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Romney Beginning to Look Like GOP Front-Runner
Deseret News ^ | 5/27/07 | Steven Thomma

Posted on 05/30/2007 7:19:37 AM PDT by Reaganesque

WASHINGTON — Just a few weeks ago, advisers to Mitt Romney spoke about a steady, gradual climb from obscurity to the 2008 Republican presidential nomination. Mitt Romney, speaking in Lakeland, Fla., Thursday, appears to have momentum on his side among GOP presidential contenders.

Now, Romney has rocketed from behind and is leading the race or is neck and neck for the lead in the pivotal states of Iowa and New Hampshire.

The road to next January's voting still is marked by numerous potholes, including persistent charges that he's a flip-flopper without conviction, a Mormon faith still unfamiliar and perhaps suspect to some voters as well as potential new competition from former House Speaker Newt Gingrich and former Sen. Fred Thompson.

Also, his rapid rise may say as much about the fickleness of Republicans this early in the campaign as it does about the former Massachusetts governor.

But for now at least, Romney enters the summer astride the top tier and within reach of being able to claim that he's the front-runner for the nomination.

"He clearly has the three M's: media, money and momentum," independent pollster John Zogby said.

Romney led the field in fund raising in the first three months of this year. Yet until now, he trailed in popularity well behind Rudy Giuliani and Arizona Sen. John McCain in most polls, either nationally or in early voting states such as Iowa, New Hampshire or South Carolina.

However, a poll in Iowa by The Des Moines Register last week found Romney leaping ahead with the support of 30 percent of likely attendees at January's precinct caucuses, well ahead of McCain's 18 percent and Giuliani's 17 percent.

In another new Iowa survey by the Republican public relations firm Strategic Vision, Romney led with 20 percent, up sharply from 8 percent the month before. He was followed by Giuliani with 18 percent and McCain with 16 percent. (A third poll showed McCain with 18 percent, Giuliani with 17 percent and Romney with 16 percent.)

Romney surged in New Hampshire as well. A new Zogby poll there found he had the support of 35 percent of likely primary voters, up from 25 percent the month before. That was well ahead of Giuliani and McCain, each with 19 percent.

Analysts and insiders pointed to three reasons for the Romney rise:

• Good reviews from party members and pundits for his performance in the party's first debate, May 3 in California.

• Unusually early television advertising in Iowa and New Hampshire. Romney has been advertising there for weeks, boasting about his record as a business executive and governor. A new ad Thursday bragged that he cut spending and taxes as governor and "enforced immigration laws, stood up for traditional marriage and the sanctity of human life."

• His rivals are in trouble with the party's conservative base. Giuliani's support for abortion rights was highlighted in the first two debates, a problem in a party that still opposes abortion rights. McCain stood with Sen. Edward Kennedy, D-Mass., on an immigration bill widely reviled by conservatives as amnesty for illegal immigrants.

Romney's criticism of the immigration proposal — which is similar to one he supported a year ago — drew a sharp rebuke from McCain.

That, conservative strategist Greg Mueller said, was a mistake that helped elevate Romney as THE conservative critic of the unpopular proposal among the presidential candidates. "The McCain attack is the best thing that's happened to Romney since the day he got in," Mueller said.

He still faces formidable obstacles.

Foremost is the charge that he's a campaign convert to conservatism after running as a more moderate or liberal candidate in Massachusetts. Notably, he supported abortion rights when he ran for the Senate against Kennedy in 1994 and now opposes them.

"That could be his Achilles' heel," said David Johnson of Strategic Vision, which found in its new poll that Romney loses 4 percentage points of his support when voters are reminded that he supported abortion rights and gay rights in the 1990s.

"That's the one reluctance about Mitt Romney among conservatives," Johnson said. "They don't know if he's a true conservative."

The other potential challenge is his Mormon faith. In Iowa, the recent Register poll found that 1 out of 5 Republicans said they were less likely to vote for Romney because of his faith. But Mueller suggested that social conservatives eventually would care more about what Romney would do in the Oval Office than what he would do in church.

"Is there an undercurrent out there nervous about the Mormon thing? Sure. But they really want to know where he stands on the issues they care about," Mueller said.

Romney's campaign aides say he can answer the flip-flop questions by pointing to his record as governor.

"The only position he's ever changed is on life, and he changed in the right direction," Romney's campaign spokesman Kevin Madden said. "It was a matter of him recognizing he was wrong in the past and now he's right on the issue."

Madden also said that Romney's faith faded as an issue when people met the candidate and realized that he "shares the same hopes and aspirations that Americans of many faiths do."

In the end, those close to Romney tamp down any talk of his being the front-runner, perhaps fearful of raising expectations too high and setting him up for a fall if and when the polls in those early states change again.

"It's still fluid. I expect they will change," Madden said.

But he said the key to Romney's success of recent weeks and his hopes for the coming months were the same: that people get to know him and his record — and that they like him.


TOPICS: News/Current Events; Politics/Elections
KEYWORDS: polls; romney
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To: MHGinTN

Flying carpets? LOL


121 posted on 05/30/2007 4:02:43 PM PDT by colorcountry ("You step in crap once and spend the rest of your life scraping it off.")
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To: MHGinTN; colorcountry; FastCoyote
Do we need flying carpets for that latest appellation?

LOL...I wonder where Coyote is? I wanna see what he does with THAT one!

122 posted on 05/30/2007 4:04:43 PM PDT by greyfoxx39 (Thanks congress and President Bush, I'm feeling very non-multi-culti today!)
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To: mirkwood
Is there any chance that you could get into the habit of linking that graphic back to Duncan Hunter's website?

<---- click here

123 posted on 05/30/2007 4:55:30 PM PDT by WFTR (Liberty isn't for cowards)
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To: greyfoxx39; Plutarch; colorcountry; MHGinTN; FastCoyote
Henceforth, you and your co-FR-theologians shall be known as the FR Flying Inmans...

So, if you didn't make the "cut" as a FR-theologian, are you an FR Grounded Outman? Is there an FR Licensing Division that gives us the power to write an officially sanctioned "FRatwa" edict about issues of concern to us?

124 posted on 05/30/2007 4:57:08 PM PDT by Colofornian
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To: colorcountry; MHGinTN; FastCoyote; Colofornian
I kinda wondered what an ‘Inman” was. LOL

Well, ya got me there. It is Imam , not Inman. I looked "Flying Inman" on google, and found so many entries that I thought it was the right spelling. I apologize.

Is anyone keeping a tally of the names we’ve been called today?

Far be it from me to call people names. That would be mean. The FR Flying Imam appellation is just a nickname, you know, like what GWB bestows on reporters and everyone else. It don't mean nothing. If those of you whose negative posting on Romney derive from your theological disagreement with Mormonism want to call yourself something positive, such as Crusaders for Truth, go ahead.

I support Romney, so I guess I am a Romneybot. I've also been a Borderbot. No problem having a name to describe your point of view, if you are proud of your position.

125 posted on 05/30/2007 5:05:06 PM PDT by Plutarch
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To: Plutarch

If Romney becomes the nominee, I think the DNC machine will have a difficult time directly attacking Romney as unqualified because of his Mormon faith, particularly since the de facto leader of the Democratic Party, Harry Reid, Senate Majority Leader, is Mormon as well.

You can’t legitimately claim Romney’s religion disqualifies him to be President, but doesn’t disqualify Reid to be Senate Majority Leader.


126 posted on 05/30/2007 5:23:41 PM PDT by ComeUpHigher
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To: Colofornian
Is there an FR Licensing Division that gives us the power to write an officially sanctioned "FRatwa" edict about issues of concern to us?

ROTFL! Good one!

127 posted on 05/30/2007 5:56:05 PM PDT by greyfoxx39 (Thanks congress and President Bush, I'm feeling very non-multi-culti today!)
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To: Plutarch
Ann Romney was raised Episcopalian. She and Mitt dated since High School. She converted to Mormonism while Mitt was on his mission. Romney would fly back from college to see her a few times without telling his parent's he was in town.

You Tube Mitt & Ann Romney On How They Met

128 posted on 05/30/2007 6:06:33 PM PDT by Rameumptom (Gen X= they killed 1 in 4 of us)
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To: Tarpon
Romney's stance on guns is the same as the Great Conservative himself Ronald Reagan. The NRA endorsed the Mass. bill he signed also. Sure some FReepers feel that we should each have our own tanks but believing the same position as Reagan is not liberal.

"You do know that I'm a member of the NRA, and my position on the right to bear arms is well known...But I want you to know something else, and I am going to say it in clear, unmistakable language: I support the Brady bill, and I urge the Congress to enact it without further delay." Ronald Reagan

"Listen to the American public and to the law enforcement community and support a ban on the further manufacture of assault weapons.” Letter from Ronlad Reagan

“As a longtime gun owner and supporter of the right to bear arms, I, too, have carefully thought about this issue. I am convinced that the limitations imposed in this bill are absolutely necessary. I know there is heavy pressure on you to go the other way, but I strongly urge you to join me in supporting this bill. It must be passed.” -- Letter to former Rep. Scott Klug (R-WI), from Ronald Reagan

129 posted on 05/30/2007 6:15:33 PM PDT by Rameumptom (Gen X= they killed 1 in 4 of us)
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To: Plutarch

“Henceforth, you and your co-FR-theologians shall be known as the FR Flying Imams, because in a secular setting you make a big fuss out of religion, and are a threat to hijack.”

So, to be clear, Mormons who start threads promoting Bishop Mitt as the perfect secular being are okay, but non-Mormons who point out that a Mormon Bishop running for President is unlikely to be secular, are FR-Theologians, but atheists who promote secularists like, perhaps, Giulani are ok, though atheistic secularism is an anti-religion and therefore a religion.

Otay, that makes a whole lot of sense.

I suggest you read the secular Nauvoo Expositor, which when it got too near the truth about Joseph Smith being a tin-pot general, was shut down and destroyed to keep hidden his misuse of the local government. That ought to be a model for you, how to censure free expression by claiming religious figures who are in government are off limits to a full blown discussion of the impact of their deeds.

And then perhaps you can come to Vegas where I live and help shut up the press about one Dario Herrera, who was converted to Mormonism by Harry Reid and turned into his political protege in the 2002 run for congress. Now then Councilman Dario it turns out was taking bribes from an assortment of people, working a no-show PR position for HUD, but most explicitly getting free lapdances and money from one Mike Galardi, titty bar owner extraordinaire. The end fallout was the G-Sting scandal which sent a bunch of people to jail, and should have sent more, including likely Harry Reid (through a complex line of scandal plagued land deals involving Dario, Erin Kenny, et. al.).

There is much more dirt to this that I don’t have time to rehears.

However, I just want to point out that some of the arguments used to keep Dirty Harry out of the slammer revolve around his being a clean Mormon and how it would be bigoted to assail him or his saintly lapdancin lapdog/Mormon convert Dario Herrera for their complicity in outright corruption. And of course their connection to real mafioso mayor Oscar Goodman have also been hushed up.

So when people like you claim we should be called the “FR Flying Imams”, I will accept that as as a moniker as long as you are willing to accept a similarly disparaging title, something like the “FR Flipping Idiots”.

Of course that is just a suggestion. I’d rather not try and insult you the way you are insulting us by comparing us to some crazy Muslims who would love to slit American throats. I’m sure that was just an ill thought comment. Wasn’t it??


130 posted on 05/30/2007 6:29:26 PM PDT by FastCoyote
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To: greyfoxx39

“Coyote, I seem to remember you getting the brunt of the attacks today. Were there some new nasties aimed at you?”

Just the usual lie that I’m a liar (and supposedly proud of it). Probably some other things too, but since I try and be loaded for bear with backup documentation before I say things, it’s pretty hard to make the insults stick.

I think we should start a Bigots against Bigots club for our detractors. Or perhaps Haters Who Hate Haters. Or Intolerants Against Intolerance. Or the Big Mama, Intolerant Bigoted Haters of Intolerant Bigoted Haters.

Of course, the Holier Than Thou name calling is pretty silly when you look at it. How about

Holier Than Thou Intolerant Bigoted Haters of Those We Just Labeled Intolerant Bigoted Haters Because Name Calling Is Easier Than Thinking

Yeah, that’s the ticket.


131 posted on 05/30/2007 6:40:48 PM PDT by FastCoyote
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To: FastCoyote
The Nauvoo Expositor was destroyed after Mobs had destroyed Mormon printing presses. True the Mormon's shouldn't have practiced a "tooth for a tooth" but there is always two sides to a story. The Nauvoo expositor called for non-Mormons to take up arms and kill Mormons. What would the general FReeper reaction be if the Boston Globe called on Liberals to openly go kill the local Massachusetts FReepers?

Mitt was not only a Bishop but a Stake President. So technically, since you think Mormons are pushing him for religious reasons you should refer to him as "President Romney". That is how we refer to Stake Presidents in our Church. I would think it would help your cause in warning others away from him that not only was he a mere local Bishop but Regional leader as well.


132 posted on 05/30/2007 6:44:03 PM PDT by Rameumptom (Gen X= they killed 1 in 4 of us)
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To: Rameumptom

“The Nauvoo expositor called for non-Mormons to take up arms and kill Mormons. “

Not that I can see after having read through it multiple times. But why don’t you prove your point by quoting the pertinent passage? Unless it doesn’t exist.

http://www.solomonspalding.com/docs/exposit1.htm

All I read is a pretty reasonable call by some citizens of Nauvoo for Joseph Smith to stop the corruption. Here is a small snippet (which expressly says it is AGAINST action by any mob on eiter side):

*********************************************
THE EXPOSITOR. FRIDAY, JUNE 7, 1844.
SYLVESTER EMMONS, EDITOR.
INTRODUCTORY.
In greeting our patrons with the first number of the Expositor, a remark is necessary for the expression of some views, and certain principles by which we intend to be governed in our editorial duties. Many questions and surmises are made by those who suppose we will come in conflict with some of their darling schemes of self-aggrandisement. Others, more honest, desire to know whether our object is to advocate any particular religious tenets, or any favorite measures of either of the political parties of the country. To all such questions we answer in the negative. Free toleration in religious sentiments, we deem compatible with the organization of our government, and should not be abridged. On the other hand, we believe religious despotism to be incompatible with our free institutions.

What we conceive to be despotism, engendered by an assumption of power in the name of religion, we shall have occasion to show hereafter. In relation to politics, whatever our own views may be upon the federal measures that now, or may, hereafter agitate the country, the Expositor will not be the exponent threof; and all the strife and party zeal of the two great antagonistical parties for the success of their respective candidates for the Presidency, we shall remain neutral, and in an editorial capacity, inactive. Another party, however, has sprung up in our midst, the leader of which, it would seem, expects, by a flourish of Quixotic chivalry, to take, by storm, the Presidential chair, and distributat among his faithful supporters, the office of governor in all the different States, for the purpose, we presume, of more effectually consolidating the government. This party we may be disposed to treat with a little levity, and nothing more. As it respects the local questions which may arise in our own county, and the candidates for the legislature from this county, we reserve the right to expatiate upon the respective claims—not on account of their politics — be they whig or democrat, but on account of a combination which we believe has for its object the utter destruction of the rights of the old citizens of the county, who have borne the heat and burden of the day; who have labored hard as pioneers of the county; who have settled and organized the county; who have rights that should be respected by every principle of honor and good faith, and whose wishes should be consulted int he choice of officers, and not have men imposed upon them, who are obnoxious, for good and sufficient reasons. In relation of such questions, we intend to express our mind freely, as our duty dictates, regardless of consequences.

If a fair and honorable course be taken by the dominant party at Nauvoo, we will have nothing to battle against; but if they do not pursue that course, we shall be prepared for the warfare. We must confess, however, if we are to judge of the future by the past, we have little to expect from that quarter: but apart from local political considerations, we have a high and more noble duty to perform. We shall spread the banner to the breeze for a radical reform in the city of Nauvoo, as the departure from moral rectitude, and the abuse of power, have become intolerable. We shall speak out, and spare not, until certain grievances are redressed or corrected; until honor, virtue, and reputation shall take their accustomed habitations, and be respected; until we teach men that no exclusive privileges can be allowed to any individual under our form of government; that the law of the land, based upon the revealed laws of heaven, are paramount to all other earthly considerations; and he who sets the laws at defiance, and evades their operation, either by direct or indirect means pursues a course subversive of the best interests of the country, and dangerous to the well-being of the social compact.

That there does exist an order of things with the systematic elements of organization in our midst — a system which, if exposed in its naked deformity, would make the virtuous mind revolt with horror; a system in the exercise of which lays prostrate all the dearest ties in our social relations — the glorious fabric upon which human happiness is based—ministers to the worst passions of our nature, and throws us back into the benighted regions of the dark ages, we have the greatest reason to believe.

The question is asked, will you bring a mob upon us? In answer to that, we assure all concerned, that we will be among the first to put down anything like an illegal force being used against any man or set of men. If any one has become amenable to the law, we wish to have him tried impartially by the laws of his country. We are among the number who believe that there is virtue and integrity enough in the administrators of the law, to bring every offender to justice, and to protect the innocent. If it is necessary to make a show of force, to execute legal process, it will crate no sympathy in that case to cry out, we are mobbed. There is such a thing as persons being deceived into a false sympathy once, who, the second time, will scrutinize very closely, to know who, or which party, are the persecutors. It is not always the first man who cries out, stop thief, that is robbed. It is the upright, honest, considerate, and moral precepts in any class that will be respected in this or any other enlightened age — precepts which have for their end the good of mankind, and the establishment of fundamental truths. On the other hand, paradoxical dogmas, new systems of government, new codes of morals, a new administration of the laws by ignorant, unlettered, and corrupt men, must be frowned down by every lover of his country. The well-being of society demand it at our hands.

Our country, by whose laws we are protected, asks us for a manifestation of that patriotism which should inspire every American citizen—the interests of the State of Illinois require it, and as a citizen of Illinois, we intend to respond to the voice of duty, and stand the hazard of the die.

We believe that the Press should not be the medium through which the private character of any individual should be assailed, delineated, or exposed to public gaze; still, whoever acts in an official character, who sets himself up as a public teacher, and reformer of morals and religion, and as an aspirant to the highest office in the gift of the people of this glorious republic, whose institutions he publicly condemns, we assert and maintain the right of canvassing all the public acts and animadverting, with terms of the severest reproach upon all the revolutionary measures that comes to our notice, from any source. We would not be worthy of the name of an American citizen, did we stand by and see, not only the laws of the State, but the laws of the United States, set at defiance, the authorities insulted, fugitives from justice fleeing for refuge, asking and receiving protection from the authorities of Nauvoo, for high crimes committed against the government of the United States, the Mayor of a petty incorporated town interposing his authority, and demanding the right of trial for the fugitive on the merits of the case, by virtue of a writ of Habeas Corpus, issued by the Municipal Court of Nauvoo. It is too gross a burlesque upon common sense — a subterfuge too low to indicate any thing but a corrupt motive. — Such acts, whether committed in a private or public capacity, will be held up to public scorn. An independent Press is bound by every sense of duty, to lay before the public every attack upon their rights: we, therefore, in the exercise of our duty, expect the support and the aid of our fellow citizens in our enterprise.

***********************************

So Rameupton, you need to provide the quote where the Expositor calls for killing Mormons. I see just the opposite, a rather high minded call for the law. This is one of those “Put Up Or Shut Up” moments.

If you can find the quote, you will actually get an apology from me, but I can’t find it. I do get a sense of fear of retribution from The General.


133 posted on 05/30/2007 7:17:59 PM PDT by FastCoyote
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To: Reaganesque

Bttt!


134 posted on 05/30/2007 7:35:01 PM PDT by TheLion (How about "Comprehensive Immigration Enforcement," for a change)
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To: Reaganesque

Bttt!


135 posted on 05/30/2007 7:35:23 PM PDT by TheLion (How about "Comprehensive Immigration Enforcement," for a change)
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To: Rameumptom

Gun banner == Liberal, no escape.

Freedom and individual rights are the target of all gun banners. If they can’t trust you with guns then what can they trust you with? Your own health care? Your own money? Owning property? Choosing what car to drive? It’s all about responsibilities, individual rights and freedoms — Removing your responsibilities is the same as removing your rights, including the right to fail.

The NRA does all sorts of odd things for reasons that have a lot to do with getting the best they can from a bad Liberal situation. Does not mean we should give in to that temptation.

Being a governor of the most liberal state in the union is enough for me to say no thanks. Romney-care fits right in with removing your responsibilities. I think Romney is a fine person, did a lot of good things, Staples, the Olympics and some good in Massachusetts. But not for me. If he is the nominee, I won’t vote for him. Better to throw rocks at the real deal socialist than to try and defend the indefensible.

In Reagan’s time there was a Democrat congress, no hope. Reagan did what he could with that handicap. Democrats made simple, raise taxes, fund socialism and ban guns so you can’t do anything about it. Of course Liberals in law enforcement, police chiefs, sheriffs, state police just parrot what the Liberals in office want them to say, does not mean I should listen to them. So a bunch of Reagan’s throw away quotes mean nothing to me.

Gun ownership, it’s rooted in trust of the people — Rights, freedom and responsibilities, all inseparable. Without individual responsibilities there can be no rights, and no freedoms.

In Reagan’s time, who would have thought there would come a day, when 40+ states would allow citizens to carry concealed, given the era’s entrenched Liberal hysteria over guns. The notion that the average citizen cannot be trusted is a concept we should all reject. The need for more civics education is a concept we should all endorse. What it takes to be a citizen and what are the responsibilities that come with citizenship should be taught in every school. Sadly that is not the case, those citizenship teaching have been replaced by trite “paper or plastic” Liberal nonsense.

BTW: I don’t think tanks should be kept at home — But then who is to decide who gets to keep what? I limit my view of the Second Amendment to weapons the U.S. Army foot soldier would carry. It’s all up to the individual to be responsible for their actions, and held accountable for those actions, regardless what they drive.

Idealistic, probably so, but what’s wrong with ideals?


136 posted on 05/30/2007 8:23:40 PM PDT by Tarpon
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To: FastCoyote
I apologize it was the Warsaw Signal that called for the killing of Mormons not the Nauvoo Expositor. Now are you going to apologize for the mob that destroyed the Mormon's printing Press, tarred and feathered the printers, beat them and shot at the girl's who saved the manuscript from the bonfire?

You left out this part out of the Expositor, do you agree with this assessment?

"In the dark ages of Popery, when bigotry, superstition, and tyranny held universal sway over the empire of reason,.."

And this quote which gets to the heart why William Law wrote the Expositor.

"On thursday evening, the 18th of April, there was a council called, unknown to the Church, which tried, condemned, and cut off brothers Wm. Law, Wilson Law,"

Somebody had some sour beans over their excommunication. Not much new under the sun.

Well since we are playing “Put Up Or Shut Up” moments. Perhaps you'd also like to apologize for this comment. Where you take an expereince you had and ignorantly applied it to all Mormons. Claiming that wikipedia verified your assertion that I worship Holy Crickets. I was wrong abot the name of the Expositor and Signal papers and have quickly apologized. How many more months do we have to wait for an apology from you on this one. (5 months and counting)

http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/f-news/1764328/posts?q=1&;page=51

Boy were they pissed about me stepping on the Mormon crickets that infested the place - what a superstitious lot. 78 posted on 01/08/2007 4:38:35 PM PST by FastCoyote

And you are a fat headed donkey, because I have indeed been told not to kill mormon crickets because they fed the seagulls that - whatever. I can't remember all the Mormon superstitious gibberish. Oh wait, here to prove my point that you are an ass, here is wikipedia: ...

So dear readers, I have been called a liar for pointing out the superstitious beliefs of Mormons about Mormon crickets - only to be vindicated by the wikipedia. So, believe who you will, but I am certainly not the liar here. 133 posted on 01/08/2007 5:35:44 PM PST by FastCoyote

Later in the article you "flip flop" and claim you never generalized and technically didn't use the word "all" mormons. A nuetral reading of the thread shows you do generalize, do insult and have no clue what you are talking about.

So how long for an apology do I have to wait.....?

....cue.... Cricket sounds here....

137 posted on 05/30/2007 9:12:58 PM PDT by Rameumptom (Gen X= they killed 1 in 4 of us)
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To: Tarpon
Personally, I am farther to the right of Mitt Romney and Ronald Reagan when it comes to guns. I just like to point out to those who try to call Romney a liberal over the issue that he holds the same position as the Great Conservative himself.

All the arguments you apply to Reagan (times have changed, worked with Dem's) apply to Romney as well. With 85% Dem's he got quite a bit done. Some of the statements he made in 1994 need to be taken in context of the time period. This was before the immorality of Clinton was sweeping the nation and gays were marrying.

138 posted on 05/30/2007 9:23:28 PM PDT by Rameumptom (Gen X= they killed 1 in 4 of us)
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To: MHGinTN

Your welcome! : )


139 posted on 05/30/2007 11:16:02 PM PDT by TAdams8591 (Guiliani is a Democrat in Republican drag! Mitt Romney for President '08)
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To: Rameumptom

“I apologize it was the Warsaw Signal that called for the killing of Mormons not the Nauvoo Expositor.”

And YOU ALSO left out the part about the Warsaw Signal being threatened with destruction after the Mormon mob had already destroyed the Nauvoo Expositor. Hyrum Smith apparently threatened to kill the Warsaw Signal’s editor. Since General Smith had a secessionist army of 2000, I can see why they called (selectively) for the deaths of the Mormon hierarchy IN DEFENSE, lest they themselves be killed.

“Now are you going to apologize for the mob that destroyed the Mormon’s printing Press, tarred and feathered the printers, beat them and shot at the girl’s who saved the manuscript from the bonfire?”

Show me a citation and I’ll look at it. I have no idea what you are talking about, but I’ll be happy to read the history.

[You left out this part out of the Expositor, do you agree with this assessment?]

“In the dark ages of Popery, when bigotry, superstition, and tyranny held universal sway over the empire of reason,..”

Ummmm, duhhh. That was why they called it The Dark Ages, perhaps you’ve never heard of it.

“On thursday evening, the 18th of April, there was a council called, unknown to the Church, which tried, condemned, and cut off brothers Wm. Law, Wilson Law,”

[Somebody had some sour beans over their excommunication. Not much new under the sun. ]

Well, Joseph Smith WAS under some heat for being a whoremaster of other men’s wives, so it isn’t unusual that he would excommunicate dissenters and they would be pissed.

And what’s up with the cricket stuff? I’ve answered your petty question fifty times the same way over the last five months. You must have some weird feedback loop that won’t let you take a simple answer.

Here’s the deal, if you find a linguist who can find where I said “ALL Mormons believe you can’t kill crickets because they are magical”, I’ll send you a hundred bucks. If you can’t find someone qualified to attest to that, I get a hundred bucks from you. WILL THAT SHUT YOU UP ABOUT THE CRICKET THING???

“A neutral reading of the thread shows you do generalize, do insult and have no clue what you are talking about.”

Well, you just snippeted me out of context, insulted me and generalized that I ‘have no clue what [I am] talking about’, so I think we know who the Miss Manners delinquent is.


140 posted on 05/30/2007 11:19:00 PM PDT by FastCoyote
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