AMS CERTIFIED WEATHERMAN STRIKES BACK AT WEATHER CHANNEL CALL FOR DECERTIFICATION

James Span Blog, Drudge, others ^ | 1/18/07 | James Spann

[RetiredArmy]

UPDATED on www.al.com, James says that 80% of the people on his blog that have answered agree with him and that of the 20% haven't, some have been very rude, crude and vulgar. He said, it is like when I have to break into General Hospital to tell everyone that a tornado is about to strike! James says that Dr. Heidi Tidie responded that she had no political agenda and such . . . pure unadulterated B.S. She has a leftist, Algore agenda because one of her first guest on her stupid show was ALGORE!!!!! So, total B.S.

The left will now put into place, as our dear Nanny Grandmother in the Speakers Chair, Comrade Commissar Nancy Pelosiovich founds the new Global Warming Committe to spend billions on. She will probably push for the stupid Koyotamoto treaty of be revisited and revoted on and passed this time by the Marxist Peoples Congress. This is just one of the first shots being fired by the Marxist-Stalinist in the new Peoples Congress of Amerika. More and more leftist agendas will be coming in the next two years. Many, many, many thousands of thanks to all the fools and losers who wanted to teach them a lesson and stayed home. You are traitors to the Republic to allow these Marxists to come to rule our Republic. I hope you are freaking happy.

[Still Thinking]

I wondered why the weather men she wants to decertify couldn't just form a new meterological society. Nobody ever said there could be only one, and the AMS would probably lose a lot of its influence when they lost 80% of their membership roster. The expelled guys could call their group the ASHNWLPM (The American Society of Honest, Non-Wussy-Liberal-Pantywaist Meteorologists)

[Still Thinking]

Leading to my favorite new phrase: "Dumb as a Democrat"

[nina0113]

Global warming my rosy red . . .

Don't you mean "frozen blue...?"

[cogitator]

My husband, also a meathead. He insists that Bush/Cheney and their "friends" in the big oil companies are personally responsible for "global warmning". My husband also worships at the church of the Weather Channel. Why am I not suprised at by his views?

Well, anybody that burned oil since 1850 is partially responsible for the current global warming trend. So I wouldn't just blame Bush and Cheney.

[cogitator]

If Global Warming is caused by human activity/industry/Big Oil, what caused the ice age and the warming afterwards, and all the warm/cool cycles before then?

If Global Warming is caused by humans, why are Mars and other planets also experiencing a warming trend?

Why don't you ask me? I know the answers to both questions.

[cogitator]

If those estimates regarding temperatures from centuries ago are off by 3 or 4 percent due to changes in other variables that weren't included in the models,

You don't understand how the oxygen isotope paleothermometer works. O18 and O16 are differentially fractionated in the atmosphere into water vapor in a relationship that is temperature-determined. (Due to the fact that O18 weighs more than O16 -- standard chemical thermodynamics). The resultant precipitation -- which ends up in ice cores -- has an O18/O16 ratio. The ratio now, at this global temperature, serves as a basis for comparison to any other time period. The O18/O16 ratio is determined by temperature. So the temperature at any other time in the past is determined based on the fractionation relationship -- there are no other variables involved.

So, when you see a temperature curve for the past ice ages, it's really a plot of the O18/O16 ratio, also called "del" O18. Frequently, rather than absolute temperature, the "delta" temperature (difference from a set standard temperature) is displayed, as shown below.

Deuterium can also be used the same way.

[VRWCmember]

The ratio now, at this global temperature, serves as a basis for comparison to any other time period.

What is the "global temperature" now? Is the "global temperature the same today for ice cores the same in Australia as it is in Austria, or the same in Athens, Georgia as it is in Athens, Greece? Was the global temperature different yesterday than it was today? Did the "global temperature" vary from July compared to what it is now in January? How about last January? If there is any variation within the year, what does that do to our comparison to previous "time periods" if we are a couple of months off of our estimate for when the age of the ice cores we are measuring. Are we sure that nothing else could affect the O18/O16 ratio over time?

[cogitator]

What is the "global temperature" now?

Pretty close to 15.5 degrees C. That would be the "annual global mean surface land-ocean temperature combined".

Is the "global temperature" the same today for ice cores the same in Australia as it is in Austria, or the same in Athens, Georgia as it is in Athens, Greece?

The statistic regards the annual global mean land-ocean surface temperature. Regional temperatures contribute to the calculation of the global mean land-ocean surface temperature.

Was the global temperature different yesterday than it was today?

Probably a little.

Did the "global temperature" vary from July compared to what it is now in January?

Not much.

How about last January?

Last January's global monthly mean surface land-ocean temperature was likely a little different than for January 2007. (Can't say for sure, the month isn't over yet.)

If there is any variation within the year, what does that do to our comparison to previous "time periods" if we are a couple of months off of our estimate for when the age of the ice cores we are measuring?

Ice cores rarely show varves that are deposited at a time scale less than annual. (Lake and ocean sediments may show alternating seasonal layers which taken together comprise a year -- this is usually a special circumstance.) Furthermore, as ice cores are compressed, sampling may not be at annual intervals; several years may be sampled to generate a data point. So intra-annual variability is integrated in the ice core sample. At high compression a sample might even represent 50 or 100 years -- put that into perspective in a record that's 420,000 or 650,000 years long (Vostok and EPICA, respectively).

Are we sure that nothing else could affect the O18/O16 ratio over time?

Oxygen isotopes: the thermometer of the Earth (this is about how oxygen isotopes in carbonates can be used to calculate temperatures in much "deeper" time than the Pleistocene)

The Oxygen Balance (primarily about ice cores)

This is a very good explanation. Key paragraph:

"Paleoclimatologists use oxygen ratios from water trapped in glaciers as well as the oxygen absorbed in the shells of marine plants and animals to measure past temperatures and rainfall. In polar ice cores, the measurement is relatively simple: less heavy oxygen in the frozen water means that temperatures were cooler. Oxygen isotopes in ice cores taken from mountain tops closer to the equator are more difficult to measure since heavy oxygen tends to fall near the equator regardless of temperature."

[Sam Ketcham]

But they won this one...As a white liberal running in a majority African American district, Tennessee Democrat Stephen I. Cohen made a novel pledge on the campaign trail last year: If elected, he would seek to become the first white member of the Congressional Black Caucus.

Now that he's a freshman in Congress, Cohen has changed his plans. He said he has dropped his bid after several current and former caucus members made it clear to him that whites need not apply.

[VRWCmember]

So as I read those two articles, I saw changes in salinity, assumptions about the size of the polar ice caps, and a couple of other variables as that if the assumptions are even slightly off (and as far as we know nobody took and recorded precise measurements of these variables thousands of years ago) then the temperature estimates would vary widely.

[cogitator]

So as I read those two articles, I saw changes in salinity, assumptions about the size of the polar ice caps, and a couple of other variables as that if the assumptions are even slightly off (and as far as we know nobody took and recorded precise measurements of these variables thousands of years ago) then the temperature estimates would vary widely.

Changes in salinity don't change the temperature dependence. They reflect the amount of light (O16) water vs. heavy (O18) water in the oceans. This is important for paleotemperature determination in carbonates, but not in ice cores. Ice cores are very straightforward (as noted, particularly for polar cores) because water vapor - liquid fractionation is temperature-dependent. Look at the graph on the page at the second link.

[AngieGOP]

"Well, anybody that burned oil since 1850 is partially responsible for the current global warming trend. So I wouldn't just blame Bush and Cheney."

I totally agree with you. As I said, my husband is a tree hugging meathead who worships at the church of the Weather Channel.

[Monti Cello]

Wrong, regurgitator -- the oxygen isotope ratio mainly reflects global ice volume - the temperature effect on fractionation is secondary, though correlated. Do you even read the links you post? Html is not a substitute for debate.

[cogitator]

the oxygen isotope ratio mainly reflects global ice volume

IN sediments, please. Look at the temperature dependence graph. And read the excerpted paragraph with the bolded section.