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Did Communism Fake Its Own Death in 1991?
American Thinker ^ | January 16, 2010 | Jason McNew

Posted on 01/15/2010 10:36:18 PM PST by neverdem

In a bizarre 1984 book, ex-KGB Major Anatoliy Golitsyn predicted the liberalization of the Soviet Bloc and claimed that it would be a strategic deception. Let's examine the facts.

In his spy book Wedge, Mark Riebling claims that "of Golitsyn's falsifiable predictions, 139 out of 148 were fulfilled by the end of 1993 -- an accuracy rate of 94 percent" [1]. Riebling's statistic, compiled from Golitsyn's 1984 book New Lies for Old, has been used in several other books and articles (including here at AT) since Wedge was first published in 1994.

New Lies for Old is not light reading, and all of Golitsyn's predictions appear in the last two chapters, some 327 pages in. Golitsyn began drafting the manuscript in 1968 [3], completed it in 1980 [9], cleared the CIA in 1982 [2], and then finalized and published it in 1984 with seven additional pages [10].

Golitsyn published his second book, The Perestroika Deception, after the Soviet Union was dissolved in 1991. This book contained further analysis of the liberalization, in addition to previously classified memoranda submitted by Golitsyn to the CIA. The two books must be read together to get a complete picture of Golitsyn's thesis.

Despite taking 22 years to write and publish New Lies for Old, Golitsyn nonetheless asserted that "the substance of the argument has changed little since 1968" [4]. Put simply, Golitsyn's argument was that beginning in about 1960, the Soviet Union embarked on a strategy of massive long-range strategic deception which would span several decades and result in the destruction of Western capitalism and the erection of a communist world government. Throughout his works, he refers to this future event as "convergence" [5]. On page 339 appears a series of Goltisyn's predictions:

The "liberalization" would be spectacular and impressive.  Formal pronouncements might be made about a reduction in the communist party's role:  its monopoly would be apparently curtailed.  An ostensible separation of powers between the legislative, the executive, and the judiciary might be introduced.  The Supreme Soviet would be given greater apparent power, and the president of the Soviet Union and the first secretary of the party might well be separated.  The KGB would be "reformed."  Dissidents at home would be amnestied; those in exile abroad would be allowed to return, and some would take up positions of leadership in government.


Sakharov might be included in some capacity in the government or allowed to teach aboard.  The creative arts and cultural and scientific organizations, such as the writers' unions and Academy of Sciences, would become apparently more independent, as would the trade unions.  Political clubs would be opened to nonmembers of the communist party.  Leading dissidents might form one or more alternative political parties

There would be greater freedom for Soviet citizens to travel.  Western and Unitized Nations observers would be invited to the Soviet Union to witness the reforms in action.

Golitsyn concluded that "the deceptive liberalization will be accepted as genuine and spontaneous and will be blown up out of all proportion by the media" [11].

These fifteen predictions are from just one page and most foretelling of events then ten years away. I chose to cite this particular page because many of the readers here at AT would be able to readily identify these claims empirically as true or not true. Of particular note are Golitsyn's predictions of separate legislative, executive, and judicial powers -- Americans would naturally embrace such a move by the Soviets wholeheartedly (and without asking questions). Making such claims about the Soviet Union in 1980 was no less absurd than would be making similar claims about North Korea today.

Foretelling the rise of Mikhail Gorbachev, Golitsyn wrote:

One cannot exclude that at the next party congress or earlier, Andropov will be replaced by a younger leader with a more liberal image who will continue the so called "liberalization" more intensively [6].

In a July 1984 memo to the CIA, Golitsyn writes: 

The Soviet strategists may replace the old leader, Konstantin Chernenko, who is actually only a figurehead, with a younger Soviet leader who was chosen some time ago as his successor -- namely, Comrade Gorbachev. One of Gorbachev's primary tasks will be to carry out the so-called liberalization [12].

Comrade Gorbachev took office as leader of the Soviet Union the following year.

Golitsyn also gave clues on the eventual replacement of Boris Yeltsin, describing the Chechnyan crisis "not as a likely cause of a military coup, but as a possible planned prelude to a change of government" [13]. Yeltsin resigned unexpectedly on New Year's Eve in 1999, installing then-Prime Minister Vladimir Putin to the Russian presidency. Putin was elected just months later, riding a wave of Russian nationalist sentiment stemming from renewed hostilities in Chechnya.

Critics will rightfully point out that the timeframes in Golitsyn's books are wrong -- he postulated the emergence of a radical left U.S. government around 1992 and "convergence" by about 2000 [14], and he states throughout his works that NATO would be dissolved, causing U.S. forces to leave Europe. He also predicted a military alliance between the U.S. and China [7]. Taken as a complete work, however, Golitsyn got most of it right.

So how did Golitsyn do it? He explains it this way:

The assessment has been based partly on secret information available only to an insider; partly on an intimate understanding of how the communist strategist thinks and acts; partly on knowledge of political readjustments, the use of strategic disinformation, and the extent of KGB penetrations of, and influence on, Western governments; and partly on research and analysis, using the new methodology, of open records of Soviet and communist developments over the last 20 years [8].

There is other evidence that corroborates Golitsyn's thesis. In his 1982 book We Will Bury You, Czech defector Jan Sejna also claimed the Berlin Wall would be torn down and the Warsaw Pact dissolved for reasons of deception [15]. Additionally, there are the 1992 and 2005 Mitrokhin Archives. More recently, weird 25-year-old videos of another KGB defector detailing a decades-long process of purposeful U.S. demoralization by Soviet intelligence services have appeared on You Tube.

Jeff Nyquist, an independent writer and the author of the worst-selling book Origins of the Fourth World War, seems to be the only Western journalist who not only noticed but paid much attention to Golitsyn. Nyquist has written hundreds of articles discussing both Golitsyn's thesis and the slow moral and economic decay of America. Nyquist and Golitsyn both dedicated books to J.J. Angleton, who in 1954 founded the CIA's counterintelligence division.

The present moral and economic bankruptcy emanating from Washington, D.C. and plaguing America portends something far more dangerous than the unintended consequences of electing so many ideological flunkies with bad educations and misguided ideals. The purpose of warfare is not to kill and maim your enemy; it is his social, economic, political, and religious reorientation. Somewhere Sun Tzu is smiling, and it isn't at America.

Jason McNew is a 36-year-old IT professional. He can be contacted at jasond@mcnew.org.


TOPICS: Editorial; Foreign Affairs; Front Page News; Politics/Elections; Russia
KEYWORDS: coldwar2; communism; convergence; golitsyn; jrnyquist; putin; russia; sovietunion
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1 posted on 01/15/2010 10:36:19 PM PST by neverdem
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To: neverdem

Article deserves a Yuri Bezmenov bump.


2 posted on 01/15/2010 10:40:24 PM PST by SpaceBar
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To: neverdem

Gee, the bullet holes in Nicolae Ceausescu’s head looked pretty real...


3 posted on 01/15/2010 10:42:02 PM PST by PGR88
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To: neverdem
Yep.
4 posted on 01/15/2010 10:45:16 PM PST by Carry_Okie (The Democrats were the Slave Party then; they are the Slave Party now.)
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To: neverdem

The short answer is YES !!!


5 posted on 01/15/2010 10:45:38 PM PST by ColdSteelTalon (Light is fading to shadow, and casting its shroud over all we have known...)
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To: PGR88

And the evil bastard in our White House looks pretty real...


6 posted on 01/15/2010 10:47:08 PM PST by unkus
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To: neverdem

OK. Who’s the conspiracy theory infiltrator posting this stuff on FR?????? This article is designed to draw out the kooks who believe in this stuff. I just know it. Really.


7 posted on 01/15/2010 10:49:06 PM PST by petitfour (Are you a Dead Fish American?)
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To: neverdem

Limbaugh warned us from the beginning that Communism wasn’t DEAD... it just moved to USA and Hid in the ENVIRONMENTAL MOVEMENT.


8 posted on 01/15/2010 10:49:27 PM PST by gwilhelm56 (OBAMA ... Orwell's 1984 was a WARNING ... NOT a TEXTBOOK!!!)
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To: neverdem

completely ridiculous.

Russia and China are now capitalist in their fashion.

The communists became journalists, environmentalists and Democrats and took over the USA. Now we’re attempting a counterrevolution. It’s all quite obvious.


9 posted on 01/15/2010 10:50:42 PM PST by devere
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To: neverdem

Couldn’t get us the old way...had to try another. Looks like the new way is working.


10 posted on 01/15/2010 10:50:58 PM PST by Dallas59 (No To O -Time is going by really really really really slow.)
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To: neverdem
You can never kill Communism.

The left still believes there is a Utopian government and resulting society and as long as they believe this bulltripe they will continue to promote various versions of communism by whatever name they find compelling.

11 posted on 01/15/2010 10:51:03 PM PST by Cold Heat
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To: neverdem

Golitsyn bump!


12 posted on 01/15/2010 10:52:48 PM PST by happinesswithoutpeace (Nobody move, Nobody get hurt)
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To: neverdem; Thunder90

Ping for the list, Thunder90...

Answer to the question in the article title: YES, definitely!

Bookmarking for a later, more thorough read of the article and links though...


13 posted on 01/15/2010 10:53:30 PM PST by LibertyRocks (Anti-Obama Gear: http://cafepress.com/NO_ObamaBiden08)
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To: neverdem

Lord Monckton says a good friend of his was a co-founder of Greenpeace. When The Wall came down, Commies from the East flooded Western Europe and took over all kinds of organizations. They took over Greenpeace and forced out all the non-Commies.


14 posted on 01/15/2010 10:55:03 PM PST by Arthur McGowan (In Edward Kennedy's America, federal funding of brothels is a right, not a privilege.)
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To: devere
Russia and China are now capitalist in their fashion

If you are a ranking party member or a relative, that is.

Capitalism is a great way to rake in money, but the totalitarian government is still alive and well, just hiding behind a better suit.

15 posted on 01/15/2010 10:55:22 PM PST by Smokin' Joe (How often God must weep at humans' folly. Stand fast. God knows what He is doing.)
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To: devere

What is it you find ridiculous? Or, were you being sarcastic?

NOTE: I have to come back to this later, so it may be a bit before I respond. I just saw your post though and was curious if you were serious.


16 posted on 01/15/2010 10:59:33 PM PST by LibertyRocks (Anti-Obama Gear: http://cafepress.com/NO_ObamaBiden08)
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To: gwilhelm56
There are some posts here that think the notion of communism simpling setting up shop elsewhere is ridiculous, but that's exactly what it does. Russia wasn't the seat of communism, it was simply one of its victims. The ideology is alive and well in thousands of hatcheries known as liberal arts departments across the United States and in other places it finds fertile ground. It lives in a country not, but in misguided minds.
17 posted on 01/15/2010 11:00:27 PM PST by SpaceBar
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To: PGR88

Walls fell, leaders were disposed of, flags changed, people cheered and the West declared victory, but the “paradigm” in the heads of millions in the former Soviet Republics and Eastern Europe persists.


18 posted on 01/15/2010 11:03:48 PM PST by Red6
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To: SpaceBar

This is true. Communist front groups sponsor just about every major community agitator and fund groups like code pink and the ACLU.


19 posted on 01/15/2010 11:08:29 PM PST by miliantnutcase
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To: miliantnutcase; All

The NWO is coming to life right before our eyes....and it’s Marxist and all that was planned that way long ago.


20 posted on 01/15/2010 11:10:58 PM PST by Halgr (Once a Marine, always a Marine - Semper Fi)
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To: neverdem
...the destruction of Western capitalism and the erection of a communist world government.

Obambi and the Neocommies are suffering from major erectile dysfunction.

21 posted on 01/15/2010 11:11:49 PM PST by rfp1234
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To: rfp1234

I wouldn’t say that, they’ve been raping us pretty good.


22 posted on 01/15/2010 11:13:36 PM PST by fieldmarshaldj (~"This is what happens when you find a stranger in the Alps !"~~)
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To: SpaceBar

yes.


23 posted on 01/15/2010 11:14:06 PM PST by genetic homophobe (They hate Sarah because she lovingly carries a failed abortion on her hip.)
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To: genetic homophobe

BFL


24 posted on 01/15/2010 11:19:29 PM PST by Wingy (Don't blame me. I voted for the chick. I hope to do so again.)
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To: fieldmarshaldj; neverdem; LibertyRocks; stephenjohnbanker; potlatch; devolve; ntnychik; FARS

25 posted on 01/15/2010 11:24:35 PM PST by PhilDragoo (Hussein: Islamo-Commie from Kenya)
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To: neverdem

Like the Trojan War the Communists retreated leaving a horse. That horse is called the university.


26 posted on 01/15/2010 11:24:41 PM PST by Blind Eye Jones
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To: Smokin' Joe

And if tomorrow the Chinese Politburo decided to end its flirtation with a limitied free market system because it wasn’t beneficial to the State, it would be abolished with lightning fast swiftness and brutality. And that would be the end of that.


27 posted on 01/15/2010 11:25:44 PM PST by SpaceBar
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To: neverdem

A little truth seeps in.

What’s happening to us is clearly the rotten fruit of decades of communist subversion.

And Americans march on, into oblivion, none the wiser. Well, almost none.

THANK YOU for posting this.

More, please.

We need to wake people up.

Obamacare is not about health care, and Cap ‘n Trade has absolutely NOTHING to do with the environment.


28 posted on 01/15/2010 11:26:22 PM PST by Boucheau
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To: neverdem

save


29 posted on 01/15/2010 11:30:59 PM PST by Eagles6 ( Typical White Guy: Christian, Constitutionalist, Heterosexual, Redneck.)
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To: SpaceBar

Exactly. The best thing that could happen for the communists was for Communism to be declared “dead”. Then they could not only proceed unhindered, but attack anyone who called them on it as ‘fringe elements’, whackos, or ‘conspiracy theorists’. Any of that sound familliar?


30 posted on 01/15/2010 11:31:56 PM PST by Smokin' Joe (How often God must weep at humans' folly. Stand fast. God knows what He is doing.)
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To: PhilDragoo

That doesn’t look like Downtown Nairobi to me.


31 posted on 01/15/2010 11:39:33 PM PST by fieldmarshaldj (~"This is what happens when you find a stranger in the Alps !"~~)
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To: neverdem

later


32 posted on 01/15/2010 11:46:24 PM PST by nina0113
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To: Smokin' Joe
The remarkable part is the complete transformation of the democrat party into the true Communist Party of America, although some other group officially holds that title to deflect suspicion away from the true standard bearers. While Europe openly recognizes their communists, ours hide like cockroaches behind the "D" label and vehemently deny their true affiliations when confronted.
33 posted on 01/15/2010 11:51:24 PM PST by SpaceBar
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To: neverdem

bump to find in the AM.


34 posted on 01/15/2010 11:52:11 PM PST by Sal (NO HEALTH CONTROL!)
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To: neverdem
Nope, it actually died. Stone cold dead. Misinformation ahead of time just tried to make their impending collapse a little less embarrassing. The folks who couldn't make a decent pair of shoes couldn't scheme their way to world power either. It is a fantasy.
35 posted on 01/15/2010 11:59:18 PM PST by JasonC
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To: neverdem

Yes, and no.

Don’t know how much if any of this was actually ‘planned’ by the Russkies. Just more kind of worked out this way, IMO.

The Iron Curtain came down. Communism just wasn’t as ‘scary’ to the West anymore. Some western reforms worked their way in, and some socialist ideals spilled out along with immigrants from the old Soviet Bloc. Some Russians got impatient with market reforms. That seemed to trigger a reactionary backlash that opened the door for Putin.

Russian Bolshevism is dead, though. No pretense of social justice left. Marx is rotting in his grave. At this point, Russia is really more fascist if even that. Hard to discern any utopian rhetoric coming out of Putin. More just plain despotic and authoritarian.

Here in the West, we have some bizarre ‘3rd way’ going on. Anti-nationalist. Odd mixture of utopian internationalist zeal crossbred with the worst elements of socialism and capitalism. Really I think it’s just a dog-and-pony show to keep the masses from rioting while the elites try their hand at reverse class warfare.

The reality of what we have going on isn’t all that different from Russia, really. Consent of the governed? Moral authority? Dead. Artifacts of the previous millenium.

We’re all Banana Republicans now.


36 posted on 01/16/2010 12:05:43 AM PST by CowboyJay (RiNO - It's 'what's for dinner'...)
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To: neverdem

Maskirovka is alive and well...

Add this to the current ideology of aggression (islam), and lead becomes the investment metal of choice.

ruefully


37 posted on 01/16/2010 12:11:39 AM PST by petro45acp (Free Republic, the only thing working on this sorry Bagram interweb thingy! Thanks Free Republic!)
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To: Blind Eye Jones
"That horse is called the university."

Who is the old Wellesley professor who bragged that Hillary Rodham came in a Goldwater Republican and left an Alinsky Commie?

yitbos

38 posted on 01/16/2010 12:12:46 AM PST by bruinbirdman ("Those who control language control minds.")
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To: SpaceBar
That was the decption of the New Left in the '60s and '70s, when they hid behind the 'radicals' of the SDS and Weather Underground, trying to appear harmless by comparison and seeming in contrast to be far closer to harmless normalcy. When conservatives pointed out the threat then and subsequently, they were branded as 'extremists', and not even used by the more 'moderate' right to balance the equation, but chucked under the bus. People who have steadfastly claimed that there should be no 'special rights' for any group have been branded as "racists", who did not agree with military aid except to stop Communism as "war mongers", or in some cases smeared otherwise because of their lack of support for military intervention or aid to specific countries. In the meantime, the New Left used their lever, partly from the War on Poverty, partly from Liberal White Guilt, and pushed the direction of American Politics and the sense of what was just farther from the Constitutional ideals, away from equal protection for all citizens under the law, and still use it, now to promote the idea of Amnesty for illegal aliens.

Add in the crippling of the American Psyche by wussifying the population through intense social campaigns, and the destruction of American Industry through a combination of crippling taxation and demands, both environmental and otherwise, and the flow of wealth has been out of this country into communist countries and their sympathizers, while at home we do not develop the carreer oriented persons who would have carried the next industrial generation forward. There is a brain drain by default; there is no compelling reason to learn the skills needed to operate a mine or prospect for minerals, because it is incredibly difficult to develop any resources you find. As such, we become increasingly dependent on trade ties which bleed us to the benefit of those who harbor very different idealogies.

At least the Democrats of my youth still could be credibly believed to love America, even if they differed in how they thought our problems should be handled. Not so any more.

39 posted on 01/16/2010 12:18:41 AM PST by Smokin' Joe (How often God must weep at humans' folly. Stand fast. God knows what He is doing.)
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To: SpaceBar
"The remarkable part is the complete transformation of the democrat party into the true Communist Party of America,"

It is now to a point where the Democrats don't shrink from the socialist label.

Republicans fear to use the socialist label because the Democrat Socialists will respond, "What do you think Medicare is?" "What do you think Bush's prescription medicine bill was?"

yitbos

40 posted on 01/16/2010 12:21:49 AM PST by bruinbirdman ("Those who control language control minds.")
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To: bruinbirdman

You got me. But I believe it`s true.


41 posted on 01/16/2010 12:40:08 AM PST by Blind Eye Jones
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To: neverdem
No, to understand what happened one needs to watch the youtubes of Yuri Bezmenov and the Soviet ideas of ideological subversion. They knew they could destroy our society using this technique. In short, one contaminated mind, contaminated the next and once these contaminated (with leftist ideas) minds took control of academia, civics, etc. it would be game over.

It has pretty much played out exactly as that.

42 posted on 01/16/2010 12:45:45 AM PST by riri (Resistance-It's the New Black)
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To: bruinbirdman

I would love to see the question about the ‘fall’ of Communism in 1991 asked of GHW Bush & BJ Clinton or anyone in their administrations. ‘Comrade J’ is a great book about KGB spying and their useful tools in NA:
‘From 1995 until 2000, a man known as “Comrade J” directed all Russian spy action in New York and oversaw all covert operations against the U.S. and its allies.....Sergei Tretyakov, Comrade J says, “In speaking out, I hope to expose how naive this is (thinking the USSR had changed). During the Cold War, in the Soviet military doctrine there was the definition of the MAIN ENEMY, which was also used by intelligence as a basic guiding principle. It was the United States, followed by NATO and China. What is the official guiding line for the modern SVR today? The terms have changed. It is now called the MAIN TARGET. But it is exactly the same: the United States, followed by NATO and China. Nothing has changed. Russia is doing everything it can today to embarrass the U.S. Let me repeat this. Russia is doing everything it can today to undermine and embarrass the U.S. The SVR rezidenturas in the U.S. are not less, but in some aspects EVEN MORE ACTIVE
today than during the Cold War. What should that tell you
continues to spy and undermine the U.S.”
http://www.npr.org/templates/story/story.php?storyId=18476273


43 posted on 01/16/2010 12:55:26 AM PST by iopscusa (El Vaquero. (SC Lowcountry Cowboy))
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To: Smokin' Joe

If communism died then the Communist tyrants of the iron curtain should have been put on trial for their crimes just as the Nazis were after the Third Reich died. Communism is still alive,it just underwent a makeover.


44 posted on 01/16/2010 12:55:50 AM PST by liberalism is suicide (Communism,fascism-no matter how you slice socialism, its still baloney)
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To: wardaddy; Joe Brower; Cannoneer No. 4; Criminal Number 18F; Dan from Michigan; Eaker; Jeff Head; ...
A Critical Perspective on Climategate: Atmospheric scientist John Christy on the East Anglia e-mails

Victor Davis Hanson: Our Sorta, Kinda War on Terror - President Obama has not signed up for a serious effort against radical Islam.

Voting Democrat Causes Cancer satire

NRA backs Willows student expelled for carrying gun in truck

The last source can only be linked. A 17 year student hunts for food, waterfowl, so he's a threat to himself and others, when the law says he's OK. This might get to SCOTUS for unreasonable search, IMHO.

Some noteworthy articles about politics, foreign or military affairs, IMHO, FReepmail me if you want on or off my list.

45 posted on 01/16/2010 1:07:46 AM PST by neverdem (Xin loi minh oi)
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To: neverdem

Soviet Communism died. The desire by the control freak class to use government powers to dictate how others will live their lives “for their own good” did not. That lust for power exists and will exist as long as man exists.


46 posted on 01/16/2010 2:26:56 AM PST by Cheburashka (It's a _happy_ Russian novel. Everybody still dies, but everybody dies happy.)
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To: neverdem

I do not think the Soviets faked the death of the Soviet Union, or the political castration of the Communist Party in Russia and the Soviet Union.

On the other hand, their moles and fellow travelers and groveling “socialist” appeasers in western Europe and the U.S. suffered no such loss of assets, position, networking ability, ideological fervor, hatred of U.S. capitalism, desire to castrate U.S. global power and influence, willingness to lie about everything, and desire to work together for a Marxist end, in spite of the demise of the Soviet state.


47 posted on 01/16/2010 2:45:35 AM PST by Wuli
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To: neverdem

Well ........... then try this:

http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/bloggers/2122714/posts

What kind of father only meets his own son once in 30 years, at an airport?

Even this simple fact seems to have been nearly non-reported.

and then ...

If you were raised for 8 years, from the age of 10 to 18, by a card carrying bi-sexual radical AA Communist from Chicago with a 601 page FBI file, what kind of Community Organizer would you be?

One who prefers “Marxist professors”, so that you wouldn’t be a “sell-out”???

Is it any wonder no college records have been released, or ever will be?

HIs first pol, to whom he was “chief of staff”, flew often to Moscow for the Communist Party Congress and came back praising the Soviet Union. He didn’t quit and he didn’t protest.

When he cheated her by getting her kicked off the re-election ballot (using legalistic tricks, just like he does now), SHE never protested, nor would accept any interviews.

Can you say “Party Discipline???

I mean, his mother met his “father’ while studying Russian for God’s sakes -— in 1959!!!

Have you never read in a history book that the Russians look for future agents in Russian Language classes? Of course! Where else to look?

Please read this, and tell everyone:

http://www.scribd.com/doc/13267412/The-Kenyan-Candidate-Obama-SetUp-Known-in-Moscow-in-1991-the-First-Time-I-Heard-of-Barack

Then ask yourself, and everyone around you:

Why do the President’s two daughters both have Russian names???

Ever met any African-American who has two children, both with Russian names???

Ever met ANYONE who has two children, both with Russian names???

I haven’t.

Mmmm mmmmm mmmmmm.

http://canadafreepress.com/index.php/article/15127

While back in Hawaii by late June of 1980, we went back to Honolulu for liberty. I don’t remember the exact address, or the exact business, but one August night, early August 1980, I stopped at a small shop that was either on Kalakaua Blvd or the street just north of it, one block north. I struck up a conversation with a young man, Mulatto, about 18, all teeth, smiling, skinny, short hair that I remember, at least short for the year we lived in.
He told me he lived in Hawaii. Not too many black Americans lived in Hawaii at all, now or then, so he being there was an oddity. I asked if he was in the service and he said no. I told him that I was a Marine and had recently gotten back from float. We spoke of world travel at this time and I told him the places we went to.
What strikes me most is what he said as to where he grew up: Indonesia. He told me he wanted to be President of the US someday. I remember lightly smiling and commenting that maybe by the time he gets to be 40 or so, America will be ready for a Black man to be President and I wished him luck. We spoke of the racial tensions I saw at home while growing up and I asked him if he ever saw that overseas or since he returned back to Hawaii. I don’t remember his answer, but we spoke more of his time overseas and his thoughts on life and philosophy of government. He made some strange comments to me, it was obvious he never set foot for any time in the continental United States and I told him he better realize that he is making judgments about the United States when he himself never actually lived there. I told him, “Hawaii aint the United States!”
He also told me something that I never forgot, for it caused me to do some other things in an effort to be nice to him and possibly a favor. We spoke of where I had been and the world as I saw it. I told him I had been to Africa , Mombassa specifically, and he said to me abruptly, “I was born there”. I told him he is not eligible to be president if that was true, but I remembered he said his mom was an American, so, maybe it was okay. But it was what I did after that makes this a true memory: I went back to the barracks and told others of this guy and suggested we all grab our photo albums and visit him again and show him pictures of Mombassa so he could see where he was from.
No one wanted to go, and at that time, my camera had failed me weeks before we hit Mombassa and it was late August or early September until I had borrowed someone else’s pictures to develop myself so I had copies of where I was. But I never forgot meeting that man for those reasons. I was going to do him a favor and show him his home country of birth. And I never went back for some reason, most likely I forgot to or just felt that a one time chance encounter would be meaningless to both of us and didn’t mean we were friends.
In the light of what is called “The Birther” movement, these memories are still foremost in my mind concerning this. While I cannot swear it was Barak Obama, all the details I do remember of that chance encounter fit the profile of the man who some people claim is born in Kenya and others claim he was born in Hawaii . The man I met was about 18, thin, Mulatto, told me he was born in Mombassa, raised overseas, was living in Hawaii and hadn’t yet been to many places in the world outside of those places, mostly, hadn’t been to the mainland of America for any long time period if at all. And he openly told me he wanted to be President.
And I remember that face, the face of a young man who sat on a table to my right front, his hands resting on the edge of the table, him leaning forward, his smile, all teeth. It was Barak Obama. I don’t know if I’d bet my life on it, but I am willing to tell people openly at the risk of my ridicule. I was there, and saw him, spoke to him, and he openly told me he was born in Mombassa, Kenya, not Hawaii .
Does it matter? Of course it does. It should not have to be explained as to why it matters.


48 posted on 01/16/2010 3:17:23 AM PST by DontTreadOnMe2009 (So stop treading on me already!)
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To: neverdem

The First Time I Heard Of Barack

By Tom Fife 11-20-8

During the period of roughly February 1992 to mid 1994, I was making frequent trips to Moscow, Russia, in the process of starting a software development joint-venture company with some people from the Russian scientific community. One of the men in charge on the Russian side was named V. M.; he had a wife named T.M.
V. was a level-headed scientist while his wife was rather deeply committed to the losing Communist cause - a cause she obviously was not abandoning.
One evening, during a trip early in 1992, the American half of our venture were invited to V. & T.’s Moscow flat as we were about to return to the States. The party went well and we had the normal dinner discussions.
As the evening wore on, T. developed a decidedly rough anti-American edge - one her husband tried to quietly rein in.

The bottom line of the tirade she started against the United States went something like this:

“You Americans always like to think that you have the perfect government and your people are always so perfect. Well then, why haven’t you had a woman president by now? You had a chance to vote for a woman vice- president and you didn’t do it.”
The general response went something along the lines that you don’t vote for someone just because of their sex. Besides, you don’t vote for vice-president, but the president and vice-president as a ticket.
“Well, I think you are going to be surprised when you get a black president very soon.”
The consensus we expressed was that we didn’t think there was anything innately barring that. The right person at the right time and sure, America would try to vote for the right person, be he or she black or not.
“What if I told you that you will have a black president very soon and he will be a Communist?”
The out-of-the-blue remark was met by our stares. She continued, “Well, you will; and he will be a Communist.”
It was then that the husband unsuccessfully tried to change the subject; but she was on a roll and would have nothing of it. One of us asked, “It sounds like you know something we don’t know.”
“Yes, it is true. This is not some idle talk. He is already born and he is educated and being groomed to be president right now. You will be impressed to know that he has gone to the best schools of Presidents. He is what you call “Ivy League”. You don’t believe me, but he is real and I even know his name. His name is Barack. His mother is white and American and his father is black from Africa. That’s right, a chocolate baby! And he’s going to be your President.”
She became more and more smug as she presented her stream of detailed knowledge and predictions so matter-of-factly - as though all were foregone conclusions. “It’s all been thought out. His father is not an American black so he won’t have that social slave stigma. He is intelligent and he is half white and has been raised from the cradle to be an atheist and a Communist. He’s gone to the finest schools. He is being guided every step of the way and he will be irresistible to America.”
We sat there not knowing what to say. She was obviously very happy that the Communists were doing this and that it would somehow be a thumbing of their collective noses at America: they would give us a black president and he’d be a Communist to boot. She made it quite obvious that she thought that this was going to breathe new life into world Communism. From this and other conversations with her, she always asserted that Communism was far from dead.
She was full of little details about him that she was eager to relate. I thought that maybe she was trying to show off that this truly was a real person and not just hot air.
She rattled off a complete litany. He was from Hawaii. He went to school in California. He lived in Chicago. He was soon to be elected to the legislature. “Have no doubt: he is one of us, a Soviet.”
At one point, she related some sort of San Francisco connection, but I didn’t understand what the point was and don’t recall much about that. I was just left with the notion that she considered the city to be some sort of a center for their activity here.
Since I had dabbled in languages, I knew a smattering of Arabic. I made a comment: “If I remember correctly, ‘Barack’ comes from the Arabic word for ‘Blessing.’ That seems to be an odd name for an American.” She replied quickly, “Yes. It is ‘African’”, she insisted, “and he will be a blessing for world Communism. We will regain our strength and become the number one power in the world.”
She continued with something to the effect that America was at the same time the great hope and the great obstacle for Communism. America would have to be converted to Communism and Barack was going to pave the way.
So, what does this conversation from 1992 prove?
Well, it’s definitely anecdotal. It doesn’t prove that Obama has had Soviet Communist training nor that he was groomed to be the first black American president, but it does show one thing that I think is very important. It shows that Soviet Russian Communists knew of Barack from a very early date. It also shows that they truly believed among themselves that he was raised and groomed Communist to pave the way for their future. This report on Barack came personally to me from one of them long before America knew he existed.

Although I had never before heard of him, at the time of this conversation Obama was 30+ years old and was obviously tested enough that he was their anticipated rising star.

Tom Fife


49 posted on 01/16/2010 3:27:02 AM PST by DontTreadOnMe2009 (So stop treading on me already!)
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To: SpaceBar

See tag line


50 posted on 01/16/2010 3:45:14 AM PST by ezoeni (Listen to this man - http://www.dailymotion.com/video/x32cxf_yuri-bezmenov)
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