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U.S. military destroys soldier's Bibles
OneNewsNow.com ^ | 5/5/09 | Fred Jackson

Posted on 05/05/2009 1:59:32 PM PDT by ReformationFan

The U.S. military is confirming that it has destroyed some Bibles belonging to an American soldier serving in Afghanistan.

Reuters News says the Bibles were confiscated and destroyed after Qatar-based Al Jazeer television showed soldiers at a Bible class on a base with a stack of Bibles translated into the local Pashto and Dari languages.

(Excerpt) Read more at onenewsnow.com ...


TOPICS: Culture/Society; Government; News/Current Events
KEYWORDS: afghanistan; bible; bibles; religiousfreedom; religiouspersecution; usmilitary
I wonder if the military is as strict on destroying porn and left-wing political material as it is against God's Word.
1 posted on 05/05/2009 1:59:32 PM PDT by ReformationFan
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To: ReformationFan

Obama’s new military


2 posted on 05/05/2009 2:03:03 PM PDT by pissant (THE Conservative party: www.falconparty.com)
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To: ReformationFan

Answer, yes it is as strict on destroying porn in these zones. All shipments to Iraq, Kuwait and Saudi Arabia is gone through to make sure there is no Playboy or anything. Political material, probably not.

But to destroy Bibles... so was this done under Bush as well? If not, then it makes total sense.


3 posted on 05/05/2009 2:03:33 PM PDT by autumnraine (Freedom's just another word for nothing left to lose- Kris Kristoferrson)
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To: ReformationFan
Surprised?

"Art. 11. As the Government of the United States of America is not, in any sense, founded on the Christian religion; as it has in itself no character of enmity against the laws, religion, or tranquillity, of Mussulmen; and, as the said States never entered into any war, or act of hostility against any Mahometan nation, it is declared by the parties, that no pretext arising from religious opinions, shall ever produce an interruption of the harmony existing between the two countries."

- Authored by American diplomat Joel Barlow in 1796, the treaty was sent to the floor of the Senate, June 7, 1797, where it was read aloud in its entirety and unanimously approved. John Adams, having seen the treaty, signed it and proudly proclaimed it to the Nation.

4 posted on 05/05/2009 2:03:52 PM PDT by MyTwoCopperCoins (I don't have a license to kill; I have a learner's permit.)
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To: ReformationFan

I do not believe it.


5 posted on 05/05/2009 2:05:05 PM PDT by the invisib1e hand (dvfausydhlio;ugyk,;6enk)
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To: MyTwoCopperCoins
it is declared by the parties, that no pretext arising from religious opinions, shall ever produce an interruption of the harmony existing between the two countries."

Looks like one of the parties produced an interruption of the harmony, and it wasn't the US of A.
6 posted on 05/05/2009 2:07:03 PM PDT by aruanan
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To: aruanan

Harmony and Islam never go together.


7 posted on 05/05/2009 2:11:06 PM PDT by MyTwoCopperCoins (I don't have a license to kill; I have a learner's permit.)
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To: MyTwoCopperCoins; the invisib1e hand; aruanan
- Authored by American diplomat Joel Barlow in 1796, the treaty was sent to the floor of the Senate, June 7, 1797, where it was read aloud in its entirety and unanimously approved. John Adams, having seen the treaty, signed it and proudly proclaimed it to the Nation.

Why don't you tell the whole truth behind this "treaty." It was treaty with the muslims terrorists of the day to get our imprisioned sailors home (also with the paying of tribute). A PR ploy. It was promptly rejected and then a few years later we went to war with the muslim terrorists.

8 posted on 05/05/2009 2:16:20 PM PDT by 2banana (My common ground with terrorists - they want to die for islam and we want to kill them)
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To: ReformationFan
Afghanistan is a Muslim country. They have a right to their own laws. There is a well-briefed military rule against prosthelizing religion. There is no purpose in having bibles in the local language other than prosthelizing religion. The soldier was wrong. Leave war-fighting to the soldiers and prosthelizing religion to ministries.
9 posted on 05/05/2009 2:18:41 PM PDT by Ben Mugged ("You cannot legislate the poor into freedom by legislating the wealthy out of freedom".)
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To: ReformationFan

“Reuters News says the Bibles were confiscated and destroyed after Qatar-based Al Jazeer television showed soldiers at a Bible class on a base with a stack of Bibles translated into the local Pashto and Dari languages. The U.S. military forbids its members on active duty — including those based in places like Afghanistan — from trying to convert people to another religion.”

Ok, after reading this article, the title is a little misleading.


10 posted on 05/05/2009 2:18:54 PM PDT by autumnraine (Freedom's just another word for nothing left to lose- Kris Kristoferrson)
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To: MyTwoCopperCoins

Which embassy do we burn first? When do we kill the first believer? Should we put that Chaplain in the “infidel” Fatwa list?

So are we ok to flush Korans down the toilet now? I mean, GTMO is US territory, so using their logic, the USA being a “secular” country, it was ok and legal to do so (even thought the flushing story was debunked). In GTMO we were not allowed to have bibles inside the camp to read during breaks from work...


11 posted on 05/05/2009 2:19:02 PM PDT by Patriot2A (bibles)
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To: the invisib1e hand

Believe it, but don’t think it’s the reason you think it is.

A Christian organization sent Bible’s translated into local languages and it is a long standing policy to not convert any people of a nation it is occupying to any religion.

It’s a valid policy and the military was right to do this in my opinion. The Soldier was wrong to not send them back as he or she probably knew the policy.


12 posted on 05/05/2009 2:20:17 PM PDT by autumnraine (Freedom's just another word for nothing left to lose- Kris Kristoferrson)
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To: Ben Mugged

That’s not the point here. The point is that since when it is ok for a US military CHAPLAIN to destroy the Bible? Try doing that with a Quoran. You will get skinned alive, or at least, your country’s embassies will get burned to the ground.


13 posted on 05/05/2009 2:20:48 PM PDT by Patriot2A (bibles)
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To: Patriot2A

Read the article before having a fit.


14 posted on 05/05/2009 2:20:59 PM PDT by autumnraine (Freedom's just another word for nothing left to lose- Kris Kristoferrson)
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To: autumnraine
Answer, yes it is as strict on destroying porn in these zones.

I'd claim conscientious objector status, as I'd have moral objections to killing on behalf of a godless government.

15 posted on 05/05/2009 2:22:55 PM PDT by Spirochete (Texas is an anagram for Taxes)
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To: autumnraine

Thanks. There’s always more to the story than the title...


16 posted on 05/05/2009 2:23:26 PM PDT by the invisib1e hand (dvfausydhlio;ugyk,;6enk)
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To: autumnraine

I read the article- twice. But if you have not served in the military and been subjected to the double standard of religious practices againg Christianity then you cannot possibly know why I react the way I do. For example, Muslims and Jews are allowed to wear headgear while in uniform in “respect” of their faith(s), but as a Christian, I was forbidden from wearing a chain with a cross. Doing so earned you an uniform violation butt-chew by the Command.


17 posted on 05/05/2009 2:24:07 PM PDT by Patriot2A (bibles)
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To: the invisib1e hand
In English, no problem. These were local language translations, meant to convert Afghanis. Needless to say that is a bit of a sensitive subject for the Afghan government, which is our host in the country. If the local officials and most of the people think we are there to fight islamic extremists and let the people live as they choose themselves, they support our being there. If they thought instead we are there to convert them all to Christianity and destroy Islam, 98% of the country would fight us to the death tomorrow. You don't need to like that for it to be true.
18 posted on 05/05/2009 2:24:33 PM PDT by JasonC
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To: autumnraine
Ok, after reading this article, the title is a little misleading.

Sure is.

The soldier was dead wrong. His job wasn't to win converts to Christianity but to follow the Army's orders.

19 posted on 05/05/2009 2:27:49 PM PDT by highball ("I never should have switched from scotch to martinis." -- the last words of Humphrey Bogart)
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To: 2banana
It was promptly rejected...

Do you have a link to this?

Now be it known, That I John Adams, President of the United States of America, having seen and considered the said Treaty do, by and with the advice consent of the Senate, accept, ratify, and confirm the same, and every clause and article thereof. And to the End that the said Treaty may be observed and performed with good Faith on the part of the United States, I have ordered the premises to be made public; And I do hereby enjoin and require all persons bearing office civil or military within the United States, and all others citizens or inhabitants thereof, faithfully to observe and fulfil the said Treaty and every clause and article thereof.

http://avalon.law.yale.edu/18th_century/bar1796n.asp

20 posted on 05/05/2009 2:31:29 PM PDT by MyTwoCopperCoins (I don't have a license to kill; I have a learner's permit.)
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To: autumnraine

It’s even more misleading then that. What Al-Jazzera did was lie by omission. They reported that a soldier brought the bibles sent to him by HIS HOME CHURCH, but they omitted two very important facts; this soldier was a chaplain, it’s expected that he would have bibles. The other critical omission was that the officer who can be heard bringing up general order 1 was head of the chaplains and he immediately instructed his subordinate not to distribute them, even as gifts, as it would be a violation. The original story was a lie, this is also misleading as they want to make it seem like the military is reacting only now, after the story broke. Liars, all of them.


21 posted on 05/05/2009 2:36:06 PM PDT by messierhunter
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To: MyTwoCopperCoins

2 Historical Context

2.1 Barbary Pirates

At the time of the Treaty and for 300 years prior, the Mediterranean sea lanes were largely controlled by the North African Muslim states of the Barbary Coast ( Tripoli, Algiers, Morocco, and TunisTunis is the capital of Tunisia. Population 674,100 ( 1994). Geography The city is located on the Lake of Tunis, and is connected to the Gulf of Tunis, an arm of the Mediterranean Sea, by a canal terminating at the port of Halq al Wadi. Economy Products i) through piracy. Hostages were either ransomed or sold into slavery. Over time, most countries found it expedient to simply pay a yearly tribute to the sultans in exchange for free passage through the Mediterranean.

Following the Revolution, America was no longer under the protection of the British tribute treaties, resulting in the pirates crippling American commerce in the Mediterranean. Having no significant Navy, the US decided to form tribute treaties with the Barbary states, such as this 1796 Treaty of Tripoli.

2.2 First Barbary War

In March 1801, the pasha of Tripoli demanded more tribute than previously agreed upon. The newly inaugurated U.S. President, Thomas JeffersonThomas Jefferson Other images: (, , ) Order 3rd President Term of Office Monday, March 4, 1801 Thursday, March 3, 1809 Followed John Adams Succeeded by James Madison Date of Birth April 13, 1743 Place of Birth Shadwell, Virginia Date of Death Tuesday, Jul, having long disagreed with the policy of paying tribute, refused the pasha’s demand. On May 10, 1801, the pasha declared war on the United States.

307 Americans captured from the ship Philadelphia were forced to work building Tripoli’s fortifications.

On April 27, 1805, Marines led by William Eaton William Eaton ( 23 February 1764 1 June 1811) was an American Army officer, involved with the First Barbary War. He supported Pasha’s brother to win the battle. Born in Woodstock, Connecticut, joined the Army at an early age and served until April 1783, w stormed the Barbary pirates’ harbor stronghold of Derna, Tripoli. It is in honor of this victory that the phrase “To the Shores of Tripoli” is commemorated on the United States Marine Corps The United States Marine Corps.

On June 4, 1805, under the imminent threat of U.S. action, Tobias Lear negotiated the Treaty of Peace and Amity with the Pasha Yusuf. To the dismay of many Americans, this included a ransom of $60,000 paid for the release of prisoners from the Philadelphia and several American merchant ships.

By 1807, Algiers had gone back to taking American ships and seamen hostage. Distracted by the preludes to the War of 1812, the Americans were unable to respond to the provocations until 1815, with the Second Barbary War, thereby concluding the encompassing Tripolian War (1800-1815).

http://www.economicexpert.com/a/Treaty:of:Tripoli.htm


22 posted on 05/05/2009 2:42:44 PM PDT by 2banana (My common ground with terrorists - they want to die for islam and we want to kill them)
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To: 2banana

Thanks.


23 posted on 05/05/2009 2:44:42 PM PDT by MyTwoCopperCoins (I don't have a license to kill; I have a learner's permit.)
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To: autumnraine
...it is a long standing policy to not convert any people of a nation it is occupying to any religion.

"Neither do men light a candle, and put it under a bushel, but on a candlestick; and it giveth light unto all that are in the house."

24 posted on 05/05/2009 2:44:59 PM PDT by Spirochete (Texas is an anagram for Taxes)
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To: pissant

I suppose they prefer us to drop bombs instead of Bibles... so be it, they chose.


25 posted on 05/05/2009 2:45:29 PM PDT by JudgemAll (control freaks, their world & their problem with my gun and my protecting my private party)
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To: messierhunter
Military chaplains are forbidden from proselytizing...anyone. If they cannot abide by that rule then they should resign their commission.
26 posted on 05/05/2009 3:25:29 PM PDT by starlifter (Sapor Amo Pullus)
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To: Spirochete

“Neither do men light a candle, and put it under a bushel, but on a candlestick; and it giveth light unto all that are in the house.”

That’s well and good, but this is a military operation. I am a Christian, but I draw the line at my COUNTRY converting. How would you feel if they were passing out Korans? With our current President, that’s not too far off the chart of reality.


27 posted on 05/05/2009 4:12:13 PM PDT by autumnraine (Freedom's just another word for nothing left to lose- Kris Kristoferrson)
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To: JasonC; autumnraine; All

In addition to military laws, there is the little problem that for an Afghani Muslim to convert to Christianity is a capital offense. Our job there is not to create potential martyrs that we then have to defend. The job is hard enough as it is. My son was there in 2006.


28 posted on 05/05/2009 4:15:49 PM PDT by gleeaikin
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To: 2banana; MyTwoCopperCoins; All

Additional historical perspective on pirates. Source: To Dare & To Conquer: Special Operations and the Destiny of Nations, from Achilles to Al Qaeda, by Derek Leebaert, 2006.

As early as 1786, Jefferson had proposed a Barbary Fund for the purpose of putting an end to piracy. When we gained independence we lost the protection of Britian against the Barbary pirates. Although Washington and Adams paid tributed “Jefferson was a harder case”. He acted as soon as he became president. Several extremely interesting operations (read the book), some successful and some not were executed. Finally, in 1815, Decatur’s activities encouraged British and Dutch naval forces to end their predations.

It looks as though 200 years has not changed much, we are still in the lead, encouraging Europe to do its part to deal with Muslims and pirates.


29 posted on 05/05/2009 4:31:48 PM PDT by gleeaikin
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To: pissant
This has been going on for some time now. When I left the military in 1992, I worked for military chaplains. They were already politically correct back then. They treated Islam as equals with Christianity and it sickened me. I knew the truth about Islam back then but I couldn't make them listen.

The plurality of the military chaplaincy made me get out.

30 posted on 05/05/2009 5:13:32 PM PDT by pctech
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To: Patriot2A

Check my Post #30. I completely agree with you. The military chaplaincy is not friendly to true christianity anymore.


31 posted on 05/05/2009 5:16:04 PM PDT by pctech
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To: JasonC
These were local language translations, meant to convert Afghanis.

Allowing someone to be informed about a religion is in no way an effort to convert them.

When I was in college I was required to take a world religion class where we read the koran, hindu, and taoist screeds. It was not an attempt to convert me.

32 posted on 05/05/2009 7:19:50 PM PDT by South Hawthorne (In Memory of my Dear Friend Henry Lee II)
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To: autumnraine

While I was in the Army from 1969-1971(Vietnam, 1970-1971, I’m especially glad I’m not in it today, in view of official anti-Christian travesties such as this((this is a case where I’d have to choose to obey God instead of man) ,also because of the approaching approval of sodomites openly serving,women in combat,and the UN’s push to use the US military for its own purposes. Whatever happened to America? The government killed it.


33 posted on 05/05/2009 9:57:19 PM PDT by liberalism is suicide (Communism,fascism-no matter how you slice socialism, its still baloney)
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To: starlifter

Perhaps you didn’t notice, but as I said, the head chaplain instructed the subordinate chaplain NOT to distribute the Bibles. Perhaps you don’t care about the truth, but NO proselytizing occured... PERIOD.


34 posted on 05/06/2009 7:17:24 AM PDT by messierhunter
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To: messierhunter
Good.
35 posted on 05/06/2009 7:30:15 AM PDT by starlifter (Sapor Amo Pullus)
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