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Senate: No Prewar Saddam-al-Qaida Ties ( Dems are gloating again )
New York Post ^ | 09/08/2006 | Jim Abrams

Posted on 09/08/2006 11:04:30 AM PDT by SirLinksalot

Senate: No Prewar Saddam-al-Qaida Ties

By JIM ABRAMS Associated Press Writer

WASHINGTON (AP) -- There's no evidence Saddam Hussein had ties with al-Qaida, according to a Senate report on prewar intelligence that Democrats say undercuts President Bush's justification for invading Iraq.

Bush administration officials have insisted on a link between the Iraqi regime and terror leader Abu Musab al-Zarqawi. Intelligence agencies, however, concluded there was none.

Republicans countered that there was little new in the report and Democrats were trying to score election-year points with it.

The declassified document released Friday by the intelligence committee also explores the role that inaccurate information supplied by the anti-Saddam exile group the Iraqi National Congress had in the march to war.

It concludes that postwar findings do not support a 2002 intelligence community report that Iraq was reconstituting its nuclear program, possessed biological weapons or ever developed mobile facilities for producing biological warfare agents.

The 400-page report comes at a time when Bush is emphasizing the need to prevail in Iraq to win the war on terrorism while Democrats are seeking to make that policy an issue in the midterm elections.

It discloses for the first time an October 2005 CIA assessment that prior to the war Saddam's government "did not have a relationship, harbor, or turn a blind eye toward Zarqawi and his associates."

Bush and other administration officials have said that the presence of Zarqawi in Iraq before the war was evidence of a connection between Saddam's government and al-Qaida. Zarqawi was killed by a U.S. airstrike in June this year.

White House press secretary Tony Snow said the report was "nothing new."

(Excerpt) Read more at breakingnews.nypost.com ...


TOPICS: News/Current Events; War on Terror
KEYWORDS: 109th; alqaedaandiraq; alqaida; dnctalkingpoints; duplicate; fifthanniversary; prequel; prewar; saddam; statesponsor; ties
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1 posted on 09/08/2006 11:04:31 AM PDT by SirLinksalot
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To: SirLinksalot
LOL. Who said there was? Zarqawi was IN Iraq, no one said he was working with Saddam.

I'm seriously feeling better about the elections after this crap.

Even the Democrat operatives pushing censorship--as mad as it makes me, it works to our advantage.

2 posted on 09/08/2006 11:06:59 AM PDT by Recovering_Democrat (I am SO glad to no longer be associated with the party of "dependence on government"!)
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To: SirLinksalot
No one in the present administration said there was a connection between Al Qaeda and Saddam or 911 and NEVER used that as a reason to remove Saddam from power.

This is a TOTAL NON story!!!!

However one the Dims will use to bolster THEIR interminable lies about IRAQ and President Bush.

3 posted on 09/08/2006 11:07:24 AM PDT by PISANO
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To: SirLinksalot

How about Saddam's financial ties to the families of suicide bombers in Israel?


4 posted on 09/08/2006 11:07:40 AM PDT by weegee (Remember "Remember the Maine"? Well in the current war "Remember the Baby Milk Factory")
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To: SirLinksalot

Hmmmm, thats not quite what the media told us when Bubba was prez...



The Herald
By Ian Bruce
December 28, 1999


The world's most wanted man, Osama bin Laden, has been offered
sanctuary in
Iraq if his worldwide terrorist network succeeds in carrying out a
campaign of
high-profile attacks on the West over the next few weeks.


Intelligence sources say the Saudi dissident believed responsible for
the bombings of American embassies in Kenya and Tanzania and a US
military barracks in Saudi Arabia in 1998, is running out of options
for a safe haven.


He is now thought to have overcome his initial rejection of Saddam
Hussein, whom he regarded as an exploiter of the Islamic cause rather
than a true believer, and is considering the offer of a bolt-hole from
which he can continue to mastermind terrorism on a global scale.


A US counter-terrorist source said yesterday: "Our State Department
issued a worldwide warning on December 11. We have solid information
that many of the groups operating under bin Laden's patronage are
planning 'spectaculars' to coincide with the period leading up to and
through the millennium celebrations.


"They want to inflict maximum loss of life in return for publicity.
Now we are also facing the prospect of an unholy alliance between bin
Laden and Saddam. The implications are terrifying.


CNN 1999...


"Iraqi President Saddam Hussein has offered asylum to bin Laden"
http://edition.cnn.com/WORLD/meast/9902/13/afghan.binladen/


5 posted on 09/08/2006 11:08:41 AM PDT by Names Ash Housewares
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To: Names Ash Housewares

Also, did anyone ever read this documentation made by the great Scripps Howard investigative reporter, Deroy Murdock ?

Read the evidence of connections between Al Qaeda and Saddam here :

http://husseinandterror.com/


6 posted on 09/08/2006 11:11:53 AM PDT by SirLinksalot
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To: SirLinksalot

http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/f-news/1600579/posts

Here is the translation of the Iraqi document explaining the contact with Osama.


7 posted on 09/08/2006 11:12:48 AM PDT by Sundog (In a world without Walls or Fences, who needs Windows or Gates?)
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To: SirLinksalot

Ping


8 posted on 09/08/2006 11:13:21 AM PDT by MissyMa
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To: Names Ash Housewares

Has anybody ever seen the movie 50 First dates with adam sandler and drew barrymore? That's what I think about whenever i hear dems go on with Bush lied. The same case of Iraq was made by dems before bush took office. But that aside, suppose there never was a clinton admin that made the same case. Why are the democrats still running with the same issue that did not work in 2004?


9 posted on 09/08/2006 11:13:25 AM PDT by sachem longrifle (proud member of the fond Du lac band of the Ojibwa people)
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To: SirLinksalot

Here is another source :


http://www.nationalreview.com/murdock/murdock200310210934.asp




Saddam’s Terror Ties
Iraq-war critics ignore ample evidence.

DEROY MURDOCK

As President Bush more robustly promotes his Iraq policy, he should confront directly those who dismiss Saddam Hussein's ties to terrorism and, thus, belittle a key rationale for Operation Iraqi Freedom. Bush's critics employ a flimsy argument that nonetheless enjoys growing appeal among a largely hostile press corps. Since Hussein did not order the September 11 attacks — the fuzzy logic goes — he has no ties to terrorists, especially al Qaeda. Therefore, the Iraq war was bogus, and Bush should be defeated.




"Iraq was not a breeding ground for terrorism. Our invasion has made it one," said Senator Ted Kennedy (D., Mass.) on October 16. "We were told Iraq was attracting terrorists from al Qaeda. It was not...We should never have gone to war in Iraq when we did, in the way we did, for the false reasons we were given."

West Virginia's Jay Rockefeller, the Senate Intelligence Committee's ranking Democrat, told the Los Angeles Times that Iraq's alleged al Qaeda ties were "tenuous at best and not compelling." In a September 16 editorial, the Times slammed Vice President Dick Cheney for making "sweeping, unproven claims about Saddam Hussein's connections to terrorism." On August 7, former vice president Al Gore stated reassuringly: "The evidence now shows clearly that Saddam did not want to work with Osama bin Laden at all."

Bush and his national-security team should repeatedly devote entire speeches and publications — complete with documents, names, and visuals, including photographs of terrorists and their innocent victims — to remind Americans and the world that Baathist Iraq was a general store for terrorists, complete with cash, training, lodging, and even medical attention.

The evidence for Hussein's cooperation with and support for global terrorists is abundant and increasing. Recall, for instance:

Hussein paid bonuses of up to $25,000 to the families of Palestinian homicide bombers. "President Saddam Hussein has recently told the head of the Palestinian political office, Faroq al-Kaddoumi, his decision to raise the sum granted to each family of the martyrs of the Palestinian uprising to $25,000 instead of $10,000," Iraq's former deputy prime minister, Tariq Aziz, declared at a Baghdad meeting of Arab politicians and businessmen on March 11, 2002, Reuters reported two days later. Mahmoud Besharat, who the White House says dispensed these funds across the West Bank, gratefully said: "You would have to ask President Saddam why he is being so generous. But he is a revolutionary and he wants this distinguished struggle, the intifada, to continue." Between Aziz's announcement and the March 20 launch of Operation Iraqi Freedom, 28 homicide bombers injured 1,209 people and killed 223 more, including at least eight Americans.

According to the State Department's May 21, 2002 "Patterns of Global Terrorism," the Abu Nidal Organization, the Arab Liberation Front, Hamas, the Kurdistan Worker's party, the Mujahedin-e-Khalq Organization and the Palestinian Liberation Front all operated offices or bases in Hussein's Iraq. Hussein's hospitality towards these mass murderers placed him in violation of United Nations Security Council Resolution 687, which prohibited him from giving safe harbor to or otherwise supporting terrorists.

Coalition forces have found alive and well key terrorists who enjoyed Hussein's hospitality. Among them was Abu Abbas, mastermind of the October 1985 Achille Lauro hijacking and murder of Leon Klinghoffer, a 69-year-old Manhattan retiree who Abbas's men rolled, wheelchair and all, into the Mediterranean. Khala Khadr al-Salahat, accused of designing the bomb that destroyed Pan Am flight 103 over Lockerbie, Scotland in December 1988 (259 killed on board, 11 dead on the ground), also lived in Baathist Iraq.

Before fatally shooting himself four times in the head on August 16, 2002, as Baghdad claimed, Palestinian terrorist Abu Nidal had resided in Iraq since 1999. As the AP's Sameer N. Yacoub reported on August 21, 2002, the Beirut office of the Abu Nidal Organization said he entered Iraq "with the full knowledge and preparations of the Iraqi authorities." Nidal's attacks in 20 countries killed at least 275 people and wounded some 625 others. Among other atrocities, ANO henchmen bombed a TWA airliner over the Aegean Sea in 1974, killing all 88 people on board.

Coalition troops destroyed at least three terrorist training camps including a base near Baghdad called Salman Pak. It featured a passenger-jet fuselage where numerous Iraqi defectors reported that foreign terrorists were instructed how to hijack airliners with utensils. (The Bush administration should bus a few dozen foreign correspondents and their camera crews from the bar of Baghdad's Palestine Hotel to Salman Pak for a guided tour. Network news footage of that ought to open a few eyes.)

As for Hussein's supposedly imaginary ties to al Qaeda, consider these disturbing facts:

The Philippine government expelled Hisham al Hussein, the second secretary at Iraq's Manila embassy, on February 13, 2003. Cell-phone records indicate that the diplomat had spoken with Abu Madja and Hamsiraji Sali, leaders of Abu Sayyaf, just before and just after this al Qaeda-allied Islamic militant group conducted an attack in Zamboanga City. Abu Sayyaf's nail-filled bomb exploded on October 2, 2002, injuring 23 individuals and killing two Filipinos and U.S. Special Forces Sergeant First Class Mark Wayne Jackson, age 40. As Dan Murphy wrote in the Christian Science Monitor last February 26, those phone records bolster Sali's claim in a November 2002 TV interview that the Iraqi diplomat had offered these Muslim extremists Baghdad's help with joint missions.

Journalist Stephen F. Hayes reported in July that the official Babylon Daily Political Newspaper published by Hussein's eldest son, Uday, ran what it called a "List of Honor." The paper's November 14, 2002, edition gave the names and titles of 600 leading Iraqis, including this passage: "Abid Al-Karim Muhamed Aswod, intelligence officer responsible for the coordination of activities with the Osama bin Laden group at the Iraqi embassy in Pakistan." That name, Hayes wrote, matches that of Iraq's then-ambassador to Islamabad.

Carter-appointed federal appeals judge Gilbert S. Merritt discovered this document in Baghdad while helping Iraq rebuild its legal system. He wrote in the June 25 Tennessean that two of his Iraqi colleagues remember secret police agents removing that embarrassing edition from newsstands and confiscating copies of it from private homes. The paper was not published for the next ten days. Judge Merritt theorized that the "impulsive and somewhat unbalanced" Uday may have showcased these dedicated Baathists to "make them more loyal and supportive of the regime" as war loomed.

Abu Musab al-Zarqawi, formerly the director of an al Qaeda training base in Afghanistan, fled to Iraq after being injured as the Taliban fell. He received medical care and convalesced for two months in Baghdad. He then opened a terrorist training camp in northern Iraq and arranged the October 2002 assassination of U.S. diplomat Lawrence Foley in Amman, Jordan.

While Iraqi Ramzi Yousef, ringleader of the February 26, 1993 World Trade Center bombing plot, fled the U.S. on a Pakistani passport, he arrived here on an Iraqi passport.

Author Richard Miniter reported September 25 on TechCentralStation: "U.S. forces recently discovered a cache of documents in Tikrit, Saddam's hometown, that show Iraq gave Mr. Yasin both a house and a monthly salary." Indiana-born, Iraqi-reared al Qaeda member Abdul Rahman Yasin was indicted for mixing the chemicals in the bomb that exploded beneath the World Trade Center, killing six and injuring some 1,000 New Yorkers.

Along Iraq's border with Syria, U.S. troops captured Farouk Hijazi, Hussein's former ambassador to Turkey and suspected liaison to al Qaeda. Under interrogation, Hijazi "admitted meeting with senior al Qaeda leaders at Saddam's behest in 1994."

While sifting through the Mukhabarat's bombed ruins last April 26, the Toronto Star's Mitch Potter, the London Daily Telegraph's Inigo Gilmore and their translator discovered a memo in the intelligence service's accounting department. Dated February 19, 1998 and marked "Top Secret and Urgent," it said the agency would pay "all the travel and hotel expenses inside Iraq to gain the knowledge of the message from bin Laden and to convey to his envoy an oral message from us to bin Laden, the Saudi opposition leader, about the future of our relationship with him, and to achieve a direct meeting with him." The memo's three references to bin Laden were obscured crudely with correction fluid.

Despite the White House's inexplicable insistence to the contrary, tantalizing clues suggest Saddam Hussein might not have shared the world's shock when fireballs erupted from the Twin Towers.

Recall that his Salman Pak terror camp taught terrorists air piracy on an actual jet fuselage.

On January 5, 2000, Ahmad Hikmat Shakir — an Iraqi airport greeter reportedly dispatched from Baghdad's embassy in Malaysia — welcomed Khalid al Midhar and Nawaz al Hamzi to Kuala Lampur and escorted them to a local hotel where these September 11 hijackers met with 9/11 conspirators Ramzi bin al Shibh and Tawfiz al Atash. Five days later, according to Stephen Hayes, Shakir disappeared. He was arrested in Qatar on September 17, 2001, six days after al Midhar and al Hamzi slammed American Airlines Flight 77 into the Pentagon, killing 216 people. On his person and in his apartment, authorities discovered papers tying him to the 1993 WTC plot and "Operation Bojinka," al Qaeda's 1995 plan to blow up 12 jets over the Pacific at once.

The Czech Republic stands by its claim that 9/11 leader Mohamed Atta met in Prague in April 2001 with Ahmed Khalil Ibrahim an-Ani, an Iraqi diplomat/intelligence agent. He was expelled two weeks after the suspected meeting with Atta for apparently hostile surveillance of Radio Free Europe's Prague headquarters, from which American broadcasts to Iraq emanate.

Clinton-appointed Manhattan federal judge Harold Baer ordered Hussein and his ousted regime to pay $104 million in damages to the families of George Eric Smith and Timothy Soulas, both killed in the Twin Towers along with 2,790 others. "I conclude that plaintiffs have shown, albeit barely, 'by evidence satisfactory to the court' that Iraq provided material support to bin Laden and al Qaeda," Baer ruled. An airtight case? No, but sufficient evidence tied Hussein to 9/11 and secured a May 7 federal judgment against him.

If one has the time or professional duty to connect these dots, a portrait emerges of Saddam Hussein as sugar daddy to global terrorists, including al Qaeda and perhaps the 9/11 conspirators. Why won't Team Bush paint this picture? One administration communications specialist told me the government is bashful on this front because these links are difficult to prove. Yes, but prosecuting the informational battle in the war on terror is not like prosecuting a Mafia don, with wiretaps, hidden cameras and deep-cover "stool pigeons." Evidence of terrorist ties can be even more shadowy than a Cosa Nostra whack job. While this makes metaphysical proof elusive, the White House and relevant agencies owe it to America's national security to highlight what they know about Saddam Hussein and terrorism, even if some of the evidence against him is only circumstantial.

Assuming he wishes to sway domestic and global opinion, President Bush and his administration should guide Americans and the world through the sometimes-murky data and identify the patterns and conclusions that arise. While Saddam Hussein never may endure a courtroom cross-examination, plenty already exists in the public record (and surely more should be declassified) to confirm that his ouster, the liberation of Iraq and its current rehabilitation were and are necessary phases of the war on terror. The president and his top advisers should present the case, not haphazardly, but systematically and in as comprehensive, well-documented, and well-illustrated a fashion as their vast resources will allow.


10 posted on 09/08/2006 11:13:47 AM PDT by SirLinksalot
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To: SirLinksalot

Iraq was attracting and training foriegn islamo facists.

David Kay said Iraq was attracting terrorists like flies to honey....

http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/f-news/1066068/posts

I dont care if they were Bin Ladens boys are not. They are all dangerous terrorists all.


11 posted on 09/08/2006 11:14:34 AM PDT by Names Ash Housewares
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To: Sundog

Stephen Hayes is the Weekly Standard investigative reporter who has doggedly researched the link between Al Qaeda and Saddam.

Read this for instance :

http://www.theweeklystandard.com/Content/Public/Articles/000/000/003/033jgqyi.asp


12 posted on 09/08/2006 11:16:53 AM PDT by SirLinksalot
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To: SirLinksalot
I think all these "faulty intelligence claims by the administration" reports that keep coming out are homogeneous now. After 3 years of perennial negative coverage I really doubt this will have any effect on Bush. I believe there is Iraq war reporting fatigue and I hope he addresses this on Monday night.
13 posted on 09/08/2006 11:17:06 AM PDT by slowhand520
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To: Recovering_Democrat

Yep.
Sit back.
Relax.
Put your feet up.
And watch them implode.


14 posted on 09/08/2006 11:17:59 AM PDT by RandallFlagg (Roll your own cigarettes! You'll save $$$ and smoke less!(Magnetic bumper stickers-click my name)
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To: RandallFlagg

Saying Saddam has no connection to terrorism is like saying Bill Clinton has no connection to the Chinese.


15 posted on 09/08/2006 11:19:36 AM PDT by Blue Turtle
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To: sachem longrifle
Why are the democrats still running with the same issue that did not work in 2004?

Because they're hoping for the, "Broken clock right twice a day," theory to work out for them.

They still don't get the fact that a broken clock is still a worthless piece of junk.

16 posted on 09/08/2006 11:21:14 AM PDT by RandallFlagg (Roll your own cigarettes! You'll save $$$ and smoke less!(Magnetic bumper stickers-click my name)
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To: SirLinksalot

The link is this: they are all Muslims, and they all want to
kill all infidels. It's the fundamental doctrine of I-SLAM.


17 posted on 09/08/2006 11:21:17 AM PDT by beethovenfan (If Islam is the solution, the "problem" must be freedom.)
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To: Recovering_Democrat

Strange world. The Democrats are trying to censor the ABC miniseries because they look bad for failing to act on intelligence. Now it seems they will be criticizing Bush for acting on intelligence.


18 posted on 09/08/2006 11:24:54 AM PDT by School of Rational Thought (Republican - The thinking people's party)
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To: Blue Turtle

Yeah. I am a little upset that our rebuttal didn't have more teeth to it. The, "Ehh, it's old news," line just doesn't work. These librats need to be nuked word for word.


19 posted on 09/08/2006 11:25:19 AM PDT by RandallFlagg (Roll your own cigarettes! You'll save $$$ and smoke less!(Magnetic bumper stickers-click my name)
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To: SirLinksalot
Notice how they wait til Zarqawi is dead to make this claim? If we still had a chance to capture him and get him to talk, they would be more circumspect in their claims.

Saddam set up an al-Qaida camp in North Iraq, in the no-fly zone, so he could keep control of that area brutally without having to do the dirty work. What do these idiots say about that?

20 posted on 09/08/2006 11:26:32 AM PDT by Defiant (Under Bush the adults are back in charge, but they are your friend's cool parents.)
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To: SirLinksalot; veritas

Don't be too sure.

Our Freeper 'veritas' is still translating.


21 posted on 09/08/2006 11:27:12 AM PDT by airborne (Fecal matter is en route to fan! Contact is imminent!)
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To: PISANO
"No one in the present administration said there was a connection between Al Qaeda and Saddam"

Wow. You are pretty far out on a limb with that one.

22 posted on 09/08/2006 11:28:07 AM PDT by lugsoul (Livin' in fear is just another way of dying before your time. - Mike Cooley)
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To: Defiant

That's an impressive fabrication, since there is no evidence that the Ansar al-Islam camp was carrying out any operations against the Kurds to "control that area brutally." They did, however, have a few skirmished with Iranians across the border.


23 posted on 09/08/2006 11:30:07 AM PDT by lugsoul (Livin' in fear is just another way of dying before your time. - Mike Cooley)
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To: PISANO
This non-story is propelling it's way through the MSM but one question the REPUBLICAN Controlled Senate Intelligence Committee has failed to answer is how did Zarqawi get into Iraq without someone knowing?
24 posted on 09/08/2006 11:33:16 AM PDT by tobyhill (The War on Terrorism is not for the weak.)
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To: lugsoul
Is that you, Jim Webb?

I recall reading many articles prior to the Iraq war about Ansar al-islam and how it was treating the people within its range. It was establishing a mini-taliban state around the camp, and villagers who wore western clothes or who violated the extreme sharia laws that al-qaida demands were being murdered. Was that false? What is the source of your all-knowing information?

25 posted on 09/08/2006 11:33:29 AM PDT by Defiant (Under Bush the adults are back in charge, but they are your friend's cool parents.)
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To: SirLinksalot
"There's no evidence Saddam Hussein had ties with al-Qaida, according to a Senate report..."

This kind of opinionated reporting infuriates me.

There is a logical, old axiom that goes: Absence of proof is not proof of absence.

So even if the statement "there's no evidence Saddam Hussein had ties to al-Qaida" is a direct quote from the Senate report, it is not necessarily true.

Why doesn't the Senate declare that there is no evidence that Osammy bin laden is still alive? Would that be either accurate or meaningful.

26 posted on 09/08/2006 11:34:25 AM PDT by Positive (Nothing is sadder than to see a beautiful theory murdered by a gang of brutal facts.)
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To: SirLinksalot
Hello?

http://today.reuters.co.uk/news/articlenews.aspx?type=topNews&storyID=2006-09-07T180146Z_01_L07918606_RTRUKOC_0_UK-IRAQ-QAEDA-MUHAJIR.xml


Al Jazeera airs audio of new Iraq al Qaeda leader

Thu Sep 7, 2006 7:02 PM BST137
| | RSS
[] []

DUBAI (Reuters) - Al Qaeda's new leader called on Muslims to unify ranks with insurgents in Iraq, according to an audio tape aired by Al Jazeera television on Thursday.

"Place your hands in our hands ... our enemy has unified his ranks, now is the time to unite," said the speaker, identified by Al Jazeera as Abu Hamza al-Muhajir.

Muhajir, also believed to use the name Abu Ayyub al-Masri, became the group's leader after the killing of his predecessor Abu Musab al-Zarqawi in a U.S. air strike in June. He has vowed to avenge Zarqawi's killing.

Al Qaeda makes up about five percent of Iraq's Sunni Arab insurgency but its suicide bombers have been responsible for some of the worst violence, often killing over 100 people in a single attack.

Iraq's south is dominated by Shi'ites who took power in the country after the 2003 U.S.-led war while central and northern cities are chiefly Sunni areas, where insurgents have been active against the Shi'ite-led government and U.S.-led forces.


27 posted on 09/08/2006 11:36:36 AM PDT by ChadGore (VISUALIZE 62,041,268 Bush fans. We Vote.)
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To: SirLinksalot

This is a real person.

He's in a real place. (Iraq)

He names his group of terrorists what ever he wants.

Al Qaeda in Iraq is a reality.

28 posted on 09/08/2006 11:37:03 AM PDT by ChadGore (VISUALIZE 62,041,268 Bush fans. We Vote.)
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To: Defiant
Ah, the old "I recall reading..." meme.

Yeah, a "mini-taliban state" - from the goat pen over to the creek.

The Kurds could've crushed this group like a bug. They were in a tiny, isolated area snug up against the Iranian border. They were as likely to "control the area brutally" as the Blue Man Group.

29 posted on 09/08/2006 11:38:32 AM PDT by lugsoul (Livin' in fear is just another way of dying before your time. - Mike Cooley)
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To: SirLinksalot

This was a real person.

He was in a real place. (Iraq)

He names his group of terrorists what ever he wants.

Al Qaeda in Iraq is a reality.

30 posted on 09/08/2006 11:38:56 AM PDT by ChadGore (VISUALIZE 62,041,268 Bush fans. We Vote.)
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To: lugsoul
OK, how about this then?

Document: Iraqi Intelligence met with Bin Laden in 1995 (Re-Post For A Reminder)

31 posted on 09/08/2006 11:41:25 AM PDT by eyespysomething
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To: eyespysomething
Trying to change the subject?

It is an unverified document that no one in military or civilian intelligence has authenticated or vouched for. There isn't a shred of corroborating evidence that it happened from any other intel source, whether sigint or humint.

I know this is a difficult thing for a lot - increasingly, a WHOLE lot - of FReepers to understand, but the fact that a piece of paper says something doesn't mean it is true. Paper will stand anything you can write on it.

32 posted on 09/08/2006 11:48:30 AM PDT by lugsoul (Livin' in fear is just another way of dying before your time. - Mike Cooley)
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To: SirLinksalot
Senate Intelligence Committee Determines Zarqawi Only Pretending To Be Al-Qaeda.
33 posted on 09/08/2006 11:48:58 AM PDT by tobyhill (The War on Terrorism is not for the weak.)
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To: lugsoul
Ah, the old use of the word "meme" meme, to make your opinion sound oh so sophisticated, while reducing the other person's to a mere recitation of something "out there" on the web. Yeah, that supports your opinion, just as much as your characterization of ansar's camp as a "goat pen". Unless you are in the military or CIA and have some basis for being so smug and snarky, you are just a guy in his underwear who has turned anti-war for some reason, and is out there trying to make everyone else as miserable as you are.

I read in 3rd grade that George Washington was our first President, and, mirabile dictu! I still remember it. That's an amazing thing about human beings--they have memories that stretch decades, and sometimes when they provide opinions, those opinions are based upon facts, figures, and information that they read days, weeks, even YEARS before. Wow. Now that is amazing, isn't it?

Instead of denying that such articles existed, or that they were wrong when they were written, you state matter of factly that it was impossible for Ansar to have committed brutal acts within its spere of influence in Northern Iraq. Unless you have special intelligence source information, you must have "read" articles that allowed you to form this opinion. Care to share with us the source of your expertise, so we don't have to just accept your words as the given truth? That might lend credence to your position. But you're just here for a drive by, aren't you?

34 posted on 09/08/2006 11:55:46 AM PDT by Defiant (Under Bush the adults are back in charge, but they are your friend's cool parents.)
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To: SirLinksalot
Good morning.

Can anyone come up with a good reason why we are supposed to believe anything that comes out of the CIA?

Elements of the CIA have clearly tried to bring W down and at best the Agency appears to be incompetent. Tie the organization in with the State Department and the DNC and it looks to me like a coup is being attempted.

Michael Frazier
35 posted on 09/08/2006 11:59:03 AM PDT by brazzaville (no surrender no retreat, well, maybe retreat's ok)
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To: StarFan; Dutchy; alisasny; BobFromNJ; BUNNY2003; Cacique; Clemenza; Coleus; cyborg; DKNY; ...
ping!

Please FReepmail me if you want on or off my ‘miscellaneous’ ping list.

36 posted on 09/08/2006 12:01:27 PM PDT by nutmeg (National security trumps everything else.)
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To: lugsoul

"That's an impressive fabrication, since there is no evidence that the Ansar al-Islam camp was carrying out any operations against the Kurds to "control that area brutally."



And you are very WRONG...as usual.

Ansar agents killed Shawkat Hajji Mushir, a PUK general and member of the ruling council, along with several other people. Ansar has been involved in assassinations for some time, killing a governor of a Kurdish region and narrowly missed killing one of the Kurdistan Regional Government's prime ministers. In February 2001, they killed Franso Hariri, a prominent member of the Kurdistan Democratic Party leadership. While the International Crisis Group has made attempts to downplay the group's significance, calling it a "minor irritant in local Kurdish politics," that's not entirely true, as Ansar was extremely destabilizing to the PUK and to a lesser degree the KDP.

Both the Christian Science Monitor and Human Rights Watch have documented instances of brutality that Ansar has committed on the local Kurdish populations. HRW even interviewed Ansar members in PUK custody who gave credible details about training in AQ camps in Afghanistan. During the Afghanistan War, a document found in an al-Qaeda guest house by the NY Times discussed the creation of an "Iraqi Kurdistan Islamic Brigade" which vowed to "expel those Jews and Christians from Kurdistan and join the way of Jihad, [and] rule every piece of land...with the Islamic Shari'a rule." Below are just a few examples of these stories.


http://hrw.org/backgrounder/mena/ansarbk020503.htm (Human Rights Watch Report)

http://www.frontpagemag.com/Articles/ReadArticle.asp?ID=5571 (Ansar, AQ and Al-Zarqawi)

http://www.csmonitor.com/2002/0315/p01s04-wome.html

http://www.back-to-iraq.com/archives/2003/02/spotlight_on_ansar_alislam.php

http://www.fas.org/irp/news/1998/11/98110602_nlt.html


37 posted on 09/08/2006 12:54:07 PM PDT by cwb (Liberalism is the opiate of the *sses.)
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To: cwb

Thanks for the quick backup documentation to what I was saying. So much for lugsoul's "I read an article meme" meme. Facts are a wonderful thing.


38 posted on 09/08/2006 1:14:07 PM PDT by Defiant (Under Bush the adults are back in charge, but they are your friend's cool parents.)
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To: Defiant

You're welcome. One of the reasons it was so quick is because it's a summation of an article I occassionaly post which contains many of your same points. It's rather long, but if you're interested, you can check it out as it also contradicts many of the liberals lies:

http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/f-news/1683075/posts


39 posted on 09/08/2006 1:31:55 PM PDT by cwb (Liberalism is the opiate of the *sses.)
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To: SirLinksalot

Same old same old misrepresentations and lies. Just heard some reporterette add that the administration has ALWAYS insisted that there was a connection between Iraq and Al qaeda.


40 posted on 09/08/2006 1:36:16 PM PDT by OldFriend (I Pledge Allegiance to the Flag.....and My Heart to the Soldier Who Protects It.)
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To: SirLinksalot
The declassified document released Friday by the intelligence committee also explores the role that inaccurate information supplied by the anti-Saddam exile group the Iraqi National Congress had in the march to war.

No surprise there. Just another element of the CIA's (and the State Department's) venal, willful and years long smear campaign against the I.N.C. (and Chalibi). All this part of the CIA's (and the State Department's) venal, willful and years long subversion of their legal obligation to build up the I.N.C. under the Iraq Liberation Act of 1998.

Had the CIA (and the State Department) made a sincere effort to actually implement the provisions of this act -- the intent of which was repeatedly reaffirmed by Congress in the face of CIA (and State Department) recalcitrance and subversion -- we would have had:

  1. A credible Iraqi "government in exile" that could have assumed sovereignty within days of Saddam's overthrow, and

  2. Thousands Iraqi soldiers participating the liberation of Iraq.

The effect these things would have had on subsequent events is now obvious. Indeed full implementation of the Iraq Liberation Act might have made the war unnecessary in the first place. (The buildup of a "Free Iraq" army and government in the "No Fly" zones might conceivably have lead to mass exodus and internal collapse within Saddam's Iraq. It certainly would have weakened Saddam and limited his options.)

The CIA, and The State Department, have the blood of thousands of American soldiers on their hands.

41 posted on 09/08/2006 1:47:11 PM PDT by Stultis
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To: SirLinksalot
Why did we go into Iraq? How come nobody ever points out the fact that if we had just gone into Afghanistan alone, we would have had an "insurgency" problem about three times bigger than what we have now in Iraq? As we pretty much know, most of the "insurgency" in Iraq is made up of foreign nationalist, financed by regimes (Iran, Syrian) who are deathly afraid of a successful democracy being established in the Middle East. If we had just gone into Afghanistan, we would have had "insurgents" from Iran, Syria, and Iraq. In that case, we would have lost Afghanistan, which would have made us look pathetically weak in the Arab world. Additionally, Iraq and Iran would move closer to being allies (me again my brother, my brother and I against our cousin). As far as I am concerned, Afghanistan and Iraq are the same war. Doing one without doing the other would have been a pointless waste of time, and would have left us in a worse position. For me, that's the bottom line on why we are in Iraq.
42 posted on 09/08/2006 1:48:00 PM PDT by NurdlyPeon (Wearing My 'Jammies Proudly)
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To: Recovering_Democrat

This report is beyond bogus. Zarqawi was welcomed into Iraq and treated at an elite, Baghdad hospital reserved for Baathist party elites under Saddam from wounds suffered in Afghanistan. He then went on to co-found the Al Qaeda-affiliated Ansar al Islam with one of Saddam's top intelligence officials. Ansar was located in a portion of northeastern Iraq not under the control of the Kurds as the deceptive information claiming to debunk this information claims. Indeed, Saddam used Ansar to combat anti-Saddam Kurdish forces.

Also, there is LEGIONS of information available to show Saddam worked with Al Qaeda, which even the 9-11 Commission confirmed, not the least of which are the documents from Saddam own's intelligence files showing Iraq and Al Qaeda worked together. The Senate committee never had those documents.

The Senate Intel. Committee was sloppy or purposely negligient in concluding no ties to Saddam and AL Qaeda. The evidence is beyond compelling. The Senate claiming otherwise is perpetuating one of the Big Lies of many Big Lies told by the left about Saddam and Iraq.

A link to a posting rife with evidence of Saddam and Al Qaeda working together. Scroll down into the comments for much, much more:

http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/f-news/1335971/posts


43 posted on 09/08/2006 1:53:23 PM PDT by MikeA (Not voting out of anger in November is a vote for Nancy Pelosi as Speaker of the House)
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To: All

This report is beyond bogus. Zarqawi was welcomed into Iraq and treated at an elite, Baghdad hospital reserved for Baathist party elites under Saddam from wounds suffered in Afghanistan. He then went on to co-found the Al Qaeda-affiliated Ansar al Islam with one of Saddam's top intelligence officials. Ansar was located in a portion of northeastern Iraq not under the control of the Kurds as the deceptive information claiming to debunk this information claims. Indeed, Saddam used Ansar to combat anti-Saddam Kurdish forces.

Also, there is LEGIONS of information available to show Saddam worked with Al Qaeda, which even the 9-11 Commission confirmed, not the least of which are the documents from Saddam own's intelligence files showing Iraq and Al Qaeda worked together. The Senate committee never had those documents.

The Senate Intel. Committee was sloppy or purposely negligient in concluding no ties to Saddam and AL Qaeda. The evidence is beyond compelling. The Senate claiming otherwise is perpetuating one of the Big Lies of many Big Lies told by the left about Saddam and Iraq.

A link to a posting rife with evidence of Saddam and Al Qaeda working together. Scroll down into the comments for much, much more:

http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/f-news/1335971/posts


44 posted on 09/08/2006 1:54:58 PM PDT by MikeA (Not voting out of anger in November is a vote for Nancy Pelosi as Speaker of the House)
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To: SirLinksalot

I thought we invaded Iraq because Saddam didn't comply with the cease fire agreements?
Nothing about WMD or links to terrorists, although he did use WMD in the past and we've found traces and the two biggest terrorists in history happened to live in Baghdad.
I must have missed those speeches.


45 posted on 09/08/2006 1:57:31 PM PDT by dyed_in_the_wool ("O you who believe! do not take the Jews and the Christians for friends" - Koran 5.51)
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To: Defiant
Saddam set up an al-Qaida camp in North Iraq, in the no-fly zone, so he could keep control of that area brutally without having to do the dirty work. What do these idiots say about that?

Ansar al-Islam was a Saddam Hussein / al-Qaeda joint enterprise. Exactly the sort of "collaborative" relationship that the 9-11 Commission denied. Just a portion of the evidence, from this source:

- Abu Iman al-Baghdadi, 20 year veteran of Iraqi Intelligence, told BBC news that Saddam Hussein is funding and arming Ansar al Islam to fend off anti-Saddam Kurds
Jim Muir, BBC, July 24, 2002

-Qassem Hussein Mohamed, 20-years of service in Iraq’s Mukhabarat, says that Saddam Hussein has been secretly aiding, arming and funding Ansar al Islam and al Qaeda for several years Scott Peterson, Christian Science Monitor, 4-2-02
Jeffrey Goldberg, New Yorker, 3-25-02

- The NSA was said to have intercepted phone calls of Iraqi officials praising Ansar al Islam and talked of funding the group Stephen Hayes, Weekly Standard, 7-22-05

- Abdul Rahman al-Shamari, in interviews with Jonathan Schanzer of the Washington Institute for Near East Policy and others, has said that high ranking Iraqi officers were in league with Ansar al-Islam/al Qaeda affiliates well before the start of the war Jonathan Schanzer, Weekly Standard, 3-01-04
- Local Kurds later reported similar stories Preston Mendenhall, MSNBC, "War Diary"
- A number of high ranking former Mukhabart agents and Military officers have been caught working with Abu Musab al-Zarqawi and Ansar al-Islam in Iraq Mark Eichenlaub, NewsBlaze, 2006

- Captured Ansar al Islam members told reporters Michael Howard and Jonathan Schanzer that the head of Iraq's Mukhabarat was helping Iraqi officials smuggle military grade TNT and other weapons into the possession of Ansar al Islam. Michael Howard, Guardian Unlimited, 8-23-02 Jonathan Schanzer, The Washington Institute, 1-15-03
-TNT, which bore the trademarks of the Iraqi military, was later found among Ansar's possessions by Kurdish security forces. Micheal Howard, Guardian Unlimited, 8-23-02

- Captured Ansar members have told their captors that Izzat al-Douri, one of Saddam Hussein's top aides, is now leading Ansar attacks on coalition targets Globalsecurity.org, 10-03 Jack Fairweather, UK Telegraph, 10-31-03 AP, October 31,2003

- Landmines, chemical weapons gear and mortars were all found among the rubble of Ansar al Islam's destroyed camp in Northen Iraq Newsday, March 31,2003, just as captured Iraqi Intelligence officers and Ansar al Islam members had claimed BEFORE the war Jeffrey Goldberg, New Yorker, 3-25-02

- Atropine auto-injectors (antidote for chemical weapons), which had been mass ordered by Iraq in late 2002, and gas masks were found at both the Ansar base in Northern Iraq and official Iraqi military compounds CNN, 10-12-02 CNN, April 8, 2003

- A number of captured or surviving members of Ansar al Islam, including their Media Chief Mohamed Gharib, have told reporters that their group accepted financial and weapons assistance from Saddam Hussein's regime Scott Peterson, Christian Science Monitor, 10-16-2003


Enough human testimony, coupled with the discovery of numerous examples of physical evidence (weapons, mines, antidotes, etc), makes it possible to re-examine the question of whether or not the regime of Saddam Hussein sponsorsed Ansar al Islam. While the of extent of sponsorship remains an open question, there is an ample amount of evidence to conclude that mines, money, TNT, chemical weapons gear and other forms of logistical support took place. All of these things are clear violations of United Nations Security Council Resolution 687, barring Iraq from harboring or aiding known terrorist groups.

46 posted on 09/08/2006 1:57:55 PM PDT by Stultis
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To: SirLinksalot

Yup, the claim that Al Qaeda and Saddam did not work together is a massive lie. The weakling RINOs on the intel. committee likely just rolled over for the Democratic partisan extremists like the traitor Carl Levin to claim no Saddam-Al Qaeda connections. You'd have to be blind not to see the mountain of evidence that such connections existed. The US Senate is showing itself to be a deeply mendacious and corrupted organization to ignore these facts all in the name of "senate collegiality."

A link to a posting rife with evidence of Saddam and Al Qaeda working together. Scroll down into the comments for much, much more:

http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/f-news/1335971/posts


47 posted on 09/08/2006 1:58:25 PM PDT by MikeA (Not voting out of anger in November is a vote for Nancy Pelosi as Speaker of the House)
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To: SirLinksalot; All
-IRAQ- some links to terror--

-The Iraq Documents--

-All Terror, All the Time-- FR's links to NBC Warfare, Terror, and More...--

48 posted on 09/08/2006 1:59:41 PM PDT by backhoe (-30-)
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To: SirLinksalot

Again, Al-Qaida was EVERYWHERE in the world EXCEPT Iraq.


49 posted on 09/08/2006 2:00:47 PM PDT by sappy
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To: MikeA

Still reading it now and yes its insulting to someone who's studied this topic for literally thousands of hours over the past three years.

When I see "there is no evidence of..." and then it's of Zarqawi's presence in Baghdad being ok with Iraq or one IIS agent pretending to know the activities of ALL IIS agents I get pretty disgusted with the utter "cherry picking" of just random people to quote and blanket statements that are demonstrably false.


50 posted on 09/08/2006 2:06:29 PM PDT by ikez78 (www.regimeofterror.com)
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