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Pickens Urged Bush to Take Iraq’s Oil (Pickens, Mad As Hell Turner, Cameron, Wyly Speak At AREDAY)
Aspen Daily News ^ | Monday, August 23, 2010 | Andrew Travers

Posted on 08/23/2010 5:42:22 AM PDT by fight_truth_decay

As the last American combat troops left Iraq last week, Oil-tycoon-turned-clean-energy-innovator T. Boone Pickens was at the American Renewable Energy Day conference in Aspen, lamenting that the U.S. didn’t take hold of the rich oil fields in the war-torn Middle Eastern nation before they left.

Pickens at first elicited laughs from an audience at the Paepcke Auditorium on Saturday night, as he bluntly made the case for America’s right to Iraq’s oil. Those laughs subsided as he recalled how he personally lobbied Presidents George W. Bush and Barack Obama to seize Iraq’s natural resources.

“I’ve heard people accuse President Bush of going to Iraq for their oil,” he began, in a public conversation with CNN founder Ted Turner and New York Times columnist Thomas Friedman. “That didn’t happen. We didn’t get the oil.”

(Excerpt) Read more at aspendailynews.com ...


TOPICS: Culture/Society; Extended News; Foreign Affairs; News/Current Events
KEYWORDS: areday; energy; jamescameron; samwyly; tboonepickens; tedturner
T. Boone Pickens: “We paid the price and [we] don’t get it ... . It’s heartbreaking to me to lose our people and the Chinese end up with the oil...”Bush was too concerned about his image..."I went to Obama.. ‘Don’t leave Iraq." Similar results

Filmmaker James Cameron: "...... artists must connect regular folks to the issue of climate change in order for renewable energy to gain broad support...

“My skill set is in media, and in getting people to pay attention on a positive level, and straight talk, and speaking to a blue-collar mentality.” Cameron said he was “Pretty pessimistic".."The number of Americans who even believe climate change is real has dropped from 47 percent to 34 percent."

Ted Turner: “We don’t have a level playing field in America”... “The field is still tilted to the goddamn coal and oil industry ... I’m mad as hell and I’m not gonna take it anymore!”....

Southern Turner Renewable Energy has invested millions in wind and solar power technology".."Obama choosing to champion health-care reform before carbon/energy legislation was a mistake".

Billionaire entrepreneur Sam Wyly: ‘I love BP’...“because they were there with big bucks when I needed ’em!”

Wyly touted his Green Mountain Energy as proof that clean energy is good business. The renewable and carbon offset seller made them $50 million in profits last year"....However, the Securities and Exchange Commission filed a lawsuit in July, claiming that the Wyly brothers (Sam & Charles) made $550 million on fraudulent business transactions.]

1 posted on 08/23/2010 5:42:26 AM PDT by fight_truth_decay
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To: All

You may want to read this story as well for additional information related:

http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/f-bloggers/2575750/posts


2 posted on 08/23/2010 5:46:20 AM PDT by fight_truth_decay
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To: fight_truth_decay
Filmmaker James Cameron: "...... artists must connect regular folks to the issue of climate change lie in order for renewable energy to gain broad support...

Edited for clarity.

3 posted on 08/23/2010 5:46:26 AM PDT by paulycy (Demand Constitutionality Now: Islamo-Marxism is Evil.)
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To: fight_truth_decay
clean-energy-innovator T. Boone Pickens

What has this guy "innovated" ?

He wanted to build a wind farm, but backed out when the real coast bacame apparent.

What innovation?

4 posted on 08/23/2010 5:49:32 AM PDT by Izzy Dunne (Hello, I'm a TAGLINE virus. Please help me spread by copying me into YOUR tag line.)
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To: fight_truth_decay

What a nut.


5 posted on 08/23/2010 5:50:00 AM PDT by grobdriver (Proud Member, Party Of No! No Socialism - No Fascism - Nobama - No Way!)
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To: All
New York Times columnist Thomas Friedman

described as “bummed out” over America's lack of progress taking on climate change....A friend of his labeled him and his peers as “the grasshopper generation” because of all the conspicuous consumption. “We ate through it all like hungry locusts,” Friedman was also a featured speaker along with Rocky Mountain Institute founder Amory Lovins and the cast of characters above billed as an “armchair chat.”

Amory Lovins: “Green China” poses a greater threat than Red China ever did"

Source

6 posted on 08/23/2010 5:54:20 AM PDT by fight_truth_decay
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To: Izzy Dunne

” What innovation? “

Mr. Pickens is known for his ever-more innovative schemes to scoop more and more money from the Public Trough....


7 posted on 08/23/2010 5:55:25 AM PDT by Uncle Ike (Rope is cheap, and there are lots of trees...)
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To: Izzy Dunne
What innovation?

T. Bone was pretty innovative the way he bribed Texas Legislators to form municipal water districts in order to use eminent domain to seize property for power line corridors and water rights to the Ogalalla Aquifer from Texas land owners. T. Bone is a top shelf snake oil salesman......

8 posted on 08/23/2010 5:55:43 AM PDT by Thermalseeker (Stop the insanity - Flush Congress!)
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To: Izzy Dunne
What has this guy "innovated" ?

He innovated the hostile take-over of viable businesses that could be butchered and sold for big profits for him and his band of weasels.

He raped Gulf Oil to get at the money in its Pension Fund. Want to know why businesses stopped fully funding their pensions?

T Boone Pickens.

9 posted on 08/23/2010 5:57:37 AM PDT by Pietro
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To: fight_truth_decay

Pickens is a slime ball who made his fortune with his wife’s money. She must have wised up, because now he wants the US taxpayer to fund his various schemes.
He tried to steal the water supply in the TX Panhandle and pipe it to the D/FW area, funded by the government, of course.
When the Panhandle ranchers got wise to this theft of their vital water resources, T. Bone had to drop the deal or get run out of TX.
His giant wind farm plan is in tatters because the government is broke, but I’m sure he has some other grandiose boondoggle up his sleeve so he can get face time at Green conferences and on CNBC.


10 posted on 08/23/2010 5:59:18 AM PDT by kittymyrib
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To: fight_truth_decay

Loony AND hypocritical. All of them. But that Wyly person got me the most angry... Carbon offset trading is another slick construct to makes billionaires out of a few...at the expense of many. And gee, didn’t Al Gore attend???Or is he too busy attending to hi chakras.


11 posted on 08/23/2010 6:00:33 AM PDT by SueRae (I can see November from my HOUSE!)
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To: fight_truth_decay

Pickens reminds me of a James Garner character in the movie “The Wheeler Dealers” trying to sell stock in Consolidated Widget.


12 posted on 08/23/2010 6:06:05 AM PDT by N. Theknow (Kennedys: Can't skipper a boat, Can't drive, Can't ski, Can't fly. But they KNOW what's best.)
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To: All
AREDay in Aspen: U.S. military sold on threat posed by climate change

Col. Mark “Puck” Mykleby, U.S. Marine Corps, strategic assistant to the chairman of the Joint Chiefs of Staff : "Issues from food shortages and crop failures to migrations of people due to natural disasters will affect world events, Mykleby said. Such events have the potential to cause upheaval and event conflict, and the Pentagon sees a link to national security."

Christine Todd Whitman: “...cataclysmic flooding besieging Pakistan demonstrates the connection between climate change and U.S. national security. I can't think of anything more scary than a Taliban-controlled Pakistan,”... “Right now that is a real possibility because of the stress being put on the government.”

AspenTimes

13 posted on 08/23/2010 6:07:25 AM PDT by fight_truth_decay
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To: Izzy Dunne

He didn’t back out because of costs - he backed out because the state of Texas told him on no uncertain terms that ownership of a power generating operation did not in any way entitle him to input on the setup and operation of the power distribution network.

Pickens had hoped to be a power behind the scenes in Texas electrical utilities, and sell “Green energy” to California.

The state informen him that the windfarm power was going to be used in state.

He had a hissy fit and stormed out.


14 posted on 08/23/2010 6:09:34 AM PDT by MrEdd (Heck? Geewhiz Cripes, thats the place where people who don't believe in Gosh think they aint going.)
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To: SueRae
Chip Comins, Founder, Producer and Executive Director of AREDAY- American Renewable Energy Day - and Managing Director of American Spirit Productions, a green film and event production company located in Aspen, CO.

Comins is trained by Al Gore to present The Climate Project slide show and is now producing the 7th Annual AREDAY 2010 – The Problem IS The Solution: Wall St. Meets Green St. Creating The New Energy Economy.

Sally Ranney, CEO of Stillwater Preservation, LLC., a wetlands mitigation banking company, and IS an Al Gore ‘Climate Project’ trainee.

Appointed by President Reagan to the Commission on Americans Outdoors and former Senator Tim Wirth to the Harvard School of Government’s Project 88, Ranney was also instrumental in designing AmeriCorps for Clinton-Gore. A former Resource Policy Analyst for The Wilderness Society, she worked closely with Pres. Carter protecting millions of acres in Alaska and the western U.S.

AREDAY STAFF

Al was there in Spirit!!!

15 posted on 08/23/2010 6:15:34 AM PDT by fight_truth_decay
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To: fight_truth_decay
“It’s absolutely nuts to lose 5,000 people, have 31,000 injured, and spend a trillion dollars, and you didn’t even get the oil,” Pickens said.

Pickens can make a point, but his credibility is not what it used to be.

16 posted on 08/23/2010 6:17:44 AM PDT by Old Landmarks (No fear of man, none!)
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To: steelyourfaith

Ping


17 posted on 08/23/2010 6:18:36 AM PDT by Army Air Corps (Four fried chickens and a coke)
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To: fight_truth_decay

Congress went berserk at the thought of the USA even bidding for oil contracts.

Thank them for our being shut out of the Iraqi oil way back them.


18 posted on 08/23/2010 6:28:44 AM PDT by Carley (For those who fought for it, freedom has a flavor the protected will never know.)
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To: Carley
We were told by Bush and our leaders, were we not? at the beginning of the war when the costs were discussed that we would be paid back from Iraqi oil by the ever greatful Iraqi whose pipelines we were to protect...then never to hear about it again.

China and England now are to gain.

19 posted on 08/23/2010 6:37:48 AM PDT by fight_truth_decay
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To: fight_truth_decay
I really don't know much about Pickens, but on this subject he's right.

Who REALLY benefited from our intervention in Iraq?

Vae victis!! We spent a fortune in lives and money for WHAT?

To make the Saudi Pigs, who contributed not one dime or one life safer.

To make the Kuwati Pigs, who contributed not one dime or one life safer.

The U.S. has been turned into an unpaid mercenary to protect the damn Oil States while they spend NOTHING on their own defense so THEY ARE FREE TO SPEND THEIR EXTRA CASH BUILDING MOSQUES AND MADRASSEHS HERE AND BANKROLLING WEST-HATING IMAMS!!!

Are we NUTS???

Bush II was a damn fool and Obama is a damn traitor.

20 posted on 08/23/2010 6:53:14 AM PDT by ZULU (God, guts and guns made America great,)
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To: fight_truth_decay
We were told by Bush and our leaders, were we not?

Sorry that is a total myth.

21 posted on 08/23/2010 6:53:19 AM PDT by MNJohnnie (The problem with Socialism is eventually you run our of other peoples money. Lady Thatcher)
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To: ZULU
No, the damn fools are the Freeper Neo Isolationists who continue to shout their emotion based dogmas rather then face the fact they were complete wrong about Iraq from the start.

Rather then welding their mind shut, yet again, perhaps the Neo Isolatists choir around here might finally learn the facts about Iraq.

Why Iraq

One of the really infuriating things in modern politics is the level of disinformation, misinformation, demagoguery and out right lying going on about the mission in Iraq. Democrats have spent the last 3+ years lying about Iraq out of a political calculation. The assumption is that the natural isolationist mindset of the average American voter, linked to the inherent Anti Americanism (what is misnamed the “Anti War movement”) of the more feverish Democrat activists (especially those running the US’s National “News” media) would restore them to national political dominance. The truth is the Democrat Party Leadership has simply lacked the courage to speak truth to whiners. The truth is that even if Al Gore won the 2000 election and 09-11 still happened we would be doing the EXACT same things in Iraq we are doing now.

Based on the political situation in the region left over from the 1991 Gulf War plus the domestic political consensus built up in BOTH parties since 1991 as well as fundamental military strategic laws, there was NO viable strategic choice for the US but to take out Iraq after finishing the initial operations in Afghanistan.

To start with Saddam's Iraq was our most immediate threat. We could NOT commit significant military forces to another battle with Saddam hovering undefeated on our flank nor could we leave significant forces watching Saddam. The political containment of Iraq was breaking down. That what Oil for Food was all about. Oil for Food was an attempt by Iraq to break out of it's diplomatic isolation and slip the shackles the UN Sanctions put on it's military. There there was the US Strategic position to consider.

The War on Islamic Fascism is different sort of war. in facing this Asymmetrical threat, we have a hidden foe, spread out across a geographically diverse area, with covert sources of supply. Since we cannot go everywhere they hide out, in fact often cannot even locate them until the engage us, we need to draw them out of hiding into a kill zone.

Iraq is that kill zone. That is the true brilliance of the Iraq strategy. We draw the terrorists out of their world wide hiding places onto a battlefield they have to fight on for political reasons (The “Holy” soil of the Arabian peninsula) where they have to pit their weakest ability (Conventional Military combat power) against our greatest strength (ability to call down unbelievable amounts of firepower) where they will primarily have to fight other forces (the Iraqi Security forces) in a battlefield that is mostly neutral in terms of guerrilla warfare. (Iraqi-mostly open terrain as opposed to guerrilla friendly areas like the mountains of Afghanistan or the jungles of SE Asia).

Did any of the critics of liberating Iraq ever look at a map? Iraq, for which we had the political, legal and moral justifications to attack, is the strategic high ground of the Middle East. A Geographic barrier that severs ground communication between Iran and Syria apart as well as providing another front of attack in either state or into Saudi Arabia if needed.

There were other reasons to do Iraq but here is the strategic military reason we are in Iraq. We have taken, an maintain the initiative from the Terrorists. They are playing OUR game on ground of OUR choosing.

Problem is Counter Insurgency is SLOW and painful. Often a case of 3 steps forward, two steps back. One has to wonder if the American people have either the emotional maturity, nor the intellect” to understand. It's so much easier to spew made for TV slogans like “No Blood for Oil” or “We support the Troops, bring them home” or dumbest of all “We are creating terrorists” then to actually THINK.

Westerners in general, and the US citizens in particular seem to have trouble grasping the fundamental fact of this foe. These Islamic Fascists have NO desire to co-exist with them. The extremists see all this PC posturing by the Hysteric Left as a sign that we are weak. Since they want us dead, weakness encourages them. There is simply no way to coexist with people who completely believe their “god” will reward them for killing us.

So we can covert to Islam, die or kill them. Iraq is about killing enough of them to make the rest of the Jihadists realize we are serious. They same way killing enough Germans, Italians and Japanese eliminated the ideologies of Nazism, Fascism and Bushido.

Americans need to understand how Bin Laden and his ilk view us. In the Arab world the USA is considered a big wimp. We have run away so many times. Lebanon, the Kurds, the Iraqis in 1991, the Iranians, Somalia, Clinton all thru the 1990s etc etc etc. The Jihadists think we will run again. In fact they are counting on it. That way they can run around screaming “We beat the American just like the Russians, come join us in Jihad” and recruit the next round of “holy warriors”. Iraq is also a show place where we show the Muslim world that there are a lines they cannot cross. On 9-11-01 they crossed that line and we can, and will, destroy them for it -

If you will not fight for the right when you can easily win without bloodshed; if you will not fight when your victory will be sure and not too costly; you may come to the moment when you will have to fight with all the odds against you and only a small chance of survival. There may even be a worse case: you may have to fight when there is no hope of victory, because it is better to perish than to live as slaves.”

Winston Churchill

22 posted on 08/23/2010 6:58:13 AM PDT by MNJohnnie (The problem with Socialism is eventually you run our of other peoples money. Lady Thatcher)
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To: fight_truth_decay
My father gets his Medicare cut and has to use a higher proportion of what he does get to pay for his medication so Iraq can be rebuilt. Why should their oil NOT pay for their own country?
23 posted on 08/23/2010 7:05:04 AM PDT by count-your-change (You don't have be brilliant, not being stupid is enough.)
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To: Izzy Dunne

I read his wind farm idea as merely a way to cash in on gvt money anyway.


24 posted on 08/23/2010 7:05:39 AM PDT by Pessimist
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To: ZULU

Amen and BTTT.


25 posted on 08/23/2010 7:15:45 AM PDT by mrmeyer ("When brute force is on the march, compromise is the red carpet." Ayn Rand)
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To: MNJohnnie
Thanks for quoting Winnie Churchill.

Churchill got his start in the war with the Mahdi in the Sudan - another example of western powers swasting money and lives trying to civilize Islamic Savages.

He went on to a career with the British military in its effort to destroy the Boer Republics in South Africa by introducing the concept of Concentration Camps for civilians.

He moved onwards and upwards with a career in the British Admiralty where he conspired with FDR who was the U.S. Secretary of the Navy, to get us involved in WW1, something we should never have done. One of his famous quotes regarded a question as to how many Americans he wanted sent to help Britain. He stated “Just one. And I would put him somewhere where he was certain to be shot.” He said that KNOWING an American death would encourage the U.S. to help Britain in a war THE BRITISH never should have gotten involved in.

As to WW2, Hitler, the Nazis and that war would NEVER have happened if it were not for the imperialistic leanings of Churchill and his good buddy, Anglophiles Wilson and FDR in WW1. Russia would never have been Boslhevized if it weren;t for WW1 and Eastern Europe wouldn't have been communized if it weren't for Churchill and FDR.

I'm not an isolationist.

Invading Iraq and taking out Saddam was smart. Taking out the Taliban in Afghanistan was well done and very necessary.

But wasting American lives and money trying to civilize two collections of Islamic Savages in a long occupation was, and is, stupid and foolish.

America should fight only blitzkrieg like wars - move in fast, totally destroy your opponent, then pull out and let his widows and orphans deal with the consequences of his stupidity.

But globalists wring their hands and think they have a responsibility to bring lightness and democracy to savages who don't understand nor respect it.

When they evolve, if ever, they can find their own way.

So far, the only experiment in Democracy which worked was the one that happened here in 1776. Because the people here were ready for it and understood it. All the rest - France, Russia, South America, etc, pretty much failed.

26 posted on 08/23/2010 7:25:49 AM PDT by ZULU (God, guts and guns made America great,)
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To: ZULU
T Bone Pickens eh....I seem to remember he tried to get a seat on the board of a Japanese company he brought into....and was politely denied...

This was during the time the Japanese were riding high ...prior to their deflation decades.

27 posted on 08/23/2010 7:49:00 AM PDT by spokeshave (mess + 0bama = quagmire recession)
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To: MNJohnnie

Yet the Saudis continue to lead in funding terrorism world wide.


28 posted on 08/23/2010 7:55:26 AM PDT by randomhero97 ("First you want to kill me, now you want to kiss me. Blow!" - Ash)
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To: count-your-change

During a hearing on the financial cost to invade Iraq the question was asked about an estimated total. The govt official said the oil reserve will be collateral to repay the cost of liberating Iraq. The video was posted on FR.


29 posted on 08/23/2010 7:59:47 AM PDT by Orange1998
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To: Orange1998

Does anyone seriouly believe that?


30 posted on 08/23/2010 9:03:24 AM PDT by count-your-change (You don't have be brilliant, not being stupid is enough.)
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To: Army Air Corps; DollyCali; IrishCatholic; meyer; SteamShovel; Desdemona; grey_whiskers; ...
Climate related jabber at the link.

Thanx Army Air Corps !

 


Beam me to Planet Gore !

31 posted on 08/23/2010 3:05:12 PM PDT by steelyourfaith ("Release the Second Chakra !!!!!!!" ... Al Gore, 10/24/06)
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To: ZULU; MNJohnnie

But wasting American lives and money trying to civilize two collections of Islamic Savages in a long occupation was, and is, stupid and foolish.

ZULU your point is valid and I think MNJohnnie’s post is right on the money and I happen to agree with it, thank you for the post. The invasion of Iraq also was not about oil per se, but I do think oil was part of the equation. If MNJohnnie is correct and I think he is then when do you think we should have left Iraq. If the purpose was to bring them to us and kill them then isn’t true the longer we were there the more of them came and were killed by our boys. Maybe that is one reason why we were spared fron another major attack like 9/11, they were too busy fighting us in Iraq, away from our major cities and population. Like MNJohnnie pointed out, brilliant!

I disagree that American lives were wasted. If anything Bush thought the enemy one thing. We are not weak! And we will strike back if ever we are attacked, one way or another, if not by this President then the next. To me it is a powerful message. Whoever is funding these savages certainly do not want American B2’s possibly carrying nukes over their skies in retaliation for a dirty bomb that went off in one of our cities. That was the mission I think our brave young men and women gave their precious lives for and I for one am ever grateful to them and President Bush for their courage, thank you and GOD BLESS them all!


32 posted on 08/23/2010 3:34:43 PM PDT by quesera (We are so screwed!!)
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To: MNJohnnie; count-your-change
I guess the definition falls on what constitutes the cost of the war with 50,000 troops remaining in dangerous conditions and the rebuilding and stabilization of Iraq. Two parts equal the cost of the whole? I did remember hearing first hand and looked it up:

Washigton Post. The clip showed Wolfowitz telling a congressional panel, "It's hard to conceive that it would take more forces to provide stability in post-Saddam Iraq than it would take to conduct the war itself," and "The oil revenue of that country could bring between 50 and 100 billion dollars over the course of the next two or three years. We're dealing with a country that could really finance its own reconstruction, and relatively soon." The show's host, Jon Stewart, hooted, "[Bleeped] that one up, too!"

Now Karl Rove in his book disputed a comment was made in regard to Iraq financing their on reconstruction.

Rove flatly denied that the Bush administration said Iraqi oil revenues would help pay for the war:

ROVE: No, no. Tom with all due respect that was not the policy of our government that we were going to go into Iraq and take their resources in order to pay for the cost of the war. … [T]he suggestion that somehow or another the administration had as its policy, “We’re going to go in to Iraq and take their resource and pay for the war” is not accurate

Press Briefing by Ari Fleischer: Question: Back on the cost issue. If the U.S. does not get a second resolution, does the President believe that U.S. taxpayers will disproportionately bear the burden of the reconstruction costs in Iraq?

MR. FLEISCHER: Well, the reconstruction costs remain a very -- an issue for the future. And Iraq, unlike Afghanistan, is a rather wealthy country. Iraq has tremendous resources that belong to the Iraqi people. And so there are a variety of means that Iraq has to be able to shoulder much of the burden for their own reconstruction (about 1/2 way down).

And given the fact that Iraq right now suffers under sanctions as a result of Saddam Hussein's repression and Saddam Hussein's attempts to procure weapons which the United Nations have said are sanctionable -- the fact of the matter is that Iraq's reconstruction will be aided by the removal of Saddam Hussein because Iraq will then be able to take its proper place among nations of the world that trades and trades freely, which all benefits the reconstruction of Iraq.

Could Iraqi Oil Help Pay Some Costs?
In its estimates, CBO also analyzed the suggested possibility that proceeds from sales of Iraqi oil could be used to offset the costs of rebuilding damaged infrastructure and occupation of Iraq. (USGOV.INFO)CBO found this idea not to be a reasonable option BUT:
•"Assuming that a post-conflict Iraq complied with all U.N. resolutions and removed the basis for the current economic sanctions, and assuming also that its oil production infrastructure was undamaged, Iraq could pay for reconstruction costs by using funds generated from that 400,000 BPD of oil and still have enough to pay for its country's current level of imports. At today's oil prices, production at that level would amount to approximately $3 billion a year."

Nearly $9 billion of money spent on Iraqi reconstruction is unaccounted for because of inefficiencies and bad management, according to a watchdog report published Sunday. An inspector general's report said the U.S.-led administration that ran Iraq until June 2004 is unable to account for the funds. In the end:
CHECK PLEASE?

China and England get oil contracts..we get a.... 'handshake'?

You are correct, in the end it was all a myth no matter who said what, when, where and how many Americans have given their lives and will continue to do so during this time of "reconstruction" in Iraq and Afghanistan.

33 posted on 08/23/2010 4:47:14 PM PDT by fight_truth_decay
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To: fight_truth_decay

Not only a myth in the end but from the get go. Of course, what did we expect?


34 posted on 08/23/2010 5:16:15 PM PDT by count-your-change (You don't have be brilliant, not being stupid is enough.)
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To: quesera

“If the purpose was to bring them to us and kill them then isn’t true the longer we were there the more of them came and were killed by our boys. Maybe that is one reason why we were spared fron another major attack like 9/11, they were too busy fighting us in Iraq, away from our major cities and population. Like MNJohnnie pointed out, brilliant!”

If that was his strategy, it could have been a good idea.

But if that was the case, why stay so long and commit so many lives and so much money and have the stated and pursued goal of “civilizing” the savages?

I think another strongman - on our side - would have been cheaper and more effective. Its a way of life there - strongmen or maniac theocrats.

Those troops could have been better employed in Syria or Iran - or even on the Rio Grande.


35 posted on 08/23/2010 10:13:56 PM PDT by ZULU (God, guts and guns made America great,)
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