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Memorizing the Way to Heaven, Verse by Verse
NY Times ^ | August 16, 2006 | MICHAEL LUO

Posted on 08/16/2006 10:02:21 AM PDT by Sabramerican

The carpeted room is full of children in skullcaps crouched on prayer mats, reciting verses from a holy text. Some mumble the words under their breath; others sing them out. They rock back and forth as they chant, their disparate voices blending into an ethereal melody.

The children, ages 7 to 14, are full-time students, in class 8 a.m. to 5 p.m., Monday through Friday, even in the summer. But they are not studying math, science or English. Instead, they are memorizing all 6,200 verses in the Koran, a task that usually takes two to three years.

It would hardly be an unusual scene in Pakistan, Afghanistan or elsewhere in the Muslim world, where religious schools devoted to memorization of the Koran and Islamic studies are common. But this class meets in the prayer room of a small mosque in Flushing, Queens, that caters mostly to South Asian immigrants and their children.

Schools like this one at the Muslim Center of New York are rare in the United States, but are emerging, especially among South Asians, as the Muslim American population becomes more established.

....By not offering instruction in other subjects,

(Excerpt) Read more at nytimes.com ...


TOPICS: Culture/Society; Extended News; Israel; War on Terror
KEYWORDS: christians; crushislam; education; islam; islamicfascists; islamisadeathcult; islamisevil; islamofascism; israel; jews; koran; koranimals; muslim; muslims; nextjihadists; nytreasontimes; trop; wot
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Jihad U?
1 posted on 08/16/2006 10:02:22 AM PDT by Sabramerican
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To: Carry_Okie

Here


2 posted on 08/16/2006 10:03:02 AM PDT by Sabramerican (Bush Doctrine- Old: Fight terrorists. New: Cease fire with terrorists.)
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To: Sabramerican
Columna quinta delenda est.
3 posted on 08/16/2006 10:07:18 AM PDT by Pyro7480 ("Love is the fusion of two souls in one in order to bring about mutual perfection." -S. Terese Andes)
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To: Sabramerican

Only one verse is necessary, and it ain't in the Koran:
"I am the way, the truth, and the life; no one comes to the Father except by Me."


4 posted on 08/16/2006 10:08:56 AM PDT by beethovenfan (If Islam is the solution, the "problem" must be freedom.)
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To: Sabramerican

Lovely, just lovely. Our own madrassas. We will really stop at nothing to make these evil, backward-thinking Islamonazis feel at home. I wonder how many terrorists will be spawned from this.


5 posted on 08/16/2006 10:09:07 AM PDT by FarRightFanatic
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To: Sabramerican
Got it.

We're in a heap of trouble.

6 posted on 08/16/2006 10:09:51 AM PDT by Carry_Okie (The fourth estate is the fifth column.)
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To: Sabramerican

Well, the Madrassas are here...


7 posted on 08/16/2006 10:11:19 AM PDT by cardinal4 (America, despite the usual suspects, stands firmly with Israel..)
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To: Pyro7480

Not being familiar with Latin, could you translate, please?


8 posted on 08/16/2006 10:12:55 AM PDT by hoagy62 (America: SUPREME!)
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To: hoagy62
The Fifth Column must be destroyed (paraphrasing the ancient Roman senator Cato the Elder, "who ended every speech of his during the Punic Wars with ceterum censeo Carthaginem esse delendam, literally 'For the rest, I am of the opinion that Carthage is to be destroyed.' Other translations include 'In conclusion, I declare that Carthage must be destroyed. and 'Furthermore, I move for Carthage to be destroyed.'")(source: List of Latin phrases, A-E)
9 posted on 08/16/2006 10:16:11 AM PDT by Pyro7480 ("Love is the fusion of two souls in one in order to bring about mutual perfection." -S. Terese Andes)
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To: Sabramerican

I was listening to CSPAN the other night and they were interviewing Ambassador Akbar Ahmed, who is the Ibn Khaldun Chair of Islamic Studies, American University in Washington DC. He is “the world’s leading authority on contemporary Islam” according to the BBC.

He was saying that a lot of what is being taught of the Koran is being interpreted wrong and that the Koran and Muslims in general, are taught to be loving and caring and respectful to others and that we are all equal. These islamofascists are interpreting the Koran to mean what THEY want it to mean and only taking passages that allow them to do what they do and kill others, etc.

Kind of like extremist christians misread/misquote the Bible and take it out of text, etc., the same is true for the Koran.

It was an interesting interview anyway.


10 posted on 08/16/2006 10:17:07 AM PDT by Lucky9teen (Ask not what the government can do for you. Ask why it doesn't.)
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To: Sabramerican

How long does it take to memorize "Kill the infidels" ?


11 posted on 08/16/2006 10:17:08 AM PDT by talleyman (Kerry & the Surrender-Donkey Treasoncrats - trashing the troops for 40 years.)
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To: Lucky9teen

Just to add, it is really sad and messed up that these children are being taught the extremist way.

This is a war of religions, not nations, imo.


12 posted on 08/16/2006 10:19:10 AM PDT by Lucky9teen (Ask not what the government can do for you. Ask why it doesn't.)
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To: Sabramerican
ages 7 to 14, are full-time students, in class 8 a.m. to 5 p.m., Monday through Friday, even in the summer

Where is child protective services. These kids need to be in a proper school, and pass state exams, not memorizing arabic, 45 hours a week.

13 posted on 08/16/2006 10:22:22 AM PDT by bird4four4 (Behead those who suggest Islam is violent!)
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To: Lucky9teen

If only Christians embraced their faith as much as the muslims do theirs.


14 posted on 08/16/2006 10:24:07 AM PDT by DonaldC
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To: Sabramerican
Boy, does this verse ever come to mind when reading this....

Eph 6:12 For we wrestle not against flesh and blood, but against principalities, against powers, against the rulers of the darkness of this world, against spiritual wickedness in high [places].

15 posted on 08/16/2006 10:24:07 AM PDT by BigFinn
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To: Sabramerican

With this type of education under their belt, they should also memorize this phrase:

"Would you like fries with that?"


16 posted on 08/16/2006 10:24:14 AM PDT by Argus
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To: Lucky9teen
Kind of like extremist christians misread/misquote the Bible and take it out of text, etc., the same is true for the Koran

Yes but when people put hoods on and waved the Bible around and killed n-gros, other Christians put them down, and they are a footnote in Chritianities history. Muslem need to stand up now, loud and strong, and take out their masked hoodlims who go around killing jews and infidels.

17 posted on 08/16/2006 10:25:19 AM PDT by bird4four4 (Behead those who suggest Islam is violent!)
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To: Lucky9teen
He was saying that a lot of what is being taught of the Koran is being interpreted wrong and that the Koran and Muslims in general, are taught to be loving and caring and respectful to others and that we are all equal. These islamofascists are interpreting the Koran to mean what THEY want it to mean and only taking passages that allow them to do what they do and kill others, etc.

Funny how no Imams condemn this form of teaching. As a reader of the Koran, believe me there is nothing to misinterpret when it comes to Christians and Jews and how to hate and kill them!!

18 posted on 08/16/2006 10:30:33 AM PDT by Bommer
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To: Bommer

The Bible is the ONLY book to read and gain spiritual guidance and knowledge from, imo.


19 posted on 08/16/2006 10:32:26 AM PDT by Lucky9teen (Ask not what the government can do for you. Ask why it doesn't.)
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To: Sabramerican
By not offering instruction in other subjects, the school may be inadvertently running afoul of state law, according to city and state education officials. Private religious schools like the Muslim Center’s program are required to provide “substantially equivalent” instruction to that offered in public schools, they said. But tracking every school-age child who leaves the public school system can be difficult.

New York State has made it virtually impossible to home school because they will not issue a diploma to anyone who is home schooled after the freshman year. Funny how the state is now dragging their feet in regards to the Muslim private schools.

20 posted on 08/16/2006 10:33:13 AM PDT by CaptainK (...please make it stop. Shake a can of pennies at it.)
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To: Lucky9teen
These islamofascists are interpreting the Koran to mean what THEY want it to mean and only taking passages that allow them to do what they do and kill others, etc.

I am not a Muslim

-I'm with the islamofascists on their interpretation of the Koran and Hadiths. They got it right.

I would bet if I could sit down with the late Zarqawi, I would have the exact same interpretation of the Koran and Hadiths as he had.

How any Muslims can come to a loving caring conclusion about Islam is beyond me. And apparently beyond Zarqawi, who killed, whenever he had the chance, those Infidel ass kissing so- called Muslims who wouldn't get Infidel blood on their hands. They took the easy way out, by misinterpreting the religion for a more peaceful life on earth with the Infidel scum. - tom

21 posted on 08/16/2006 10:35:32 AM PDT by Capt. Tom (Don't confuse the Bushies with the dumb Republicans - Capt. Tom)
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To: Bommer
Akbar Ahmed discusses Islamic fundamentalism, why he believes some terrorists act in the name of Islam and his goal to spread the peaceful teachings of Islam to younger generations.

Here is the transcript of the interview.
22 posted on 08/16/2006 10:36:03 AM PDT by Lucky9teen (Ask not what the government can do for you. Ask why it doesn't.)
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To: Lucky9teen

The trouble with the Muslim contention that terrorists are misinterpreting the Koran is that it is disputed by 1400 years of history.Islam is a tribal blood cult that gained territory and adherents by the sword. For conquered people it has always been submit to Islam or die. If anyone feels that this has changed over the centuries, I suggest you try to open a Catholic church in Saudi Arabia.


23 posted on 08/16/2006 10:36:16 AM PDT by Old North State
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To: Sabramerican
I got the first verse...

There's a lady who's sure all that glitters is gold
And she's buying a stairway to heaven
And when she gets there she knows if the stores are closed
With a word she can get what she came for...

24 posted on 08/16/2006 10:36:36 AM PDT by Hatteras
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To: Sabramerican
Not bad. If you memorize the whole Koran - which isn't much longer than the New Testament - and stay a Muslim your whole life not only are you guaranteed heaven, but you get to pick ten people to come with you.
25 posted on 08/16/2006 10:38:04 AM PDT by wideawake ("The nation which forgets its defenders will itself be forgotten." - Calvin Coolidge)
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To: Pyro7480

Thank you.


26 posted on 08/16/2006 10:38:54 AM PDT by hoagy62 (America: SUPREME!)
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To: Hatteras

Ok, I feel better. I see I'm not the only one who thought about Stairway to Heaven when I saw the title.


27 posted on 08/16/2006 10:39:05 AM PDT by radiohead (Hey Kerry, I'm still here; still hating your lying, stinking, guts you coward.)
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To: Capt. Tom

I didn't say I agreed with what he said, I just found it interesting his view point (see my last post to the transcript).

I haven't read the Koran, but from what I've seen of Islam, it is NOT a religion of peace, but rather a religion of pieces and shrapnel.


28 posted on 08/16/2006 10:39:37 AM PDT by Lucky9teen (Ask not what the government can do for you. Ask why it doesn't.)
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To: Sabramerican

So now we are to call them Asians as our cousins the Brits do, eh?


29 posted on 08/16/2006 10:40:02 AM PDT by Old Professer (The critic writes with rapier pen, dips it twice, and writes again.)
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To: CaptainK

"New York State has made it virtually impossible to home school because they will not issue a diploma to anyone who is home schooled after the freshman year. Funny how the state is now dragging their feet in regards to the Muslim private schools."

It seems in many states, like here in Colorado, if a religious school forgoes the accreditation process, they can pretty much teach whatever they want.


30 posted on 08/16/2006 10:40:58 AM PDT by DonaldC
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To: Lucky9teen

Some of best friends are illiterate.


31 posted on 08/16/2006 10:41:28 AM PDT by Old Professer (The critic writes with rapier pen, dips it twice, and writes again.)
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To: Lucky9teen
Kind of like extremist christians misread/misquote the Bible and take it out of text, etc., the same is true for the Koran.

Allow me to fill you in on some facts missing from your analysis:

(1) The Christian Bible and the Muslim Koran are two different books and they say different things.

(2) The Koran explicitly teaches that it is good to either kill nonbelievers or to enslave them, that killing people can be an effective method of getting into heaven, and that it is fine to tell lies to nonbelievers.

(3) The Christian Bible does not contain the teachings outlined in fact (2).

32 posted on 08/16/2006 10:42:38 AM PDT by wideawake ("The nation which forgets its defenders will itself be forgotten." - Calvin Coolidge)
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To: DonaldC

USA is sowing to the wind, and we can expect to reap the whirlwind.


33 posted on 08/16/2006 10:42:42 AM PDT by tessalu
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To: Lucky9teen

And Brer Rabbit had a deathly fear of the briar patch.


34 posted on 08/16/2006 10:42:52 AM PDT by Old Professer (The critic writes with rapier pen, dips it twice, and writes again.)
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To: wideawake

They must be expecting about 90% to be poor learners then.


35 posted on 08/16/2006 10:43:56 AM PDT by Old Professer (The critic writes with rapier pen, dips it twice, and writes again.)
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To: wideawake

It's not my analysis...I was just talking about someone else's analysis...whom I have linked the transcript of here.

I don't agree with it and I too believe the Koran is filled with nasty stuff.


36 posted on 08/16/2006 10:44:48 AM PDT by Lucky9teen (Ask not what the government can do for you. Ask why it doesn't.)
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To: Old Professer

What does that mean?


37 posted on 08/16/2006 10:45:09 AM PDT by Lucky9teen (Ask not what the government can do for you. Ask why it doesn't.)
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To: Lucky9teen

I understand the comparison that was being made but I don't buy the attempt at equivalency.

Christianity does not advocate killing or subjecting to dhimmitude those who decline to join the religion.

Neither does Christ expect us to allow ourselves to be annihilated.


38 posted on 08/16/2006 10:48:26 AM PDT by prairiebreeze (Brought to you by the American Democrat Party, aka alQaeda, Western Division.)
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To: Argus

I seriously doubt they plan on getting a job. Me thinks they have a vastly different 5yr or 10yr plan than most 7-14yr olds.


39 posted on 08/16/2006 10:50:47 AM PDT by 1forall (America - my home, my land, my country.)
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To: Old Professer
Ntahc. But the best part is that the school only teaches Koran memorization - it doesn't teach Arabic.

So most of the students, who speak Urdu and English, barely understand anything they're memorizing.

I had formerly assumed that Arabic language classes were part and parcel of the memorization project, kind of the one benefit that could be expected to accompany the drudgery.

It's pretty amazing to compare this to the Talmudic study that Jews undertake - where comprehension is key and learning at least three languages is standard.

40 posted on 08/16/2006 10:53:09 AM PDT by wideawake ("The nation which forgets its defenders will itself be forgotten." - Calvin Coolidge)
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To: prairiebreeze

It wasn't that the two can be compared equally, that is impossible, as you've pointed out.

It was the point that things can and are taken out of context to suit the reader's intentions.


41 posted on 08/16/2006 10:56:01 AM PDT by Lucky9teen (Ask not what the government can do for you. Ask why it doesn't.)
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To: beethovenfan

7"And when you are praying, do not use meaningless repetition as the Gentiles do, for they suppose that they will be heard for their many words.


42 posted on 08/16/2006 10:59:14 AM PDT by CJ Wolf
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To: Lucky9teen

He fooled you. It's actually the other way around. Mainstream Christians and Muslims and Jews practice what some people call buffet spirituality. Take a little of this and a little of that, leave that, pass on this, depending upon what suites your tastes.
This is how you can tell a faithful believer who believes the religious text and try to live what it commands.
They will refrain from immorality and decadence, they will not change thier morals or beliefs based on what popular culture is into and usually are standing against the tide. They will be labeled by apathetics or agnostics as fundamentalists and they will place a huge value on family.
They will also be active in spreading thier religion. The difference is in the last, Christians will go on mission trips and knock on doors handing out tracts and talking about Jesus. Jews will be active in the community and Muslims will do the same as well as detonate bombs, saw people's heads off on TV, and hijack airplanes. Convert or die. Other religions don't go this far.


43 posted on 08/16/2006 11:00:32 AM PDT by TheKidster
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To: TheKidster

Exactly. Well said. And no, I was not fooled.


44 posted on 08/16/2006 11:03:36 AM PDT by Lucky9teen (Ask not what the government can do for you. Ask why it doesn't.)
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To: Sabramerican

I don't think they're memorizing the way to 'heaven'...


45 posted on 08/16/2006 11:04:27 AM PDT by Rummyfan
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To: Lucky9teen

I saw some of your other posts and am glad to see that you definitely have not been fooled.

Like others have said, there is no need to read the Koran to understand the religion. Look at the fruits produced. As far as religions go, Islam has produced the least amount of good fruit for going on centuries now.


46 posted on 08/16/2006 11:10:12 AM PDT by TheKidster
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To: TheKidster
"...and Muslims will do the same as well as detonate bombs, saw people's heads off on TV, and hijack airplanes. Convert or die."

They don't even do the "convert" part anymore. It's just, die, die, DIE!!!

47 posted on 08/16/2006 11:16:15 AM PDT by jackibutterfly (.)
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To: TheKidster
"...and Muslims will do the same as well as detonate bombs, saw people's heads off on TV, and hijack airplanes. Convert or die."

They don't even do the "convert" part anymore. It's just, die, die, DIE!!! Or, kill, kill, kill!

48 posted on 08/16/2006 11:16:42 AM PDT by jackibutterfly (.)
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To: Sabramerican

"Schools like this one at the Muslim Center of New York are rare in the United States, but are emerging, especially among South Asians,"

"South Asians"? What the hell are those? Australians?


49 posted on 08/16/2006 11:17:12 AM PDT by L98Fiero (I'm worth a million in prizes.)
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To: jackibutterfly

Whoops. Sorry about the duplication.


50 posted on 08/16/2006 11:17:40 AM PDT by jackibutterfly (.)
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