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Very good Op-editorial...impossible for juries to determine motivations...
1 posted on 05/06/2007 8:56:40 AM PDT by TheBethsterNH
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To: TheBethsterNH
but hate crime legislation still threatens to punish people for holding bad thoughts.

What are the statutes of limitations on this?

Would this mean that dipping Christ on the crucifix into a container of urine could lead to the arrest of the "artist" who expressed his art?

2 posted on 05/06/2007 9:02:35 AM PDT by EGPWS (Trust in God, question everyone else)
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To: TheBethsterNH

“Some of the more hyperbolic critics of this legislation complain that it amounts to an attempt to silence social conservatives. For example, James Dobson, founder of Focus on the Family, warned that the measure would “muzzle people of faith who dare to express their moral and biblical concerns about homosexuality.” That’s nonsense: Only those who acted on their bigotry by committing violent crimes against protected groups would be affected.”

I’m not so sure it is nonsense. Even as we speak, the word “crime” is being redefined.


3 posted on 05/06/2007 9:04:01 AM PDT by sageb1 (This is the Final Crusade. There are only 2 sides. Pick one.)
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To: TheBethsterNH
Looks like someone has been reading their history ,see Tokubetsu Koto Keisatsu. The Japanese had a efficient organization from about 1911 till 1945 for just these situations, the “Thought Police”. The people that champion these laws never stop to think they will be the eventual victims of them.
6 posted on 05/06/2007 9:25:53 AM PDT by Polynikes
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To: TheBethsterNH

We most seriously punish a hitman because he kills without emotion. We forgive an abused wife who kills her husband in his sleep because she was driven to it by emotions like fear and hatred. With “Hate-Crime” the logic is reversed. I would welcome an explanation.


7 posted on 05/06/2007 9:26:02 AM PDT by muir_redwoods (Free Sirhan Sirhan, after all, the bastard who killed Mary Jo Kopechne is walking around free)
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To: TheBethsterNH

This is a two pronged attack on Christians, first HR-1952 puts Christian leadership in prisons then HR-2015 fills their empty positons with homsexuals.


14 posted on 05/06/2007 12:21:44 PM PDT by thiscouldbemoreconfusing
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To: TheBethsterNH

Don’t forget that attached to this hate-crimes bill would be a gun-control bill which would ban all semiautomatic weapons, handguns, pump action shotguns, and rifles that “Shoot more than 100 yards and/or could penetrate level I body armor”. (That would ban everything except muzzloaders and hand-loaded shotguns) It would also require everyone to turn in their newly illegal weapons and register all legal ones with the government.


15 posted on 05/06/2007 5:16:54 PM PDT by Thunder90
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To: TheBethsterNH
"Very good Op-editorial...impossible for juries to determine motivations..."

Although I am no fan of hate crime laws, juries have always been required to determine motivation in the majority criminal cases. Most criminal offenses have state of mind (mens rea) elements, the most common being intent. If you intended to kill someone it's murder, if you were just reckless it's manslaughter. Often, the hardest element for juries to deal with is whether the defendant intended the results of his actions or just didn't care what the results would be. A defendant may claim he didn't know there was dope in his glove compartment and that someone else left it there. Since most drugs laws only prohibit the "knowing" possession of the contraband the jury must decide whether the defendant knew or should have know the dope was there.

My problem with hate crimes is that they assume some victims are more important than others. A person shot as a result of jealousy or greed bleeds just a red and hurts just as bad as someone who gets shot because of racism. The motivation in each instance is just as evil.

16 posted on 05/06/2007 5:29:41 PM PDT by joebuck
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To: TheBethsterNH

Not counting hitmen or psychopaths, aren’t most violent crimes committed out of hate? You don’t kill someone because you think he’s a nice guy. Prosecuting differently because the crime was committed out of hate for a race, gender, etc. is just an attempt to make racism, sexism, etc. illegal. I believe that people have a right to be as prejudice as they want, and if they act on it and kill a person they’re prejudice against, they should be tried the same way as a normal murderer. To libs the Constitution is what you make it.


20 posted on 05/07/2007 5:18:30 AM PDT by NavySon ("To the future or to the past, to a time when thought is free...")
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