Posted on 11/28/2007 4:10:27 PM PST by jy22077
Because it’s been over for 2-1/2 years. Give it a rest.
Her starvation, and really it was the dehydration, did not dissolve her brain. That occurred long before.
If you want to believe otherwise, that's fine with me. But it's a fantasy, completely unsupported by medical science.
Your brain does not dissolve.
Do you still want to say that after reading some of the posts on this thread? ;)
Rehash??? If you don’t like the topic, you are free not to click on it or comment on it. May others not be so cold and rude as you’ve been if one of your loved ones ever is in the same situation.
I will agree that Terri’s brain had atrophied over time. But, I do believe the 13 day dehydration did probably make that worse.
The ME said the Terri was heavely dehydrated. In fact, he noted that it was one the worst cases of dehydration he had ever seen.
To conduct an autopsy on severely dehydrated corpse and then say that that dehydration had nothing to do with atrophy of the brain is ridiculous.
I do believe the 13 day dehydration certainly contributed to Terri’s brain atrophy.
But I will concede that Terri’s brain did atrophy quite a bit before the dehdration occured.
Of course, the ME did note that her higher thinking areas were largely intact and preserved and that the atrophy was mostly concentrated in the motor and vision areas of her brain.
ES i agree with you let it rest
Wrong! This should NEVER be given a "rest"! This should NEVER be forgotten! I, for one, can never forget, and neither should anyone else. This was MURDER by the State of Florida. Period!
Jesus Christ died over 2000 years ago, and nobody is saying give that a rest.
She never will be...
this is a free speech site. If you want to give this topic a rest than ignore it, but don’t tell others they have to.
Agree
Of course, a probate judge ordered that she could not have food or water orally either. I guess you win, counselor.
That is correct. The parents had numerous doctors and specialists who honestly believed they could work with Terri to accept natrual food and water. Greer flately refused any type of therapy or rehab for Terri and at one point told the parents they were relitigating the case. The court further flately refused that these doctors even examine Terri Schiavo or that she undergo futher testing. Even when the appeals court allowed the parents to have doctors examine Terri Schiavo, the court allowed the husband to severely limit the testing and examinations.
The lawyer for the parents claimed that she put 50 to 70 affidavits in front of Judge Greer and was only able to get 2 doctors to examine her and that was only after the appeals court ordered it.
I didn’t kill Terri, nor did I have the slightest thing to do with it.
The orders to not feed her orally were based on medical testimony that doing so could possibly fatally choke her. Giving it to her through a stomach tube did not kill her.
Removing the tube did. The oral thing had nothing to do with it.
The Doctors and Terri Schiavo
At time of Terri’s death, the Schindlers had nearly 50 doctors on the record who stated that Terri wasn’t PVS or new testing was needed to confirm her diagnosis.
Many of these doctors relied soley on the video tape clips and their own personal experiences and expertise in brain injury and PVS.
However, several doctors did manage to examine Terri or at least observe her and many did see her medical records (at least some of them). Take Dr. Sara Mele for instance who was able see Terri medical records from Medaplex.
Michael and his confederates undercut the Schindler’s 50 docs by stating that many of them never examined Terri and only relied on the video tape clips.
However, Michael neglects one critical fact that was never pointed out; Michael would not let any doctors to examine Terri (Schinder docs).
In fact, Michael got a court order which prevented any Schindler doc from examining Terri or conducting any tests on her.
This was part of Michael and Felos’s plan to prevent the Schindlers from upsetting the PVS diagnosis (which was critical in insuring Terri’s death) and getting her treatment.
Michael could always use the defense and he did, that they didn’t examine Terri when in fact Michael prevented them from examining Terri.
Dr. Hammersfar and several docs wanted to examine Terri in 2001, but Michael prevented it and Dr. Hammersfar was only able to examine her when the Appeals Court ordered it (during that time Michael petitioned nearly 6 times to have Terri killed).
But when we examine the examination factor, we see that it is quite weak. Observe:
Dr. Barnhill - Examined Terri for 10 minutes one time and I believe for 1 hour another time.
Dr. Karp - Examined Terri for 1 hour.
Dr. Cranford - Examined Terri for 45 minutes.
Dr. Greer - Examined Terri for 30 minutes
Dr. Bambakidis - Examined Terri for 30 minutes
Dr. Gambone - Examined her for 1 hour once and 10 minutes every 4 mouths after that.
Total Time of examinations over 4 or 5 year period - A little more than 5 hours.
The earlier docs did examine her (Dr. Barras, Dr. De Sousa) much more extensively in the early years, but back then the MCS wasn’t widely known and was never revisited by those docs.
I will agree the early docs probably had great deal insight into Terri’s condition. After Dr. Barnhill, examinations of Terri were quite weak and the MCS diagnosis became much more well known. However, Terri was never given to most advanced tests to confirm this diagnosis and the autopsy (Dr. Nelson reported it) did say that Terri could have been MCS.
Several Doctors did observe her and deemed her not PVS or questionalable PVS:
Dr. Cheshire - Obeserved Terri for 90 minutes. Saw her medical records
Dr. Avery - Obeserved Terri for 30 minutes.
Dr. Carpenter - Observed Terri for 30 minutes
Dr. Young - Observed Terri for 30 minutes.
2 Doctors did run examinations on her:
Dr. Hammersfahr - Examined Terri for over 3 hours.
Dr. Maxfield - Examined Terri for nearly 3 hours. Some argue the Dr. Maxfield was a radiologist conducting a neurological examination. However, Dr. Gambone wasn’t a neurologist either and conducted a neurological examination in much less time. Both had full disclosure to Terri’s medical history.
Between Hammersfahr and Maxfield Terri was examined longer than all of Michael’s other doctors combined.
Also the following caregivers were able to make observations too:
Carla Iyer
Heidi Law
Carolyn Johnson
Trudy Capone
You also have the following people who questioned PVS:
Fr. Molnowski
Bob Schindler, Mary Schindler, Suzanne Schindler, and Bobby Schindler
Pat Anderson, Tom Boderson (speech therapist) and David Gibbs
Michael resisted any testing needed to further confirm her diagnosis even though the Schindlers pleaded adamantly that Terri needed further testing based on dozens of affidavits from doctors accross the country.
Later, Michael claimed he wanted an autopsy to prove to the world the extent of Terri’s brain damage.
Michael resisted any and all efforts to have Terri further diagnosised but after she was dead had no problem have different tests performed on her to prove her diagnosis.
In a final note, Terri was never examined again after the 2002 trial even though radical new testing had become available that could have answered many troubling questions experts voiced about her condition.
Over 40 doctors weighed in on Terri’s PVS diagnosis. All they agreed that Terri was either MCS (not PVS) or she needed further testing to make that conclusion.
Although nearly all of these doctors did not personally examine Terri Schiavo, they did view video taped evidence of her responses and interactions. While some did make conclusions based on the short clips found on the Schindler’s website about Terri, many did fact make conclusion of the video taped evidence used in the trial that was far longer and in dept of what was on the Schindler’s website.
Many of these doctors had special expertise in the treatment of brain injured patients. Some of these doctors were also experts in the MCS diagnosis.
Neither the courts or Michael allowed these doctors to examine Terri Schiavo.
According to Pat Anderson, she put 50 to 70 affadavits in front of Judge Greer and in the end was only able to get 2 doctors to examine Terri Schiavo (Hammerfahr and Maxfield). This was not on the orders of Judge Greer but on the orders of the Appeal court who ordered Judge Greer to allow these doctors to examine Terri Schiavo.
The Best Schindler Doctors
1. Dr. Jacob Greene Ph.D. - A neurologist from Jacksonville, Florida. Submitted his affidavit in May of 2001. He examined Terri’s medical records (at least
some of them) and the video (from the 2000 trial) not to the so called edited ones. Disputed PVS based on the video and her medical records. Submitted
another affidavit in February of 2005 in which he Believed she was MCS (became recently known) and recommended further tests. Believed she should have had an
fMRI which Terri never received. Did not examine Terri. Dr. Greene holds a practice that specializes in the testing of brain injured patients.
http://www.terrisfight.org/userfiles/File/Affidavit%20Jacob%20Green.htm
2. Dr. Alexander Gimon. - A PHd Neuropsychologist from Florida. Had studied the video clips presented at the October 2002 Medical Evidentiary Hearing. Gave
an in-dept analysis on each one of the videos. Also reviewed the audio recording. Disputed Terri is PVS. Offered his expert medical opinion based on the
tapes and audio clip.
http://www.terrisfight.org/userfiles/File/alexGimonAffidavit082503.htm
3. Dr. Richard Neubauer - A HBOT specialist doctor from Florida. - Viewed the actual video tape (From 2000 trial). Recommended hyperbaric Therapy for Terri.
Submitted his affidavit in May of 2001. Submitted another affidavit in March of 2005 and urged that Terri be given a chance at HBOT.
http://www.terrisfight.org/userfiles/File/Dr.%20Neubauer%20Affidavit.doc
4. Dr. William Russell - A retired neurologist from Florida - Reviewed the medical records of Theresa Marie Schiavo, a videotape of her (From 2000 Trial),
the trial testimony of Dr. Barnhill, the affidavits of Drs. Carpenter and Young and that of Bishop Larkin filed in her guardianship court file, the motion
for rehearing, and various letters from Ms Schiavo?s family members. Disputed PVS. Believed Terri to be more aware than Ronald Reagan. Vouched for Dr.
Hammesfahr’s credibility. Submitted his affidavit in May of 2001.
http://www.terrisfight.org/userfiles/File/DrRussellaffidavit.htm
5. Dr. Webber - A specialist doctor from Florida - Reviewed Terri’s medical records covering the period from 1991 to 1999. Also, studied the videotape of
Terri and her mother, apparently taped in 1999 or 2000. Disputed PVS. Submitted his affidavit in May of 2001.
http://www.terrisfight.org/userfiles/File/Affidavit%20Fred%20Webber.htm
6. Dr. James Avery - A medical doctor from Florida - Observed Terri for 30 minutes. Questioned PVS diagnosis. Recommended swallowing tests. Submitted his
affidavit in February of 2000. HE DID OBSERVE TERRI!
http://www.terrisfight.org/userfiles/File/Avery%20Affidavit%20-%20Swallowing.pdf
7. Dr. Cheshire - A neurologist from Mayo Clinic in Jacksonville, Florida - Observed Terri for 90 minutes, Reviewed her medical records and the video tapes
(not the edited ones). Disputed PVS. Submitted a wonderful lengthy affidavit in March of 2005 and believed Terri was misdiagnosised and was MCS. HE DID
OBSERVE TERRI!
http://www.hospicepatients.org/william-cheshire-jr-md-03-05-affidavit-re-terri-schiavo.pdf
8. Dr. John Young - A medical doctor from Florida. - Observed Terri for 30 minutes. Questioned PVS diagnosis. Recommended swallowing tests. Submitted his
affidavit in February of 2000. HE DID OBSERVE TERRI!
http://www.terrisfight.org/userfiles/File/young.PDF
9. Sara Green Mele - A speech pathologist from Chicago - Reviewed Terri’s medical records along with all of her records about her therapy at Mediplex. Also
reviewed the video tapes and audio recordings. Gave an in-dept analysis of the videos. Disputed PVS. Submitted her affidavit in 2004.
http://www.terrisfight.org/userfiles/File/Affidavit%20from%20Speech%20Pathologist.doc
10. Dr. Jay Carpenter - A medical doctor in Florida. Observed Terri for 90 minutes. Submitted lengthly affidavits to the court urging swallowing tests,
testing, therapy and disputed the PVS diagnosis. Was responsible for the initial grassroots medical movement to save Terri’s life. HE DID OBSERVE TERRI!
http://www.terrisfight.org/userfiles/File/Dr%20%20Jay%20Carpenter.pdf
12. Dr. Thomas Zabiega - A neurologist from Illinois. Viewed videos of Terri and other info. Also reviewed the audio recording of Terri. Said the
following about the audio recording of Terri Schiavo: “believe she is making verbalizations on the tape. In fact, around 45 seconds, when she is asked “How
are you doing” she definitely changes her voice and says “good”. She appears to say “yeah” several times... then at the end of the tape when she is asked
“do your ears hurt” she definitely says “no”. Even if none of the words were discernible, the fact that her voice changes during the tape to different
questions suggests she is understanding what is being said to her. A patient in PVS does not respond and does not have any changes in verbal output.”
Disputed PVS. Urges for further testing. Submitted an affidavitt in 2005.
http://www.terrisfight.org/userfiles/File/zabeiga.PDF
13. Dr. Myra Stinson - A speech patholgist from Florida. Viewed videos from 2002 trial and audio recordings of Terri. Disputed PVS. Urged for more
swallowing tests. Stated that Terri was saying words based on the audio recordings.
http://www.terrisfight.org/userfiles/File/Myra%20Stinson%20Affidavit%20090703.pdf
14. Dr. Mack Jones - A Florida Neurolgist. Listened to audio recordings of Terri Schiavo. Made the following comments: “She does appear to be responding
to her father’s questions and attempting to form words.”
15. Dr. William Bell - A professor of neurology at the Wake Forest University Medical School. Listened to audio records of Terri Schiavo. Made following
comments: “Did respond [to her father’s voice] as she seems to pace her vocalization to his voice and not the reverse (his voice to
her vocalizations).”
16. Tom Boderson - Pat Anderson’s legal assistant and a speech therapist. Worked with Terri for a couple of weeks. Made the following comments and
coclusions: “Terri responds to a variety of stimulii, including
responding to both her mother’s and my voices, both in person and over
the phone, by fixing her attention and frequently by laughing. When I
sang to her, she often VOCALIZED, in her best effort to sing along with
me. She recognizes and takes great pleasure in certain singers and
songs which ARE her favorites (most especially John Denver
singing “Country Roads”). She learned to love several songs I sang to
her with which she didn’t seem to be familiar with, but others she
never learned to appreciate (just not her cup of tea, obviously).”
17. Carla Iyer - Florida RN who worked closely with Terri. Reported that Terri was speaking words.
18. Heidi Law - Florida CNA who worked with Terri. Reported that Terri was responsive and speaking words.
Other Schindler Docs
19. Dr. Ralph Akenman - A psychiatrist from Ohio. Specializes in treatment of brain injured patients. Did not observe or examine Terri but says his therapy could possibly help her. Submitted her affidavit in March of 2005. Just a helpful affidavit in my opinion.
http://www.terrisfight.org/userfiles/File/Ankenman.pdf
20. Dr. Beatrice Engstrand - A neurologist from New York. Did not examine Terri or her medical records. Did state that she could help Terri because of similar patients she has delt with. Disputes PVS. However, she did study under Dr. Plum, the pioneer doctor of the PVS state, so her conclusions may be credible. Urged for a PET scan and fMRI. Submitted affidavit in March of 2005.
http://www.terrisfight.org/userfiles/File/Engstrand.pdf
21. Dr. Alyse Eytan - A psychairtrist from Chicago. Had followed the Terri Schiavo case in the news. Basically a doctor offering her expert opinion based what she has read and seen. Sounds like a moral POV affidavit. Submitted her affidiavit in March 2005.
http://www.terrisfight.org/userfiles/File/Eytan.pdf
22. Dr. Goldsmith - Is a regular doctor. Had not examined Terri but had seen the video clips. Questionable on PVS. Believes his therapy could help Terri. Encouraged further testing and therapy.
http://www.terrisfight.org/userfiles/File/Goldsmith.pdf
23. Dr. Carolyn Heron. Is a regular doctor from Chicago. Had followed the Teri Schiavo case in the news. Basically a doctor offering her expert opinion based what she has read and seen. Has seen the video clips. Disputed PVS based on her expertise. Urged additonal testing.
http://www.terrisfight.org/userfiles/File/Heron.pdf
24. Dr. David Hopper - A psychologist specializing in brain injury. Disputed PVS. Recommended further tests.
http://www.terrisfight.org/userfiles/File/drhopper.PDF
25. Dr. Lawrence Huntoon - A neurologist from New York. Did view the so called edited video clips. Disputed PVS based on his expertise and knowledge on the video clips. Believed Terri to be MSC. Stood by his affidavit later by refuting the autopsy results. Is one the foremost experts on the MCS diagnosis.
http://www.terrisfight.org/userfiles/File/Huntoon.pdf
http://www.christorchaos.com/DrHuntoonLetter.htm
26. Dr. Hyink - Speech Language Pathologist from Colarado. Did view the so called edited video clips. Offered her expert medical opinion based what she knows of the case. Urged communication therapy. This patholgist is Laura Shepherd’s pathologist, the disabled daughter of Linda Shepherd.
http://www.terrisfight.org/userfiles/File/Hyink.pdf
27. Dr. Jill Joyce - Speech Language Pathologist. Did view the so called edited video clips. Disputed PVS based on her expertise and thevideo clips. Offered her expert medical opinion based what she knows of the case. Urges additional therapy.
http://www.terrisfight.org/userfiles/File/Joyce.pdf
28. Dr. Phillip Kennedy PH.D. - A neurologist. Offered his expertise in the case. Urged Terri to undergo a fMRI.
http://www.terrisfight.org/userfiles/File/Dr%20Philip%20Kennedy.pdf
29. Dr. Ricardo Senno. A regular doctor from Illinois - Offered his insight on what he has seen and his expert medical opinion. Only saw photos of Terri on the internet. Conclusions based on this sound weak. It more of moral stand he takes. Urged further testing.
http://www.terrisfight.org/userfiles/File/Senno.pdf
30. Dr. Stanley Terman - A neurologist from California - Reviewed info on Terri including the Wolfson GAL Report. Recommended further testing such as fMRI.
31. Dr. Michael Uszler - A doctor from California. Questioned testing done on Terri.
http://www.terrisfight.org/userfiles/File/Uszler.pdf
32. Dr. Richard Weidman - A doctor from Washington D.C. Disputed Terri is PVS based on what he had seen and heard. Urged more testing.
http://www.terrisfight.org/userfiles/File/Weidman.pdf
33. Dr. Peter Morin - A neurologist from Maine. Studied info about the case. Raised many moral questions.
http://www.terrisfight.org/userfiles/File/morin.PDF
34. Dr. Peter Luca - A doctor from Michigan. Addresseed his moral POV of view regarding Terri’s situation.
http://www.terrisfight.org/userfiles/File/luca.PDF
35. Dr. Paul Harch - A doctor from Louisana. Sided with Dr. Neubeur to have Terri undergo HBOT treatment.
http://www.terrisfight.org/userfiles/File/harch.PDF
36. Dr. Peter Brunner - A speech patholgist from Florida. Urged Terri to undergo Vitalstim treatment.
http://www.terrisfight.org/userfiles/File/brunner.PDF
37. Dr. David Coulter - A doctor from Boston. Urged more testing for Terri.
http://www.terrisfight.org/userfiles/File/coulter.PDF
38. Dr. Kyle Lakas - A speech patholgist from Texas. Urged Terri to undergo Vitalstim tretment.
http://www.terrisfight.org/userfiles/File/Lakas.pdf
39. Dr. Rodney Dunaway - A neurologist from Texas. Viewed video clips. Disputed PVS. Urged further testing.
http://www.terrisfight.org/userfiles/File/DR.%20Dunaway.pdf
40. Dr. George Isajiw - A doctor from Pennsylvania. Viewed video clips. Disputed PVS. Urged further testing.
http://www.terrisfight.org/userfiles/File/Dr.%20Isajuiw.pdf.
41. Dr. Leonard Rybak - A doctor from Illnois. Viewed Videos. Disputed PVS. Conferred with Dr. Hammesfarh’s diagnosis. Urged Further testing.
http://www.terrisfight.org/userfiles/File/DR.%20Rybak.pdf
42. Dr. Laura Barclay - A neurolgist from Tampa, Florida. Disputed PVS based on the video clips and other information about Terri. Urged additional testing and therapy.
http://www.terrisfight.org/userfiles/File/Dr%20%20Laurie%20Barclay.pdf
Still Others:
43. Dr. William Bell - A neurology professor from Wake Forest University - Doubted Terri’s PVS diagnosis. Said the following about it regarding the video clips. “I asked Dr. Bell if he thought a moan uttered after a painful blow could be a reflex. “It’s highly unlikely,” he replied. He qualified his answer by noting that he had not actually seen the video of the exam, but he believes that the description of Terri’s reaction is not consistent with a reflex. “A moan is not a reflex,” Bell said. “A wince or grimace is not a reflex.”
In other words, kill her rather than give her a chance. Nice.
Right. But as always, you supported it. To this very day.
I agree. They didn’t want to try any attempts at oral feeding (regardless of evidence presented to them) because she might choke, get pnumonia an die. But they were pulling the feeding which was starving and dehydrating her to death.
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