Free Republic
Browse · Search
News/Activism
Topics · Post Article

Skip to comments.

Ruby Ridge revisited: Deval let sniper off the the hook
Boston Herald ^ | November 2, 2006 | Kimberly Atkins

Posted on 11/04/2006 12:16:33 PM PST by happinesswithoutpeace

As the Justice Department’s chief civil rights prosecutor, Deval Patrick made the controversial decision not to criminally prosecute an FBI sniper who shot and killed an unarmed woman as she held her infant daughter in her arms during a 1992 standoff in Ruby Ridge, Idaho.

The incident, in which U.S. Marshall William F. Degan of Quincy and the wife and son of white separatist Randy Weaver were killed during an 11-day standoff, is cited by experts as the spark that started the anti-government militia movement that exploded after the standoff in Waco, Texas, less than a year later. 1994, Patrick, the Democratic candidate for governor who was then assistant attorney general, concluded there was insufficient basis to prosecute FBI sniper Lon Horiuchi for shooting and killing 43-year-old Vicki Weaver. Horiuchi had testified that he opened fire on the woman’s husband and his friend, Kevin Harris, when he thought they were about to fire on an FBI helicopter.

Patrick made the recommendation despite a report by a task force assembled by Patrick’s boss, Attorney General Janet Reno, that found numerous problems with the FBI’s handling of the standoff, and called the protocol used by the FBI’s Hostage Rescue unconstitutional under the circumstances. The report referred the case to Patrick’s department to decide whether to charge Horiuchi. Aides to Patrick said he was unavailable for comment because he was preparing for last night’s debate. Former Justice Department spokesman Myron Marlin called the incident “a tragic one that occurred during the final months of the first Bush administration.”

“The Justice Department believed the critical element of willfulness necessary for a criminal civil rights prosecution could not be established beyond a reasonable doubt,” Marlin said in a statement to the Herald yesterday. “Such willfulness, or knowing, intentional use of unreasonable force could not be made out against the FBI agent.”

Patrick’s assessment, he noted, was“reaffirmed by a separate criminal investigative team.”

In 1995, however, a Senate subcommittee headed by Sen. Arlen Specter (R-Pa.) found “simply no justification” for the shot Horiuchi took that killed Vicki Weaver and “missed the 10-month-old baby in her arms by less than two feet.”

“Horiuchi should have known that as he fired blind through the cabin door, he was shooting into an area which could well have contained Vicki Weaver and her two younger daughters,” states the report, which took no position on whether Horiuchi should have been prosecuted.

The decision not to prosecute was ripped by both conservative and liberal groups. “It was obscene,” said author James Bovard, an outspoken critic of federal officials’ handling of the case. “There was no need for the excessive force the FBI used in gunning down a mother holding her baby. ACLU Legislative Counsel Timothy Edgar said the incident was “the result of overzealous - and unchecked - federal power.”


TOPICS: News/Current Events
KEYWORDS: banglist
Navigation: use the links below to view more comments.
first 1-5051-100101-150151-167 next last

1 posted on 11/04/2006 12:16:34 PM PST by happinesswithoutpeace
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | View Replies]

To: happinesswithoutpeace
This was mass murder--with the actors committing the perfect crime.

Mrs. Clinton going to pay a few Conservative/Christians back when she resumes power!

2 posted on 11/04/2006 12:20:16 PM PST by 100-Fold_Return (In Prisons Tattletales Are the Same as Child-Molesters...hmm)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: happinesswithoutpeace

If Mass. elects this scumbag kiss the state goodbye, it'll be David Dinkins on steroids.


3 posted on 11/04/2006 12:21:59 PM PST by Extremely Extreme Extremist
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: happinesswithoutpeace
Someone once asked me if there really was a "patriot underground" in existance.

I replied: "No, because Lon Horiuchi is still alive."

4 posted on 11/04/2006 12:22:08 PM PST by FReepaholic (If ignorance ain't bliss, I don't know what is.)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: happinesswithoutpeace

I remember lon horiuchi, who shot a woman holding a baby. Justice was not served.


5 posted on 11/04/2006 12:23:58 PM PST by ozzymandus
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: 100-Fold_Return

TEXT SAYS: " I'm from the Government--I'm here to help you"

6 posted on 11/04/2006 12:23:59 PM PST by radar101 (LIBERALS = Hypocrisy and Fantasy)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 2 | View Replies]

To: happinesswithoutpeace

I remember how outraged we were that Bill and Hill's political enemies could so arbitrarily be killed.

Little did we know what misfortunes would befall those who had the bad luck to be close to their inner circle and who chose to cross them.


7 posted on 11/04/2006 12:25:22 PM PST by NaughtiusMaximus (Let's all be Magnificent Bastards. Turn out those Republican votes!)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: happinesswithoutpeace

All this stuff on Devalued Patrick should have been dug up during the primary. I am afraid we will will be stuck with this clinton lackey leftist for quite some time.


8 posted on 11/04/2006 12:25:41 PM PST by cloud8
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: happinesswithoutpeace

of white separatist Randy Weaver...... What, exactly, is a white separatist? If I tell you or anyone to leave me the "F" alone, am I a white separatist?


9 posted on 11/04/2006 12:26:17 PM PST by Safetgiver (Stinko De mayo, Stinko to the Commies.)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: happinesswithoutpeace

I think someone from the government will be along to remind everyone that Randy Weaver was a felon, and the none of this would have happened if he hadn't sawed off that shotgun barrel.


10 posted on 11/04/2006 12:26:32 PM PST by tacticalogic ("Oh bother!" said Pooh, as he chambered his last round.)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: FReepaholic

Lon Tomohisa Horiuchi

Born: 9-Jun-1954

Gender: Male Religion: Roman Catholic Race or Ethnicity: Asian Sexual orientation: Straight Occupation: Government

Nationality: United States Executive summary: Sniper who killed Vicki Weaver

As an FBI sniper he shot and killed Vicki Weaver on August 22, 1992 as she was holding her infant daughter, during the Ruby Ridge standoff. It is an act many consider murder.

Wife: (six children)

11 posted on 11/04/2006 12:26:58 PM PST by radar101 (LIBERALS = Hypocrisy and Fantasy)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 4 | View Replies]

To: FReepaholic

Well said.


12 posted on 11/04/2006 12:27:01 PM PST by happinesswithoutpeace (You are receiving this broadcast as a dream)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 4 | View Replies]

To: happinesswithoutpeace
1. Wound a mexican drug dealer infiltrating the US? That's 12 years!

3. Relay orders from an imprisoned terrorist? 2 YEARS.

2. Snipe an unarmed, baby-carring mother? NO PUNISHMENT AT ALL.

13 posted on 11/04/2006 12:27:16 PM PST by gaijin
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: happinesswithoutpeace
“Such willfulness, or knowing, intentional use of unreasonable force could not be made out against the FBI agent.”

Yeah right. He could not see clearly while looking through his telescopic sight before he pulled the trigger. It was well.....unintentional.

14 posted on 11/04/2006 12:27:49 PM PST by beltfed308 (Democrats :Tough on Taxpayers, Soft on Terrorism)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: happinesswithoutpeace

"an FBI sniper who shot and killed an unarmed woman as she held her infant daughter in her arms"


I always wondered what caliber that baby was. They can be dangerous in close quarters if the wrong end is pointed at ya.


15 posted on 11/04/2006 12:28:00 PM PST by BLS (You'll never know why you're alive until you know what you would die for.)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: ozzymandus

Also the guy rumored to be the one popping Waco escapees during the fire...


16 posted on 11/04/2006 12:28:49 PM PST by gnarledmaw (I traded freedom for security and all I got were these damned shackles.)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 5 | View Replies]

To: All

Thank you. Don't ever forget.


17 posted on 11/04/2006 12:29:30 PM PST by happinesswithoutpeace (You are receiving this broadcast as a dream)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 15 | View Replies]

To: happinesswithoutpeace

1. The federal murderers at Ruby Ridge and Waco were/are irredemable scum.

2. So is anyone who tries to excuse them in any way.

3. Those muderers (and their supporters) should go join Al Queda. They will fit right in.


18 posted on 11/04/2006 12:31:20 PM PST by LibKill (Beer is proof that God loves us and wants us to be happy. - Benjamin Franklin)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: 100-Fold_Return

Ruby Ridge was during Bush41's term.


19 posted on 11/04/2006 12:31:28 PM PST by rvoitier (Democrat Party, not Democratic Party.)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 2 | View Replies]

To: gnarledmaw

I remember that. The Waco sniper hides out back featured hatch marks carved into some wooden support beam --the sniper makes a mark for each target struck, into groups of five.


20 posted on 11/04/2006 12:31:51 PM PST by gaijin
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 16 | View Replies]

To: tacticalogic
"...and the none of this would have happened if he hadn't sawed off that shotgun barrel."

If Weaver had not been entrapped into making a sawed off shotgun, the whole thing would not have happened. The point of the Government action was to get another informant friendly with the Aryan Nations. Weaver would not do it, so the Goverment made this Scheme.

21 posted on 11/04/2006 12:32:54 PM PST by Anti-Bubba182
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 10 | View Replies]

To: radar101

Where is Horiuchi now? Still a sniper?


22 posted on 11/04/2006 12:33:10 PM PST by Dante3
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 11 | View Replies]

To: happinesswithoutpeace

Its good to remember this stuff but the militia timeline in the article is off. Openly operated militias, those "anti-gov" or not, were already in decline by then.


23 posted on 11/04/2006 12:34:43 PM PST by gnarledmaw (I traded freedom for security and all I got were these damned shackles.)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: Dante3

Maybe his is working for "CNN" now....


24 posted on 11/04/2006 12:34:51 PM PST by Gaffer
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 22 | View Replies]

To: Dante3
Where is Horiuchi now? Still a sniper?

Last I heard he was a training instructor at Quintico (sp).

25 posted on 11/04/2006 12:34:52 PM PST by beltfed308 (Democrats :Tough on Taxpayers, Soft on Terrorism)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 22 | View Replies]

To: gnarledmaw

Yes, Lon Horiuchi was at Waco, and he is said to have shot several innocent people who ran from the burning building. But no followup investigations were ever allowed, and clinton had all the remaining evidence bulldozed and buried. Including the infamous front door with the bullet holes in it.

Presumably Janet Reno approved of Horiuchi being there, assuming that her foggy mind was up to such details. It's not as if he was a low-profile kind of guy, and after Ruby Ridge allowing him to go into action again with his sniper rifle was absolutely incredibly stupid, if not deliberately murderous, on the part of his superiors.

I haven't heard a single word about Horiuchi since Waco. I wonder if he is still at the FBI, no doubt being given medals and promotions by that idiot Mueller?


26 posted on 11/04/2006 12:36:19 PM PST by Cicero (Marcus Tullius)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 16 | View Replies]

To: Cicero

"Including the infamous front door with the bullet holes in it."

Or when the finally admitted they used incendiary devices.


27 posted on 11/04/2006 12:39:35 PM PST by happinesswithoutpeace (You are receiving this broadcast as a dream)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 26 | View Replies]

To: Cicero; Dante3; gaijin

I believe I had read that he received a promotion to some admin position shortly thereafter, I dont know that its true...


28 posted on 11/04/2006 12:40:29 PM PST by gnarledmaw (I traded freedom for security and all I got were these damned shackles.)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 26 | View Replies]

To: gaijin
From answers.com:

Three of the twelve expended .308 Winchester shell casings that the Texas Rangers reported finding in the house, were at Horiuchi's position, but officials maintain that they could have been left over from the BATF's use of the house earlier, and that it would be impossible to run ballistics tests to see which rifle fired the shots[5].

29 posted on 11/04/2006 12:40:55 PM PST by beltfed308 (Democrats :Tough on Taxpayers, Soft on Terrorism)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 20 | View Replies]

To: happinesswithoutpeace

Three empty shell casings were found where Horiuchi was stationed at the time, but there was no investigation. Apparently the FBI said it couldn't be proven because his rifle had been rebarrelled. A somewhat odd thing to do in the circumstances, one would think.


30 posted on 11/04/2006 12:42:14 PM PST by Cicero (Marcus Tullius)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 27 | View Replies]

To: Cicero

"A somewhat odd thing to do in the circumstances, one would think"

Not odd. A cover up.


31 posted on 11/04/2006 12:45:10 PM PST by happinesswithoutpeace (You are receiving this broadcast as a dream)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 30 | View Replies]

To: Dante3

Whereabouts Undisclosed. The photo came from one obtained by Soldier of Fortune Magazine


32 posted on 11/04/2006 12:45:47 PM PST by radar101 (LIBERALS = Hypocrisy and Fantasy)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 22 | View Replies]

To: happinesswithoutpeace
Is THIS the Deval Patrick you're talking about, who let off Horiuchi?

Deval Patrick

33 posted on 11/04/2006 12:46:36 PM PST by gaijin
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: gaijin

That would be him.


34 posted on 11/04/2006 12:48:37 PM PST by happinesswithoutpeace (You are receiving this broadcast as a dream)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 33 | View Replies]

To: tacticalogic
Good afternoon.
"none of this would have happened if he hadn't sawed off that shotgun barrel."

Shouldn't that read "If he hadn't given in to the urgings of the Government snitch that had been sent in to provide leverage to the Government in their attempts to make Weaver one"?

Michael Frazier
35 posted on 11/04/2006 12:49:32 PM PST by brazzaville (no surrender no retreat, well, maybe retreat's ok)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 10 | View Replies]

To: gaijin
Deval Patrick


36 posted on 11/04/2006 12:50:19 PM PST by gaijin
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 33 | View Replies]

To: tacticalogic

Anyone who tries to excuse the murders at Ruby Ridge and Waco is a Clintonite scumbag.


37 posted on 11/04/2006 12:52:34 PM PST by LibKill (Beer is proof that God loves us and wants us to be happy. - Benjamin Franklin)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 10 | View Replies]

To: 100-Fold_Return
This was mass murder--with the actors committing the perfect crime.

Murder? Yes. Mass Murder? No. (I think you need a bunch more victims for that.)

Whoever authorized the shooter is, in my mind, every bit as culpable as Horiuchi, however.

38 posted on 11/04/2006 12:53:40 PM PST by Triggerhippie (Always use a silencer in a crowd. Loud noises offend people.)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 2 | View Replies]

To: All

http://www.apfn.org/apfn/horiuchi.htm is an interesting read with links.


39 posted on 11/04/2006 12:53:58 PM PST by beltfed308 (Democrats :Tough on Taxpayers, Soft on Terrorism)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 29 | View Replies]

To: brazzaville

"If he hadn't given in to the urgings of the Government snitch"

"urgings"

Nice term. What type of "urging" was it?


40 posted on 11/04/2006 12:54:29 PM PST by happinesswithoutpeace (You are receiving this broadcast as a dream)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 35 | View Replies]

To: happinesswithoutpeace

I was being ironic.

I could also say it was odd how the power failed and all the children's bodies being stored in freezers after they were burned to death thawed out.

Oops! More evidence gone!


41 posted on 11/04/2006 12:54:33 PM PST by Cicero (Marcus Tullius)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 31 | View Replies]

To: happinesswithoutpeace
Or when the finally admitted they used incendiary devices.

And the FLIR tapes.

42 posted on 11/04/2006 12:54:47 PM PST by beltfed308 (Democrats :Tough on Taxpayers, Soft on Terrorism)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 27 | View Replies]

To: Extremely Extreme Extremist

Well he's trying to put a lie to his moniker "spend it all Deval". He wants to be called "free 'em all Deval."


43 posted on 11/04/2006 12:54:51 PM PST by Lonesome in Massachussets (The hallmark of a crackpot conspiracy theory is that it expands to include countervailing evidence.)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 3 | View Replies]

To: Cicero

I know.


44 posted on 11/04/2006 12:57:19 PM PST by happinesswithoutpeace (You are receiving this broadcast as a dream)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 41 | View Replies]

To: beltfed308
"And the FLIR tapes."

Now , now the alphabets have told us that the experts really didn't know what they saw on those tapes. It was all just reflections off of the planets Venus.
45 posted on 11/04/2006 1:00:07 PM PST by happinesswithoutpeace (You are receiving this broadcast as a dream)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 42 | View Replies]

To: happinesswithoutpeace

I'm waiting to hear form those freepers who think that the FBI should be trusted to "protect" us.


46 posted on 11/04/2006 1:00:32 PM PST by Seruzawa (If you agree with the French raise your hand - If you are French raise both hands.)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 1 | View Replies]

To: cloud8
Free'm all Deval reminds me of one of those smooth talking, impeccably dressed, UN bureaucrats from some African hell-hole where the rest of the people dine on sticks and dirt soup.

If he wins... sticks and dirt soup will become the staple of the MA middle-class.

47 posted on 11/04/2006 1:03:30 PM PST by johnny7 (“And what's Fonzie like? Come on Yolanda... what's Fonzie like?!”)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 8 | View Replies]

To: Seruzawa

I met Randy Weaver twice. While he did not seem bitter, he did seem like he was still pissed at the government. I have to say that I have lost ALL respect for the FBI, the ATF and the government in general. They seem to have no problem killing unarmed women, and burn men, women and children....and then not prosecuting the guilty.

Meadow Muffin


48 posted on 11/04/2006 1:07:39 PM PST by rwgal
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 46 | View Replies]

To: radar101
Some of us know him. Story was he was adopted. Had an uneventful upbringing and got selected for West Point.

No one knew he had a sociopathic personality ~ which is the #1 requirement to serve as an executioner or FBI sniper ~ which is what that job calls for.

Not likely he'd understand why he was on trial.

49 posted on 11/04/2006 1:15:31 PM PST by muawiyah
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 11 | View Replies]

To: rwgal

I have to say that I have lost ALL respect for the FBI, the ATF and the government in general..





Yet you still love your country? How do you love your country and not the machinery of govt that, at least in part, defines it?


50 posted on 11/04/2006 1:18:27 PM PST by durasell (!)
[ Post Reply | Private Reply | To 48 | View Replies]


Navigation: use the links below to view more comments.
first 1-5051-100101-150151-167 next last

Disclaimer: Opinions posted on Free Republic are those of the individual posters and do not necessarily represent the opinion of Free Republic or its management. All materials posted herein are protected by copyright law and the exemption for fair use of copyrighted works.

Free Republic
Browse · Search
News/Activism
Topics · Post Article

FreeRepublic, LLC, PO BOX 9771, FRESNO, CA 93794
FreeRepublic.com is powered by software copyright 2000-2008 John Robinson