(On This Day in History) July 16, 1945 : U.S. Conducts First Test of the Atomic Bomb

History.com ^ | July 16, 2007 | History.com

[Rummyfan]

The greatest engineering achievement of the twentieth-century bar none.

And it saved milions of lives, both Japanese and American. More Japanese died in the fire raids we were conducting via convenstional bombing and more would have died. Operation Olympic, the invasion of the Japanese mainland, would have resulted in millions of casualties.

[PeterPrinciple]

“Based on a detailed investigation of all the facts and supported by the testimony of the surviving Japanese leaders involved, it is the Survey’s opinion that certainly prior to 31 December 1945, and in all probability prior to 1 November 1945, Japan would have surrendered even if the atomic bombs had not been dropped, even if Russia had not entered the war, and even if no invasion had been planned or contemplated. “

from: http://www.ibiblio.org/hyperwar/AAF/USSBS/JapansStruggle/index.html#

I found the above while doing some reading on history. didn’t sit right with me. The site is a fascinating source of WWII history. I usually consider this source credible but two things struck me.

1) the source of the information they based the opinion on. Of course they were going to surrender...........

2) Wasn’t the invasion of Japan planned for September or October, thus making the Dec 31 date a moot point? Willing to be corrected on this.

[DuncanWaring]

Dr. J. Robert Oppenheimer, director of the project, watched the mushroom cloud rise into the Nevada sky.

Since when is the "Trinity" site in Nevada?

[DuncanWaring]

...in all probability prior to 1 November 1945, Japan would have surrendered ...

Considering how fanatically they fought all the way north through the Pacific island-hopping campaign, I consider this assertion specious.

They fought, essentially to the last man elsewhere, and then they would just roll over and surrender the mainland of Japan itself?

[HockeyPop]

Actually, Czarist Russian pogroms can be equally credited for “driving out” it’s Jews in the 1880s whose children and grandchildren worked on the Manhattan Project. My cousin who at the age of 21 was given responsibility for one component of the bomb. And sticking it to the Russians and communists has been a family pursuit ever since.

[punster]

************
I am still relieved that America developed the atomic bomb and used it against Japan to end WWII. An invasion of mainland Japan would have cost hundreds of thousands of American lives.
************

There is also good reason to believe the use of the A-Bomb also saved the lives of many of the Japanese people. Without something so dramatic, the Japanese may have fought to the death.

The Japanese military leadership committed many atrocities, but the Japanese people were being dragged along into the maelstrom. It would have been very unpleasant having to fight them, because the loss of life would have seemed like genocide.

After the war, the United States helped the Japanese rebuild. Now, the Japanese are among our most loyal allies. They are also leaders in developing technology. The rebuilding of Japan has been a “win-win” proposition.

[mkjessup]

My great uncle worked in the Kaiser shipyards in California during World War II, and many many years later, he told a story to us about being offered an opportunity with a bunch of other welders to volunteer for a project which would take them out of state for about a month, pay them triple wages, but they had to be vetted and their backgrounds checked.

He told us that after being approved for this special welding project, they were put on a bus with blacked out windows and driven for God-knows-how-long, until they arrived at their destination, which was a bunch of tents out in the middle of nowhere, looked like a desert. They were provided with all the necessities, given blueprints, and told to build a new secret experimental ‘radio tower’, which they did, right to spec.

Back on the bus after about a month, and he said he had no idea what kind of damn radio tower they had built until after he saw pictures in LIFE magazine about the Manhattan Project (after the War), and he realized that it was the tower used at the Trinity test that he had helped assemble.

I’m very proud of him.

[Wiseghy]

Nope. Can’t say I buy this. Every serious historian who has looked into this agrees that Japan was nowhere near surrendering.

In fact, they nearly did not surrender after the first two atomic attacks, with the military almost succeeding in confiscating the Emperor’s announcement recording before it was broadcast.

Japan’s military government could not come to consensus on surrender, especially the non-conditional surrender demanded by the Allies. They have prepared very, very strong defenses of core islands, expecting a miracle to save them or to die with honor intact.

[DogByte6RER]

You’re right...

That’s a correction that Hisory.com needs to rememdy.

[PeterPrinciple]

Nope. Can’t say I buy this.
—
Note that the source is a transcription of a survey requested by Truman. My quote is taken out of context but it is the summary of the survey. I would not have come to that conclusion from the evidence presented. I don’t buy it either except that it may have been political or else there was some regret at the use of it. If you went on site and saw the devastation, it would have to influence your thinking if you didn’t consider the big picture which the survey DOES NOT.

Just as all don’t agree with the decision now, many did not then either. Pretty clear in my view that the use of the bomb saved lives.

[TexanByBirth]

I got the opportunity to go to the Trinity site a number of years ago when we lived in New Mexico. There is really not much to the site (as you might expect), but it was really cool to know you were standing where a nuclear device was detonated.

I believe they still open the site to the public on certain weeks in April and October.

[PeterPrinciple]

In reviewing the report again, Noticed the following:

“The present report was prepared by the Chairman’s Office under the editorship of Commander Walter Wilds, USNR. “

Would there be some inter service rivalry evident in the report which was quite common then and in my opinion a good thing? Competition is good even in the military.

[Realist]

I just received this article from my retired Air Force brother in law. It is about the invasion of Japan and gives the details about the plans and preparations of both sides. This would have been horrific. I had no idea.

Had this happened, a whole lot of people running around now wouldn't be running around now.
Here is a link. It is a long read.

[posterchild]

IIRC it is open the first Saturday of April and October. It mentions the first Sat of October and that the site is open in April here - http://www.wsmr.army.mil/pao/TrinitySite/trinph.htm

It was open for the 50th anniversary on Sunday July 16, 1995. There were several hundred to a thousand tourists like myself and perhaps 50 protesters. Of course the media only focused on the protesters.

The only time I ever felt personally insulted by Rush Limbaugh was the Monday after when he dismissed all visitors there as protesters who had no jobs to go to and hence the time to visit there. (I’m still an avid fan and 24/7 subscriber though and hope he’ll apologize with a free nobel prize nominee mug or something:))

[mikrofon]

Same here -- my Dad was stationed in the Aleutians, ready to go in hadn't Truman done the right thing at the time...

"A weapon of mass destruction can only be used for one thing. Now you might think it will ensure peace and freedom but I guarantee you it'll never have the effect you're hoping for until you use it at least once."

[indcons]

Military history ping

[AZamericonnie]

Thanks for the pings indcons!

[DogByte6RER]

Yes...I am aware of the October and April tour dates.

This is something that has been on my to do list for some time.

Here is a great website called “The Bureau of Atomic Tourism” -

http://www.atomictourist.com/

[SunkenCiv]

It sounds like a crock. 45+ Japanese cities had been leveled by conventional incendiary bombing, still no surrender. And the Japanese didn’t surrender after the first atomic bomb. It took two atomic bombs to convince the Emperor. He assembled the warlords and said, look, this kingdom is what I will pass on to my son to rule after me, and unless the war ends now, there will be no kingdom. Even with that, there was a last-ditch attempt by some officers to stop the surrender order from going out.