Cherokees eject slave descendants

BBC ^ | Sunday, March 4, 2007

[Jedi Master Pikachu]

Descendancy stems from the 19th Century Dawes Commission lists

Members of the Cherokee Nation of native Americans have voted to revoke tribal citizenship for descendants of black slaves the Cherokees once owned.

A total of 76.6% voted to amend the tribal constitution to limit citizenship to "blood" tribe members.

Supporters said only the Cherokees had the right to determine tribal members.

Opponents said the amendment was racist and aimed at preventing those with African-American heritage from gaining tribal revenue and government funding.

The Cherokee Nation has 250,000 to 270,000 members, second only to the Navajo.

'Right to vote'

The list of descendants stems from the Dawes Commission, established by Congress more than 100 years ago.

	This is a sad chapter in Cherokee history Taylor Keen, tribal council member

It created two lists - one of "blood" Cherokees and one of black freedmen.

Principal Chief Chad Smith said about 8,700 people had voted - more than the turnout for the Cherokee constitution vote of four years ago.

He said: "The Cherokee people exercised the most basic democratic right, the right to vote.

"Their voice is clear as to who should be citizens of the Cherokee Nation. No-one else has the right to make that determination."

But opponents of the amendment levelled accusations of discrimination.

Tribal council member Taylor Keen said: "This is a sad chapter in Cherokee history... this is not my Cherokee Nation. My Cherokee Nation is one that honours all parts of her past."

Saturday's vote followed a ruling by the Cherokee Nation Supreme Court last year securing tribal citizenship for descendants of freedmen.

Members can obtain government benefits and tribal services including housing and medical support.

Slaves were held by a number of native American tribes and were freed after the Civil War in 1866.

[ARE SOLE]

Brotherhood walks, it's all about the cashish.


Regards.

[metmom]

Supporters said only the Cherokees had the right to determine tribal members.

OK. So why should anyone object to that?

Opponents said the amendment was racist and aimed at preventing those with African-American heritage from gaining tribal revenue and government funding.

Ah, the crux of the matter.

[Eric in the Ozarks]

When we decided to allow two classes of citizens (one can own casinos, the other cannot) it was only a matter of time before this happened. Next, the percentage of Indian blood will become the test for receiving casino money. They'll start with those who aren't at least 50 percent...

[Jedi Master Pikachu]

It does seem to be about money--for both sides.

More Cherokees voted over this than for their constitution, according to the article.

[mainepatsfan]

The tribe I'm descended from only considers those who can trace tribal lineage back to 1800 to be members today.

[AD from SpringBay]

Are the Cherokee being niggardly in their approach to tribal membershp? Are they throwing another faggot in the fires of racism?

[Clara Lou]

Descendants of Cherokee slaves received a form of reparation. Reparations are terminated.

[mainepatsfan]

So are the libs capable of accusing the Cherokees of being racist?

[muawiyah]

The "blood quanta" is a common determinant in Canada. In the United States the most critical issue has always been the political side of the "tribe" ~ it's existence as a functioning, governing body over a period of time.

It's pretty clear that the "slaves" were part of the Cherokee polity, and this is the United States, not Canada.

This ain't over ~

[Jedi Master Pikachu]

Guessing that the majority of Americans have some Amerindian blood--though usually in small amounts only.

[narby]

The Cherokee tribe was forced by the feds to move to Oklahoma from Ga. in the 1800's, but some stayed behind and fought the government about the move. They were later forcefully removed, which led to the "trail of tears", and many died during the difficult trip.

The main tribe, already in Oklahoma, decided that "real" cherokees were the ones who had gotten there first, and cut the "trail of tears" Cherokees out of tribal membership. When the communal tribal lands in Oklahoma were divided up among the members (late 1800's), the trail of tears Cherokees didn't get land (all Cherokee land is now private - no "reservations" exist in Okla.) To this day the trail of tears Cherokees don't get tribal health care and other federal goodies, even if they are 100% "Indian".

(I'm going from 30 year old memory on the history, so no whining if I've got a couple things wrong here)

[montag813]

Indian "blood" is the ultimate get-into-Ivy-League-school-with-mediocre-grades-free card.

[Migraine]

Are the Cherokee being niggardly in their approach to tribal membershp? Are they throwing another faggot in the fires of racism?

Why don't we just call a spade a spade? There will be no more monkey-business with tribal funds. To all hangers-on who hoped for a gravy-train: the jig is up. Anyway, these disparate factions haven't had anything to do with each other in a coon's age.

[senorita]

Apparently you don't understand tribal sovereignty status. The founders of the United States considered the Indian nations as another nation. This is documented by the fact that they signed treaties with them.

The US government can only sign treaties with another government. This was long before any Indian casinos were proposed.

And by the way, each tribe constructs it's own constitution.

[at bay]

Don't know what this is all about? Can you say CASINO REVENUE? At a casino near Fresno only the few hundred tribal members first agreeing to the casino keep the yearly, per member jackpots (Indian profit-sharing)of close to half a million each. Excluded tribal members regularly picket the place trying to join, to no avail.

A group of nameless tribal leaders adorn the casino walls. It might as well say "no new members welcome", even if you can prove blood lineage. What a sham.

The new caption on the old Indian ad could be "First they exclude me from the tribe, then they throw french fries, wrapper and all at me in the street. Man have I been trashed."

Or "You want something to cry about? We'll give you something to cry about. We'll call it sovereignity, but it will really mean, most of you are left out in the cold."

[atomicpossum]

I thought slavery was a White Man thing, and that 'Native' Americans had a PC culture... (ha).

[mainepatsfan]

It's an interesting dilemma...the more tribal members the less money for each individual member.

[Eric in the Ozarks]

In Prior Lake, Minnesota, the local tribe that developed Mystic Lake Casino peeled off several hundred "members" who didn't politicaly support the tribal chief in office at that time. This was no small deal. Each and every tribe member cleared over $1 million from Mystic Lake.
The ex-tribals were < 50 percent Indian in most cases. Some were more than 50 percent but didn't care for the chief's leadership.

[BeAllYouCanBe]

I have read accounts of African slaves escaping and being caught by Indians in the Ohio Valley. It wasn't a good life to be an African Indian slave.

1. Were these slaves part of the tribe? I suspect they were and participated in the tribal life and should be members.

2. If the "War of Northern Aggression" had not been fought then would these Africans be part of the tribe still? They would have been become members in future generations -- at least I speculate that would happen.

3. With only 8,700 votes this is a very small minority of the tribe - but this is the system.

[ichabod1]

Guessing that the majority of Americans have some Amerindian blood--though usually in small amounts only.

I don't believe that for a minute. At this point I think you'd be a lot safer to say that most of us have a lineage that came through Ellis Island. Although, now that I think for a minute, my Grandma was a Southern Lady from New Orleans, so who knows. I may just have some slave owning blood in me. I really doubt it about the amerind though.

[Dustbunny]

How can the election be a 'fraudulent election' if the tribe members voted on it?

How can a person that is not of Cherokee blood hold a membership?

Geeze, my husband is more than 1/16th Delaware, wonder if he can get a membership.

[senorita]

Sorry, but I graduated Magna Cum Laude with no "Indan Money." Stop painting us with a broad brush of ignorance.

Just like any other ethnicity, we have many conservative tribal members and many liberals.

[Jedi Master Pikachu]

And yet, it is obvious that the tribal nations are not fully sovereign now, not even as sovereign as the states.

[padre35]

True, but not complete narby, in WNC, a large group of Cherokee stayed behind I think they handle their own affairs seperately from the Oklahoma branch if you will.

[Rb ver. 2.0]

I've done some work in the Andrews-Murphy valley area of Western NC, an area that suffered from the trail of tears. The old USGS topo maps of that area show a scattering of small, rectangular Cherokee reservations deep in the hollers and coves away from the main valley. I'm guessing those are remnants of Indian family land from ancestors that hid out, didn't go to Oklahoma, and received Federal recognition decades later.

[Tax-chick]

Members can obtain government benefits and tribal services including housing and medical support.

Fewer "Cherokees" means a bigger slice of the handout pie for each. TYG.

[BeAllYouCanBe]

"How can a person that is not of Cherokee blood hold a membership?"

There are t-shirts in Oklahoma that say, "What do you call a white man that is 1/2 Indian? Answer, a white man.

I guess the Cherokee believe that you need to have a pure race. Can you imagine a white guy saying that?

[Rb ver. 2.0]

" in WNC, a large group of Cherokee stayed behind I think they handle their own affairs seperately from the Oklahoma branch if you will."

Yep, and they have their own Harrah's Casino at Cherokee, NC.

http://www.nc-cherokee.com/
http://www.harrahs.com/casinos/harrahs-cherokee/hotel-casino/property-home.shtml

[Tax-chick]

The Cherokee Nation of Oklahoma (subject of this article) and the Eastern Band of Cherokees (NC/GA) are separately recognized by the U.S. government. The different factions have been in place for nearly 200 years. The OK Cherokee government is incredibly corrupt, but some of the other tribal governments out there are even worse.

[at bay]

It's all about the money.

[johnny7]

“Where da' money?!”

[Hardastarboard]

The founders of the United States considered the Indian nations as another nation.

I always wondered how much the US government would respect their soverignty if the Indian nations passed a law mandating that every citizen own a belt fed weapon.

[muawiyah]

Got Dutch?

[Hardastarboard]

So based on this precedent, can we vote to expel our liberals, since they cause us so much trouble?

[montag813]

Sorry, but I graduated Magna Cum Laude with no "Indan Money." Stop painting us with a broad brush of ignorance.

Congratulations on your hard work. But don't blame me for non-existent "ignorance". Native-Americans routinely get bumped ahead of whites and even blacks for elite-school admissions and scholarships, as well as corporate placements, regardless of qualifications. In one high school we surveyed, a "Native blood" female student was admitted and given a full scholarhsip to Wellesley even though 43 other female applicants in her school had both higher grades and higher standardized scores. Affirmative action hurts those from an ethnic group who excel, while others among that groups slide by. This is rarely an issue with Indians, because the amounts are so few. With blacks the effect is extreme--I am white and know many people who go out of their way to avoid black doctors because of the perception that many of them were admitted to med school based only on race. That perception is buttressed by real-world examples, such as "Dr" Patrick Chavis, the landmark affirmative action plaintiff that liberals made a poster child in the 1970s. Chavis got admitted ahead of a more qualified white, which led to a landmark Supreme Court ruling. Chavis later killed a patient in a negligent liposuction, and paralyzed another. Racial quotas like this tarnish those "minorities" who work hard and achieve by themselves.

[MuttTheHoople]

Red-face speak with heap forked tongue to Buffalo People. Bad medicine. Give red face no fire-water or wampum.

[Jedi Master Pikachu]

Although they (and people from other people groups (races)) might not say it, the general view is that any human half European descended and half non-European descended is usually considered the non-European descent. In those cases, it is as though being of European descent is the exclusive descent.

[Eric in the Ozarks]

I think I understand it. Indians are Americans but not all Americans are Indians. America can draft Indians into the Army but they get their own license plates.

[Knitting A Conundrum]

This pretty much sums it up. There have been other groups purging their rolls as well. Money talks. Politics is the tool sometimes of those with power/money to consolidate it more.

[roscommon]

The REAL story here is that these descendants of former slaves want to continue such a tight relationship with their former ancestor's *masters*. You would never see this phenomena occur with the progeny of slaves who worked on white plantations.

-Roscommon

[aruanan]

Members of the Cherokee Nation of native Americans have voted to revoke tribal citizenship for descendants of black slaves the Cherokees once owned.

So these guys really are the aboriginal rednecks!

A total of 76.6% voted to amend the tribal constitution to limit citizenship to "blood" tribe members.

Yes, but what about descendants of children produced by Indians and the slaves? If the Cherokee nation is to detemine what constitutes purity, they're going to be in huge trouble if they ever hope to use any kind of objective criteria. It looks to me that these former slaves of Indians could stand, via reparations, to make a real killing off the lucrative casino industry.

[muawiyah]

Notice that the finding in question (about Chavis) was made by an "....administrative law judge..."

It's not like he was put on trial for this (as far as I know).

Still, Bakke's real problem with the admissions board was the anti-military bias of several of its members.

Chavis would have been admitted with or without Bakke around.

The US government should ahve withheld all federal aid or contracts from the University of California as a consequence of their actions in the Bakke case.

Alas, this was 1973 and the Liberals were riding high and anti-military attitudes were popular.

The persistent failure by Malkin and others to recognize this component of Bakke's problem is truly astounding.

[decimon]

The tribe I'm descended from only considers those who can trace tribal lineage back to 1800 to be members today.

Does lineage include percentage?

[Tax-chick]

A few years ago when I looked into it (Der Prinz has Cherokee ancestors :-), anyone with a provable ancestor on the Dawes Roll could register with the Cherokee Nation of Oklahoma. It really built up their numbers (and therefore their perceived value as a political bloc).

[mainepatsfan]

I don't recall seeing that as a requirement.

[BigCinBigD]

Stalking Hubcap and He who sits in melon patch were unable to be reached for this article.

[Cvengr]

Well, I guess this means any reparation payments to blacks for past slavery can be debited from the Native American budget accounts.

[Jack Black]

The existence of semi-sovereign Indian tribes within the USA is a really interesting thing.

In many states now as draconian laws are getting passed to outlaw smoking even in bars, these laws don't apply to Indian reservations. On Hotel/Casino near here (Lucky Eagle) had a large "Smoke Easy" even complete with cigar manufacturers, cigar store owners, free booze and scantily clad serving girls. Lots of stuff was raffled off. Collections were taken for the armed services.

In Travis McGee's book "Domestic Enemies" the Indian reservations have begun minting their own money out of gold, as the US $ has devalued to near uselessness.

As the rest of the nation becomes a hellish nanny state there maybe many things we have to go to "Indian Country" to enjoy.

Say what you will about their problems, at this point they seem better able to provide basic freedoms (like say having a nice Avo #2 with your Johnny Walker) than most of the States of the Union.

It is a strange anachronism that they are all racial states. Everywhere else racial states are bad. The Serbs, who are about as auntonomous a little band as the Cherokee only wanted to accomplish what the Indians in this story are doing - sort out those of pure blood from the mongrels and cast the mongrels out of the motherland.

This double standard I find amusing, rather than irritating for some reason.

[Cvengr]

Every instance of association with Indian nationals, direct or remote, Indian or government agency, which I have had over a lifetime of living in the American Southwest, have been accompanied by an intuition of corruption worse than if one was associating with close friends of Tony Soprano.

I've also never known a privately owned business fulfilling a simple contract relationship with an Indian nation to have not been defrauded some fair value of their effort, if not their entire enterprise.

IMHO, they bring most of their woe upon themselves.