Posted on 09/28/2009 8:12:21 AM PDT by GodGunsGuts
Sept 27, 2009 — What would Darwin do? Just in time for the 150th anniversary of The Origin of Species, his magnum opus has been reprinted with an introduction not by a scientist or historian, but by a Christian evangelist. He and a Christian movie actor are trying to get their special edition to students at major universities. Talk about brashness. Darwin’s defenders are stepping on themselves to condemn this – well, blasphemy...
(Excerpt) Read more at creationsafaris.com ...
Peer reviewed Scientific PROOF?
Two whole genome duplications means that vertebrates were the result of a smaller genome that was duplicated twice. In other words, vertebrates weren’t fully formed and fully functional all at once, or over a period of six days.
That is about as specific as asking 'how long is a piece of string?' and expecting a precise answer. They were one day long (one complete light/dark cycle). Since the Hebrews didn't even have a word for an hour, minute or second, or any means of measuring it, implying that it had any relevance is asinine.
Because God is omnipotent He has the ability to manipulate time as you perceive it. He has revealed to us his ability and willingness to do in Joshua 10:13 where the sun stood still and the moon stopped, and in 2 Kings 20:9-11 where time ran backwards for Hezekiah. God is not bound or constrained by time as you perceive and measure it. Do not forget that both Psalms 90:4 and 2 Peter 3:8 tell us that for God a 1000 years is like a day and a day like 1000 years.
Did you or any scientist you know of witness these genome duplications taking place?
No. Did you see me typing in my response to you?
Creationism: Where there is a Creator that has made in his own image man, where man creates from what God has lent them; cures for the survival of the weak so they too can contribute to mankind.
What to choose, what to choose…
I see you’re back to editing the article titles for bait value.
Know, I did not. But I have watched how real time responses get generated on Free Republic thousands of times. How many times have whole genome duplications been observed in real time?
No, you asserted that yom always means a "normal" 24 hour day, and further asserted that it was the only interpretation acceptable with respect to Genesis I. However, you have never addressed my original contention that there is a sufficient lack of specificity in both the Hebrew language and the wording of Genesis to permit a devout Christian any other interpretation than your own.
Please quote where I said that yom always means a normal 24 hour day.
The evidence is strong that I typed it in, just as the evidence is strong that the vertebrate genome underwent two whole genome duplications, based on work done in the past four years.
Are you saying that scientists have watched whole genome duplications occur thousands of times in real time? Or are you merely assuming that genome redundancy = evolution?
God created the Universe and everything in it fully formed and fully functional over the course of six normal length Earth days.
What is this strong evidence. Have scientists been able to observe these whole genome duplications, or are they just assuming what must be proved?
Creationism has no scientific basis.
That’s the point of GGG’s posts. That’s also why the posts aren’t scientific.
If it were up to creationists, no one could manufacture a toaster.
In your post #22 you said: "There is no getting around it, the Bible describes each day of creation as a normal length Earth day." All I am asking is that you substantiate this.
As one of the most important sources of novel gene functions, gene duplications play a major role in evolutionary change. Though a gene copy will generally become inactive after duplication, it can be saved—either by acquiring a new function or dividing aspects of the original gene's function—on its way to becoming ubiquitous, or “fixed,” within the population.
The notion of “evolution by gene duplication” was proposed in 1970 by Susumu Ohno, who argued that gene and whole genome duplication provided the raw material for evolutionary innovations such as subcellular compartments, fins, and jaws. Having “extra” copies of genes provides the opportunity for duplicate genes to escape the constraints of purifying selection, and allows the genes to diverge and acquire novel functions. Ohno also proposed that two rounds of whole genome duplication occurred at some point in early vertebrate evolution—a possibility that could explain the relatively large size and complexity of the vertebrate genome.
Investigators equipped with far more powerful genome-mining tools than were available to Ohno have long sought evidence of this hypothesis (known as the 2R hypothesis, for “two rounds” of whole genome duplication), but with conflicting results. The observation that some gene families have four members in vertebrates but just one in invertebrates (the 4:1 rule) appeared to support the 2R hypothesis, until it was discovered that less than 5% of homologous gene families (similar genes with shared ancestry) followed the rule. But even when gene families do follow the rule, their configuration could just as likely arise from two rounds of single gene duplication as from whole genome duplication. And because duplicate genes are far more likely to degrade than to assume new or shared functions, the signal of whole genome duplication disappears.
Recent studies have shown that the global pattern of the physical location of homologous genes provides evidence of ancient whole genome duplications in yeast and plants, even when most of the duplicates have degraded. Now Paramvir Dehal and Jeffrey Boore have taken this approach to test the 2R hypothesis, by comparing the recently completed genome sequence of the invertebrate sea squirt with the genomes of three vertebrates—pufferfish, mouse, and human. (Because the sea squirt is a close relative of vertebrates, its genome can help reconstruct a more accurate tree of the organisms' evolutionary relationships than a more distant relative like the fruitfly could.)
After generating gene clusters that each contained “all, and only, those genes that descended from a single gene in their common ancestor,” the authors used a method to infer the evolutionary relationships of the genes in each cluster. They could then compare these gene trees to the known evolutionary relationships of the organisms to determine when each gene duplicated in relation to when the lineages diverged. From this analysis, Dehal and Boore identified over 3,500 gene duplications present in multiple vertebrates, indicating they had occurred at the base of the vertebrate tree, dating back some 450 million years. But did these early duplication events arise from some large-scale duplication event, or were they simply the result of a great number of smaller scale duplications?
To explore this question, the authors analyzed the relative positions of the resulting paralogs in the vertebrate genome with the highest-quality data—the human genome. When considering only this subset of 3,500-plus early vertebrate duplications, they found a global pattern of human genome segments with similar arrangements of paralogous genes and multiple chromosomes with long linear stretches of interdigitated sets of paralogous genes—evidence that the duplications occurred in large segments. Even stronger support for the 2R hypothesis comes from the observation that the colinear arrangement of these genes is predominantly in a 4-fold pattern; this repetitive pattern is seen across almost all the human chromosomes. It's unlikely, the authors argue, that any combination of smaller, independent duplication events could have generated the same pattern.
Now that strong evidence for Ohno's hypothesis exists, researchers can investigate both the mechanism of genome duplication events and their possible effects on vertebrate evolution. It seems likely that a whole genome duplication would provide combinatorial possibilities that could permit a greater leap in evolution than could single gene duplications, even if the single gene duplications affected the complete set of genes. Studies that examine the function of these paralogous genes can explore whether these large-scale genomic events helped drive organismal complexity and diversification within the vertebrate lineage. —Liza Gross
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