Posted on 08/29/2005 4:26:08 AM PDT by hildy123
A Georgia county is being sued by the American Civil Liberties Union over its pre-meeting prayers. The suit claims one prayer at a recent Cobb County Commissioners' meeting ended "in the name of Jesus our Savior," which phrase, according to the ACLU, puts the invocation in violation of the Constitution of the United States.
However, attorney Steve Crampton of the American Family Association Center for Law & Policy, protests that the Cobb County officials' prayers are entirely legal, and the commission members have the right to open meetings with prayers acknowledging Jesus if they so choose.
But unfortunately, the pro-family lawyer notes, "This is one of those areas where our separation of church and state fanatics have really made headway over the last several years with the argument that praying in Jesus' name before, in this case, a county commission meeting constitutes the establishment of religion, prohibited under the First Amendment."
Still, Crampton, a constitutional law specialist, points out that there is historical as well as legal precedent for this kind of prayer. "Of course, the reality of the matter is that this is a practice that has been honored throughout the history of our nation, from the first days of the Continental Congress till today," he says.
And as far as the courts are concerned, the AFA attorney adds, the highest court in the land has also weighed in. "The U.S. Supreme Court ruled in 1983 in the Marsh v. Chambers case that legislative prayers with a historical background are perfectly constitutional -- that we are a people that has long recognized the obedience and role of our government as being under God," he says.
The ACLU's suit claims the Cobb County Commissioners' prayers are offensive to five county residents. However, a spokesman for Cobb County is arguing that the officials' prayers are legal because they take place before the meetings and are entirely voluntary.
You said: I assume Mr. Crampton would feel the same way if they started out each meeting by facing Mecca and praying to Allah or by chanting some scientology crap.
I don't think there is the same historical record of praying to Allah, etc. in the United States. That said, I could stomach another person praying to his/her God while I pray to mine at the same time.
I am not personally offended by prayers to the Judeo/Christian God or to Jesus. I am personally offended by prayers to Allah or any other God that advocates the murder of Jews and Christians. I am also offended by Scientology chants, Wicca spells, and the mantras of other non-religious religions. But, since the Constitution doesn't espressly prefer one religion to the exclusion of others, I don't see how some government organization can start a meeting with a Christain prayer without allowing prayers to the God of terror. The better approach is for government to do the government stuff and let people pray on their own time or pray silently to themselves.
Are ACLU lawyers paid or volunteer?
Interesting, all those governement references to God, but not one to Jesus Christ (though one obliquely with the citing of a preached Gospel).
How Mr. Crampton "feels" about anything is not the issue.
The issue is whether or not this prayer violates the Constitution. A strict constructionist would say "no." A "living, breathing document with emanating penumbras" bozo would say "yes."
So--5 people were offended! As far as I know, there is no right not to be offended. The ACLU should stuff it back up their backsides and get the hell out of Dodge!
I thought what the first amendment said was the government could NOT infringe on religion.
The photos are an essay are showing the relation of our laws to the commandments.
Jesus wasn't around yet ;)
So am I! That makes 2 of us. If we can get 5 of us to say we are offended by them - can we sue to disarm...er...ban them?
Wow...I had know idea...I am going to use this with some "progressives" I know...
Too bad the ACLU has its head up its @$$ with the "free exorcise thereof" part.
So someone (in this case 5)is offended. So what? Can't someont just tell the ACLU to pound sand?
16. Use technical decisions of the courts to weaken basic American institutions, by claiming their activities violate civil rights.
(This strategy goes back to the founding of the American Civil Liberties Union by Fabian Socialists Roger Baldwin and John Dewey and Communists William Z. Foster and Elizabeth Gurley Flynn among others.
27. Infiltrate the churches and replace revealed religion with "social" religion. Discredit the Bible and emphasize the need for intellectual maturity which does not need a "religious crutch."
29. Discredit the American Constitution by calling it inadequate, old-fashioned, out of step with modern needs, a hindrance to cooperation between nations on a worldwide basis.
I guess if they were to sacrifice a live goat to the Gods of earth, wind and water and dance naked in the meeting hall, the ACLU would have argued in their behalf for their "freedom of religion".
I guess if they were to sacrifice a live goat to the Gods of earth, wind and water and dance naked in the meeting hall, the ACLU would have argued in their behalf for their "freedom of religion".
so how long til the ACLU gets its hands on nascar? last time i checked they still started every race with a prayer.
Mere speculation and transferral of your unbelief is an
arguement of error. I cannot accept your dementia.
Paid by our taxed incomes thanks to a poorly written act of
Congress intended to promote Civil Rights- misinterpreted and exploited by the transmission belt to Soviet Communist
dictatorship (the ACLU)and their useful idiots.
Your point is...?
Disclaimer: Opinions posted on Free Republic are those of the individual posters and do not necessarily represent the opinion of Free Republic or its management. All materials posted herein are protected by copyright law and the exemption for fair use of copyrighted works.