. :^)


6 posted on 06/07/2005 10:05:27 AM PDT by dangus
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To: okstate

Yeah, I go to it too.


7 posted on 06/07/2005 10:08:00 AM PDT by BipolarBob (Yes I backed over the vampire, but I swear I didn't see it in my rearview mirror.)
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To: Crackingham
Brett Fidler: “we display things that have been proven through the scientific method . . . "

Not exactly:

I. The scientific method has four steps

1. Observation and description of a phenomenon or group of phenomena.

2. Formulation of an hypothesis to explain the phenomena. In physics, the hypothesis often takes the form of a causal mechanism or a mathematical relation.

3. Use of the hypothesis to predict the existence of other phenomena, or to predict quantitatively the results of new observations.

4. Performance of experimental tests of the predictions by several independent experimenters and properly performed experiments.

from http://teacher.nsrl.rochester.edu/phy_labs/AppendixE/AppendixE.html

8 posted on 06/07/2005 10:11:00 AM PDT by savedbygrace ("No Monday morning quarterback has ever led a team to victory" GW Bush)
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To: Crackingham

"Please do not offer my god a peanut. "


9 posted on 06/07/2005 10:18:11 AM PDT by Manic_Episode (OUT OF ORDER)
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To: okstate

The Tulsa Zoo is filled from one end to the other with pro-evolution statements on their exhibits. They should stick with what they can know from "the scientific method", as curator Fidler likes to brag.


10 posted on 06/07/2005 10:18:55 AM PDT by savedbygrace ("No Monday morning quarterback has ever led a team to victory" GW Bush)
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To: Crackingham

This rich guy was disappointed in the size of his manhood so he arranged to have an elephant's trunk transplanted down under. After recovering he's takes date to a dark, candle-lit restaurant, and he has to show off. The waiter leaves a basket of fresh dinner rolls. The guy casually picks up a roll with his new member.
She gasped and said, "Is that what I think it is? Can you do that again?"
And he replied, "I suppose so . . but I don't think I can take another roll up my rear."


11 posted on 06/07/2005 10:35:42 AM PDT by tumblindice
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To: BipolarBob

Yes, actually.


12 posted on 06/07/2005 10:40:43 AM PDT by highball
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To: savedbygrace
The Tulsa Zoo is filled from one end to the other with pro-evolution statements on their exhibits. They should stick with what they can know from "the scientific method", as curator Fidler likes to brag.

They do. That's why they educate the visitors on the findings of evolutionary biology, which are the result of the application of the scientific method.

13 posted on 06/07/2005 10:44:59 AM PDT by Ichneumon
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To: mnehrling
The zoo should just name an elephant "Jesus" or "Moses". Just like Ganesh (sp?), it is just a name.. (The name "Jesus" is a mistranslation anyway.)

That's what I thought, too...at first.

Then, I read it again. It is a statue of the Hindu elepahnt god, Ganesha.

This is compounded by the fatuous "...the big globe by the entrance, evokes religion through the saying "the earth is our mother, the sky is our father". Zoo staff says it's there to add a Native American flair,"...

14 posted on 06/07/2005 10:53:10 AM PDT by ApplegateRanch
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To: Ichneumon

You've never been to the Tulsa Zoo, have you?


15 posted on 06/07/2005 10:55:37 AM PDT by savedbygrace ("No Monday morning quarterback has ever led a team to victory" GW Bush)
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To: okstate
The Tulsa Zoo is still my favorite (and America's favorite) zoo

I'd have to take issue with that statement. :)

St. Louis' zoo is still free admission. Always will be.

16 posted on 06/07/2005 11:05:24 AM PDT by ShadowAce (Linux -- The Ultimate Windows Service Pack)
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To: mnehrling

Mistranslation? Lots of names have alternate corolaries when translated from language to language. It's not a "mistranslation" but one of several options. The name James is similiar in that there are many other alternatives that have evolved from Greek to Latin to our modern languages.


17 posted on 06/07/2005 11:42:41 AM PDT by bethelgrad (for God, country, the Marine Corps, and now the Navy Chaplain Corps OOH RAH!)
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To: bethelgrad
Yeshua (YHSWH) in Hebrew actually translates to Joshua, the name 'Jesus' came from early translators who tried to apply Greek language rules to Hebrew. Leasus is Greek for Joshua, and Leasus evolved to Jesus as the translations were passed on.
'Jesus' didn't even exist as a proper name until after this error. This is not limited to the Bible, this error was also duplicated in many translations of writings of the time including Josephus' Contra Apion.

No, I'm not one of those who think it is a big deal, just kind of funny.. I can imagine Jesus upstairs listening to prayers asking "Who are they talking to?"
18 posted on 06/07/2005 11:55:09 AM PDT by mnehring (http://www.mlearningworld.com)
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To: dangus
"Dan Hicks... frequent[s] the Tulsa Zoo with [his] children. "
"Great. A bunch of Hicks. :^)"
The zoo should demonstrate proper inclusiveness and include them in the exhibit. A large cage with a simulated habitat ought to be reserved for them. I could envision the warning posted on the cage: "do not feed, do not taunt..."
19 posted on 06/07/2005 12:57:08 PM PDT by GSlob
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To: savedbygrace

So I'll just explain to my son, "Son, the animals here are smarter than the people taking care of them."


20 posted on 06/07/2005 1:04:22 PM PDT by streetpreacher (God DOES exist; He's just not into you!)
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