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A Second Look at Romney
Townhall.com ^ | December 14, 2007 | Mona Charen

Posted on 12/14/2007 5:06:25 AM PST by Kaslin

Pretty much every election year since I can remember, a complaint has arisen that goes like this: "Why are we stuck with these awful choices? In this vast country of highly successful individuals, why don't any of the best people run for president?" Some years evoked more howls than others, and admittedly, 1976 really did present two underperformers, as did 1996. So let's pause to notice the fact that this year we have some exemplary choices.

Fred Thompson is an excellent man who is running a refreshingly substantive campaign. John McCain has demonstrated not just personal courage (which is admirable enough) but the courage of his convictions. And Rudy Giuliani achieved a seemingly impossible task in transforming America's largest city.

But no one running is more impressive than Mitt Romney. It was his speech on religion in American life that caused me to take another look at him. Until then, I confess that I saw him as a sort of robo-candidate: smooth, articulate, but perhaps a little opportunistic and possibly even insincere. The religion speech cast a new light on him.

The question as to whether someone's religious convictions are a fit subject for public scrutiny is not as simple as it sounds. It's too pat to say, "There should be no religious test for public office and there's the end of it." If a candidate were, say, a fundamentalist Mormon like Warren Jeffs, or a Scientologist, that would be an obstacle. But the mainstream Mormon Church has enough of a track record in producing excellent Americans that the particularities of its doctrine are by now a matter of purely scholarly interest. No one thought to raise objections to Mormonism when Mo Udall ran for president, nor even when Mitt's father, George, made a bid. The Senate majority leader is a Mormon and this fact causes not a flicker of interest on the part of his colleagues. Besides, Mitt Romney served as governor of Massachusetts. If anyone felt Joseph Smith's brooding presence during that time, they haven't mentioned it.

What Romney's religion speech demonstrated was not so much his devotion to his own faith (though he declined to run away from it) as his understanding and embrace of America's civic religion. In his telling, that civic religion amounts to a commitment to religious liberty as well as to broadly shared religious values. "It is important to recognize," he said, "that while differences in theology exist between the churches in America, we share a common creed of moral convictions. And where the affairs of our nation are concerned, it's usually a sound rule to focus on the latter -- on the great moral principles that urge us all on a common course. Whether it was the cause of abolition, or civil rights, or the right to life itself, no movement of conscience can succeed in America that cannot speak to the convictions of religious people." Romney went on to paint America as the golden mean between the empty cathedrals of Europe and the violent jihadists of the Islamic world. It was a masterful performance.

But then Romney has been masterful in everything he has attempted. It is not insignificant that this cum laude JD/MBA graduate of Harvard guided Bain Capital to become a hugely successful private equity investment firm and rescued Bain & Company from financial collapse. Romney was brought in to save the 2002 Winter Olympics when the games were mired in scandal and $379 million in debt. Romney was able to turn the situation around completely so that the games actually turned a $100 million profit instead. (He also gave back his salary.) That's not slick, that's substance.

When Mitt Romney took office as governor of Massachusetts, the state had a $1.2 billion deficit. Four years later it was in surplus. He boasts that fourth and eighth graders in Massachusetts achieved the highest scores in the nation in reading and math, though they were doing so before he became governor as well. But his program of assessment, merit pay for good teachers, English immersion and a focus on math and science may have helped keep them at the top.

It is difficult to find any significant weakness in Romney. He is refreshingly articulate, exceedingly well prepared and self-disciplined, clearly an excellent manager with both private and government experience, happily married with a large, supportive family, and well within the mainstream of conservatism on every major issue. His nomination would not divide the base.

He is just the sort of candidate people complain that they never get.


TOPICS: Editorial; Politics/Elections
KEYWORDS: 2008; monacharen; romney
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1 posted on 12/14/2007 5:06:27 AM PST by Kaslin
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To: Kaslin
'It is difficult to find any significant weakness in Romney. '

I want to vote for a CONSERVATIVE - SOCIAL AND FISCAL. Mitt seems to be just another smooth talker from the northeast, who thinks he knows more than us hayseeds in flyover country.

2 posted on 12/14/2007 5:09:37 AM PST by mathluv
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To: Kaslin
It is difficult to find any significant weakness in Romney

Mona you are redefining "significant" to "ignoring"

3 posted on 12/14/2007 5:14:48 AM PST by tiger-one (The night has a thousand eyes)
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To: Kaslin
"why don't any of the best people run for president?"

She never mentions Duncan Hunter. People don't talk about Hunter mostly because people don't talk about him. If people started talking about him, maybe people would start talking about him.

4 posted on 12/14/2007 5:17:51 AM PST by ClearCase_guy (The broken wall, the burning roof and tower. And Agamemnon dead.)
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To: Kaslin; Abbeville Conservative; asparagus; Austin1; bcbuster; bethtopaz; BlueAngel; ...
...well within the mainstream of conservatism on every major issue. His nomination would not divide the base.

Another conservative columnist endorses Romney along with National Review Online and Paul Wyerich and Pat Buchanan to name a few.

PING!

5 posted on 12/14/2007 5:21:56 AM PST by circumbendibus
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To: mathluv
I trust you’re not voting for Huckabee then?

I’m a Mitt person. This is an honest question.

6 posted on 12/14/2007 5:25:25 AM PST by coca-cola kid
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To: Kaslin
Although I don't plan to vote for Romney in the primary (unless by the time I vote it is down to him and Huck), I have found myself being more impressed in the past couple of weeks.

If I see more promise, or ba*ls from him on the WOT (which is my primary concern, hence my inability to support Huck) he will be moving up on my list.

7 posted on 12/14/2007 5:25:37 AM PST by codercpc
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To: Kaslin

There goes my respect for Mona Charen’s mind. How about taking yet another look at Romney, specifically at his record? His record belies his current profession of conservatism.
Shame on you Mona, falling for a snake oil salesman.


8 posted on 12/14/2007 5:28:30 AM PST by 668 - Neighbor of the Beast ( "Do well, but remember to do good.")
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To: 668 - Neighbor of the Beast

That is silly


9 posted on 12/14/2007 5:34:32 AM PST by Kaslin (Peace is the aftermath of victory)
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To: Kaslin
"He is just the sort of candidate people complain that they never get."

I find a lot of validity in the argument presented. IMHO - Romney is the "best" Republican candidate.

10 posted on 12/14/2007 5:36:45 AM PST by LZ_Bayonet (There's Always Something.............And there's always something worse!)
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To: Kaslin
the state had a $1.2 billion deficit. Four years later it was in surplus

HOW much DID he raise taxes while he was Governor? I ownder if he returned any of the surplus to the people who OWNED it.

Liberal don't understand anything, do they?

11 posted on 12/14/2007 5:39:22 AM PST by colorcountry (To anger a conservative, lie to him. To anger a liberal, tell him the truth.)
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To: Kaslin

National Review
Mona Charen

...

Who else is on the list?


12 posted on 12/14/2007 5:39:30 AM PST by samtheman
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To: ClearCase_guy
Because he doesn't have a chance. I hope however when we win the election on November 4, 2008 who ever gets elected will choose him in his administration
13 posted on 12/14/2007 5:40:06 AM PST by Kaslin (Peace is the aftermath of victory)
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To: fieldmarshaldj

We need your wisdom over here....


14 posted on 12/14/2007 5:41:46 AM PST by SnarlinCubBear ("Tolerance becomes a crime when applied to evil." -- Thomas Mann)
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To: mathluv

If not Romney, who then? Why?


15 posted on 12/14/2007 5:48:39 AM PST by circumbendibus
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To: samtheman

Hugh Hewitt


16 posted on 12/14/2007 5:56:04 AM PST by dawn53
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To: circumbendibus

Did Buchanan endorse Romney ? If so , when ?


17 posted on 12/14/2007 5:58:12 AM PST by Neu Pragmatist (Your friendly resident drive-by poster , it's for a great cause ! Stop the RINO's - VOTE FRED !)
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To: samtheman

Endorsements
Editors of National Review Endorse Romney For President:
… “Romney is an intelligent, articulate, and accomplished former businessman and governor. At a time when voters yearn for competence and have soured on Washington because too often the Bush administration has not demonstrated it, Romney offers proven executive skill. He has demonstrated it in everything he has done in his professional life, and his tightly organized, disciplined campaign is no exception. He himself has shown impressive focus and energy.
… “We believe that Romney is a natural ally of social conservatives. He speaks often about the toll of fatherlessness in this country. He may not have thought deeply about the political dimensions of social issues until, as governor, he was confronted with the cutting edge of social liberalism. No other Republican governor had to deal with both human cloning and court-imposed same-sex marriage. He was on the right side of both issues, and those battles seem to have made him see the stakes of a broad range of public-policy issues more clearly. He will work to put abortion on a path to extinction. Whatever the process by which he got to where he is on marriage, judges, and life, we’re glad he is now on our side — and we trust him to stay there.

… “As he argued in his College Station speech, his faith informs his values, which he has demonstrated in both the private and public sectors. In none of these cases have any specific doctrines of his church affected the quality of his leadership. Romney is an exemplary family man and a patriot whose character matches the high office to which he aspires.

“More than the other primary candidates, Romney has President Bush’s virtues and avoids his flaws. His moral positions, and his instincts on taxes and foreign policy, are the same. But he is less inclined to federal activism, less tolerant of overspending, better able to defend conservative positions in debate, and more likely to demand performance from his subordinates. A winning combination, by our lights. In this most fluid and unpredictable Republican field, we vote for Mitt Romney.” (the entire editorial is a Must Read)

Dr. John Willke, a Founder of the Pro-Life Movement Nationally and Internationally, Served for 10 Years as President of The National Right To Life Committee and Helped Found the Organization:
“Unlike other candidates who only speak to the importance of confronting the major social issues of the day, Governor Romney has a record of action in defending life. Every decision he made as Governor was on the side of life. I know he will be the strong pro-life President we need in the White House. Governor Romney is the only candidate who can lead our pro-life and pro-family conservative movement to victory in 2008.”
Paul Weyrich, Chairman and CEO of the Free Congress Research and Education Foundation, current National Chairman of Coalitions for America, founder and past director of the American Legislative Exchange Council, the founding president of the Heritage Foundation, and co-founder of the Moral Majority with the late Jerry Falwell:
“As he travels across the country, Governor Romney has outlined a blueprint to build a stronger America rooted in our common conservative principles. With a clear conservative vision to move America forward, he will strengthen our economy, our military and our families. More importantly, he already has an exceptional record of putting conservative values to work. Because of his experience, vision and values, I am proud to support Governor Romney.”

David A. Keene, Chairman of the American Conservative Union:
“In recent months, Governor Romney has emerged as the single candidate most worthy of conservative support. That’s why I’m endorsing him and intend to spend as much time as possible in the weeks ahead convincing my fellow conservatives that if we are serious about electing a conservative president in 2008, it’s time to unite behind his candidacy.”
(Audio Clip From Laura Ingraham Show On 11/29/2007: David Keene On His Endorsement Of Governor Mitt Romney)

Wendy Long, Chief Counsel, Judicial Confirmation Network, former clerk of U.S. Supreme Court Justice Clarence Thomas:
“Our country faces a new generation of challenges, which has presented our courts with a new generation of legal issues. As Governor of Massachusetts, Mitt Romney witnessed firsthand the impact our courts can have when facing these new challenges. I believe that he, better than any other candidate for President, understands the need for our courts to respect democracy and the will of the people. I believe that he, better than any other candidate for President, would nominate judges and justices of the highest caliber, who would be faithful to the text, history, and principles of our Constitution. I look forward to working with the Governor.”

U.S. Senator Jim DeMint (R-SC), National Co-Chair of Romney for President Campaign:
“I believe that he is exactly the leader America needs to secure our future. Americans are tired of the same old ideas that keep coming out of Washington. They are hungry for a leader who will draw on America’s strength. I would like Governor Romney to know that key Republicans like you want him to run for President.”
(Ivy J. Sellers, “Jim DeMint’s Letter Endorsing Mitt Romney,” Human Events, 1/09/2007) • (Listen to a Romney for President radio ad featuring Sen. DeMint: “Stop Spending”)

U.S. Senator Judd Gregg (R-NH), National Co-Chair of Romney for President Campaign:
“I am proud to stand alongside Governor Romney as he campaigns to build a stronger America. For months, the people of New Hampshire have had the opportunity to meet Governor Romney all over the state and listen to his ideas for bringing change to Washington. Mitt Romney embodies New Hampshire’s values – values that stress government living within its means, lower taxes, a stronger military and stronger families. Governor Romney is the strong leader we need to lead America forward. He has the experience, vision and values needed to be our next President.”
(Mitt TV Clip: Senator Judd Gregg (R-NH) Endorses Gov. Romney)

Sheriff Joe Arpaio - Maricopa County, Arizona:
“I like him,” Arpaio said of Mitt Romney. “He’s a man of principle, of good character. He did a great job in Massachusetts and I feel he’s going to make a great president.” “I’m sure the governor believes in my philosophy too,” Arpaio said. “He sure would not be asking for my endorsement if he didn’t believe in what I’m doing.”
(Sara Bonisteel, “Arizona Sheriff Joe Arpaio Tells FOX News Why Mitt Romney Picked Him for Presidential Campaign,” Fox News, 2/28/2007)

Craig Sandler, former Director of General Operations of the National Rifle Association and former Nashua Police Chief:
“Throughout his career in both the public and private sectors, Mitt Romney has demonstrated exceptional leadership ability, integrity, and commitment to principle. As a New Hampshire resident, former law enforcement officer, and avid sportsman, I am supporting Governor Romney because he is the candidate who will protect our Constitutional rights and strengthen our nation.”

Retired Major General James “Spider” Marks, U.S. Army:
“Governor Romney has been outspoken in his commitment to our men and women in the military. Our troops need more support from Washington and Governor Romney will ensure that they have the resources they need to defend this country. I am proud to be joining Governor Romney’s campaign. On national security issues, the Governor has distinguished himself as a true leader ready to invest in our national defense.”

Dr. Bob Jones III, Chancellor of Christian fundamentalist Bob Jones University in Greenville, SC:
“This is all about beating Hillary [Clinton]. And I just believe that this man has the credentials both personally and ideologically in terms of his view about what American government should be to best represent the rank and file of conservative Americans. As a Christian I am completely opposed to the doctrines of Mormonism, but I’m not voting for a preacher. I’m voting for a president. It boils down to who can best represent conservative American beliefs, not religious beliefs.”

Dr. Robert R. Taylor, Dean of the College of Arts and Sciences at Bob Jones University:
“We’re not electing a pastor — we’re electing a president.”

Dr. Wayne Grudem, professor of Theology at Phoenix Seminary, a former president of the Evangelical Theological Society, and a hugely influential thinker in Christian academia:
“As an evangelical professor of Bible and theology, I have decided to support Mitt Romney for President (even though he is a Mormon) for two old-fashioned reasons: First, he is the best-qualified candidate, and second, he holds moral and political values consistent with those in the Bible.” (read more)

Mark DeMoss, president of The DeMoss Group, a public relations firm for evangelical Christian groups and causes:
“After spending months researching his life and his record, and hours with him (and his wife and staff) in his home, his office and on the road, I am convinced his values practically mirror my own—values about the sanctity of life, the sacredness of marriage, the importance of the family, character and integrity, free enterprise and smaller government. But more than one candidate shares my values...” (read more)

Ambassador Thomas Melady, former U.S. Ambassador to the Vatican from 1989 to 1993:
“In Governor Mitt Romney, I have found a candidate who represents the family values that are so important to me. His appreciation for the value of a strong family is clearly exhibited in his vision for America. He understands that every decision he would face, affects the American family. I look forward to working to help Mitt bring his family friendly change to Washington.”

U.S. Congresswoman Kay Granger (R-TX), Highest Ranking Republican Woman In The U.S. House Of Representatives:
“Governor Romney is a proven leader and natural problem solver. He has demonstrated the ability to turn problems into successes. As Americans, we need his leadership in Washington. He is the only candidate to demonstrate that he has a strategy to make America stronger by returning to our core conservative principles that have made this country so great. I am proud to join his campaign.”

U.S. Congressman Connie Mack (R-FL):
“Governor Romney is a proven problem solver with an unparalleled record of success in both the public and private sectors. Governor Romney is a mainstream conservative leader who will be a champion of hope and opportunity for every American, a catalyst for conservative change in Washington, and a staunch defender of our freedom, security and prosperity. I’m pleased to offer Governor Romney my endorsement and look forward to working hard to help elect him the next President of the United States.”

U.S. Congressman Pete Hoekstra (R-MI), top Republican on the U.S. House Permanent Select Committee on Intelligence:
“Governor Romney understands that a President must focus on both current and emerging threats to our nation and that an agile and aggressive intelligence community provides America’s first line of defense against those threats.”

U.S. Congressman Lamar Smith (R-TX), Ranking Republican Member of the House Judiciary Committee:
“Governor Romney is the only candidate in this race who has the ability to take Washington apart and put it back together, so that it works better for the American people. I am happy to endorse his candidacy for President. He understands the importance of getting America back to conservative principles and common sense leadership. Governor Romney is the right choice for Americans who want to see change in Washington.”

U.S. Congressman Vernon Ehlers (R-MI), former research physicist, member of the Science and Technology Committee:
“When I evaluate candidates, I look first for integrity, competence, and a good, common sense philosophy of governance. Mitt Romney scores astoundingly high on all points. Governor Romney is a candidate with an innovative vision for America. In the course of his impressive career, he has earned a solid reputation for successfully solving enormous problems that others thought couldn’t be solved. With Governor Romney in the White House, we will have the strongest possible leader to enhance America’s competitiveness through science, technology, engineering and education. I proudly endorse his campaign.”

Missouri Governor Matt Blunt, National Co-Chair of Romney for President Campaign:
“Mitt Romney’s strong conservative principles are right for America. He is a strong leader and a proven problem solver - in private business, the Olympics, and as Governor. Governor Romney lives the American values that we cherish. I believe he has a great vision for the future of the United States.”

Nebraska Governor Dave Heineman:
“In his campaign for the presidency, Mitt Romney has outlined the clearest vision to move our country forward. With exceptional leadership experience and outstanding values, Governor Romney is the only candidate who can bring true conservative change to Washington. I am proud to be a part of his team and look forward to joining him as he travels across this country discussing his strategy to build a stronger America.”

Rhode Island Governor Don Carcieri:
“Governor Romney has a strong record of results for the people of Massachusetts. In his four years as chief executive, he erased a deficit and provided health care without raising taxes. Our country faces a new generation of challenges that requires a leader ready to call upon the strength of the American people. With the leadership experience he brings from the private and public sectors, Governor Romney is just that leader.”

Former Governor of Colorado Bill Owens:
“Well, I think he’s one of the brightest people I’ve ever seen in public office. He’s a businessman, he’s a manager. He understands markets, he understands the private sector. He is a conservative, he wants to cut taxes. You know, he’s a Republican who was elected in Massachusetts, which has about 12% of its voters who are Republican. He was able to win that election, and we saw what he did at the Olympics.”

Virginia Lt. Gov. Bill Bolling:
“Mitt Romney also has the right vision for the future of our country. We can trust him to keep America safe at home by defeating the Jihadists abroad; and keep America strong by reigning in government spending, keeping taxes low, protecting the values we believe in, and confronting head on the new generation of challenges currently facing our nation.”

Former Lt. Governor of Michigan Connie Binsfeld:
“Governor Romney is the leader our country needs. He is committed to strengthening our economy and adding jobs to the workforce, critical issues for the people of Michigan. Additionally, Governor Romney has a proven record on the issues facing our nation. He’ll keep taxes low, cut government spending, and reform health care. With Governor Romney, Americans know they have an exceptional leader with a proven record of results.”

Former Lt. Governor of Florida Toni Jennings:
“I have been very fortunate to get to know Mitt Romney and his wife, Ann, on a personal level. Mitt and Ann live their private lives in exactly the same way they live their public lives – with compassion, honesty, faithfulness, and an optimistic and hopeful belief in the strength of the American people. I look forward to telling Floridians about Romney, and why they should believe in him – because I know that Mitt Romney is the strong conservative leader right for the job.” (read more)

Rev. Lou Sheldon, head of the Traditional Values Coalition:
“When I give my support for a candidate, I am giving the green light, if he wins, all the way down the line in terms of so many moral and social issues...My thinking is that Mitt Romney is a person with the experience and with the Jude[o-]Christian moral values,” Sheldon told CBN’s David Brody, adding that he’d “been around Mormons long enough to know that when they pray in the name of the Lord Jesus Christ they are sincere about that— that he is the Lord and the redeemer and the one that they have to be answerable to.” (1, 2, 3)

Other religious-right activists on Romney’s committee include Jay Sekulow of Pat Robertson’s American Center for Law and Justice, Gary Marx of the Judicial Confirmation Network, prominent anti-abortion and Constitutional attorney James Bopp, Jr., Christian Coalition board member Drew McKissic, Jay Sekulow’s son Jordan, anti-immigration writer James Edwards, and leaders or activists associated with the Alliance Defense Fund, Iowa Christian Alliance (formerly the Christian Coalition of Iowa), Heartbeat International, Legacy Law Foundation, and Citizens for Traditional Values.

Jay Sekulow, Chief Counsel, American Center for Law and Justice, Constitutional Attorney and Supreme Court Advocate:
“Governor Romney has a strong record of defending traditional values and supporting the faith community. He is the one candidate who has spoken to the importance of promoting stronger families. In Washington, he will stand alongside those defending our most important values.”
(View important comments from Jay Sekulow in this video: Voices from the Values Voter Summit)

James Bopp, Jr., General Counsel, National Right To Life Committee and James Madison Center For Free Speech, Constitutional Attorney and Supreme Court Advocate, Prominent Advocate For Pro-Life Issues and Campaign Finance and Election Law:
“I believe that Governor Romney is the best qualified person for President. He is a fiscal and social conservative, he has impressive administrative experience in the private, non-profit and public sectors, and he is a proven and successful politician.”
(View important comments from James Bopp, Jr. in this video: Voices from the Values Voter Summit)

Camille Solberg, past President of the Wisconsin Coalition for Traditional Marriage:
“Governor Romney has a strong record on the issues that matter most to social conservative voters. Facing unprecedented challenges to some of our most basic values, he acted to promote a culture of life, defend traditional marriage and strengthen the family. His is a record of action and a platform social conservatives can and are supporting. I am honored to be a part of his team.”

John Peyton, Mayor Of Jacksonville, Florida:
“In Massachusetts, Governor Romney applied conservative principles and successful private sector practices to grow the economy and restrain state spending. As President, Governor Romney will bring this same strong and innovative leadership to the White House as America faces new global and domestic challenges.”

Deon Long, Statewide Chair of Romney for President Florida African American Steering Committee:
“Governor Romney is the only candidate that is presenting substantive policies and reforms to address the problems Americans face today. With a record of innovative leadership, it is clear that he is uniquely qualified to provide the leadership we need to expand access to affordable health care, keep our taxes low, raise the bar on education and keep our country safe.”

State Senator Kevin Coughlin (R-OH):
“Our nation needs a leader like Governor Romney, a candidate with a proven record of accomplishment and success at governing using conservative principles. I am confident he can build a stronger America by reforming health care, improving education, restoring fiscal responsibility, and keeping our nation’s military strong. I look forward to joining Governor Romney as he discusses his ideas to bring change to Washington with Ohians.”

State House Representative Shannon Jones (R-OH):
“Governor Romney is a dedicated leader who understands the needs of everyday Americans. Like many Ohioians, he believes we need to bring conservative change to Washington by reducing government spending, keeping taxes low, and governing with the highest ethical standards. Unlike any other candidate, Governor Romney has laid out a comprehensive strategy to prevent a nuclear Iran. He understands that the best ally for peace is a strong America and he is the best choice to keep us safe from the threat of terrorist sponsored regimes.”

Ambassador Sichan Siv, former U.S. Ambassador to the U.N. Economic and Social Council:
“Unprecedented challenges from abroad and at home are too great to leave to an inexperienced executive. We need someone ready to provide steadfast and innovative leadership. Throughout his career, Governor Romney has proven his ability to take on difficult situations, analyze all variables, and find the right solution. I am excited to work with him.”

California’s oldest and largest Republican volunteer organization, the California Republican Assembly, endorsed Mitt Romney for President on November 11, 2007 with an overwhelming 148-73 vote during the group’s annual convention held in Sacramento. The Board of Directors for the Young Republican Federation of California also voted to endorse the Romney campaign


18 posted on 12/14/2007 5:58:37 AM PST by circumbendibus
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To: Neu Pragmatist
Did Buchanan endorse Romney ? If so , when ?

Not exactly. He wrote a very positive column after the "Faith in America speech" and has made very favorable comments about Romney ever since, especially on "The McLaughlin Group."

19 posted on 12/14/2007 6:04:58 AM PST by circumbendibus
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To: mathluv

I’m of the same opinion as you. He’s just another RINO from the East. Maybe slicker than some.


20 posted on 12/14/2007 6:07:19 AM PST by SnarlinCubBear ("Tolerance becomes a crime when applied to evil." -- Thomas Mann)
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