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Subtle are Einstein's thoughts
Physics World via PhysicsWeb ^ | September 2005 | Alan H Batten

Posted on 09/10/2005 4:56:18 AM PDT by PatrickHenry

"Stop telling God what to do!" When Niels Bohr said these words to Albert Einstein - if indeed he ever did - it was probably in exasperation with Einstein's frequent repetition of the phrase "He does not play dice with the universe". The latter is perhaps the most famous of Einstein's many references to religion, although "The Lord God is subtle, but malicious he is not" comes a close second. There are many others too (see box below).

Scientific materialists, who regard all forms of religious belief as superstition, are often puzzled and even embarrassed by Einstein's frequent remarks about God. But conventional religious believers - knowing that Einstein was a Jew - often jump to the conclusion that he was referring to the traditional Judaeo-Christian God, and invoke his authority in support of their own beliefs.

I suspect that both groups have misunderstood Einstein and that we should all read more carefully what he wrote about science and religion. In 1940, for example, he submitted a paper to a conference on this subject in which he clearly stated that, in his view, there could be no "legitimate conflict between science and religion". The main source of conflict between the two, he argued, lay in the concept of "a personal God".

As the physicist Max Jammer describes in his 1999 book Einstein and Religion, that remark created a furore at the time. Many people in the US assumed that by denying the existence of a personal God, Einstein was denying any kind of God. What we now call the "religious right" was then vocal in its criticisms (and probably would be today).

However, Einstein's use of the word "God" was idiosyncratic. Indeed, Banesh Hoffmann - his biographer and former colleague - wrote that we do not know precisely what Einstein meant by the word. Perhaps, however, we can explore some of the things he did not mean.

Religious experience

As has been well documented, Einstein was born into a secularized Jewish family that did not observe any traditional rites. Nevertheless, stimulated by religious instruction from other relatives and at school, the young Einstein had an intensely religious phase that lasted for about a year. It came to what he later called an "abrupt end" at the age of 12, when he concluded that many Bible stories were incredible. At the same time, he discovered Euclidean geometry, which he then thought offered a level of certainty that no religion could.

After that early experience, Einstein never again took part in any formal religious observances - Jewish or Christian - except, perhaps, to attend the weddings or funerals of friends and relatives as a matter of courtesy. Looking back on his brief religious foray, Einstein wrote in his 1949 Autobiographical Notes that it was quite clear "that the religious paradise of youth...was a first attempt to free myself from the chains of the 'merely personal', from an existence dominated by wishes, hopes, and primitive feelings".

Einstein felt that the insights into the universe given by science and mathematics were a greater and surer release from the "merely personal" than religion. He was awestruck by our ability to comprehend the universe, at least in part, and in later life remarked several times that the most incomprehensible thing about the universe is that it is comprehensible. This kind of awe, he believed, was essential for scientists and, indeed, for human beings.

"The most beautiful experience we can have is the mysterious," he wrote in a 1931 essay. "A knowledge of the existence of something we cannot penetrate, our perceptions of the profoundest reason and the most radiant beauty, which only in their most primitive forms are accessible to our minds - it is this knowledge and this emotion that constitute true religiosity; in this sense, and in this alone, I am a deeply religious man." This remark shows that Einstein defined religiosity in his own terms. Indeed, in the essay he goes on to distance himself from orthodox Jewish and Christian religion, expressing his disbelief in the idea that an individual can survive after their body dies or in any kind of final judgement. He was instead satisfied with the "devoted striving to comprehend a portion, be it ever so tiny, of the Reason that manifests itself in nature".

Pantheism and the personal God

Einstein's conviction that nature is rational is closely linked to his conception of God: he could not believe that God played dice with the universe, because that would be irrational. He accepted what he believed to be the corollary, namely that human beings have no free will. Einstein's other favourite saying - that the Lord is subtle but not malicious - is related to the same conviction of rationality. "Nature", he concluded, "hides her secret because of her essential loftiness, but not by means of ruse."

For those who regard all forms of religious belief as superstition, it would be attractive to conclude that Einstein simply meant "nature" whenever he used the word "God". Indeed, identifying God with nature is known as pantheism, a belief that is generally attributed to the unorthodox Jewish philosopher Baruch Spinoza (1632-1677). We know that Einstein admired Spinoza greatly and, although he did not share all of his religious views, it would seem plausible to label Einstein a pantheist.

However, in 1929 - during a rare interview with a journalist - Einstein was directly asked if he believed in the God of Spinoza. "I can't answer with a simple yes or no," he replied. "I am not an atheist [and] I do not know if I can define myself as a pantheist." Indeed, pantheists view God and the universe as co-eternal and believe that there was no act of creation, whereas Einstein does seem to have regarded the universe as a creation.

But why did Einstein not believe in a personal God? To answer that question, we have to understand what he meant by the term. I would define a personal God as a God with whom human beings can have a relationship, analogous to those they have with one another. Although this idea might seem to indicate that God has a human form, I think it is perfectly possible to believe in a personal God who is not anthropomorphic. I suspect - but cannot clearly demonstrate - that Einstein sometimes confused the two ideas.

For example, while Einstein certainly did not like anthropomorphism, he still used personal terms, such as subtlety and malice, when speaking about God. Indeed, in his 1929 interview, the best simile he could think of for God was as the author of a whole library of books! Einstein would probably have defended himself by pointing to the limitations of human language, which make it almost impossible to avoid personal terminology completely.

But it is surprising that Einstein used such personal terms when talking about God, given that he saw his lifelong devotion to science as an attempt to transcend the "merely personal" in his own life; this suggests that he thought a personal God would be a limited God. Whatever he meant by "personal God", Einstein remained consistent in his opposition to the idea until the very end of his life.

Cosmic religion

Although Einstein was not always consistent in what he said about God, there is a consistent theme running through his thoughts on religion - a theme that he called "cosmic religion". He used this term to reflect the awe he felt when confronted with the universe and our ability to begin, at least, to comprehend it. Writing in 1930, he saw hints of this cosmic religion in the Psalms and the Hebrew prophets, and more clearly in Buddhism. This cosmic religion, he wrote, "knows no dogma and no God conceived in man's image; so that there can be no church whose central teachings are based on it".

Einstein's dislike of organized religion is clear. Many people today, according to opinion polls, have similar ideas. They profess to believe in the spiritual - or even in God - yet rarely or never enter a church, mosque or synagogue. However, Einstein should not be regarded as their precursor. Their "new-age spirituality" is often anti-scientific, whereas Einstein's cosmic religion was based firmly on a profound understanding of the physical universe, and of its underlying mathematical structure.

Einstein also often referred to his feelings of mystery and awe. The mystery, it seems to me, had three elements. Why is there anything at all? Why is the universe rational and ordered? And how can we, with our limited human minds, understand and appreciate at least something of that ordered rationality? I believe he used the word "God" as a shorthand for all this because he could think of none better.

Einstein's condemnation of anthropomorphic images of God is at one with the most profound insights of all religions. He knew very well that the second commandment (which Jews and Muslims have kept more strictly than Christians) says we should not make any graven image and bow down and worship it. On that theme, Einstein agrees with the Hebrew prophets, whom he saw as forerunners of his cosmic religion.

Whether or not he meant more than their denunciations of idols when he denied belief in a personal God, I do not know. However, Einstein's cosmic religion differs both from orthodox monotheism and from scientific materialism because of his conviction that science and religion must work together to explore the mysteries that fascinated him. That, surely, is the meaning of another of his famous sayings: "Science without religion is lame, religion without science is blind."

Box:
Einstein on God and religion

*[Quantum] theory yields much, but it hardly brings us close to the Old One's secrets. I, in any case, am convinced He does not play dice. (1926, in a letter to Max Born)

*I cannot conceive of a God who rewards and punishes his creatures, or has a will of the kind we experience in ourselves. Neither can I nor would I want to conceive of an individual who survives his physical death.... (1930, from an essay)

* We see a universe marvellously arranged and obeying certain laws, but only dimly understand those laws. Our limited minds cannot grasp the mysterious force that moves the constellations. (1929, part of his reply to the question: "Do you believe in the God of Spinoza?")

* What I am really interested in is whether God could have created the world in a different way; in other words, whether the requirement of logical simplicity admits a margin of freedom. (Mid-1940s, remark reported by Ernst Gabor Straus, then Einstein's assistant)

* Then I would feel sorry for the good Lord. The theory is correct anyway. (1919, reply to his assistant, Ilse Rosenthal-Schneider, who asked what he would have done had Eddington's eclipse measurements not supported general relativity)

* Science without religion is lame, religion without science is blind. (1941, from an essay)



TOPICS: Culture/Society; Miscellaneous; Philosophy
KEYWORDS: crevolist; einstein; stringtheory
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To: hosepipe; PatrickHenry
"Or lots of clues about everything."

I'm afraid I resemble that remark.

:-)

41 posted on 09/10/2005 10:31:12 AM PDT by FireTrack
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To: VadeRetro
"I am not an atheist"
--Einstein
:-)

42 posted on 09/10/2005 10:32:26 AM PDT by Tribune7
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To: Quark2005
I don't think it's possible to study science & nature without being moved by it. The Bible is an awesome book; but you can't convince me that the universe is not also a revelation of God. Nothing teaches man greater humility before the Infinite than to see his insignificant place in the midst of time and the cosmos.

I agree with what you are saying. I should have clarified my remarks by saying, "The Bible is the only Holy Book that is a valid revelation from God."

Thank you for making that distinction. Clearly I believe that God also reveals his ways through His creation; as my tag line indicates.

43 posted on 09/10/2005 10:34:45 AM PDT by bondserv (Creation sings a song of praise, Declaring the wonders of Your ways †)
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To: Ichneumon
"Einstein found the creationists' idea of God to be, in his words, "naive"."

And we haven't even discussed the lesser Gods and Demons...

44 posted on 09/10/2005 10:47:40 AM PDT by FireTrack
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To: FireTrack
Ever delve into entanglement?

As in quantum entanglement and action-at-a-distance?

I know a bit about it, but I'm no expert. I've had several semesters worth of grad. level quantum physics; I spent a little time studying Bell's inequality & its implications, but it was a few years ago; I've since moved on to other areas of work - and as they say with all science knowledge, "use it or lose it". Quantum entanglement is not an easy subject to get your mind around.

It is my opinion that the theological (and even physical) implications of entanglement, while important, are somewhat exaggerated, however. I do know that the biggest misconception about it is that quantum entanglement somehow allows one to sidestep the effects of relavity (and the speed limit of light), when in fact, it really does not.

45 posted on 09/10/2005 10:49:10 AM PDT by Quark2005 (Where's the science?)
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To: FireTrack
relavity

I meant relativity of course. (Embarrassing to misspell this word on an Einstein thread....)

46 posted on 09/10/2005 10:52:51 AM PDT by Quark2005 (Where's the science?)
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To: Right Wing Assault
he was a famous, quirky looking guy

I would not know personally, but apparently he was very lively, personable and outgoing, had an excellent sense of humor, and was quite relaxed in social situations, and was the only friend of Goedel. Goedel was the opposite in almost every way, yet had a very close home life.

47 posted on 09/10/2005 10:54:14 AM PDT by RightWhale (We in heep dip trubble)
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To: Ichneumon
Do you think Einstein believed that God exists or he just referred to him as another way to describe nature?
48 posted on 09/10/2005 11:04:10 AM PDT by Raycpa
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To: RightWhale
Einstein was quirky-looking in his later years (a fate that probably awaits us all), but as a younger man -- although he was nobody's idea of a movie-star, I can understand that he may have had a way with the ladies:


49 posted on 09/10/2005 11:16:45 AM PDT by PatrickHenry (Discoveries attributable to the scientific method -- 100%; to creation science -- zero.)
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To: Ichneumon
Then why does the majority of "the world" remain unpersuaded by this "proof"? Something appears to be wrong with your presumptions.

Your thoughts were foresaw by God and He inspired Paul to clear things up for us. Bolded for your convenience.

Rom 1:18-32
18 For the wrath of God is revealed from heaven against all ungodliness and unrighteousness of men, who suppress the truth in unrighteousness,
19 because what may be known of God is manifest in them, for God has shown it to them.
20 For since the creation of the world His invisible attributes are clearly seen, being understood by the things that are made, even His eternal power and Godhead, so that they are without excuse,
21 because, although they knew God, they did not glorify Him as God, nor were thankful, but became futile in their thoughts, and their foolish hearts were darkened.
22 Professing to be wise, they became fools,
23 and changed the glory of the incorruptible God into an image made like corruptible man--and birds and four-footed animals and creeping things.
24 Therefore God also gave them up to uncleanness, in the lusts of their hearts, to dishonor their bodies among themselves,
25 who exchanged the truth of God for the lie, and worshiped and served the creature rather than the Creator, who is blessed forever. Amen.
26 For this reason God gave them up to vile passions. For even their women exchanged the natural use for what is against nature.
27 Likewise also the men, leaving the natural use of the woman, burned in their lust for one another, men with men committing what is shameful, and receiving in themselves the penalty of their error which was due.
28 And even as they did not like to retain God in their knowledge, God gave them over to a debased mind, to do those things which are not fitting;
29 being filled with all unrighteousness, *sexual immorality, wickedness, covetousness, maliciousness; full of envy, murder, strife, deceit, evil-mindedness; they are whisperers,
30 backbiters, haters of God, violent, proud, boasters, inventors of evil things, disobedient to parents,
31 undiscerning, untrustworthy, unloving, *unforgiving, unmerciful;
32 who, knowing the righteous judgment of God, that those who practice such things are deserving of death, not only do the same but also approve of those who practice them.

50 posted on 09/10/2005 11:22:46 AM PDT by bondserv (Creation sings a song of praise, Declaring the wonders of Your ways †)
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To: Quark2005
" As in quantum entanglement and action-at-a-distance?"

Yep, pretty fascinating stuff and wasn't it Einstein who predicted this "spooky" action-at-a-distance? It is unreal how this man using only his mind and a chalk board conceived of these properties of nature that we now only have the technology to prove or telescopes to view as in black holes.

51 posted on 09/10/2005 11:26:07 AM PDT by FireTrack
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To: Ichneumon
If it really mattered what Einstein thought about God, this one would be the cruncher for crevo thread purposes:

"To assume the existence of an unperceivable being ... does not facilitate understanding the orderliness we find in the perceivable world."
-- Albert Einstein, letter to an Iowa student who asked, What is God? July, 1953; Einstein Archive
This is not a God who pops in every once in a while to make a new species because microevolution can never become macroevolution. There are no miracles at all with this God. He got it as right as He needed it up front.
52 posted on 09/10/2005 11:31:16 AM PDT by VadeRetro (Liberalism is a cancer on society. Creationism is a cancer on conservatism.)
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To: PatrickHenry
[He was even worse in economics. The guy was a socialist.]



I admire Einstein most for his willingness to change his mind when the evidence warranted it. He abandoned his long held belief in a static universe when it was demonstrated that the universe was expanding, and he abandoned his pacifist views when he realized that the Nazis were not likely to be reasoned out of committing genocide.

He also learned to respect much of American entrepreneurial ism in his later years after he spent some time here.
53 posted on 09/10/2005 11:33:32 AM PDT by spinestein (Forget the Golden Rule. Remember the Brazen Rule.)
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To: PatrickHenry
What women used to call "bedroom eyes." (Young Charles Boyer was supposedly the classic example.)

I never had them, but I have some silly-looking pics of my Dad as a young man making them at the camera.

54 posted on 09/10/2005 11:35:51 AM PDT by VadeRetro (Liberalism is a cancer on society. Creationism is a cancer on conservatism.)
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To: PatrickHenry

BUMP!


55 posted on 09/10/2005 11:36:43 AM PDT by Lancey Howard
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To: FireTrack
It is unreal how this man using only his mind and a chalk board conceived of these properties of nature that we now only have the technology to prove or telescopes to view as in black holes.

IMHO, the most truly remarkable thing about Einstein was the diverse range of subtopics in physics he contributed essential knowledge to. His 1905 paper included:

-a study of Brownian motion (the first self-contained empirical method of measuring molecular/atomic masses)

-the photoelectric effect (essentially the discovery of photons, which is actually the theory that won him the Nobel Prize)

- AND special relativity.

Later in life he contributed general relativity, important theories in quantum statistics and the specific heats of solids, and to the development of quantum mechanics and cosmology.

Any one of this vast number of contributions would have been enough for most physicists to say they had a successful career.

56 posted on 09/10/2005 11:37:00 AM PDT by Quark2005 (Where's the science?)
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To: Quark2005
Another intriguing theory: http://www.geocities.com/mirrorplanets/ I guess what I'm doing here is reinforcing how much we have left to discover and just how much we don't understand.

I think Einstein instead of allowing himself to accept something that might have been false in his religious beliefs instead opted for a childlike religion of possibilities?

Einstein, I believe, trusted in a Creator that would appreciate his courage of conviction. :-)

57 posted on 09/10/2005 11:39:20 AM PDT by FireTrack
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To: PatrickHenry

58 posted on 09/10/2005 11:39:28 AM PDT by VadeRetro (Liberalism is a cancer on society. Creationism is a cancer on conservatism.)
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To: FireTrack

What part of your little plug did I miss?


59 posted on 09/10/2005 11:45:36 AM PDT by Zechariah11
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To: JCEccles; PatrickHenry
Brilliant physicist, amateurish theologian.

Einstein never claimed to be a theologian. Ah, but aren't we all of necessity "amateurish" theologians in our own way?

Every human comes at least once to a place where we consider if there is not Something Bigger out there. Were this not so; if we could not grasp anything larger than our own needs, I doubt we would qualify as "conscious" entities.

Thus each of us determines our own theology - be it Paganism, Pantheism, Christianity, Atheism, Agnosticism, etc., etc,. And the spectrum of adherence to the tenets of each faith is equally as broad, and changes over the course of one's lifetime.

Quote-mining in order to prove or disprove Einstein's religious convictions is a futile endeavor...for none of us were privy to his conscious thoughts as he slipped from this life. I am however, immensely satisfied that Einstein, for all his brains, still retained a sense of wonder, awe, and mystery about the Universe.

60 posted on 09/10/2005 11:47:37 AM PDT by Aracelis
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