Posted on 11/21/2009 7:26:17 PM PST by jveritas
Today healthcare vote in the Senate was so badly represented by many on our side and of course by the media and was blown way out of proportion. In reality it is a meaningless vote. The vote today was only to start the debate and it is absolutely does not guarantee at all that the current bill in the Senate with it current version of public option aka socialized medicine is going to pass. In fact as it stands now this current bill is assured to be defeated because the socialists are not going to get 60 votes for cloture to end the debate and hence they cannot move the bill for a final vote. In other words the bill in its current form is dead.
Senator Lieberman has said so many times, very clearly, and very adamantly that he is going to filibuster an end for the debate as long as it has any form of public option and he also said many times that he was going to vote to allow the start of the debate as he did today. That is why Senator Lieberman has been for weeks the most hated person among the left wing lunatics. Many people misunderstood and misinterpreted what he has been saying and thought that Lieberman did not follow through on what he said he was going to do.
Senator Olympia Snowe has said that she is going to filibuster an end to the debate on this current healthcare bill if it contains the current form of public option. She wants a trigger public option which in practical political terms a meaningless thing that will never be triggered. In fact today she even voted against the start of the debate.
Now some will say that if the socialists do not get 60 votes to end the debate and move the bill for a final vote then they are going to use reconciliation or the so called “nuclear option”. This is very unlikely because for the use of reconciliation the bill has to go back to the budget committee or finance committee where it is going to be watered down significantly and just includes the insignificant trigger public option or a trigger co-op. Even very left wing Senators like Tom Harkin said that reconciliation will be a very bad thing to do.
What is the most likely scenario?
Most probably they are going to be able to pass a healthcare bill that contains a trigger public option or a trigger co-op which in all practical form is a meaningless gesture because it is not going to be triggered at all in the future. This is the bill that will go to Obama to sign it into law, the democrat politicians and their media will celebrate but their left wing lunatic base will go insane in a way that will shock many. The left wing lunatic base wants a strong public option (aka socialized medicine) as a minimum and is very much against a trigger public option or a trigger co-op because they know very well that the trigger means absolutely nothing and when this happens the left wing lunatic base is going to explode in total anger against the democrat party.
Rubbish!
The bill hasn’t passed yet. The sleeping giant is wide awake. The sky isn’t falling.
My understanding is that only 3 bills in history have failed after this phase.
I think Reid can (if he wants) to pass this with 50 votes (plus Biden, if tie).
“The Democratic coalition is already fracturing as a result.”
Sounds nice, but how it is fracturing? All dems voted for it.
Some of you folks have yet to figured out you live in a dictatorship where your representatives in government represent nothing but themselves and other insiders.
Throw in millions of government sponsored illegal aliens, and even your electoral process has been compromised and undermined.
Data please. Back up your claims with data.
Excellent post.
“LOL...you really have an insane conspiracy mind.”
Thanks! I’ve worked on it for years - usually am right however. Most “famous” preditiction involved being allowed to only fish in a 4 sq. mile area with fishcops on the boarders, strong currents and no fish. Came true.
“Rubbish!”
Let’s hope...
“The bill hasn’t passed yet. The sleeping giant is wide awake. The sky isn’t falling.”
That’s what B.OReily said about HR3200... the sky fell anyway.
I hope you are right.
I am sorry you are not correct on that. Whether or not they can be recalled is a power reserved to each state, just as the times, places and manners (rules) for electing senators and representatives is.
With all due respect. This vote was an opening. Once you give a quarter to marxists they will eat you alive. We are being played for fools by the leftist cabal that runs washington. They will pass this, they have too much invested and they know that even if they lose in 2010 the reapportionment after the 2012 census will give them permanent power once they discover millions on uncounted people all in blue states. That will also give them the electoral college permanently as well. Elections will be a mere formality because they will win every single one from now until doomsday...
Still believe that Mc Cain will win the election don’t you?
Common sense says if the Democrats can get the 60 votes to begin debate, they can also get the votes to pass it when they are ready. They also can get enough votes to stop a fillibuster.
What difference does it make if they are 'recalled', but still attend Congress and have their votes counted. If you think a Congressman can be recalled name one who has been.
Whether or not it’s difficult to do isn’t the issue I was responding to you on.
You stated it is unconstitutional and not possible to recall congressman. Whether or not it’s been done means nothing. If a state has laws set up to provide for recalls, then they have a process in place for recalling their congresspeople. How tough it is to do, whether it’s been done before or not, isn’t the point. The point is you were wrong in your rebuke of my statement. If you wanted to be clearer and make the point that it’s not worth it to try because it’s too hard to do, that’s a different argument.
In fact it is possible and there is nothing in the constitution that says they cannot be recalled. Therefore just as the states set how their electors are chosen, the states under the 10th amendment are able to decide and set up their own laws as to if and how to recall their congresspeople.
Whatever the states do will be a legal nullity, since the Federal government will ignore it.
Possibly, but it won’t be ignored without a legal fight.
And again, that’s not what you originally said. This doesn’t justify your initial remark to me.
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