Defense Focus: Diesel sub wonder weapons

United Press International ^ | Aug. 31, 2007 | MARTIN SIEFF

[sukhoi-30mki]

Cutaway of German Type 212 class

[mylife]

Never discount diesel boats

[Enchante]

"In 1982 the British nuclear submarine HMS Conqueror proved the conventional operational potency of the nuclear attack submarine by sinking the Argentine heavy cruiser General Belgrano during the Falklands, or Malvinas, War."

LOL. There wasn't much "proof" needed of that concept..... the General Belgrano operating anywhere within the operational area of the HMS Conqueror was on a suicide mission. The only question was whether the Brits would decide to sink her because they were showing a lot of restraint, IIRC. They could have sunk a lot more Argentinian ships if they'd wanted to.

[sukhoi-30mki]

Cutaway of French Scorpene

[Badeye]

Interesting. But I think the authors own bias comes through with the repeated assertions that nuc subs can’t operate effectively in ‘shallow waters’.

We’ve been doing that very effectively for half a century in the Med, for just one glaring example of the author’s bias.

[Abathar]

I imagine with the new more powerful batteries available they are extending range and time between snorkeling considerably.

It only takes one torpedo to ruin your whole day....

[2banana]

In 1982 the British nuclear submarine HMS Conqueror proved the conventional operational potency of the nuclear attack submarine by sinking the Argentine heavy cruiser General Belgrano during the Falklands, or Malvinas, War.

Yeah - a modern nuclear attack submarine sinks a WWII cruiser that was being held together with chewing gum and bailing wire...

[Zerodown]

Drei tausend Meters
Torpedo LOS!
Surface!
Hans, machine gun all zurvivors
Say, didn't we already see this movie?

[hometoroost]

"It has been around as long as the submarine itself"

No it hasn't. The first submarines were in use prior to the Civil War and were use before the advent of the diesel engine.

[MindBender26]

Diesel boats. They are a navy’s parallel to one sniper with a good rifle.

You never know where or when.....

[sukhoi-30mki]

The author doesn’t talk much about the new AIP systems being added to subs.The German fuel cell based systems can go stay under for around 4 weeks at a speed of 5 knots.

[taxcontrol]

And with some of the new fuel cell technologies, it is quite possible that diesel boats can be even quieter than Nukes.

[Red Badger]

Rest In Peace, old friend, your work is finished.......

If you want on or off the DIESEL ”KnOcK” LIST just FReepmail me........

This is a fairly HIGH VOLUME ping list on some days......

[Yo-Yo]

Diesel subs are excellent defensive weapons. Nuclear subs are excellent offensive weapons.

I believe it was Tom Clancy's Red Storm Rising that started with the CIA knowing something was up with the Soviet Union because all of the sudden there was a shortage of car batteries in Russia. This led the CIA to believe that Russia was replacing the batteries in their diesel subs in preparation for something big.

[Yo-Yo]

LOL! Ok, I guess this does qualify as a diesel ping!

[Nervous Tick]

>> Israel has already deployed three German-built Dolphin diesel submarines to carry nuclear-armed cruise missiles to provide it with a survivable second-strike capability to deter Iran or other nations from the temptation of carrying out a pre-emptive first strike with nuclear weapons

I was wondering about Israel’s second-strike capability just the other day. I’m glad to see that they have it.

[petertare]

Fact is diesel boat have steadily been improved, modernized and quieted.

New propulsion modes are quiet above and below the waterline. They are every bit, in some regards better, than a nuc powered vessel in terms of maneuver, stealth, and life cycle economy. We should build them, but for political and force priorities/bickering do not.

A CVBG would be nearly helpless to counter even a modern two boat threat provided with some initial targetting. Crusie missiles of several types can overwhelm any US defense—and torps are not yet obsolete.

Time to get in the pig boat business.

[BOBTHENAILER]

I WANT ONE

[Pyro7480]

Yeah - a modern nuclear attack submarine sinks a WWII cruiser that was being held together with chewing gum and bailing wire...

And they used World War II-era torpedoes to sink her!

[Zerodown]

World War II-era torpedoes .....

Heard tell Belgrano went down after a hit with a wire-guided torpedo.